I have never had any knee problems at all...until now.

A friend thinks it is tendonitis - it is the outer edge of each knee and it really bothers me after skating....

I realize i changed boots about a year ago from Harlick to Klingbeil and there is a heel height difference, but could it just be my age (47?) or because i am trying so hard to get lower on the sit spin and the jumps? Strange thing is ...it is not one knee but both!

Any advice? - Miraclegro

There's a name for it which I've forgotten, but I have this condition/syndrome. Basically your outer quad is stronger than the inner, and it pulls your kneecap to the outside. It's not something that will go away by itself.

See a physiotherapist. They can diagnose, set you up with a strengthening plan and also talk to your coach about what you can and cannot do. You can keep skating though!

CanadaanAdult: did you have patellofemoral syndrome in mind?

(I have to run now... wanted to add though that I have the patellofemoral syndrome, and there are some easy to do exercises to help with it - I do second the visit to the PT though to get the knee troubles diagnosed)

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--renatele

you may have iliotibial band tightness, go to your doctor to get it checked out and dx and then make sure you see a good PT that can set you up on a good stretching and strengthening program. iliotibial band tightness is common in athletes esp. sports that involve a lot of knee bending like runners.

good luck hope you feel better

with patellofemoral syndrome that most common complaint is actually knee pain anterior of the knee, as opposed to miraclegro's complaint of lateral (outside) knee pain which occurs with iliotibial band tightness

True. Well, both conditions benefit GREATLY from PT, and the exercises are the type that can be done not just in the gym.

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--renatele

I get the same thing, and was told by my PT that it's because my quads are stronger than my hamstrings and therefore pull unevenly on my knee (especially outer quads, which we use so much in skating). I first got this problem in my left knee from practicing too many sitspins, so now I limit the number of sitspins I do. I also get it in my left knee when I do too many axel takeoffs, so now I am limiting those as well. It's the push onto the LFO edge that seems to be the culprit for me. Hamstring strengthening exercises help, and really deep quad stretches DEFINITELY help.

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"You don't have to put an age limit on your dreams." - Dara Torres, 41, after her 2nd medal at the 2008 Olympics

Hee! That would be the right knee. That one hurts below the kneecap. I have an old injury there. I had tight IT band syndrome so badly that I ripped the IT band partially off the left knee on a jump one time. Yes both knees are messed up.
I love my physiotherapist. The most important part is keeping my physio talking to my coach, so that when I say that I am unable to do something, it's not because I'm not slacking off, it's because it's on my limitation list.

Chrondomalacia patella ... from what i remember from the warm and fuzzy orthopedist who diagnosed me at 13, and said i wasn't 'worth' treating because i was a chubby and uncoordinated kid who was never going to be an athlete - it's chronic inflammation under the kneecap caused by a mistracking kneecap. And I get much the same symptoms described here, and, yup, changes in heel height can trigger it, because they change the way I bend and move that kneecap around. Treatable .. with a decent physiotherapist, which i found out when I was a chubby and uncoordinated adult.

Actually, that was my diagnosis as well (refer to my other post above). I was told my kneecaps were tight and that was a contributing factor. I still blame axels and sitspins, though.

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"You don't have to put an age limit on your dreams." - Dara Torres, 41, after her 2nd medal at the 2008 Olympics

Make sure you are doing proper off-ice exercises. Get into a good circuit training habit. So many injuries come from over-training a new skating move without doing the proper strength training for it. Everything in moderation though. Be consistant about your off-ice training routine.

So, this isn't super serious, then? I just have to get to the right Physiotherapist (what is the diff. between that and a Physical Therapist?)

and get some good exercises...?

A good exercise is the single leg squat. Do it in front of a mirror bare foot, make sure your foot, knee and hip line up. It helps strengthen all your stabilizer muscles.

By the way, whatever you do, don't self diagnose or take the word of someone who doesn't understand the mechanics of skating. For example, the first PT I went to had me doing quad exercises and it made my knee hurt worse than ever. I knew I already used my quads a lot in skating and this just felt wrong, so I quit her and went to a PT who is also a skater. The skater PT knew exactly what muscles I used and for what, and she suspected poor hamstring to quad strength, which is apparently common among skaters (since we use our quads so much). She tested my relative muscle strength and confirmed that my hamstrings were weaker than my quads, and prescribed me hamstring strengthening exercises and reduced use of the outer quads (i.e., no sitspins or axels for awhile). It worked. But every body is different, so just be sure to have the physical therapist measure the relative strength of your inner quads vs outer quads and your quads vs hamstrings to make sure you aren't being given the wrong exercises!

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"You don't have to put an age limit on your dreams." - Dara Torres, 41, after her 2nd medal at the 2008 Olympics

It helps to find a trainer who is sport specific. In other words you prepare your body for your sport. Figure skating has a lot of counter body rotation deep knees and centrifugal force. You need to find someone who understands the kinetic chin and how it is linked to your sport.

Well, that oughta be fun in this little town of limited choice....

At a minimum, try asking around as to what trainers/physical therapists any of the local high school or community college athletic teams use. Those trainers may not understand the physics of skating, but they will generally be more tuned into stresses of athletics and the frame of mine of athletes than just picking a therapist from a list provided by your insurance provider.

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miraclegro,

One thing that can really help you is a full body work out on an exercise ball. It can be difficult, but so helpful for all those little muscles that we don't even think about. When I was competing, there were three things that really helped me when I was in top shape...the Nordic Track, Jump Rope, and exercise ball.

in the states we commonly say phyiscal therapist in a lot of countries outside the US a physical therapist is referred to as a physiotherapist.

You're the Sydne Vogel who competed in the 90's and was jr. national champion? Cool that you are posting here! Are you skating in adult events now? I enjoyed watching your performances on TV and still have a video of '96 nationals somewhere.

Hey Sydne - Welcome to SkatingForums!
Thanks for the advice - I'm reinflating my exercise ball now.

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I have experience with chondromalacia in my right knee. Doesn't bother me on a regular basis anymore. However, my Ortho doc told me no squats, stairs, or running. Since he's 6'8" and played pro football, I tend to listen to him.

Go see an orthopedist and get an expert opinion, and don't self-diagnose. You could make it worse. Now, you can go in and say "I've been doing some research...."

I had the same thing earlier in the summer, went to my dr. and got diagnosed with patellofemoral syndrome. It took me about 2 weeks of physio and daily specialized exercises/stretches, and it slowly went away.

It all started with me falling really bad on one of my knees. The dr. thinks from there I started walking a little differently to compensate for the sore knee. I refused to go to the dr. at first, because I didn't think there was anything they could do. After falling down the stairs at home (the pain got so bad I could not control my muscles), I decided that this has to end!

When I started physio, my knee caps would not even move when the knees were relaxed. It was bizarre.

Honestly, go get some help, because it will not stop on it's own.
Good luck!

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If you don't fall, you are not learning anything new!
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I've pain in one knee - not much, about 1 or 2 on the scale of 1-10, and it only hurts when I stand on that leg and bend deep, or rock forwards to my toe, but this is the first time I've had a joint pain, so I'm looking to treat it right before it becomes chronic.

Yeah, I know, stop my whining, take two aspirin, and get back on the ice. Lots of people skate with shattered bones, detached tendons and ligamants, artificial knees and hips, missing disks, etc., and they don't complain. But, pain is evil, not because it hurts, but because it says something is wrong with what one is doing.

I tried cold, hot and cold baths, and layed off it for over a week.

It started after a lot of practice on (mostly forward outside) 3 turns - which has the motions that generate this problem. No special reaction to inside or outside sideways knee pressure. Initially was under the knee cap, and just below the knee (don't know whether it is in the patellar ligament or the quadriceps). Now is only under the knee cap.

Presumably a minor league sprain or strain from overuse, or something like that. I figure a doctor would just say that a lot of people in late middle age get arthritis, and that adults shouldn't skate, so haven't bothered.

The obvious next step is to start progressively exercising it again, stretches and strength, and getting back on the ice. Does that sound right? I'm going to try ibuprofen too, but hate the idea of using drugs long term. Are there over-the-counter joint drugs that actually work, and do they interact badly with ibuprofen? Any other advice?

could try taking glucosamine, if it's cartillage or something... at least that takes on the problem, not the symptom. downside: pretty pricey stuff.