Hi all, I'm new to the site, but now that I know it's here, I hope to spend much more time here!

I am going to a pro shop to be fitted for new custom skates tonight - decided it was finally time to stop screwing around with used skates and throw some money down (sold my laptop to pay for it!).

I have been skating for the past few weeks on a pair of used Klingbeils that I got a _fantastic_ deal on. They're really a nice, if well-worn, pair of skates, the biggest problem is that the toe is too narrow for my feet in the toes and I lose circulation on the outsides of my feet if I wear them too long without a break. I also found as I was attempting to learn the waltz jump (CCW) the last time I went that the tongue puts a lot of pressure on the inside of my ankle, to the point of causing a numbness that has lasted several days (I haven't been skating since). I didn't realize it until I took the skates off, but the left of the tongue had really pressured the side of my foot and caused the area to be very sensitive. I don't bruise, but if I did, I have no doubt I'd have a nasty bruise there...

This being said, the skates are great to skate on, they perform really well compared to the pair I had before (which were no good at all, the leather was soft and floppy and I didn't realize the benefits of stiff leather). I really want a pair of skates that I can keep on for more than an hour though, without worrying about harming my feet.

My roomate has about the same size of feet as me, and has a pair of SP Teri Super Teri's that he bought in 1997 (he hasn't been skating for 3-4 years), which he let me borrow one day and I thought they were absolutely fantastic.

However I've also noted some negative reviews of SP Teri, and the guy at the Pro shop suggested that I give Graf figure skates serious consideration (my roomate also said that they were worth considering, though he had never seen/used them). I'm a bit concerned about Graf though, as they seem to be more focused on making hockey skates, and the boots don't look the same as the normal figure skate (a suede look as opposed to shiny leather).

I've only got a few hours until I leave for the pro shop, but I was hoping some of you might be on who could make some last-minute suggestions. I'm not concerned about price so much as I am concerned about finding the best boots possible.

Any advice? It's greatly appreciated!

You should post these kinds of questions in the "On Ice" forum. That's a place for people who skate to discuss skating, equipment, etc. This is a fan forum. Maybe one of the administrators could move the thread?

Graf is rumored to be having major problems in skate production lately. You can find many satisfied customers for almost any skate manufacturer and just as many unsatisfied customers. I believe the trick is in the initial measurement and fitting. I have had good luck with Klingbeil ... but that's probably because I go right to their shop in NY and have Bill Klingbeil do the measurements. If you are buying stock boots, try a few before you decide. Good luck.

My last 2 boots have been grafs and I love them. My brother, a former national senior competitor uses double strength Graf's as well

Ive used Reidell's for 24 years....

but it really is personal preference. Reidell has changed their boot over the years and I personally liked the old ones...heh - but those had plastic in the boot frame and apparently people were having ankle issues. They changed this about 8 years ago TTBOMK, and although I still like them, my next pair I will explore other options. Ive had mine rebuilt twice.

Things to think about are not only comfort and fit, but weight, composition, strength, height of boot, incline (some are more inclined than others), and internal components - like does it use molding material that will remember your foot, etc.

i think this may be a bit too late, but if you're not very advanced yet, you might not want to put down the money for a pair of customs. Most people are just fine in stock boots, at least while they're still learning. And, they're a lot less expensive than custom boots. The exception would be if you have some sort of weird anomoly in your feet. But things like the arches can be changed with arch supports if needed, and the toe box could be stretched if needed. Also, a lot of boots are heat moldable, so you won't need to worry about as long a break in period. For most people, especially beginners, this is more than enough.

I dunno, imo, customs aren't really worth it unless absolutely necessary, especially at lower levels when you dont need a lot of stiffness in the boot.

I'm right now skating in a pair of jackson's, and i love them. before that, i had riedells, and i liked those too, but the next level up was a bit too pricey for my budget.

But if you do get SP Teri's, i've heard they are near impossible to break in. This could lead to blisters, sore raw feet, and not a happy time. Especially if you're on the smaller side. But everyone has different feet. I've never skated in sp teri's, but that;s just what i heard.

I agree with Sue that custom boots are only necessary when you have speacial foot issues or you're an advanced enough skater that little things like that make a significant difference. Customs are about what, $500 and up? And then you'll probably have to get new blades too. Stock boots are just as good (again if you don't have special foot needs that can't be fixed by stretching, heat molding, custom instep things etc)

I'm lucky enough to have pretty "standard" feet so that stock Riedells fit me with no problems. I'm also really light on my boots so that while other people at my level get silver and gold stars, bronze stars are plenty stiff for moi (they're almost a year old and still look like new)

The other issue here is that, if you are just learning waltz jumps, you are talking about getting a boot that is way too strong for your level now. A good skate fitter should not sell you a pair of boots that isn't appropriate for you. Jacksons are very good for starting out, if they fit you right. Many people like Reidells, which also make a few "beginner" level models. I'd say make sure you get real leather, not a synthetic, and get a boot that comes separate from the blade (which will allow you to adjust the blade placement if necessary). Then just go with what fits you best and in the strength needed for your current level of skating. Custom Grafs (or customs in general) are not necessary right now! Save that money for lessons--so you'll need them sooner!

Yeah, unless you have very specific foot problems that can't be accomodated by a stock boot, custom boots are a waste of money, and too high-end a boot is a waste too cause you'll never break them in. I suggest Riedell silver or gold stars, or Jacksons (what lower-end models are there?) I also suggest you get an MK professional or Coronation Ace (is it ace, or comet that I'm thinking of? Pretty sure it's Ace) attached to it. You probably shouldn't pay more than 500 for the WHOLE thing (blades and boots), not for the boots themselves. Waste of money if you're learning waltz jumps right now, and it'll hurt like a mother if the boot is too stiff.

since you're in the seattle area...pm me and tell me where you're getting fitted...some shops are better than others around here...

as for boots...i agree that mid level reidell or jackson boots might work for you if you don't have problem feet...

also...if you're at a level to need such equipment...i assume you're taking lessons...which would mean that you have a coach...said coach should also be a good source for advice on equipment...

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do ya ever get the feeling that ms. bielman wishes she'd never done that damn spin???

As everyone said, you really don't need customs right now. Someone in my gamma/delta skating class a looong time ago bought custom SPTeris, and I don't think they help her that much. I learned all my edges, some of my spins, and was trying a loop by the time my low end made-for-recreational-skating-haha Riedells had broken down so much I couldn't do back crossovers anymore.

I now have stock SPTeris (in a combination size since my feet are wide), and it's been a long time since I've gotten them so I don't really remember what the break in was like. However, I don't recall having any problems with blisters or numb feet. They were hard to break in compared to the Riedells I had before, but it wasn't as bad as my friend's Harlicks. She battles blisters constantly. Ick.

I haven't heard anything about Graf, other than that they have this special sort of lining that molds to your feet really easily. SPTeris have a wide toe box and a narrow heel, which is what I needed. Harlicks are longer and narrower, but I think it really depends on who fits you. I've seen skaters with reeeeeeaaaaaally narrow Harlicks but my friend's Harlicks fit like my SPTeris.

Not sure how $$$ you're willing to go, but my SPTeris were $580 for boots and blades. Apparently they're able to take me through doubles, if I ever get there, LOL. (I'm willing to bet that my skating classmate paid a lot more for her customs.) My old Riedells were $175 and they came with the blades, but I think they were too low level for what I was doing back then.

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"The ice is finer when the zombie goes over it!" - said by an excited 5-year-old at the rink

"The life you've led is in fact not the totality of what is possible for you." - John Partridge of Wheaton College (and a Matrix philosopher )

Count me in as another Riedell fan. I skated in Riedell's for 6 years way back in the day and although they weren't a perfect fit, they were the best fit due to my misshapen feet! Nothing else even came close to fitting the same. Mind you, since then there may be many differences in boots or new boots out there but I have remained loyal to Riedell.

Thanks for all the lovely responses! My first inclination was that I did not need to spend so much money on skates, so I picked up a few pair of really crappy skates on eBay. Then I spent a little but not too much more on the used Klingbeils. Throughout this my roomate has been telling me I need good skates. Though stubborn, I finally gave in to his way of thinking after selling my laptop and having money burning a hole in my pocket.

Unfortunately, I didn't get any of the responses before going, but I ended up deciding on a pair of Graf Edmontons. They had a size 10.5 in stock, and though my feet measured as a size 11, they fit so well and were SO unbelievably comfortable that I bought them right then and there. They weren't any cheaper than Teris though...after a 15% discount I still paid just under $400 for the boots. I don't mind the expense though - I figure this is an investment that I'll use for a few years to come, and I really am enjoying skating so far.

Since I got boots that were in stock, I only have to wait for blades, so my waiting time is only a few days instead of a few weeks. The fitter highly recommended Coronation Ace blades, but after much deliberation I decided to splurge and go with MK Gold Stars. The cost of these hurt...as it was a more than double that of the Aces...but I took a big swallow and decided on them, because they really appealed to me - both the tapered edges and what the fitter told me about the metal (they are harder to bend by accident, and the metal is of a better quality). Plus my roomate tells me this is what Todd Eldredge uses, and though I know that I'll never be as good, it's nice to dream.

I figure any limitations I face in skating now can't be blamed on the skates! I don't find many things that I really like and stick with like I have been with skating, so I don't mind splurging when I do.


blades - FYI, I bought the skates at OlympicView Arena. I stopped by Highland first the other day, but the fitter at OlympicView seemed more knowledgeable and helpful (he also put the best sharpening I've ever seen on my old skates).

Also, I don't have a coach yet, I've just been teaching myself. I bought more than I need, but I do intend to get coaching at some point soon - I wanted to have a decent pair of skates first.

Be sure to find someone experienced with those tapered edges to sharpen them.

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Do you have a coach?

If so, s/he should be telling you what kind of skates and blades you need.

My daughter had two pairs of used Reidell goldstars until her coach told her she needed something stronger for jumps...we got Harlicks high testers, stock, but they build the skate according to drawings (many) of your feet, and blades for the level of jumps. They were great, perfect.

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loveskating

"I just get giddy every time I watch Sasha Cohen skate..." My daughter said that.

Most certainly. After spending that much on them, I won't be taking them anywhere but to the guy I bought them from for sharpening. He does a fantastic job, and though it costs a bit more to get them sharpened there than the only other place I've had skates sharpened, he takes his time sharpening them and makes them as perfect as possible.

I had him sharpen my old blades, and he started off by using a tool to straighten one of the blades which was not perfectly straight, and with both used marker all along the bottom and then went over them very lightly with the stone, so that you could see the slight unevenness of the previous sharpening. He was also very flexible on the depth of the bore, whereas before I was not given any option (they simply did a 1/2" bore). I had him make them closer to 7/16" (I'll discuss/question that more in another thread). When finished sharpening spots down the entire length of both sides of the blade with a fingernail to ensure the sharpness, and applied a bit of blade polish as a finishing touch.

He gave me the same warning as you when I started considering the tapered blades, but after experiencing the sharpening he did, I didn't need any further encouragement to always go back to the same place. It's nice to find somebody that's really good at something, especially when it's something that directly affects your skating.

Wow. You not only got way too much boot, but WAY WAY WAY too much blade. I'm doing triples and I'm not even using Gold Seals- I have the level below which is a pattern 99 (Gold Seal is the John Wilson brand version of Gold Stars- and from what I hear, it's much better). But Gold Seal/Gold Star are pretty much an honor to wear, the last step up in your career to refine everything about your skating. They're not blades for learning your doubles, and certainly not your singles. I know it's your money and your feet and everything, but I strongly urge you to cancel your order and get Coronation Aces. You are going to have a very hard time learning basics in Gold Stars- I know of a boy who returned the blades after trying them for a few days (and he was doing up to double axel) because he and his coach agreed it was just too much blade for his level.

You can, absolutely, buy too good of equipment for what you need. I know of a world-class elite athlete who takes a couple of weeks to break in Edmonton Specials, so that translates to....months/years for you. That's not gonna be fun, that's really going to halt your progress. If on top of that you throw in a blade that there is no way you can possibly understand how to harness yet, you're really only going to go backwards in terms of progress. I'm glad your fitter tried to convince you to buy a blade appropriate for your level, but I'm shocked he let you walk away with a Gold Star order form, that's just crazy. That's like taking up ballet and expecting a week later to be dancing on Grishko pointe shoes. Things with skating take a lot of time, and it's one thing for which investing "for years to come" is absolutely worthless. In years to come, you'll need new blades no matter how much they cost you, cause you'll eventually run out of metal to sharpen. And by then, you probably still won't need Gold Stars. It's not an insult- as I said, I don't even use them- and neither do about three-quarters of my friends. They're an elite blade, for elite skaters. To everyone else, it's a waste of money. Please reconsider?

I agree with stardust....you got WAY too much blade.

Really, you will have trouble learning even 3-turns with those.

Even Phantoms might be too much!

By the time you need Gold Stars, if ever you get to doing triples, you will long have out-sharpened them and they will be useless. The blades go before the boots do for beginners like you. Stick with the boot, but yes, please change to a blade more appropraite for you.

You arent losing any QUALITY of blade by going with Aces...you are getting a completely different blade, but still high quality. It would be like you going skiing for the first season and trying out parabolic skiis that are 200 in length...hard to handle and learn the basics. It would be like taking up biking and hopping on Lance's highly specialized bike. It is NOT like picking up a higher priced basketball, where the skill really lies in the person and not the equipment. Whether you have a ball made of plastic or pig skin, you will shoot the same. SO NOT TRUE with skating.

i'm with the above posters. It really is too much blade and boot. the boots are probably going to be so stiff, your feet won't be happy. and the blade, you're going to have a harder time learning basics and spins and jumps and turns. It'll feel like you're fighting the blade.

I'm skating in a pair of jackson competitors, which have a pair of ultima blades on them. For what i'm doing (single jumps, with spins way better than jumps) those skates work just fine. After the initial adjustment time, I'm not fighting with the skates or blades, and the improvement is a lot faster.

seriously, if you can, cancel the blade order, and maybe even look into returning the boots. isn't the edmonton's the highest level boot graf makes? not to be pessimistic, but you may very well be miserable in those skates and blade.

I agree with stardust and md2be...I only started in Grafs when I started doing double axels and triples, and I use a Gold Seal ...but on a different note, it's easier to adjust to a Graf Ed Special because grafs usually tend to be an easier boot to break in than say, Risports, SP's or Harlicks.

The blade though, is just way too advanced. I used to work at a skating store and fitted boots and blades for advanced skaters, and never would I have put a skater working on singles on a blade that advanced. It's too much money and like the others said, even the most basic of skills will be tough. I remember I had to relearn a camel spin with the Gold Seals, and it was hard to find my centre of gravity and get comfortable on the blade.

Anyways, I hope whatever you choose benefits your skating, although I do hope you'd reconsider

Holy crap, Graf Edmontons and Gold Stars for learning the WALTZ jump????!!!! I can't help but feel your skates fitter ripped you off.... Or I can't believe he let you have your way with those choices, especially the blades. ITA that these skates are for someone doing TRIPLES or at least all doubles. Your skates fitter told you Gold Stars won't BEND as easily? You're not gonna bend any blades, oh my god! Are quads in your plans for the near future? And don't they have an 8 inch radius? That's gonna be a pain learning spins and turns. So yeah, that's about $1000 for not even Freestyle 1. I would REALLY advise you to reconsider your purchases.

I just have to keep adding....

I have been skating for 24 years and still do doubles, and I never used stiffer boots than Riedell Imperials (or equivalent)...which is not their top line. It is right above Royals (WHICH I HIGHLY REC. FOR YOU!!!!).

I am older now, and have had my current pair for 5 years. I still do doubles, but I dont skate more than 4-5 times a month, which is why they have lasted so long. More importantly, I have had to have these UN-ENFORCED (meaning: a layer of leather taken OUT) because after 3 years of skating on them and doing doubles, I still hadnt broken them in enough. And Im pretty tough on them.

You have purchased boots stiffer than this, and you are skating less aggressively.

Check out Riedell Royals and Professional Blades...that is what I started on. (If they still make Professional blades).

Also, if you are size 11 and only went down .5 in boot size, I might suggest that they are actually too big! Usually skates run 1-2 sizes smaller than shoes. For serious fit, they should feel like Chinese foot binding! But for you, just make sure you can wiggle your toes a very little amount.

OK...lol..Riedell has completely changed their boot names since I last bought....


anyway....this is a guide. It is there for a reason...so people dont buy boots that will make learning miserable. Youd do well in a Gold Medallion or even a Bronze Star boot...but nothing more. I suggest you look up similar index guides at the websites of Graf and other skate manuf. They spend a lot of time and money designing boots which will help skaters at each level.

http://www.riedellskates.com/ice/index.html (click on "ICE" then on "Recs")

Here is the blade I rec to all my interm. skaters:
http://www.riedellskates.com/blades/index.html (click on INterm. and look for Professionals)

Thats true, md2be, about skate sizes, especially grafs. They should be sized 1.5-2.5 sizes smaller than what your foot measures on the stick...

Yikes.

I will say...you 'sound' a bit more knowledgable in general than your average beginner skater...but there's so much to learn about this sport that may not be readily evident at first, that it's easy to make mistakes for the first few years, at least.

Here's the advice I would have given you from the start.

Do these skates fit reasonably well otherwise? I would take these to the pro shop first, check for 'proper' fit, and see if you can get the toe box punched or stretched to accommodate your toes. A good fitter should be able to tell you whether that's do-able for your Klingbeils.


First off, how tight are you lacing these boots? If you're lacing them too tightly around the hooks, I'm not surprised about the ankle pain. Also, sometimes the tongue of a boot will shift slightly, and put pressure in strange places. This is not, in itself, a reason to ditch the boots and get new ones. (You think you have ankle pain now.....just wait for break-in of a new pair!) Again, a good pro shop can do a number of things to adjust the boots you've got so that they work for you.

I will also say that even though the boots were used, they were broken in to someone else's foot. It still takes a bit of adjustment and break-in time so that the boot will mold to your foot.

You sound like you like the Klingbeils....so really, I'd try to adjust those first. Remember....breaking in new skates, even heat-molded Grafs, is often no picnic...you may not be able to keep new ones on for more than an hour for a while, and break-in pain can really be a doozy sometimes.

How are the blades on the Klingbeils? If they're still good, why not just transfer the blades onto new boots, if you do in fact decide that new boots are called for? Check for proper blade/boot sizing fit, but if it works....

Different boots work for different people, and even then, not all the time. All boots can be great, or all boots can suck. It's very much an individual thing...each time. I love my SP Teri's...yes, they are a very *ahem* solid boot, but then I trash skates, normally, so I need and like a stiff boot. I certainly wouldn't recommend my Super Teris for someone who isn't really jumping yet....oh, the pain.



Really, what this sounds like is a case of 'bigger/better is better'. Which is so untrue in skating, it's not even funny. The 'best' boots for someone else are not likely to be the best for you. Too much boot (and blade) can be damaging, both for your feet and body, and for your skating.

Did the pro shop guy that originally suggested Graf for you...perhaps sell Graf? I'm just saying...some people can be so eager to make a sale that they don't stick as closely as they should to discovering what the best product for a customer is. This can also lead to upselling (bigger profit margin, I imagine, though I'm not sure).

I'm with the others....you got sold too much for your level. When you're finally at a suitable level for these products, then go back and get them. But they'll just get in the way at the moment, and make you feel that you wasted your money...which in a way, you did.