Hello,

I am going to Hackensack for the first time. This is more first time traveling anywhere for skating and I am at an utter loss as to what to pack. Do people typically bring 2 outfits for each day at camp...One for on-ice and one for off-ice or wear the same thing for both on and off-ice activities? How is the food situation? Is the rink typically cold?

Any help would be greatly appreciated

TIA

Hi Tia,

I look forward to seeing you! The Ice House is my home rink and I'll be attending the camp as well as working registration tomorrow afternoon and Saturday morning. Regarding your questions, although you certainly can bring two outfits per day if you'd like, it's not necessary. The most important thing is to be comfortable both on and off the ice. Whatever you normally wear to practice should be just fine.

The Ice House is a four sheet facility. The on-ice temperature tends to decrease from Rink 1 as you go down to Rink 4. At this point I'm not sure if we'll be on rinks 3 or 4 yet but these two rinks are noticably colder than rinks 1 and 2. (At least it feels that way to me.) Regardless of which sheet of ice I'm on when I skate at the Ice House, I typically wear a sweater or warm-up jacket that I can just unzip and take off if I get warm and then I just skate in a long or short sleeve t-shirt depending on how I feel.

I am not sure if you signed up for the buffet lunch on both days or not. If you did not, there is a snack bar at the Ice House that serves breakfast and lunch. In addition there are a number of restaurants and diners in the area that are within a five to ten minute drive of the rink. (Burger King, McDonalds, Cheesecake Factory, etc.)

If you have any other questions please feel free to shoot me a PM or just tap me on the shoulder over the weekend if you need anything.

Take care and I look forward to meeting you.

Frank

I went to the Hackensack camp a couple of years ago and found the rinks very cold. Especially on Sunday morning since it was pretty early. BTW, try hard to make it to your first Sunday session. When I was there, only about half the group showed up (at 8 am!) and as a result it was really great for those of us that did. Cold, but great.

I wore the same clothes for the on- and off-ice work, leggings with a T-shirt or long sleeved shirt and one or two fleece. Or a t-shirt with a warmer long sleeved shirt and a fleece. You will do some standing around watching, so that's why you may want to go with layers and when you get warm, you can always take one layer off.

I think I bought the food they had arranged for for the camp both days and it was okay. It was a hot meal, but I can't recall exactly what it was. There is a snack bar there where you can get something else, too. I also tend to bring some fruit and/or granola bars to snack on. You probably won't be able to run out to get something to eat somewhere else (due to time and fatigue!) but you should be able to find something to eat at the rink.

I also bring extra of the essentials when I travel for skating: extra tissues, extra knee-highs, extra pair of leggings or tights (depending on whether I'm wearing dresses or leggings), extra pair of gloves. And I have a bigger skate bag I use when I travel, since I'm hauling all this extra crap.

Have fun at the camp and let us know how it went!

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August 22, back on the ice!

Very cold rinks. Bring two separate outfits for each day for comfort, because you will be doing a lot of "cold sweating," and want something fresh for the next day. I've been known to change my top 1/2 way through the day for comfort, too. You'll have a blast--it is so much fun!

See everyone tomorrow!

Foodie Alert: I highly recommend "White Manna" Hamburgers! It's right across the McDonald's on River St. With grilled onions...their burgers are DA BOMB!!!

Can't wait to go back to Hackensack again this Christmas for more "White Manna" burgers!!!

__________________
Cheers,
jazzpants

11-04-2006: Shredded "Pre-Bronze FS for Life" Club Membership card!!!
Silver Moves is the next "Mission Impossible"
(Dare I try for Championship Adult Gold someday???)

Thank you for the support, you guys!!!

Okay, so i'm the clueless one...where is Hackensack?

I'm worried about driving out to NJ tomorrow from the City... something about the GWB on a Friday before a long weekend sounds like a really bad idea. What happens tomorrow (I don't have a private lesson planned), and is it critical to be there? I can make the drive if I have to, and may do it in any case to figure out where the rink is, but it's not really going to be a fun trip tomorrow.

Hackensack is in New Jersey. (Or "Jersey" as I was told was the proper term to say amongst the locals...not sure if that's really true though...) It's about almost an hour from New York City to there. (Allowing for traffic...)

__________________
Cheers,
jazzpants

11-04-2006: Shredded "Pre-Bronze FS for Life" Club Membership card!!!
Silver Moves is the next "Mission Impossible"
(Dare I try for Championship Adult Gold someday???)

Thank you for the support, you guys!!!

It's "Joisey!"
And methinks it's not an hour, unless you're traveling from Long Island. (Heck, last year and the year before, I drove from my home town in upper Westchester County, and it took only an hour.)

The GWB can be a nightmare (tune to 1010AM for those traffic updates).

You might want to consider driving north and crossing the Hudson at the Tappan Zee--though I can imagine that getting there mihgt not exactly be a picnic either. But it's nice to have options.

Have fun, everyone, at the camp. Looking forward to hearing about your ventures and experiences. ...

__________________
Doubt whom you will, but never yourself.
"Do what you love, and you'll never have to work a day in your life."
-Haha, I've *arrived*! I am listed as a reference on Wikipedia.

HA!!! I expected a former "Neu Yawker" to respond!!!

Re: Traveling from LI vs Westchester to Hackensack: the average speed of the person driving from Westchester would be higher since, once you are in Westchester, all you would be thinking about is how to leave it as fast as possible.

__________________
Cheers,
jazzpants

11-04-2006: Shredded "Pre-Bronze FS for Life" Club Membership card!!!
Silver Moves is the next "Mission Impossible"
(Dare I try for Championship Adult Gold someday???)

Thank you for the support, you guys!!!

Any reports?

__________________
Adult Nationals, 2009 "The Time of My Life"

Just back from the camp and it seemed like everyone had a great time. Smaller this year - only about 70 skaters, but I think that is because of the holiday weekend. I was on the pairs track and there were only 3 teams, so we got a lot of attention. Marcy Hinzman and Aaron Parchem did a great job with us, and we also had some good ballet and stretch classes from Christine. For us pairs, it was a packed agenda and we all got a lot out of it.

Tim

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~
People dream of flying, birds dream of skating.

Very fun, VERY sore today. I was in the competitive singles track, and my biggest complaint was that my group was too big. It really limited the amount of individual feedback we got. Also, I think the expectation from the way the groups were assigned was that everyone in group 1 had a strong flip and lutz, and that wasn't really the case.

Craig was the coach who challenged me the most during his toe jump and jump combination class (attempting my first double toe in a long time, landing a few axel-toes and axel-loops), and I really appreciated that. Emily taught combo jumps with him and was a sweetheart. She comiserated with me about how it's not fair to land the hard jump and fall on the easy one after I fell on the single toe part of an axel-toe loop.

Edward's moves seminar was really good, and though it wasn't anything new to hear, it always helps me to have everything spelled out completely. He was really nice and worked with three of us on junior moves during the open session at the end. I'll be the first to admit that my moves are weak, but everything he said reinforced exactly what my coaches say. While not really that shocking (don't stick your butt out is kind of a universal comment!), it's nice to have another set of (very well-regarded) eyes to know that my coaches and I are on the right track. His spin class was really challenging because he made us do every spin from the t position, which just highlights every (and there are many) weaknesses in your technique.

Christine did a ballet class with us on Saturday and stretch on Sunday. Because of the class size, there was no room to use the barre, so we did barre without the barre, which just makes everything harder! Stretch was first thing Sunday morning, and thank god for it, because most of us were really sore from Saturday!

Vakhtang led an off-ice jump class that focused more on plyometric drills for explosiveness than jump rotation, which I really liked. I felt that he could have pushed us a bit harder in the on ice class. He was funny and was joking around with Edward during the small junior moves class. He's got incredible edges!

Suzana taught combination spins and worked really well with our large group. Her advice was helpful, and I really liked her teaching style. She also taught choreography and music interpretation, the latter with Christine. I'm someone who has a lot of difficulty stringing together even the most basic moves, so those classes were mentally challenging but fun.

Peter and Naomi taught stroking to both competitive groups combined, and I'm not going to complain about standing around waiting when it means watching Peter! But the group was pretty big, although they kept it moving really well. I think the level range was a big challenge in that class as well.

I think that covers all of our classes. I'm being nitpicky about some of them, but only because the overall experience was great! I liked the intimacy of a small camp, but would have liked to have more of a chance to meet the ice dancers and recreational track singles skaters. I would definitely go back, and hopefully this year's small size won't mean anything bad for camp in future years.

I had an absolute ball. This was my first time traveling for skating or attending a skating seminar of any type so I was really nervous but everyone was sooo friendly and it was nice to see other adult skaters.
I was in the recreational singles track and it was a good fit for me. We were all at about the same level and there were other rotationally challenged skaters there (yeah!) so for the breakdown:

The first day we worked on edge jumps and toe jumps first thing in the morning. Vahtung looked at our group and said "ok let's see your axel". The silence was deafening. He then came back to reality and we worked on the waltz, salchow, and loop. At the end of every mini-jump session we had to do one jump in front of the group which I found very nerve racking. I have never been put on the spot to skate in front of other people. I quickly got over it. Toe jumps with Craig was a lot of fun and for the rest of the day we did spins, ballet, off-ice training, and choreography. I was thoroughly pooped by the end of the day and instead of going into NYC as planned, I went back to the hotel and slept.

On day 2, we crammed in combo jumps, stretching, music interpretation, stroking, and moves. The highlight of the day though was the open session at the end. The competitive folks were on rink one so it was just the recreational skaters one rink 2 and most of us were too tired to do anything. The few of us who stayed to practice were basically just getting private lessons. I worked on loops with Marcy Hinzmann and Edward attempted to fix my 3 turn pattern. The best part though is when I was just playing around trying to incorporate the tips Marcy gave me into my pathetic loop attempts I see Emily skating toward me. She said I looked like I was having fun and could she work with me (like I was going to say no ) on the loop some more (she spent time trying to fix it that morning). I had a fabulous time and will definitely be back next year.

Oh and Jazzpants, I tried White Manna burgers. There are fabulous even though I did get a look when I said no to the pickles. I hate them and apparently that is a crime in NJ.

I have taken a private lesson with Edward before... BOY IS HE SCARY STRICT!!! (But... I'm used to and like strict!!! )

LOL!!! Yeah, I just pick the pickles out when they're not lookin' (I hate pickles too!!!)

Mmmm...nothing like White Manna burgers to totally blow your diet on!!!

__________________
Cheers,
jazzpants

11-04-2006: Shredded "Pre-Bronze FS for Life" Club Membership card!!!
Silver Moves is the next "Mission Impossible"
(Dare I try for Championship Adult Gold someday???)

Thank you for the support, you guys!!!

Wellllll ... I was just crushed. I went home halfway through the first ice session for recreational singles, and I didn't come back.

I'm still getting the hang of three-turns and mohawks, and when the instructor asked to see our axels, toe loops and salchows, I thought he was joking. I hadn't done so much as a waltz jump. When the crowd started to run through their jumps, I realized that this camp -- despite what was advertised -- was no place for a beginner. I didn't want to waste the instructor's time and I felt that I would endanger all the other skaters, who clearly knew what they were doing. So that was it for me.

Everyone else seemed to be having a terrific time. It seemed to be a worthwhile and fun program. I was inspired by so many women, of all ages, shapes and sizes, trying to do their best. I wouldn't hesitate to return next year, so long as I have the skills. And I'll definitely spread the word around my home ice -- the more adults, the better!

Sorry to hear it didn't go as you had hoped. For the money you spent, I would have stayed and tried to just get something out of the off-ice stuff and the choreo classes, and just listen to the jump stuff for future reference.

I think this highlights a big problem with the way the camp is set up and advertised. My decision not to go was mostly based on finances, but a small part of it was my confusion over which track to sign up for. The descriptions really didn't say a lot. I have competed for over 2 years, but I'm still officially Pre-Bronze and my hardest jump is the loop. I felt like the competitive track was most suited to my approach to skating and my goals, but I figured everybody else there would have all their singles (and from Kelli's post, I see that I was right) and I worried that the recreational track would be for real beginners and that I might be bored. It sounds like that might have been the best place for me, although I'd be curious if any "competitive" skaters did that track and what they thought of it.

I hope that in future years, the organizers clearly describe what skills are needed/found in each track and make recommendations for registration. The camp is way too expensive (even the recreational track) for skaters to waste their time and money.

And not to sound snippy, but who/what gave the instructors the idea that recreational skaters would be able to do an axel? If I had an axel, even if I never competed, I wouldn't sign up for a "recreational" track. Don't the organizers know what various adult skating levels mean as far as skills?

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Terri C is a Bronze lady!
Gold Moves, here I come!

Not to be offensive, but there are indeed some adult skaters out there that are recreational and have axels, doubles etc and don't compete. There are some that even have never competed!

It all depends on each individual's goals and purposes in skating. Some people do it for fun. Competing isn't for everyone.

Back in the day, a lot of the women elites did triples for FUN. Brian Boitano could even do a quadruple toe-loop. However none of these people competed with those jumps.

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Keep Evolving. "From this moment forward, every voice that told you - You Can't - , has been silenced." - Freedom Writers

I'm sure there are, but as I said, if I had an axel and were going to do this camp, I would sign up for the competitive track, even if I didn't compete, b/c the way the tracks were framed, it would seem that the competitive track was for those with more advanced skills.

The point I was trying to make was that since those who signed up for the recreational track were likely at a fairly low level in FS (based on the (little) info given about the tracks), it would have made more sense to at least ask the participants what jumps they could do before expecting them to do an axel - it sounds to me like the axel was part of that particular jump class for both tracks...but shouldn't an adjustment be made depending on the track?

Which goes back to my previous post - much more description about the tracks and skill level they are catering to is needed.

__________________
Terri C is a Bronze lady!
Gold Moves, here I come!

I know at least two skaters like that, so I can understand. I think the problem is that based on what I've read on the brochure,

Who knows... I'm not that big on skating camps myself, based on my experience with the Kathy Casey seminar that I've been to a few years back. If I was going there just to meet celebs, that's one thing. But my intention is to learn how to skate! And looking at the different tracks, I don't know about you, but even the recreational track is ....ummm... very physically intensive session there!!!

And call me greedy, but I want the coaches ALL to myself to learn what *I* want to learn!!! LOL!!!!

FallDownGoBoom: I'm sad that you didn't have a good time. Did you talk with Craig M about this... or you just "up and left?" If you had just "up and left", it's a shame, b/c at least if you talked with Craig M about it you two would have worked out something to get to the point where at least you get some cool skating tips and do the off-ice training at least. As of now, there's no way the organizers can deal with your particular situation, b/c they didn't know there was an issue. And they're not mind-readers (and who knows if they're reading skatingforum.com ) Get my drift?

__________________
Cheers,
jazzpants

11-04-2006: Shredded "Pre-Bronze FS for Life" Club Membership card!!!
Silver Moves is the next "Mission Impossible"
(Dare I try for Championship Adult Gold someday???)

Thank you for the support, you guys!!!

I understand this point. However, I think it's important to note that there is no difference in a coach asking "Can you do an axel?" and a coach saying "Please do an axel." and a student responding "I haven't worked on axels yet." I can assure you that even with the higher level competitive group, although we were encouraged to push ourselves and attempt new elements even if we weren't completely comfortable with them, nobody was "expected" to deliver any particular element. For example, since the Ice House is my home rink, Craig is pretty familiar with my skating and he knows I've toyed with double jumps from time to time. He asked me to try a double sal. I explained to him that I am currently re-working this jump on the harness with another coach and that I would prefer to not try this jump on my own yet since I am having technical issues with it. However, I did propose something else to work on and he agreed. No harm. No foul.

Although I do think that the application packet could be better constructed (and I'd love to help with this and other adminstrative tasks regarding the camp and will tell Craig so when I see him this week), I don't think it's indispensible that a list of technical elements be included. First, it's impractical since technical ability will vary within a group based on enrollment from year to year. Secondly, nobody is forced to do anything they're not comfortable doing. Including a "list of elements" defeats that philosophy. Lastly, if a skater feels that they're better off in another group for whatever reason, they are more than welcome to speak to the staff and they will be moved into whatever group they feel is appropriate. Group assignments are made for logistical purposes (scheduling ice time, scheduling coaches, etc.). However, the staff recognizes that not every assignment will work out perfectly and skaters are encouraged to speak up with their concerns if they are not getting the most from their experience.

One final point: at the conclusion of the camp several of the club members who participated in the camp realized that there was no evaluation distributed this year. As a result, I'd like to ask any of the camp participants to PM me or e-mail me with any concerns, issues or suggestions they might have regarding the camp. I, in turn, will share this information with the club and staff at the Ice House.

It was great to meet everyone that attended the camp this weekend. My best wishes to all of you.

Take care,

Frank

FrankR, thanks for offering to take up concerns and suggestions.


The literature should be more specific: "Participants must have a familiarity with toe loop, salchow and axel and a desire to fine-tune them." If beginners can be accommodated, that should be clear: "Skaters who have not jumped will be instructed in cross-overs, edges, etc., and introduced to the waltz jump." When I registered, I had put far too much faith in the phrase, "This camp is for everyone."

The welcome packet should include a map of the facilities. I wandered quite some time before I found the ballet class.

Instructors should introduce themselves and say what they'll be working on. I might have stuck around if the coach had said he would divide us into, say, three groups based on ability. Also, organizers should make it clear when the schedule has changed. The first class for recreational singles, for instance, was to be choreography. Instead, it was jumps -- and that instantly threw me into a panic. My thinking was this: If I can't get through the first on-ice session, how will I get through the rest of the day?!

Hi,

I'm sorry you felt as you did and that you didn't enjoy your experience. As I said, I'll share how you felt with the staff and include your feedback. Hopefully you'll be willing to give it another shot and your expectations will then be met.

Take care,

Frank

FallDownGoBoom, it's too bad that you didn't talk to Craig-- I was literally the lowest level skater there (4months of lts classes and no crossovers, much less jumps), and about half of my recreational singles group couldn't jump... so all of the coaches worked with us to do what we could do. During jumps, Craig divided us up and the non-jump people picked the skills we worked on-- Emily Hughes even helped me with backwards stroking (sad but true)!

I definitely would encourage adults of any level to take part in this-- I came away having learned so much and encouraged by all of the rest of you who were so much better than me (and tried to make me feel better by encouraging me!)

Next year, I'll be back-- with a jump and crossovers!

Naomi and Peter are now Pairskaters. And, that's all I have to say.