Has anyone here ever competed against kids/teens as an adult skater?

I've done it in dance, where it's really not a big deal. Steps are the same and age really isn't an issue.

But this past weekend, my silver free event was cancelled at our local competition because I was the only one to sign up. After watching open juv (age 13 and up, no upper age cap, must have pre-juv or juv free) and the oldest group of pre-juv, I wish I had asked to be moved into one or the other. I would have been 10-12 yrs older than the oldest skater out there (they were all in high school), but it would have been an opportunity to get another performance under my belt without having to travel. I wouldn't have cared if I got beat by all the kids because it would have just been more for the experience, although after watching both of these groups I totally would have held my own in either group (only 1 of the 4 open juvs landed a double, none were clean on their axels, and only 1 of the pre-juvs had a clean axel). I skate on sessions with most of the teenagers in both events and the parents know me, I'm usually in the same group with them at test sessions. (The kids actually look up to me and think I'm cool...obviously they don't know what cool is.) I don't think anyone would have cared if a 28 yr old were out there. Maybe next year this might be a good way to compete more without having to travel. I test standard track, so having the right tests isn't an issue for me.

It might also be good to see how I score under IJS, since some competitions use it for open juv.

And at the very least, I think it's a good way to demonstrate "look, you can still skate when you're an adult!" After all, these high school kids who are competing, regardless of what level, will be our age class I adult skaters before we know it.

Has anyone had good/bad experiences with this? (I know I've seen a few masters skaters doing it to see how their programs are scored under IJS but a 20-something competing senior is different than a 20-something competing pre-juv).

Parents/coaches, how would you feel if your teenage skater were competing against someone in their mid-late 20s who, test-wise, was at the appropriate level (provided there was no equivalent adult event offered, or it was cancelled due to lack of entries)?

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I'm not sure where the crossover points are - there's a sticky at the top of this forum list for link. One of them includes the USFSA standard to adult track crossovers for (I think) Adult Nats. Each competition form includes their own restrictions as well, so read carefully. I read one last week that said skaters who have ANY standard/adult tests cannot compete in Basic Skills events.

When I competed back in the 1980's, I had to skate against 12 years olds in my one-and-only USFSA competiton because there WAS NOTHING ELSE for adults to do. After I skated, one of the judges came to me and said that they could not give me a win because of my age. Discrimination? Absolutely! That's why I didn't test or compete in USFSA any further. I went the ISI route and had a great time. You're fortunate that rules have evolved so that you could be offered an opportunity like this.

The disadvantages are that the younger skater's parents will think you have some sort of an advantage - size, skill, age, etc. or that you'll be a distraction to their skaters, which is dangerous on warmups. Gossip will result (regardless of how much you think they like you) and you will be forging new territory.

The advantage is your maturity and probably preparedness. You're well liked, so people might just consider it a curiosity until you start winning. Then you might hear sandbagging allegations, lol.

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Hmm. The way I see it, if it's older kids v adults on the same level, there may not be such a big discrepancy in skills.

I think that kids v adults is rather similar to males v girls. Kids may not have developed muscles and necessary stamina in comparison to adults. There will always be talks that the adult is stronger and had more experience etc. Males will definitely have a biological advantage (given that they have went through puberty). Girls may have the stereotypical "flair for artistry"(a load of bullocks I tell you).

There will always be differences.
I'm 18 and I may mind competing against smaller bodies- better jumps, nicer spirals. And some of the younger skaters may mind that I have more strength. I competed against guys in solo compulsories under ISI, and I certainly see the advantage they have with jumps and speed.

The issue lies with whether the rules allow merging of similar ability groups and whether the competitors are agreeable. You could always ask what would happen if there isn't sufficient competitors...

My two cents...

I competed against a kid in dance at the Grand Rapids Open in 2007 (and I beat her, much to her mother's chagrin!), but like you said, age isn't really a factor there.

When I first started competing again as an adult, I skated against the kids in Pre-Pre (this was before the minimum age for adults was changed to 21). I think my next oldest competitor was at least 8 years younger than me (I was 24 at the time) and I very rightfully came in last place.

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I've got mad salchow disease!

I skated at an event in UT where the YA (young adult) was combined with gold and masters. We had a 20 y/o boy with 2A in our group, I was 40 another skater was 50 and a few more in their 30's. The boy fell on everything, fully rotated and sat, I managed 2 axels and 2 double toes, the 50 y/o did an axel and a nice double loop attempt. Needless to say the young man came in a disappointing 3rd amongst a field of women all of who could have been his mothers. He was not pleased, as he perceived he was a regional Novice contender.

If you skate and win against the children often it may foster hard feelings, if you do it once in a while to see you IJS score it might be deemed as more acceptable. The adult tracks were made to keep the adults and the children seperate, I would only skate against the children in free skate if you had no other choice. JMHO

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A lot of these "kids" as I call them are 16, 17 year old young women who, in terms of size and strength, may not be physically stronger but are probably in better shape, not to mention more agile. (Oh to be 17 again.)

I wasn't planning on doing this frequently. But once a year or so when my rink hosts a competition a month before ANs, just to get another performance under my belt, or in the late summer after I have a new program choreographed so I can compete it before Peach or Buckeye, or to just get a little IJS experience, it might be worthwhile. (Or our other local silver ladies who didn't compete this year for various reasons will compete next year...or some of the bronzes will moved up...this will solve my problem, at least until I move up to gold and am the only gold in the area!)

If people would have a problem with it and want to gossip, I guess it's their problem, not mine.

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2010-2011 goals:
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Well I am 59 and I was dumb enough to test my Introductory Interpretive 2 years ago at Nationals (and pass) which put me in a group the following year with women who were 25 years my junior ..... dumb, dumb, dumb! With a 25 year age difference and WAY more skating experience than me, I finished 10th out of 10.

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Dianne
(A.O.S.S.? Got it BAD! )

I competed against kids 3 times at the Grand Rapids Open, twice because they had no adult category to put me into and had me up against some 12 year olds, and once because they needed someone to compete a dance. I felt awkward about competing against kids and almost pulled out each time, but the kids looked up to me because I was a good sport, cheered them on, and they saw me as one of them.

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Champagne in 2005, 2008, 2009 - who's next out of the pre-bronze club...?

Wang chung!

That's my experience with doing dance against the "kids" (teens...whatever). I actually didn't sign up for it at our competition this weekend because I haven't really been focusing on the two pre-gold dances offered d/t ANs and trying to test the other two first, but all the younger skaters from my club had been bugging me to do it with them. Normally there is a mix of adults and younger skaters at all levels of the dances.

We were able to have a few adult events. There were 2 adult bronzes in that event, and 2 of us signed up for interp (so I at least got to do that). We were our usual adult skater selves, screaming and going nuts for our competitors. The kids/teens around were all just amazed that we can cheer for the person who we're up against, hug each other as one skater is getting on and the other is getting off, etc.

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2010-2011 goals:
Pass Junior MIF test
Don't break anything

That's absolutely true and as long as you're okay with the situation, go for it!

Bravo! ITA

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I competed "as a kid" in a couple of small local competitions. They didn't have an adult gold or masters event, so I competed intermediate with the kids. One year I even did a short program. For the most part the kids totally creamed me, but my coach and I agreed that those programs were some of the best I had skated. Maybe it was motivation. Who knows??

One mom was in the stands apparently very vocally complaining that it wasn't "fair" because I'm way older. Her kid was doing double double combos and placing well at regionals in intermediate. I maybe had a nice double sal on a good day. What another mom told me is that a judge was sitting there and turned around and gave her a piece of her mind. She pointed out that I had a job and got to skate sporadically as compared to kids with springs for legs who get to skate hours each day. I love that lady!!!

Ouch. At least I was 6th out of 7 cuz the 7th one didn't bother to skate, in my comp against kids. But I did have fun doing it.

I do agree though that when skating against kids, you have to compare your performance to your previous performances, not theirs. I was 22, started skating a year previous and I was up against 16 year olds with foolproof axels (they weren't allowed to do more than that) and all sorts of spin combo's, and one 30-something ish lady with like 8 years of experience skating artistic competitions... Well duh! Of course I was gonna lose, lol.
On the other hand, that did mean there was no pressure at all and I skated great. No falls, centered spins, did everything I intended to, even didn't fall on a jump I had started doing 2 weeks previous to the comp (didn't check the landing and had to do a few 3 turns to come out of it but no fall). So looking at it that way... Nothing wrong with skating against kids!

I've competed against kids many times over the past 30-odd years as an adult skater.

To me, it comes down to one question: do you want to skate or do you want to win?

If you just want to get out on the ice and see what you can do on that given day and maybe get some feedback from the judges or just get some milage out of your program/dress/music or just have a good time, then it doesn't matter who you skate against. Younger, older, better, fitter, whatever; it doesn't matter because what the others do isn't your focus.

If, however, you compete in order to see where you stack up against the others in your group, then it's probably best to stick with events where competitiors are close in skill and age.

It's a mental issue, I think, more than physical.

The announcement for our State Championships just came out. Adult divisions are for skaters aged 18+ . I am 49, I'll be 50 later this year. Do I compete against kids? Depends on your definition.

I have to say I am over competing against people who are less than 1/2 my age. When I first skated I was in my early-mid 20s, and was competitive against 18 year olds (and younger). But not now.

Sometimes they split divisions according to age, ie <12 and >12 for a division, even though there's only 3 skaters cos they don't want the 14 year olds feeling bad losing to 8 year olds. I've never yet known them to do that for an adult division, like <35 & >35 or similar, regardless of how many entrants (though the most we've had in Adult Silver has been 3-4).

We also have solo dance. Last year, even though there were only 2 competitors doing dance, it got split so there was an Adult Solo Dance division - but I wonder if that will happen this year. So far they have advertised Elementary & Pre-Preliminary solo, and no option for Adult Solo Dance.

That's my rant over.

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Katz

Saved by Synchro!
I was over it, now I'm into it again !

Gossippy, annoying, obnoxious, snotty skating moms were part of the reason I quit freestyle when I was a kid. (Seriously, even at age 11 I never understood why they had nothing better to do than sit around the rink and talk about whose kid thiers was a better skater than, and trash talk the kids who were better than theirs.) That and the fact that gossippy, annoying, obnoxious, snotty skating moms tend to breed equally obnoxious, annoying skaters. At least when it came to synchro, our coach kept the obnoxious brats in their place and parents were not allowed in the arena when we practiced.

__________________
2010-2011 goals:
Pass Junior MIF test
Don't break anything

You say "adult divisions"- does that mean you are also divided by level? Because if you want to hear "Bullsh*t" let me tell you why I don't skate in Iowa Games- adult is a "level" not an age group. Doesn't matter what adult level you are. If you're an adult, you skate against all the other adults- this year we had 3. This year, in a surprise win (haha) the pre-juv lady, who chose to compete adult instead of standard, took the gold, the prebronze lady the silver, and the brave woman, who really put herself out there because she just wanted a chance to skate alone on the ice, in Basic 4 went home with the bronze.

Yeah, it's not about winning- but when there is that much disparity, they need to be skating against the book. NO ONE should be forced to compete their backward wiggles and one foot glide against someone else with a camel and an axel. (Not to mention you are held to the time limit for your level, so the programs aren't even the same length...)

At least if you are divided by level, in theory (I know- it's a bad theory) an 18 year old prebronze skater should have the level same elements as a 50 year old one.

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-Jessi
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Yeah, the Iowa Games are pretty goofy, because most adult skaters in the state don't compete (I didn't, because I had to work.). In years when more of us competed, they did divide by level. The thing is, it's still a qualifying competition for the State Games of America, so even though those three skaters really couldn't compete "against" each other, by medaling at the Iowa Games they all qualified for the State Games of America where, if they choose to go, they will presumably get to compete against others at their own level.

Were you there last year? It was the same thing, though not so jarring- there were 6 adults, iirc it was something like, 1 gold, 2 silvers, 2 bronze and a no-test. The 3 higher level skaters essentially demanded that it was split into 2 events. Since it wasn't an "everyone medals" situtation- it was entirely unfair for them to be skating against bronze and no-test skaters. But the competition originally just had it as an "adult" event.

Synchro has the same issue. At ISI nationals we compete "adult"- but there are always 2 teams that are so far beyond what the other 3 or 4 teams are at.

Personally, I prefer competiting against kids. The only competition I did, I competed against the same kids in 3 events. I beat them in some, not in others. The only time it was "unfair" was actually to a child- a 5 year old who was put into "high" stroking, because she was a Delta. It was me, and 2 other FS3 skaters against her. On muscle development alone, she had no chance. (I got 2nd in that one- meaning I beat one kid my age, and lost to another.)

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-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

No, I was last able to do it two years ago. It's always like that, though - just an "adult" event that gets subdivided pretty much on the spot so that more people can qualify.

I think you may be talking about the Winter Iowa games because I'm in charge of the Summer Games and we didn't have that situation. The problem is there aren't enough adults signing up. If we had enough, I'd group them by age.

And there is no such thing as skating against the book. If you are the only one in your group, you get a gold medal even if your whole program is a human zamboni - so that's pretty much worthless.

joelle

That's something ISI does well - although I'd hate to lose in a field of just me

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It's all about the dress!

That is funny. My kids just skated with the book in ISI and both got second in their comp programs. I have no clue why people think with the book means first place.Its doesnt in ISI.
USFSA did change which is why you ask to skate up a level or combine age groups.
That said, my kids have always been with older kids and adults.The adults here dont mind, and as my daughter coach says, its called a competion for a reason!

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The ISI printed a clarification in their Jan/Feb 2009 issue:

I always thought of "skating against the book" in ISI like being graded in school: you need to get a "B" or better.

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That is why its harder to be against the book.
If you have two skaters you can place first and not even have a good skate. You just need to be better than skater B. When you are alone, you need 8s or above.My daughter put her hand down on her double sal, which is why the second place.My son didnt land his axel not cheated, so he had 8s from two judges and 7 from the third judge. Second place, even though he had first in his fs program.
We watched a boy in fs 6th place second as well, bad bad camel.
That is why we try and have both kids either skate up or let them skate with older kids. We dont care about the placement, more about the experience of being out there.

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