So my coach has had me doing axel preps(waltz-backspin, loop-backspin, backspin-loop, etc.) and our lessons lately, since December actually have been really focused on my programs for competitions instead of learning new things. She said that after my comp on the 11th, she will have me try the axel, and maybe start on a double(so exciting since it will be my year anniversary of when I started skating). She told me that I could try an axel on my own free time when I practiced, because she thought that I was perfectly capable of getting the height and rotation(and I learn things really fast since I practice ever day) and I told her that I was worried about bad habits forming. So I think she said to not try too many, and told me up and not around and stuff like that, which I already knew. So. Basically my point is:

1. Do you think it is safer to just wait until she has the time to go through it with me?

2. If you answered no to the above question, what advice do you have for me, in order for me to not kill myself trying this jump.

IMO, I'd wait. YOur'e totally right to be concerned about getting bad habits, and you won't be able to see what you're doing wrong by trying it yourself. I spent literally YEARS undoing bad habits from an old axel. I'd wait until she has the time to go through it with you. Keep doing the preps, those are really beneficial.

Sounds like you do learn things really fast, learning an axel after a year of skating in a good accomplishment!

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I'd actually attempt to try it on your own a few times. You'll never get it if you don't practice, obviously. Next lesson, you can show your coach what you've been working on and he/she can correct any bizarre issues you might be having.

Honestly, when I was learning my axel, I did it from a standstill and just did a side-hop and jumped into it. Once I got it that way, I started learning how to do it from a back edge. When I work on my double axel, I start with a right forward outside edge and then switch to my left foot and take off. Either of these forward approaches work well when first learning the jump. Good luck!

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"Without Vision the People Perish"
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Like WhisperSung said, I also think it's good to start learning the Axel from a standstill. That's actually what my coach tells me. It might be also a good idea to use harness, which I personally never tried but I heard it helps. Good luck with your Axel!

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Maybe I'll try it a small amount of times, if I'm brave enough, the day before my next lesson, that way, I wouldn't be getting muscle memory for bad technique, and she could fix it the next day anyway? I got two completely different responses, so.. not sure what to do.

doing it from standstill seemed to be more difficult for me but most people say it helps them.

Harness helped alot.

If you are worried about doing it wrong you could just try waltz backspins but kida try and rotate more in the air, then jsut finish it on the ice. I don't think it will make any really bad habits, you'll just progress slower when ur coach is not there to point out each little mistake. Practice makes perfect, and i don't think you'll ever get your axel if you only do it with your coach ever.

I would try a few, but if it really feels off, then wait and ask your coach to look at it.

I bruised a few ribs trying it on my own.

I would wait until she does a few with you in your lessons just to make sure you are doing it right. Then practise alone (but make sure she has a look at them every so often to make sure you are still doing them correctly)

It is very hard to undo bad habits!

But that is just my opinion.

I'd say - borrow a full set of hoc key gear and then fling youself with abandon!
Lyle

Oh totally!

But you know my trainer gave me advise that totally works: SPONGES! Just the normal, supersoaky flat housekeeping kind (not the bath sponges) with large holes (they're more firm than the fine-foam ones) and without an extra rough scrubbing layer (you don't wanna scrub your skin off). Just put them in your tights and under a tight shirt and they stay in place - especially around the butt they do - and you barely feel the falls!

and we'll have to call you Sponge 5x5 square pants!
Lyle

When I had the sponges in, nobody noticed! Everybody just thought I had a big butt. They laughed their ***** off when I started taking out the sponges, one by one, struggling to get 'em out, hahahhaha! But you know, after continuous pain from a fall on my pelvis for a month, I did not exactly care what everybody else thought. I also have wrist protection and wear it most of the time.

Some people dont dare to jump without it though when they wear it in practice. I dont have that problem, but for some that is reason to practice without protection.

My boyfriend is especially kind. He suggested that if I compete in an artistic skate competition, I should go either as spongebob or michelin man. Other suggestions I heard were a balloon and "Big Black Yo-Momma"

Heh. . .what I failed to mention above (so as not to scare the OP) was that the very same day I started landing my axel, my thirteen year old little self couldn't be contained. I wanted to do it again and again and again (because, hey, it's really exciting when your foot connects correctly with the ice, darnit!). I caught my feet by accident on a take-off and cracked a few ribs when I whiplashed into the ground. 3 weeks later, I was back at it anyway. I love me my axel

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"Without Vision the People Perish"
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Oh, I have no quirms about practicing it either. I believe I wouldn't be able to jump if I was afraid to fall.
I just waited till somebody explained to me how to do it first because frankly it's insane trying to jump it not actually knowing how to (to clarify things, we didn't do prep work for it before I tried it on my own - somehow our club doesn't do prep work for the axel until they start trying the axel - really strange.) And 2 weeks after the incident, I tested, and I did train before that of course... Wasn't too bad, I just took painkillers.
Though I STILL have the bruise for some reason and I fell on it in november...

LOL you guys are CRAZY! Me too I guess but just not brave enough to try what will unbdoubtedly be a SplAxel
Lyle

LOL you know I was scared at first of it too, it's a strange feeling to jump from the front to be honest! Then we got a different coach, just for 1 lesson, but she's kind of intimidating. I was more afraid of her than of the axel and the lutz and since then, I just conjure up an image of her whenever I get afraid.

And being more relaxed seems to make you fall less often and less hard too.

Also the axel actually isn't so scary once it starts making sense in your head. Cuz at first I figured, "my GOD, WHERE TO am I jumping? I'm just jumping into the air!!! How am I EVER going to get into a backspin position if I swing my leg this far forward and if I swing my leg forward, how am I ever going to revolve enough to land: how am I EVER going to land from this?"
And then at some point I realized that the more you swing that leg, the easyer it is to get into that backspin position and the MORE you turn, not less, thus making it easyer to land, not harder, and then it's far less scary.

Right now I'm just figuring, "patience girl, it took you half a year to go from waltz to lutz and thus add a half a revolution to your jumps: this isn't just a jump, this is another half a revolution, you don't expect it to come in a week do you?"

And also, some of the teachers DO let me try an axel and some don't and I'm very driven to prove to those who DONT let me try it that I AM ready to try it. I mean I know I don't have the height yet to actually land an axel: my left leg's always been weaker than my right leg. But that doesn't mean I can't try.

Okay well this is a video of my supposed axel in my parent's bedroom, from the end of January, because I haven't gotten a chance to try again since then, since I've had ankle issues, but um, if there's anything that I can fix based on this video, I'd welcome any suggestions because I don't want to die when I go and try it for real on the ice.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXmYyq4SuLw

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Great work! The first couples are really nice. Only one thing is your feet should cross like the back spin in the air position(L foot over R). Just don't overdo it when getting tired. Really nice!

Yeah, what das_mondlicht said: Good rotation but it still seems like you're jumping around a bit because your feet aren't in a backspin position. And do something about those arms!

I think you are pretty capable of doing a correct axel with a bit more practice. Keep at it, Laura! Show 'em, those 8-year-olds! *lol*

Oh, and I suggest you watch an axel video on youtube posted by "cedyna". It demonstrates how your feet and arms should be positioned very well!

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Your legs don't really have to be tightly crossed in the air, you just need to have the left foot in front of the right shin and have the left hip closed, like a somewhat open backspin position.
I think your biggest issue is going to be what your arms and legs are doing on the transfer from the RBO edge to your takeoff edge. On the floor, you swing your left foot to the front before turning out and stepping onto your takeoff "edge". That is something you need to stop doing because you won't want to do that on the ice. Before you step out for the jump, you want to be on a RBO edge in a typical landing position (you can keep your left big toe on the floor if you're simulating this on the floor), then bring the free foot into the heel of the right foot before stepping out. As you step out, you want your chest to go forward over your takeoff knee while your shoulders and elbows pull back. On takeoff, everything comes through together, just like on a waltz jump.

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"You don't have to put an age limit on your dreams." - Dara Torres, 41, after her 2nd medal at the 2008 Olympics

what does this mean for the English-impaired?

Off topic (moderator, please remove my thread if neccessary.)
Don't you have your constructive phrase but have to translate other's?

Oh man I have the hardest time with going from the back edge, to the takeoff edge, even on waltz jumps. My coach had me practicing just that for a whole lesson once, and I just could not do it correctly. I think when I do it on the floor, I'm more concerned about rotation and height than the simple things(which I guess are actually extremely important) like arms going back and the edges. Next time I try doing it, I'll try and do what you said. Thank you so much for the advice, because I don't want to be doing it wrong and think that I'm doing it perfectly. Question, do I have to consciously think, "oh I need to cross my feet" once I go up? And when you say bring the heel to the right foot, do i jump from that spot or do I step a little once I bring it there? *did that make sense?*

*edited to add*
So here is a new video of me jumping today, before all the advice from on here, so don't repeat yourself, lmao. Um yeah. So I just got an MRI and they think I have a stress fracture in the fibula in my right leg. So.. this probably wasn't too healthy.. LOL. http://youtube.com/watch?v=4rV4y22CMR8

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I think I can help a little - these floor axels are extremely well rotated at landing and really fun to watch (NICE JOB 5x5!) but start off overrotated before she leaves the floor. You don't want to be stepping directly foreward with your left arm already rotated to the left before you take off or else you are whipping the jump around. This is good to practice gathering the weight over the landing side but is a bad start for jumping on the ice.

If you think of the jump actually starting from the RBO gliding entry edge then 5x5 steps all the way around 180 degrees before jumping, that's too far for ice skating but nice ballet technique! Instead you want to step on the LFO at about 135 degrees and when you make that step you want to lead with the left shoulder, not with the chest square. (lots of different arm and hand positions are used here)

So after all that introduction - I believe that doubletoe was trying to give instructions for this crucial step - starting off on RBO edge with your left toe on the floor (to keep you balanced while practicing this standing on the floor) bring the left foot straight in to rest on the heel of your Right foot. My coach wants the free foot heel brought all the way to the right foot instep. Now bend straight down and make the step to 135 degrees onto the left foot as doubletoe describes and everything is properly lined up. It is nearly impossible to whip an Axel from this entry. I hope that this was correct and helpful, and 5x5, I hope you can do more of these soon.
Lyle

I really appreciate your help! What you're saying sounds correct to me, and I will definitely try to incorporate the actual edges next time and the pre rotation.

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