Who likes Kalesavich and Parchem?

[hoptoad]

I'd like to hear from fans of this pair. What are their strengths? I've heard people rave about them, but so far I don't see what the fuss is about. I just rewatched US Nationals and wasn't all that impressed--perhaps someone could tell me what to look for.

I think I was turned off in part because the commentators kept saying how *difficult* their SBS triple salchows were. I've heard that Stephanie has difficulty with triple jumps and their performance seemed consistant with that. I also thought she doesn't hold the landing edge in the throw jumps very long and seems excessively bent at the waist when she's stroking. Aaron seems pretty capable, but they didn't wow me separately or together.

What am I missing? Who would you compare them to skill-wise or even potential-wise?

[Miezekatze]

Well from the one time I saw them skate I though their strenghts right now are more in the presentation area, they are very expressive and I thought they had a nice powerful style and seemed to match quite well. Also their programs last season had very good choreography IMO.

[Scott]

I think that this team has several strengths as well as weaknesses. Their presentation is definately a plus. They seem very confident on the ice and this helps cover up several areas that need improvement. First the jumping is weak. She has trouble landing the jumps and his take off technique is not the best. Howver, he seems to be strong and the lifts are good. From whath I have seen of them they have very good unison and skate with a good deal of speed. While their prgrams are very pleasant to wtach I feel that the choreography is basic, which really is the fault of their coaching staff. This team has potential and is certainly going to a threat to Scott and Dulebohn this year. However, they are going to have to be watching over their shoulders because we have several teams that will be in the hunt this year. I think that Orscher and Lucash are going to be strong ( I understand that they have been training in Russia this spring) and I wonder what impact Roth and McPherson and the new team of Hinsman and hartsell will have.

[Aimless]

I like how compact and powerful they both are. They are beautifully matched. In my opinion (for what it's worth), they are both super attractive and I really like the connection between them. The way they interact off ice makes me think that they care about each other and know how to be a team. Charisma and great potential, I think. I hope their choreography and costuming can be more original in the coming year. I thought they beat Scott & Duhlebohn at Nationals, wished they could have gone to Olys or worlds. Happily look forward to their development and progress in the coming season.

[pittypat]

I agree completely with Aimless; also, I attended U.S. Nationals in January and their chemistry with each other and the crowd really does exist.

I, too, wish they could have gone to Olympics rather than S/D.

[Trillian]

I'm not a huge fan of this pair but I do appreciate their skating--mostly for the reasons others have already mentioned. They're very nicely matched physically, move well over the ice together, and her positions in lifts are beautiful (he's a strong partner on that end as well). I also happen to really like their choreography, though I question how well it necessarily goes over with international panels, and they have natural chemistry. It's rare to see a pair with such an age difference (seven years, I think) relate so well to one another on the ice, especially while the younger partner is still in her teens.

On the other hand, the reason I can't bring myself to get too excited about this pair--as far as the jumping goes, I think this is about as good as they're going to get. Stephanie's two-footed triple sal at nationals was about the best attempt I've seen from her at a triple (and she can't do a double axel), and considering how long she's been working on these jumps, it seems like they may just not be happening. Unfortunately, as good as their pairs skills may get, the side by side jumping is not world class at this point and that's going to limit their future--especially when you have young skaters coming up who can land triples with a lot more frequency.

[Hidden Agenda]

No matter how much I like them and their look together on the ice, I think the lack of ability to do SBS double axels is going to seriously limit their potential. For that reason alone I think Hinzmann and Hartsell will pass them by in their first season together.

[loveskating]

I like them...powerful with lovely line and lots of charisma.

What is it about that frigging 2 axel and lady pairs skaters???? Katia Gordeeva, Isabelle Brasseur, Jamie Sale all called it their "nemisis" at one time or another?

Is it that she can't land it at all or that she has trouble? If the former, I agree, big trouble...if the latter, perhaps not considering the long line of great pairs skaters who had lots of trouble with the 2 axel except when it really counted.

[Trillian]

[quote:914fd3812a="loveskating"]Is it that she can't land it at all or that she has trouble?[/quote:914fd3812a]

As far as I know, she's never landed it cleanly in competition (or even come particularly close). I don't believe they had it in their programs this past season.

As for the problem with female pairs skaters and the double axel, a lot of them get into pairs in the first place because they're failed singles skaters--hence, they're not going to be strong jumpers to begin with. That's one reason I'm skeptical about K&P's future--in the U.S. especially, more and more of the female singles competitors getting into pairs are actually very strong jumpers. And that is necessary. Kalesavich was the only female in the top six at nationals last year who hadn't at least made it out of regionals in singles at the junior or senior level. Three of the six, in fact, had competed internationally in singles. I believe every female pairs skater to win a national title since (at least) 1989 besides Calla Urbanski had qualified for nationals in singles at some level or another (and for all I know, Urbanski may have too). As rare as it's been for successful female singles skaters to go into pairs, those are the ones who end up winning the big competitions.

[Meredith]

I first saw them compete as juniors at 2000 Nationals and was completely blown away. They were clearly the class of the field IMO.

For all the reasons previously mentioned, i.e., charisma, connection with one another, plus flow, line, etc. I remain very much in Kalesavich and Parchem's corner. Wish their placement had been higher in LA.

Let's just say this is one team I look forward to seeing again. Add to that, I feel comfortable that I [i:770b24a66f]will[/i:770b24a66f] see them again. In an era of disposable partnerships, that's saying quite a bit.

JMO

[pittypat]

[quote:76eca74456="Hidden Agenda"]No matter how much I like them and their look together on the ice, I think the lack of ability to do SBS double axels is going to seriously limit their potential. For that reason alone I think Hinzmann and Hartsell will pass them by in their first season together.[/quote:76eca74456]

I will wait to see H/H together before passing judgement on them but the Hartsell's IMO had horrendous presentation/artistry (obviously the international judges weren't keen on their skating, either) so H/H will have to go a [b:76eca74456]long, long[/b:76eca74456] way in that area to impress me over K/S.

Still, Stephanie needs to get down those jumps! Now! :roll:

[Debbie S]

I agree with Meredith, and others, that their charisma, power, and flow make them a pair to watch in the future. Perhaps most important is that they both seem to get along really well - no small feat, considering the age difference. I read an article about them in the L.A. Times during Nats (or was it USA Today?) that talked about how they got together and built a good relationship and they both sounded level-headed and committed to their partnership.

I'm not sure it really matters if she competed as a singles skater at the national level. Katia Gordeeva never made a big splash in singles and look what she accomplished. Bottom line: yes, they need to be more consistent in their jumps and throws, but I think (and hope) we'll see a lot more of them in the future.

[kar5162]

I think they are beautiful skaters - charming, confident, and with great style. That said, you have to have the tricks too and Stephanie just doesn't seem to have the jumps. If it were just improving consistency I'd be more optimistic, but she just doesn't have a double axel. Unfortunately, you can only get so far with no double axel and an inconsistent (+ 2 footed at best) triple salchow. My guess is that if H&H and O&L and any other new pair teams can come out and land the jumps at Nationals with presentation that is adqeuate if not nearly as strong, they'll pass up Stephanie and Aaron.

[haribobo]

Hinzmann/Hartsell will not pass Kalesavich/Parchem this year at nationals, unless absolute disaster strikes. I have strong hopes for H/H in the long run, but pairs at their first nationals tend to be a little rough around the edges and the judges tend to be a little stingier with the marks...you have to earn your way to the top-- pairs aren't generally allowed on the podium their first year in seniors (unless one partner is in very high regard with the USFSA-- Kyoko Ina for example). I think Hinz/Hart could eventually be a podium pair, and K/P will eventually sink if they don't get the jumps, but that won't all happen this season. I expect K/P in the 3-5 range this year, while H/H should be in the 6-10 range......good luck to both though! :)

[purplecat]

I enjoy their skating although their SBS jumping does make me worry about their future. So it sounds from this thread that Stephanie isn't close to landing a double axel...what about a triple toe? Just curious. At any rate, I wish the best of luck to them in the future. They are a beautiful looking pair!

[Trillian]

[quote:9920a3debf="purplecat"]So it sounds from this thread that Stephanie isn't close to landing a double axel...what about a triple toe?[/quote:9920a3debf]

Nope. That's why they were trying the triple sal this season instead. She did manage a two-footed attempt at that at nationals, so it's possible a clean one is on the way. I can't imagine it'll ever be consistent, though, with all the trouble she's had on the triples.

[bleu]

I like how compact and powerful they both are. They are beautifully matched. In my opinion (for what it's worth), they are both super attractive and I really like the connection between them. The way they interact off ice makes me think that they care about each other and know how to be a team. Charisma and great potential, I think.

While reading this, I thought of Sale-Pelletier. With S&P gone, Stephanie and Aaron are one of very few amateur pairs that can connect with each other and the audience. I hope that noone is offended but Stephanie&Aaron are in a league of their own when it come to "skating as one or pairness".


I hope their choreography and costuming can be more original in the coming year. I thought they beat Scott & Duhlebohn at Nationals, wished they could have gone to Olys or worlds. Happily look forward to their development and progress in the coming season.

I love their costumes...at least their last year costumes...but I know what you mean about originality. I also want to see then go to simple but elegant and meaningful costumes. I totally agree with your comment about choreography. They need help.

In short, they are head of all russians pairs and some others in terms of connection with each other and the audience, pairs lifts(Aaron is a GREAT pair skater ..even better than the remaining top two male skaters!. I hope Lloyd Eisler or David Pelletier are watching him) and charisma. They just need to improve on their technical ability. They need to hire a strong singles coach and a choreograper. If all this works out, WATCH out people!!!

[Scott]

Bleu, I enjoyed your comments about Kalesvich/Parchem. I really think that Aaron is the soul of this team. Stephanie has wonderful presentation but I think it is Aaron that pulls it all together. I agree with Trillian However, concerning their technical abilities. Stephanie has got to get the jumps down or this team will be over taken.

I too, thought that they beat Scott/Dulebohn at US Nationals but I also thought that other teams were placed lower than they should have been.

Concerning the comment that K/P are the only team that can connect with the audience I think that you are stretching it a bit. There are several others who have that connection, including Scott/Dulebohn. I remember that at US Nationals one of the largest ovations after the short program was given to Orscher/Lucash. This team by the way was placed 8th after the short and should have been much higher, never did figure out what was in the judges minds about that placement. Also, Inoue/Baldwin were well received by the crowd.

[Bibby]

[quote:3201f2d9e8="haribobo"]Hinzmann/Hartsell will not pass Kalesavich/Parchem this year at nationals, unless absolute disaster strikes. [/quote:3201f2d9e8]
ITA. K/P are just getting better every year and will only get passed by new teams if they bomb. They're still a young team, so even though Stephanie is not landing consistent sbs jumps, they have years to work it out and/or find a jump that they can both do consitently together.

[kar5162]

Wasn't thinking...I forgot that Danielle isn't skating with Steve anymore. I certainly don't expect Hinzman and Steve to place above them this year.

[Hidden Agenda]

The USFSA may reward a nicely paired team at home with a good placement, but they don't send the teams out of country on important international assignments if they simply don't have the goods to be competitive. Look at last year's Junior World Team and the conspicuous absence of Appel and Harris. I am shocked that the general feeling here seems to be that the complete lack of a double axel is no big deal, especially at the Senior(read Championship) level.
Yes, definitely pairs is about skating "as one" but there has to also be the minimally accepted number of jumps, and right now that is double axel and at least one triple to be internationally competitive. If new teams go out with good pair skills, audience connection, artistry, as well as the jumps (read high first AND second marks), then those teams who are relying primarily on charisma are going to be disappointed.
I'd like nothing more than to see K and P get their jumping act together. If they increase their ability in that area then they deserve higher placements, but, I don't think fans telling them "It's not that important" is being very helpful, really, to them or to US pairs in general. Being a fan doesn't mean being blind.

[bleu]

Scott - I think you are right...but I can dream, right? :wink:

[Sylvia]

[quote:8f96f275a3="Hidden Agenda"]The USFSA may reward a nicely paired team at home with a good placement, but they don't send the teams out of country on important international assignments if they simply don't have the goods to be competitive. Look at last year's Junior World Team and the conspicuous absence of Appel and Harris.[/quote:8f96f275a3]

Appel/Harris placed 12th of 14 pairs (3rd of the 3 US pairs) at 2002 Junior Worlds in Hamar, Norway. Someone posted recently that they may be staying junior this season, which makes sense if they are trying to up the technical difficulty of their sbs jumps and throw jumps.

[Trillian]

[quote:7593a742fb="Sylvia"][quote:7593a742fb="Hidden Agenda"]The USFSA may reward a nicely paired team at home with a good placement, but they don't send the teams out of country on important international assignments if they simply don't have the goods to be competitive. Look at last year's Junior World Team and the conspicuous absence of Appel and Harris.[/quote:7593a742fb]

Appel/Harris placed 12th of 14 pairs (3rd of the 3 US pairs) at 2002 Junior Worlds in Hamar, Norway.[/quote:7593a742fb]

Appel & Harris weren't originally named to the team, though, remember. The first three pairs named were the Stieglers, Don & Guzman, and the Ganabas. A&H replaced D&G after they split, and Vise & Ibarra replaced the Ganabas after they withdrew.

However, Kalesavich & Parchem ARE getting the international assignments, at least for the time being, because of their placement from nationals. They should be getting two Grand Prix events this year. And keep in mind that the Stieglers also got Grand Prix events a few years ago when there was no way they had the technical goods to be competitive. I would say the USFSA has quite a history of sending couples to important internationals even though they aren't up to the technical caliber of the top teams.

[haribobo]

Well of course the USFSA is going to send K/P to GP events-- they were the bronze medalists at nationals......and the 1st-3rd place teams almost always get GP events. Anyway-- I do think Hidden Agenda is right-- it IS a big deal that K/P can't land clean jumps...but in the mean time they still have had their act together more than any other US team besides I/Z and S/D. And though Stephnanie can't seem to land a clean triple jump or double axel, at least she stands up and skates the rest of the program well-- strong presentation and well landed throws and other elements keep them above the other pairs. Roth/McPherson, Inoue/Baldwin, and Orscher/Lucash are the pairs that look poised to overtake Kalesavich/Parchem if they can build up some experience and get both consistency and skate some strong programs....we could see quite a battle on our hands for the US medals in the next couple years (after I/Z and S/D are gone). I do feel that US pairs is still in somewhat of a transition period........and I'll probably still feel that way until I see more than 1 clean short program at nationals. :)

[Scott]

[quote:785957605d="haribobo"]Well of course the USFSA is going to send K/P to GP events-- they were the bronze medalists at nationals......and the 1st-3rd place teams almost always get GP events. Anyway-- I do think Hidden Agenda is right-- it IS a big deal that K/P can't land clean jumps...but in the mean time they still have had their act together more than any other US team besides I/Z and S/D. And though Stephnanie can't seem to land a clean triple jump or double axel, at least she stands up and skates the rest of the program well-- strong presentation and well landed throws and other elements keep them above the other pairs. Roth/McPherson, Inoue/Baldwin, and Orscher/Lucash are the pairs that look poised to overtake Kalesavich/Parchem if they can build up some experience and get both consistency and skate some strong programs....we could see quite a battle on our hands for the US medals in the next couple years (after I/Z and S/D are gone). I do feel that US pairs is still in somewhat of a transition period........and I'll probably still feel that way until I see more than 1 clean short program at nationals. :)[/quote:785957605d]

You are so right. But we are also going to have to see someone deliver on a good clean long. I am a big fan of Inoue/Baldwin but I am concerned that they may be peaking. So, I do not have them at the top of my list, though I think they will be competitive this year. They are both getting 'older' and I wonder how much more of difficult training they will be able to take. Roth/McPherson have so much potential but I haven't seen them in a long time. Orsher/Lucash could be the ones to challenge. They can jump, but they need more time together. Still I think it was quite an accomplishment for this team to land at #5 at US nationals after just one year together. I also feel that if Hinzman/Hartsell gel they could be a surprise this year.

[NorthernLite]

[quote:ea946afdd0="bleu"]
With S&P gone, Stephanie and Aaron are one of very few amateur pairs that can connect with each other and the audience. I hope that noone is offended but Stephanie&Aaron are in a league of their own when it come to "skating as one or pairness".
[/quote:ea946afdd0]

Bleu's comments really struck a chord with me. Putting aside whatever tech problems K & P may have, the connection, the buzz I get from them does remind me of my response to S & P.

Interesting analogy.

[Scott]

Bleu, I really like this pair (K&P) but I really don't see the connection to S&P at all. Kalsevich and Parchem have charm but they do not come close to the charisma or the technical ability of S&P. I think that you are streching it a bit. I was at US Nationals and while K&P were well received there was not the connection with the crowd that you are refering to. Quite frankly, it is a rare event when someone comes along with the charisma that S&P have. I don't know of any US teams that have that connection, not even Ina and Zimmerman. I do think, however, that the Hartsells had a charisma that the crowd liked but they didn't always use that to their advantage.

[hoptoad]

Thanks for the responses everyone. I hope K&P will hit the GP next season with the jumps to do well. I think I was underwhelmed by them in part because I didn't see many of the skaters placed below them.

Also, I think the commentators did them a disservice, as well as the viewers, when they kept talking about K&P's "difficult SBS triple salchows". It seems there are plenty of legitimate positve things to point out in their skating that would not have undermined their own credibility.

[Sylvia]

Here's a new article on K&P from USFSA Online:
http://www.usfsa.org/news/2001-02/kaleparc-profile.htm

[sk8lvr]

That's a very interesting article. I can't wait to see their programs next year. I hope that the jumps really are coming along for this team.

[pennskater]

There is another new pair - Jennifer Don and Jonathan Hunt.
Considering that Don/Guzman were doing very well last year, and received international assignments before their break-up, and that Hunt did well with Handy, this could be an exciting team. Don just came in 2nd in Jr Ladies singles last year, so she is obviously well thought of by the USFSA. Both are very strong skaters, and Don consistently lands 3toe and 2axel. The hard part will be getting used to each other's styles.
I don't expect any first year team to medal at nationals, but I would expect them to be 5-10 if they can get it together.

[Scott]

Does anyone know if J. Don is going to quit singles or is she fgoing to try and do both singles and pairs this year. Doing both is a liablity and will hurt the development of the pair.

[bleu]

Great to see a new article about Stephanie&Aaron. thanks for posting.

the SP sounds good too.

[Sylvia]

[quote:fb2ccd1551="Scott"]Does anyone know if J. Don is going to quit singles or is she fgoing to try and do both singles and pairs this year. Doing both is a liablity and will hurt the development of the pair.[/quote:fb2ccd1551]

Jennifer Don has a JGP singles assignment (Yugoslavia) in September, so I would think she is planning to continue singles for the time being.

Back in the fall of 2000, Katie Orscher decided to give up singles in order to focus on starting pairs with Garrett Lucash. This was after she had won the bronze medal in Junior Ladies at 2000 US Nationals and competed in the first of her two assigned JGPs that fall (she withdrew from her 2nd JGP).

Don is not Orscher, however, and as long as she wants to juggle the demands of singles and pairs, I think she should go for it. IMHO, it's still too early to speculate on whether or not "doing both is a liability" for her. Only time will tell! :)

[Hidden Agenda]

Past a certain level, it would seem a skater needs to make a choice between singles and pairs if they want to be internationally successful - example Yamaguchi and Galindo.
Maybe this is part of the reason the Russians dominate pairs. They don't look at pair skating as the discipline to try when all else fails. It is a viable option for a talented young skater, and they encourage full focus on it from day one.
Wish we would see more of our skaters - and fans - give it that same respect.

[Trillian]

[quote:f73dbbd3ba="Hidden Agenda"]Maybe this is part of the reason the Russians dominate pairs. They don't look at pair skating as the discipline to try when all else fails. It is a viable option for a talented young skater, and they encourage full focus on it from day one.
Wish we would see more of our skaters - and fans - give it that same respect.[/quote:f73dbbd3ba]

I think we are seeing more of that attitude from our skaters. Katie Orscher was improving tremendously in singles and showing every sign of being a contender on the senior national level when she decided to focus on pairs--landing every triple (which I'm told she can still do), for one thing. Most of the girls do keep going in singles for some time, but that's not necessarily a liability at the lower levels as long as they're able to put in the practice time for both disciplines. Competing in singles helps a promising pairs skater to develop his/her solo skills, and I suspect that in the future, we'll see a lot more (girls especially) give up singles in favor of pairs. Orscher was a great example for some of the younger girls: she most likely wouldn't have been a Four Continents competitor or Olympic alternate this year in singles, but she accomplished both her very first year in pairs. Some of the younger girls who are quite talented but tired of fighting the pack in singles might decide to focus on pairs sooner rather than later.

[Scott]

Interesting comments from Trillian and Hidden Agenda. I think that the reason our top skaters in pairs do well is that they concentrate on pairs. Look at Kalesvich/Parchem. They are where they are because they do pairs. It is one of the reasons that they have such a high artistic ability. They know how each other skates and they blend into the performance together. If one of them was doing pairs they most probably would be lower in the rankings. As for Katie Orscher, she gave up a promising singles career to skate pairs and look where she and Garrett are because she made the choice to commit herself. It should also be mentioned that it is not just the ladies who have to make choices. I went back trhough the archives and found that Garrett gave up his singles career to do pairs. In looking at Kalesevich /Parchem I can't remember If Kalesvich ever skater singles.

BTW I am going to be very curious to see how Kalesvich/Parchem and Orscher/Lucash stack up this year. I think that these two teams have the look that international judges in particular are going to like. If Kalesvich gets her jumps down they will really move up. I also hear from Simsbury that Orscher/Lucash are looking very polished and strong. Aparently the trip to Russia was worth while for them. I can't wait to see these two pair teams in action and to see if they can unseat Scott/Dulebohn from the top three. I say this with somewhat of a heavy heart because my sentimental favorites are Inoue/Baldwin but there comes a time when reality has to set in....

[Trillian]

[quote:c3d305177e="Scott"]In looking at Kalesevich /Parchem I can't remember If Kalesvich ever skater singles.[/quote:c3d305177e]

I'm quite sure she must have competed in singles at some point, but she probably did give it up early. She was U.S. novice champion way back in '97 when she was only 12, and I don't recall seeing her name in singles results at any point after that.

Most of the ladies in senior pairs at nationals this year gave up singles some time ago, with Molly Quigley, Jennifer Don, and Sima Ganaba being the exceptions. For Quigley and Don it obviously worked out fine this season (though I think Quigley might be smart to focus on pairs now that she's been to nationals), and Ganaba has had some good showings at sectionals as well. Among the higher-ranked junior girls, Colette Appel, Jackie Jimenez, Emma Phibbs, and (I think, but I'm not sure) Amy Howerton have all given up singles in favor of pairs already.

[quote:c3d305177e]I say this with somewhat of a heavy heart because my sentimental favorites are Inoue/Baldwin but there comes a time when reality has to set in....[/quote:c3d305177e]

I don't think it's all over for I&B this season by any means. IMO there are five or six teams in contention for the three world spots this year and they're definitely one of them. A few years down the road might be another story because of their ages and her history of serious injuries, but as long as she can stay healthy enough to compete, I expect them to be a definite factor on the national scene. Remember that both come from a strong singles background, for one thing, and I was quite impressed with their presentation as well. Along with O&L, they were one of the most pleasant surprises of nationals last season IMO. :)

[Scott]

Good morrning Trillian! You made my day with the comment about Inoue/Baldwin. However, when I say that reality has to set in I mean that I really do not see I/B challenging Kalesvich/Parchem at this point. The reasons for this are I am concerned about the injuries Inoue has suffered in the past and the consistent improvement of Kalesevich. I also question whether I/B will be able to hold off Orscher/Lucash this year as they are really improving as they spend more time together ( this is based on comments I am getting from Simsbury where I have some friends- of course those people are prejudiced!) I think that Kalesevich and Parchem are going to be strong this year primarily because I think their coaching staff is going to eye that third worlds spot and spend the time and effort to get Kalesevich's jumps consistant. If she gets these jumps K&P could move past Scott & Dulebohn. I also think that Scott&Dulebohn have to be worried about Orscher& Lucash. Another wild card is Roth & McPherson. But to be truthful I find it questionable whether this team will in its first year as Seniors be able to place in the top five with the level of talent that is already there.

[IgglesII]

[quote:d85a7cf102="Scott"]Another wild card is Roth & McPherson. But to be truthful I find it questionable whether this team will in its first year as Seniors be able to place in the top five with the level of talent that is already there.[/quote:d85a7cf102]

I find it questionable that this team was just *handed* senior grand prix assignments without having to go through Indy.

They weren't at nationals, so they should have to prove it just like everyone else. If they wowed the field at Indy and won both the short and the long, fine...no arguments from me.

Just bestowing these two assignments on them, however...absolutely bogus.

[Scott]

[quote:4564396f3c="IgglesII"][quote:4564396f3c="Scott"]Another wild card is Roth & McPherson. But to be truthful I find it questionable whether this team will in its first year as Seniors be able to place in the top five with the level of talent that is already there.[/quote:4564396f3c]

I find it questionable that this team was just *handed* senior grand prix assignments without having to go through Indy.

They weren't at nationals, so they should have to prove it just like everyone else. If they wowed the field at Indy and won both the short and the long, fine...no arguments from me.

Just bestowing these two assignments on them, however...absolutely bogus.[/quote:4564396f3c]

My concern is that by this action the USFSA is giving a nod to put these skaters ahead of Orscher/Lucash. Inoue/Baldwin, Quigley/Cording, Speilberg/Joeright and others, without having to ever compete against these teams. Seems like the USFSA is trying to crown this pair as the next in line. Unfortunately for the USFSA I don't think that teams like Orscher/Lucash and Inoue/Baldwin, or Speilberg/Joeright will take this sitting down.

[Mayra]

[quote:1d4f72648f="IgglesII"]

I find it questionable that this team was just *handed* senior grand prix assignments without having to go through Indy.

They weren't at nationals, so they should have to prove it just like everyone else. If they wowed the field at Indy and won both the short and the long, fine...no arguments from me.

Just bestowing these two assignments on them, however...absolutely bogus.[/quote:1d4f72648f]

I was surprised that this team received two gp events and I agree that the decision is questionable, but its not as if Roth/McPherson are a newly formed team who have never competed and were suddenly "bestowed" gp assignments without ever having proven themselves. They are the 2001 Jr. World Bronze medalists and seems to me that the USFSA awarded them assignments based on this team's ability to get results, albeit more than a year ago at the junior level. I would assume that this team was at the very least monitored before they were given gp events over other teams.

[Scott]

Mayra, I would hope that Roth/McPherson were monitored but if that did happen all the other potential "candidates" would also have to be monitored and I don't think that they were. Word would have gotten out if this was the case. I have a real problem with how this was done. It seems totally unfair to those skaters who competed at the senior level and climbed up the ladder in the rankings to be blocked outr by Jr. Level skaters who have never ever competed in a major Sr. Event. I don't care how good a team is at the Jr. level, senior competition is different and you should have to prove yourself in that venue. This politics of gift giving should be thrown out the window. When we propel Jr. Level skaters into the senior spotlight it is a mistake.Make that team earn it. No other sport allows such an bogus placement to occur. This is either a sport that is dependent on competitive ability or it isn't. I really think the system has slapped some very fine Sr. teams right in the face. These teams include
Spielberg/Joeright, Quigley/Cording, Orsher/Lucash and Inoue/Baldwin. And why aren't we considering the new teams of Don/Hunt or Hinsmen/Hartsell? Quite franly if you think about it almost all of these teams or members thereof have substanially more international experience than Roth/McPherson's appearance at Jr. worlds warrants. .

There is no way that Roth and McPherson should be given the lilmelight to share with Kalesevich and Parchem who have had to work their hearts out to get that position. While I still think Kalesevich/Parcehm are going to face a stiff challenge form other teams this year I do not think that at this point Roth/McPherson should be included in this group-that is unless they prove themselves in a head to head competition at nationals with everybody on the smae competition plane.

[hoptoad]

Scott, I agree with you. I would not have a problem with them getting one event as recognition of their performance in juniors (doesn't the USFSA usually give Jr World Champions a shot at the GP, even in the tight ladies field?). Inoue and Baldwin did get one event, SkateAmerica, but I think Orsher and Lucash should have gotten one before Roth and McPhersone got two. On the other hand, I think even promising new pairs like H&H and D&H should have to prove themselves in competition before getting GP events.

[Scott]

[quote:5a463f56a0="hoptoad"]Scott, I agree with you. I would not have a problem with them getting one event as recognition of their performance in juniors (doesn't the USFSA usually give Jr World Champions a shot at the GP, even in the tight ladies field?). Inoue and Baldwin did get one event, SkateAmerica, but I think Orsher and Lucash should have gotten one before Roth and McPhersone got two. On the other hand, I think even promising new pairs like H&H and D&H should have to prove themselves in competition before getting GP events.[/quote:5a463f56a0]

I totally agree with you. Nobody should be given a free ride.

[Mayra]

Scott, I think we got our wires crossed. I meant that if R/M recieved their two GP events based on their past results, I would hope that they were monitored before the decision was taken given the fact that this team was out with an injury and their competitive status unknown.

As it is I think with so many teams fighting for international assignments, pairs in the U.S could get very interesting. Especially with teams like Roth/McPherson, Phibbs/Patrick and Vise/Ibarra moving up to seniors, and teams like O/L and I/B breaking out and doing so well. In O/L's case this was their first season competing with each other. As well as new teams that were formed and of course I/Z, S/D and K&P. I would hope the level of skating would reach another level and some sort of consistancy within the teams met.