Weiss "tornado"

[Serenity]

What do you think of Michael Weiss's new move the "tornado"? I like it. Can't wait to see him get it down well enough to land cleanly. One thing you have to say for Weiss is that he's not afraid to try new things. I also like his "freedom blades". It's nice to see creative new moves. Way to go Mikey!

[PAskate]

IMHO, I don't like it. I wish that he would polish the "trick" before he puts it into a performance, although he seems to feel that it's more important to keep trying things in competitions before they're polished to get the practice. I would rather see a high, easy triple jump with good run out than a scratchy trick.

Buth then I'm a traditionalist, and a good clean program with complicated footwork, spins, and jumps is more impressive and entertaining to me than backflips and other tricks. But he entertains the crowd.

[Suzanne]

I like the tornade and the freedom blades -- very cool!!

[duane]

weiss definitely deserves credit for trying new things. i like the tornado, and think--once its perfected--it will end up as a very popular, crowd-pleasing move.

[AxelAnnie22]

I think it is silly. What is the point? It is show skating, IMO, and should belong there, along with the back flip.

[Rebekka]

I dont' think what he did was ground breaking considering he landed the move on "all fours" and it is an illegal move in eligible competition.

What I find rather curious is that his IF program was 15 seconds too short and he didn't appear to have been given a deduction for it. :x

[bunghodog]

I dont like the blades or the tornado, I thought he skated well, I like the rolling stones music, but I think as for the worlds his best skate will win a bronze, he could win nationals, although I like Matt Savoi's style better even though he doesen't have a quad.

[Serenity]

Of course it's show skating and ineligible in competition! But this was a pro-am competition, not worlds or nationals. The pro-am competitions give skaters a chance to do some of the pro "tricks" that they can't normally do. I like to see the skaters have fun, and I don't see anything wrong with doing a "crowd-pleasing" move in a competition like this. (And yes, I still cheer every time I see Scott Hamilton do a back flip or Surya Bonaly land a back flip on one foot or Lloyd and Eisler do a head-banger). I also love the "pure" skating programs of skaters like Yuka Sato. Variety is the spice of life!

[Serenity]

Oops. I meant Brasseur and Eisler. Lloyd is Eisler's first name, of course. Duh.

[grondahl]

Originally posted by Rebekka

What I find rather curious is that his IF program was 15 seconds too short and he didn't appear to have been given a deduction for it. :x


Wow, if this is true Todd was ripped off big time! Todd actually SKATED , while Mikey did alot of brake dance & gymnastic moves.

[tollerfan]

I much preferred Todd's program. I detest having to look at men's hairy armpits during a skating competition or show (Michael, please put a shirt on with that vest). I do like the look of Michael's new blade moves on his heels, but I think it's going to get old pretty quickly. I agree with PAskate on the tornado...don't put the trick in until you're doing it consistently. It just looked messy to me.

[nits]

I wasn't very impressed with the move either.

[danibellerika]

I think he should be working on not 2 footing his quads and falling on triples rather than doing some move that's not allowed in eligible competition(and have it done sloppy at that). I'm not sure if the freedom blades will catch on or not, but they're kinda interesting. But as someone else said, it's gonna get old.

[TRAxel]

Originally posted by PAskate
IMHO, I don't like it. I wish that he would polish the "trick" before he puts it into a performance, although he seems to feel that it's more important to keep trying things in competitions before they're polished to get the practice. I would rather see a high, easy triple jump with good run out than a scratchy trick.

I'm sure that he has it polished in practice!! Don't skaters usually have thier tricks polished or pretty close to it before they present it?? Jeesh... even now with Brian Orser, sometimes he touches his hands down on his back flip he's been doing for years. I liked the move, something new and different... nice to see instead of the same old, same old.

[Schmeck]

Isn't this 'tornado' really just a backflip with a full twist? I think Weiss is a cheesy promoter of himself, to the detriment of skating. I hope they ban his blades at eligible competitions, or give him major deductions for his showy, cheap moves. And I'm praying that he moves on to pro status soon, since he seems to want to be the showman at every event he enters.

Schmeck

[Alexa]

Schmeck, I agree. I do give Michael credit for hanging in there, and continuing to do good work, but he does come across as a cheesy promoter of himself--that is a good description, one I had trouble coming up with myself. And I don't even mind the new blades, but I feel like instead of constantly working on these tricks that will never have a place in competitive skating, he should spend the time trying to make his quad more consistent or working on his choreography a bit more. That is fine he wants to be a showman, but I think he should turn pro for that, and hopefully he will after this year.

[bluejewel]

I like the move because it combines a move used in high diving with figure skating. It's very innovative, and potentially dangerous.

[Alexeiskate]

Originally posted by tollerfan
I much preferred Todd's program. I detest having to look at men's hairy armpits during a skating competition or show (Michael, please put a shirt on with that vest). I do like the look of Michael's new blade moves on his heels, but I think it's going to get old pretty quickly. I agree with PAskate on the tornado...don't put the trick in until you're doing it consistently. It just looked messy to me.

Funny about the hairy armpits comment. His arms and chest are shaved so why not do the pits also :roll:

I agree with Schmeck's comment about the 'Tornado'. Let call the move what it really is - a back flip with a full twist - instead of coming up with some media-friendly name that has nothing to do with the move itself. PLus landing on all fours took away any impact that the move might have had. I also agree that Mike hasn't really figure out what to do with the Freedom blade yet. So what if one can go on his heels when he glides. Big whoops. And I also wish the commentators stop giving MW the credit for inventing the Freedom blades.

[Suzanne]

He shaves his chest and arms? He's not just naturally hairless there?

[memememe76]

I don't get why people are so angry about the move. It's not like he's doing it in competition. It's a friggin' exhibition number. Who cares?

[Jenny]

I thought it was great, and also enjoy what he's doing with the blades.

As for being a self promoter, why not? His career (and his family's livelihood) is based on *him* and what he does. He's the product, so he's got to promote the product.

Jenny

[TRAxel]

Originally posted by memememe76
I don't get why people are so angry about the move. It's not like he's doing it in competition. It's a friggin' exhibition number. Who cares?

LOL.... I totally agree memememe76!

[Mel On Ice]

I liked it and was impressed he could pull it off, even if it were on fours. Give it time, I think he'll land it.

Wonder what kind of gymnast he would have been.

[grondahl]

Originally posted by Jenny

As for being a self promoter, why not? His career (and his family's livelihood) is based on *him* and what he does. He's the product, so he's got to promote the product.

Jenny



I think the problem many people have with Weiss' self promotion is that it very often comes across as being very cheesy and tacky. Kind of like a low budget carnival act. :oops:


OTOH there are many successful skaters who have been able to self promote themselves with both class and tact.

[BigB0882]

I can't believe he is calling this a tornado!! Its like being the first person to land a 5toeloop, and renaming it since you added on an extra revolution before anyone else. A backflip is a backlflip, even with a twist!

[Suzanne]

Actually, it's a much MORE difficult move than a back flip. It deserves a different name, IMO.

[Schmeck]

Back flips with a full twist are not all that difficult to attain for a trained athlete. My then 10 yr old daughter was doing them on the floor, and was doing a forward handspring on vault with a 1/2 twist on/ half twist off/ before she quit gymnastics and made it onto a synchro skating team last year.

Didn't Scott Hamilton say that learning to do a backflip was pretty easy, and that one reason they were not allowed in eligible competition was that they looked showy, but it didn't take all that much skill to attain one?

I thought this was a competition, not an exhibition???? Most people watching this competition probably had no idea of the difference between a real competition and the made-for-tv pro/am shmush that gets promoted as real competition. And that's why I can't stand it when Weiss does this cheap stuff, because he gives figure skating such a cheap image! No wonder it doesn't get taken seriously as a sport!

[memememe76]

I thought this was a competition, not an exhibition????

You consider the Hallmark a competition? I wonder if Sarah is going to use her Fossi number at Nationals as her long program.

Most people watching this competition probably had no idea of the difference between a real competition and the made-for-tv pro/am shmush that gets promoted as real competition. And that's why I can't stand it when Weiss does this cheap stuff, because he gives figure skating such a cheap image! No wonder it doesn't get taken seriously as a sport!

Oh please, no one is going to point at Weiss' backflip tornado thingie as the downfall of figure skating. Watching Alexie hump on the ice will make people giggle before the backflip. Or seeing S&Z's SP costumes. There are actual things during a real competition that are already taking care of that.

Where were all the angry posts when Scott and Surya landed backflips in Ice Wars? Because Weiss adds in a twisty thing to it, he should lose his American citizenship?

[dbell]

I can't believe he is calling this a tornado - Well, this is a man who renamed "Shoot the Duck" the "Mike Pike" :roll:

Honestly, I thought the Village People dressed him!

I try to like him, I really do, but he makes it so darned difficult! 8O

[kayskate]

I think it is silly that he called the thing a "tornado". This is a comon gymnastics move. While I am not an expert at gymn, I think it may actually be (officially) called a "backflip w/ a full twist" in the gymn community. I feel similarly about the "Mike Pike". It's just a shoot-the-duck.

A few years ago US pro skater Rory Flack Burghart (sp?) was planning to try this. I remember it mentioned by commentators televising some event when she was performing. I guess she never actually did it.

Does anyone know if Weiss's funky blades are legal in eligible competition? I guess there is no rule against them yet. Maybe one will be put in place.

Kay

[Alexeiskate]

Originally posted by kayskate
Does anyone know if Weiss's funky blades are legal in eligible competition? I guess there is no rule against them yet. Maybe one will be put in place.

Kay

The Freedom blades are legal in eligible competiton, because they are freely available to his competitors if they also desire to use the blades. I believe that was one of the rule for any new piece of equipment to be legal in eligible competition.

[Jenny]

Originally posted by grondahl
I think the problem many people have with Weiss' self promotion is that it very often comes across as being very cheesy and tacky. Kind of like a low budget carnival act. :oops:

OTOH there are many successful skaters who have been able to self promote themselves with both class and tact.

People have said this for years, and while certainly I personally would never have such a web site dedicated to myself, I'm not in his situation either. I don't know what it's like to be Michael Weiss, I only know what it's like to be me. But I'm not going to assume that since I think I know what's right for me, I can accurately say what's right for him.

I'm sure he would love it if there were fans who created web sites and banners and fan forums for him. But since that is not happening, what do you expect him to do, sit back and wait to be noticed? That ain't gonna pay the rent. There are few career options for skaters, and lots of competition from bigger names for the relatively few plum spots on tours, pro ams or commentating.

It's no different that people trying to make their way in the movies or as recording artists. Talent is but a small part of the equation - promotion is everything.

He's worked as hard as his fellow skaters over the years and achieved a competitive record to be proud of. If he has to take matters into his own hands to ensure a secure future for him and his family, then good for him I say.

There are better skaters than him who have not enjoyed active post-competitive careers. Maybe if they had worked a little harder at promoting their product, they'd still be skating.

Jenny

[Alexeiskate]

There's nothing wrong with having a personal web site. A couple of elite skaters have their own official sites and they're informative and fun to read.

Of course when you're in an occupation that requires the public interest in order to make a living you have to do some sort of self-promotion, but there are different routes one can take to promote oneself. If the public perceive your self-promotion to be arrogant, then you will lose their support and your career won't thrive.

[Mel On Ice]

I find the argument for hating Weiss because of his website ridiculous. First, it's very obvious it wasn't written BY him, but by a PR team schooled in Tiger Beat and Teen magazine. Secondly, the site's been down for months, and is no longer promoted on his USFSA bio page.

He's a good skater and though it might be considered an "easy" gymnastics move, I gather it's much harder on skates. And I doubt he's sneaking it in to his competitive long program.

[Alexeiskate]

Originally posted by Mel On Ice
First, it's very obvious it wasn't written BY him, but by a PR team schooled in Tiger Beat and Teen magazine. Secondly, the site's been down for months, and is no longer promoted on his USFSA bio page.


It's Michael Weiss's official website, put up for him and about him. Regardless of who is responsible for its content, it's Michael's responsibility to have final approval of the site's content. The site isn't down. I was on the site about two days ago when the headline on the site went something like "Watch Michael Weiss go after two world records - the first to land a quad lutz and the first to do the back flip with a full twist on the ice." And before someone post a reply saying "what's wrong with that headline?' let me be the first to say that I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that headline. I'm just paraphrasing what was on it about two days ago.

[scooter133]

Originally posted by tollerfan
I detest having to look at men's hairy armpits during a skating competition or show (Michael, please put a shirt on with that vest).

At which event recently did he undo the vest? It was on TV not too long ago.

[Mel On Ice]

really? I did a search and couldn't find it. I stand corrected.

[Rebekka]

I was just over at the Weiss site and the headlines are:

MIKE WINS SILVER,
AUDIENCE GIVES HIM GOLD!

Looks like it was very recently updated. ;)



His site is managed and run by his wife Lisa.

[duane]

the backflip is used by many skaters to excite the crowd, and it always does. surya made her backflip unique by landing it on one foot. now, mike's tornado (and i see nothing wrong with calling it that. "backflip with a full twist" is too long and technical sounding!) adds a new twist to the popular backflip--literally!

and, mike is very much aware that the move cannot be used at eligible competitions, and i'm sure he is attempting to get the move down solid for exhibitions, pro-ams, and his future pro career. (or, perhaps he'll perform the move at his last eligible international competition, ALA surya bonaly's Olympic backflip! :D )

[Badams]

why do you people care so much about michaels website? give me a break! do go there if you don't like it. sasha's is every bit as cheesy and pathetic...why isn't she bashed for it?

[nigella]

Originally posted by Badams
sasha's is every bit as cheesy and pathetic...why isn't she bashed for it?


You must be living in a cave without internet service! Sasha's site has received plenty of bashing on the Web.

[Serenity]

Why does every single post about Michael Weiss end up with so many people bashing him? This post was started with the simple question about what people thought of his new tornado move, not about his website, tendency to promote himself, etc. I wonder if someone else had debuted the move (like Scott Hamilton or Surya Bonaly or Evgeny Plushenko) if the reaction would still be negative from so many people.
Can't we simple evaluate a skating move without becoming so personal about the skater who does it?

Unfortunately it seems that our judgment of whether or not we like something often depends on which skater is doing it. Weiss is not my favorite skater, but I can appreciate that he at least tries to be innovative and keeps working hard to continue in the sport despite many disappointments and injuries. And goodness knows he's achieved more in the sport than most of us have.

Just imagine that your absolute favorite skater did the tornado (Alexei, Todd, or whoever-- fill in the blank with YOUR favorite). What would you think of the move then? And remember, it's SUPPOSED to be a crowd-pleasing show move, NOT a move for a serious eligible competition.

[grondahl]

"Just imagine that your absolute favorite skater did the tornado (Alexei, Todd, or whoever-- fill in the blank with YOUR favorite). What would you think of the move then?"


If one of my favs were trying to do this move I'd think the same thing that I think of Weiss trying to do it - too much ado about a gimmicky non-skating trick.



"And remember, it's SUPPOSED to be a crowd-pleasing show move, NOT a move for a serious eligible competition."



Then why is Team Weiss carrying on like this is some ground breaking, record making, figure skating move for the ages? :roll:

[KathySkates]

I have to say that I am almost never bored by ANYONE'S skating, even beginners.
I have a soft spot for Michael Weiss! I love the classical, masculine style of his competive programs. I also admire him for trying to come up with new and innnovative moves and ideas.
I find myself rooting for him every time!

[adrianchew]

Admin hat on - there is a difference between bashing and critique. ~adrianchew~

Michael invites the criticism... someone who cares need to tell them to stop. I actually took the time to go read what his website put up about his Hallmark performance...

Michael Weiss unleashed his "Tornado", won over the crowd but finished a surprising second at the Hallmark Skaters Championship Saturday night, Dec. 14, at Columbus, Ohio.

I was at Hallmark - the crowd at Hallmark cheered even louder for Todd Eldredge who finished third at the event. What they are doing is the equivalent of misinformation and even possily deception.

Michael accepted the scoring but thought he did well enough to win. "I had a great time out there tonight. The crowd was with me, and it was just a lot of fun. In interpretive skating, you never know what the judges are looking for, but I had a blast."

That's a subtle way of pretty much saying - "I wuz robbed!". :roll:

Earth to Michael Weiss & family - concentrate on the skating! I'm not even a fan but I think he's got a decent shot of winning Nationals and medalling at Worlds possibly too... but the bad PR won't win him any medals, how he performs will.

As for the Weiss "tornado" - its pretty cool, and possibly very dangerous. Think widow + 2 kids... not pretty. I would rather see him drop the cheesy moves, and the freedom blades, and concentrate on his "normal" skating... he's certainly talented enough to do well and might just endear himself more to the crowds like Todd has.

[AxelAnnie22]

Originally posted by Serenity

Just imagine that your absolute favorite skater did the tornado (Alexei, Todd, or whoever-- fill in the blank with YOUR favorite). What would you think of the move then? And remember, it's SUPPOSED to be a crowd-pleasing show move, NOT a move for a serious eligible competition. Well, I hate to tell you, but when my favorite skater does something I think is silly, awful, sub-standard, I still speak up. Just check and see what I had to say about Irina rolling on the ice. Didn't like that, and don't like the tornado.......although I bet Alexi would do a clean one ;)

[duane]

i think serenity makes a valid point. i dont think this move would be getting anywhere near the criticism it is receiving if it had been landed by anyone other than michael weiss.

OTOH, adrian is correct in that MW is one who (easily) brings criticism to himself, especially with that hilarious website. i mean, did he really think he was the crowd favorite at hallmark? i wasnt in the audience, but it was clear by the televised event that both todd and yagudin received a much more enthusiastic response from the audience. and yes, his 2nd place finish was surprising--he should have finished behind both yagudin and todd.

still, i think the tornado is a cool move!

[TRAxel]

Could someone kindly post Michael's website URL?

Please and Thank you.

[adrianchew]

http://www.michaelweiss.org

[Alexeiskate]

Originally posted by Serenity

Just imagine that your absolute favorite skater did the tornado (Alexei, Todd, or whoever-- fill in the blank with YOUR favorite). What would you think of the move then? And remember, it's SUPPOSED to be a crowd-pleasing show move, NOT a move for a serious eligible competition.

They probably wouldn't have named it "The Tornado" or gave it any a name at all and just let the move speak for itself. Surya's one foot layout backflip is spectacular, but she didn't feel the need to give it some potentially awe-inspiring name. She simply did it in her program and then let the "Ooohs" and "Ahhs" from the audience speak for themselves.

[Mazurka Girl]

Look at it this way. People who don't like Mike are going to have to criticize his web site & critique moves like this now that they can no longer chastise him about how he doesn't have a quad or triple axel. IMO, that's progress, because it means he's made gains in the consistency dept.

I don't particularly like his Rolling Stones program. The music could be edited better & I wish he would put a shirt on. But he can do his move if he wants & call it the tornado, the hurricane, the storm watch or whatever he wants. People who don't seem to know when & where he can do it haven't taken the time to understand the competition rules. And I don't really care what they say on his website because I don't usually read it.

LOL, I hope Mike wins another Nationals. He's an alright guy & he made improvements this year.

[AxelAnnie22]

Originally posted by dbell
-
I try to like him, I really do, but he makes it so darned difficult! 8O

I'm with you dbell. I try to like him.....really I do. But he keeps getting in the way of himself.

And whoever said cheap stuff was right on the mark. He is far too talented a skater to have to resort to show stunts. It cheapens the whole sport. And sliding across the ring on the "freedom blades" my husband said "Oh he looks like a Cingular commercial" :roll:

Surya caught a lot of flack for her attitude. And, Scott, sat in the kiss and cry and told the cute kids beside him that he knew he wasn't supposed to do that, and they should NEVER do that.

And, Mazurka Girl.....just dismissing criticism of Mike as words of people who don't like him is glossing over what is so. When you say he "has a quad" I would argue that on the facts. Goebel has a quad (several, in fact), Yags and Plushy have quads. Mike, has landed a quad on a rare occasion. It is like saying that Todd has a quad. (Much as I love Todd, I wouldn't even make that leap - no pun intended). To HAVE something you have to be able to reliably land it most (think 90%) of the time. (And that would be 90%of the time you plan to land it....not of the times you try to land it). With all due respect, I don't think Mike falls into that category.

Also, consider the amount of time he spent training the tornado (I hate even thinking he called it that....why a tornado?). I think it would have been better spent on perfecting other areas of his skating......like his quad?

[missmarysgarden]

In an earlier post, someone asked "I wonder what kind of a gymnast Mike would have been?" Well, he comes from a gymnastics family. I suppose he would have been a decent gymnast - he has the right kind of body for it.

As for the "tornado", I'm sure that it is much more difficult to land on ice than it is on "land". In gymnastics, it is called a "full" - meaning a salto (flip) with one full twist. It is a "B" skill in gymnastics, an entry level skill in optional gymnastics, considered very basic. I judged a long local meet two weeks ago, and all but a handfull of the 80+ gymnasts at Level 8 did a full, many of them excellent, even among the 9-10 year olds. Several did "double full". By Level 9, two levels below Elite, if you don't have a double full, you are nowhere. Many Level 9's do double saltos as well; some Level 10's do excellent "triple fulls", and what is called a "full-in" - that is a double back salto with a full twist. All competitive Elite gymnasts have an arsenal of triple fulls, full-ins, some have "full-in, full out" (that's a double back salto with two twists), and double saltos in layout position. And they are often done in combination directly and/or indirectly connected.

By the way, doing back or front saltos to a "prone" position (a controlled landing, not on all fours) used to be a "big skill" in gymnastics - what judges call a "cheap C" - they have all been downgraded to "B", and there is a deduction of .1 for having more than one in a routine. We expect they will either be "A" in the next Olympiad, or eliminated from the Code (making them either illegal voiding the routine, "uncharacteristic" requiring a .1 deduction, or no value). They usually receive execution deductions anyway, and their inclusion often results in an artistry deduction as well because they are so clunky. We call them "belly flops"!

As far as Michael is concerned, I liked him better in his "early years". Some people find his apparent narcissim off-putting. I'm one of them.



The only wow about the tornado would be if he landed it. It is a simple skill in gymnastics - trickier on ice - like everything! But very unattractive to me when done on ice -

[Mazurka Girl]

Originally posted by AxelAnnie22
And, Mazurka Girl.....just dismissing criticism of Mike as words of people who don't like him is glossing over what is so. When you say he "has a quad" I would argue that on the facts. Goebel has a quad (several, in fact), Yags and Plushy have quads. Mike, has landed a quad on a rare occasion. It is like saying that Todd has a quad. (Much as I love Todd, I wouldn't even make that leap - no pun intended). To HAVE something you have to be able to reliably land it most (think 90%) of the time. (And that would be 90%of the time you plan to land it....not of the times you try to land it). With all due respect, I don't think Mike falls into that category.
Mike's quad toe has always been inconsistent in past seasons. Now he has been landing it consistently at the the last several competitions & exhibitions I've seen. As well as the triple axel & triple axel combo, which had also been inconsistent in previous seasons. So I would say he has made gains in that area. Maybe you have only seen it on a "rare occasion" but others have seen it more often than that, especially this season. What I would actually consider more of a rarity was when he missed the triple lutz, because that has been one of his more consistent jumps for awhile now.

And don't put words in my mouth Axel Annie, I did not dismiss criticism of Mike. I tried to state what I wanted to say as clearly as I could but it's not what you have noted. I don't really care if people like him or not, but they should at least be able to differentiate between his web site/projected media image & the actual skating.

[AxelAnnie22]

MissMary
Thanks for the information. I loved learning about that. I was wondering, though, does the velocity and speed one would get skating into the "full" in anyway offset the difficulty in landing it on the ice? I know it wouldn't make it easier to land, but would it make it easier to initiate?



Mazurka Girl you said:
Look at it this way. People who don't like Mike are going to have to criticize his web site & critique moves like this now that they can no longer chastise him about how he doesn't have a quad or triple axel.

Sorry if I didn't interpret that in the way you intended. It sounded to me as though you were glomping all comments that were not favorable into the "People who don't like Mike" category. I think it is possible to like lots of skaters, and for a variety of different reasons. And, it is possible to not like certain things that skaters whom you like, might do, or not excel in.

[Mazurka Girl]

Originally posted by AxelAnnie22
I think it is possible to like lots of skaters, and for a variety of different reasons. And, it is possible to not like certain things that skaters whom you like, might do, or not excel in.
I wasn't 'glomping', thank you. I will express myself more clearly next time. And this other stuff doesn't relate to anything I have said so I don't really know why it's in a paragraph to my attention.

On the issue of whether or not Mike has a quad, we'll simply have to disagree. But to present it as fact that he does not have one is something I believe is pretty inaccurate & I certainly question the basis for that information.

SL - and that's just my opinion ;) :roll:

[adrianchew]

I thought Mike landed a NON 2-footed 4-toe/3-toe at Hallmark - can someone tell me if he did or didn't? I thought he did a 4-toe/3-toe at Crest the night before too... that was possibly clean too?

No - I haven't watched my tapes of either event (except Crest ladies).

I do think Mike has improved this season.

[AxelAnnie22]

I thought they were both two footed. But, I am so over-saturated skating competitions, videos, on line reports.....I can hardly keep anything straight at this point :??
I'll be looking forward to the answer to your question:)

[nigella]

According to Mike's website:

*His signature move is the Quad Lutz*

Can someone tell me which compeitions that he has landed this jump on one foot to make it a "signature" move?

[duane]

nigella,
i think they meant to say "His signature move is attempting a quad lutz". ;)

[nigella]

Originally posted by duane
nigella,
i think they meant to say "His signature move is attempting a quad lutz". ;)



LOL the Weiss Team seems to be taking some "big time" liberties with the facts! :oops:

[kayskate]

I have to wonder what Weiss's success rate w/ the 4lutz might be in practice. His attempts in competition looked pretty good, but all were 2-footed. I wonder if he has landed the jump any better in practice.

Kay

[Chico]

Personally I don't like the way Michael Weiss promotes himself. On the whole his outfits, gimics, and self promotion makes me wince. This is MY opinion. He talks big, but on the whole I can't see it. You can like yourself too much I think...... His "new" jump is a gimic to me, ditto with the blades. Reminds me of his "Mike Pike". (I can do a lovely "Mike Pike" backwards down the ice. I skate. Maybe I should name it after myself. =-/)

Chico

[missmarysgarden]

That's what I meant, Chico, when I said that I and others are put off by his narcissim.

I was listening to Charles Barkley on PBS this morning talking about his new book and about life after sports. He made statement that sums up how I feel about athletes. He said that it would be sad if the value of a person were summed up by thenumber and quality of their success as athletes. So if you strip away the "wins" of any athlete, and look at what kind of a person they are during and after their career, I would not be attracted to Michael Weiss. That's why athletes like Michelle Kwan, Janet Lynn, etc. are and always will be at the top of my list.

Aside from that, I think that Weiss has many wonderful qualities as an athlete. I just don't enjoy him because I don't like his attitude, or the attitude and behaviours of his "team".

[Mazurka Girl]

Originally posted by AxelAnnie22
I thought they were both two footed.

Mike landed a clean quad in a combo at the Detroit competition. I don't know about Columbus because I didn't see any of the SPs.

I never thought he would get a quad lutz in competition, but now I'm leaning toward thinking he might actually be able to pull it off sometime in the next year. The attempts have been pretty good so far.

Charles Barkley. A great example of humility in the athletic world. :P


SL - and that's just my opinion ;) :roll:

[missmarysgarden]

You might be surprised if you read Barkley's new book. I was very impressed with much of what he had to say about life after sports, how grateful he is for the opportunities he had as an athlete, and what he feels is really important in life - and what he plans to do with his.

You might be surprised as well to know how much quiet charitable giving he has done during his athletic career.

[Mazurka Girl]

No thanks. There are many athletes who make such contributions, not only Charles Barkley, whether anyone is aware of it or not. I just find it amusing that he is the example used.


SL - and that's just my opinion ;) :roll:

[missmarysgarden]

Charles has been much on the interview circuit lately - commercial, public radio, public television. Believe me, I am not a lifelong Barkely fan. I was just very much impressed by what he had to say. Another thing he said was that he expected that his athletic career was without question the "most fun and most exciting" time of his life, and it probably would not be topped. But he made the point that fun and excitement is not the measure of the value of a life. What one does to leave even some small part of the world a better place is what matters. I liked hearing that - especially from Barkeley. Whether he was sincere or not I will not argue. It remains to be seen. But its something to think about.