Why do coaches have different standards on skating?

[joyjoy]

Looking at the quality of skating in certain athletes, you can certainly tell who will become champions and who will not. Looking at the US ladies, for instance, they all have grace,style, costumes, the whole package, etc. Sasha has a beautiful layback, Michelle and Sarah have beautiful spirals. But compare them to the Japanese skaters such as Yoshie Onda, their is really no comparison. Her layback is really atrocious, she has ugly spirals, her costumes are seriously lacking; she does not have the whole package. Her jumps are strong though. But why does Onda's coach and say Cohen's coach see things differently? I mean a lot of people see that Onda doesn't have the presentation whereas Cohen will usually beat everyone with her artistry. Doesn't Onda's coach see that her pupil is seriously lacking in posture, spirals, costumes, style, etc? Does Onda's coach seriously expect her Onda to compete for gold with what Onda has?
I look at all the coaches out there and see that some instill jumping in their pupils and some instill posture, style, the complete package. Isn't it also prettier to look to the eye that a skater has what Kwan, Cohen, Hughes, etc, have to offer than those skaters who are seriously lacking in this area? Doesn't the coaches see this and want to improve on this in their pupils? I would think that as a coach you will focus on all the aspects on what makes a great skater. I don't want to go into judging here but I will for a little bit. Judging is almost similar here in a sense in that certain judges favor certain things over others. But the difference here is that judges are not paid to teach but that "skaters trust their coaches to give them the best advice there is. "

Sorry for going on and on. Please feel free to reply. I hope you understand what I am trying to say. Also, this message is not to criticize Yoshie Onda personally. I just happen to pick her to give an example. I feel that her coach's teaching is questionable. :(

[adrianchew]

Coaches tend to focus on technique, some are better than others in different areas. The Japanese coaches seems to be focusing on jumps, the Chinese coaches are taking the same approach, whereas the coaches in the US seem to be overall far more balanced.

[rack]

Body types factor into the situation. I remember an article about Midori Ito at the time of the 1992 Olympics, which said she wished she had the gracefulness of Kristi Yamaguchi.

Ito may not have had the flexibility of Yamaguchi, but she had the muscle type to be an extraordinary jumper. And they were both great skaters.

That should be the joy of figure skating- that different skaters bring different skills and strengths to the sport. And we, the fans, can favor those skaters whose strengths we respond to.

[loveskating]

There are not that many truly great skaters who can do it all going on at any given time, never were, never will be.

Seems we don't recognize how incredible skating is, how incredibly difficult are the standards that have been set, and how rare and very precious anyone who is a true master of skating is???

Frankly, one trip to the practice ice seeing kids do perfectly good footwork as to the blades except that they look like little fish flopping about will teach you how extremely difficult it is to do any of this stuff with the kind of carriage, quality and line that people like Sasha manage!

Its not easy...kids learn spirals within a few months, sitspins etc within a year or sooner, footwork too...doing it at speed and on center, with line and expression, is almost impossible.

[kayskate]

I think many coaches focus on jumps b/c they are a must. maybe not a 3axel for a lady, but the other triples are. The mindset is probably that once the athlete can do the jumps, we can work on the rest. This seems to have been the case w/ Tim Goebel.

Last season I remember speaking w/ a talented teenager's mother who said her daughter's coach wanted the kid to get the jumps. That was of primary importance. I believe there is some truth to that. The jumps are the price of admission. How many lousy camels, sits and laybacks do we see? How much weak unidirectional footwork occurs during elite competition? Quite a bit. However, those skaters w/ lower quality spins, footwork, and extension can often do the triples. If they couldn't do the triples, they would not be there at all. I only know of one skater who could really spin but lacked the jumps and was regularly shown on TV (in the US). That was Lucinda Ruh who may arguably be the best spinner ever.

I agree w/ the poster who is dismayed at the qulaity of Onda's layback. She has a 3axel and great jumps but that layback is worse than mine! IMO, there is no excuse for a miserable layback at her level. I am not picking on Onda either, merely responding to the example given previously. Onda is a very good skater. I hope she develops her artistic and spinning skills in the future.

Kay

[loveskating]

I tend to agree about the price of admission being the jumps...and from a family's POV, they probably don't want to keep sinking money into the skating if the kid cannot do the 3 jumps, so that is an incentive for the coach to push the kids. Its reasonable considering how skating is funded family by family in the U.S.

As for Onda's layback, I'd just remind everyone that Michelle, Tara and all the U.S. ladies used to have a layback just like that (perhaps performed more musically, but nevertheless, just like that). In fact, I think maybe ABC or at least ESPN just got Sarah's layback on the graphic introduction to the skating shows (it looks like Sarah's layback).

It was Angela who turned all that around, as I recall.

[duane]

with, say, Onda, i think it was obvious to her coach that her best asset as a skater would be powerful jumps, so that has been the focus of her skating. she has seemed to improve other aspects of her skating as well, tho IMO she is not anywhere near michelle/sasha's league.

still, it is possible for a powerful jumper to stand on top of the podium. of course, to do so usually requires not only a clean, difficult performance, but mistakes by the more complete skaters.

personally, i think what a coach focuses on depends on the skater. as adrian stated, the chinese coaches seem to be focusing more on the jumps, but i think that has more to do with the skaters. so far, the most successful chinese skater has been chen lu, whose overall skating skills rivaled anyones. i think if the coaches had a skater of chen lu's quality, they would be more balanced in their coaching.

[missmarysgarden]

The coach who can teach everything is rare. Like skaters (or gymnasts), coaches have more experience, understanding and talent in some areas than they do in others. Coaches make a huge investment of themselves in the career of an elite athlete. It is hard to be selfless enough to say "I've taken him/her as far as I can with regard to (fill in the blanks....spinning, jumping, layback, speed, etc.)" And its hard to go "shopping" for a coach - you give up a lot of intangibles in a long term relationship. Also, skaters/dancers/gymnasts don't always have the same learning style. Some may be superb learners when it comes to say style and expression - learning by imitating --- but not so good at overcoming fear, pushing the envelope - where they might benefit from a hard pushing coach. Its a match game - and finding the perfect "partner" can be as much of an accident as a successful search. Unfortunately, athletes tend to be attracted to coaches who excel in their own area of talent (natural jumpers are drawn to great jumping coaches; artists drawn to artistic coaches). Better if opposites attract?!! Best if coaches "share" their athletes and bury their egos - but it seldom happens. When athletes leave strong coaching relationships, it is often to seek out help in their weaker areas - and this is hard on the ego of the abandoned coach.

This is one reason why USA Gymnastics now has extended "training camps" for all athletes selected as promising athletes for international competition - from pre-juniors to world team members. They hope that coaches coming together will give more athletes the opportunity to learn "the best from the best" - and that coaches can learn from each other, too. I already see more balance among top level gymnasts, and in the juniors as well. It will be interesting to see what the future brings. It might serve as a model for other athletic federations.

[AxelAnnie22]

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It was Angela who turned all that around, as I recall. Angela always had a lovely layback. However, real pressure for the ladies came when Dick Button put a picture of NNN's gorgeous layback, with beautiful arch, and gorgeously pointed foot on a split screen with Michelle's layback, at the 1999 US NATS. We saw a very much improved Michelle the next year.