Hersh article on new season

[Debbie S]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/international/cs-0211150294nov15,0,439265.story?coll=cs%2Dinternati onal%2Dprint

Basically about the lack of established stars on the GP circuit this fall, w/ the injuries and such. Also about Sasha Cohen's music choices (you can't have an article from Hersh that doesn't criticize a skater's music, can you?) and a bit on the lack of up-and-comers, with some discussion on the inability of countries to develop talent and the fact that only a few countries are winning medals on the GP and JGP circuits.

Interesting bit about Canada - I wouldn't think Canada would have a problem developing figure skaters, but they, like other countries aren't immune to economic realities. The thing that perplexes me is why they can't find corporate sponsors willing to contribute to the federation and skater development, like the U.S. has done.

[AxelAnnie22]

Thanks for posting the link. I agree with his assessment. I am even pretty bored, and I am a skating maniac!

I also agree with his comments about Sasha's music choices. Although her choreography and musicality make her interpretation unique, I loved her earlier music choices. Those choices added another layer of depth and beauty to her skating.

[gandalf]

Originally posted by Debbie S
Interesting bit about Canada - I wouldn't think Canada would have a problem developing figure skaters, but they, like other countries aren't immune to economic realities.

There are alot of countries with far larger populations than Canada who haven't produced nearly as many top 10 skaters. The season isn't over yet, there could still be a few surprises at Worlds if our skaters perform to their potential, particularly Langlois & Archetto and Sandhu.

The lack of "star power" in a post-Olys year is nothing new. Typically it's this year that creates those new stars.

[hydro]

i agree with Hersh in part, but i think he fails to mention some outstanding skaters/teams that have already made an impact starting with last season.

he completely leaves out the Chinese skating team, including the both new pairs teams. they've already skated very well on the GP, and could possibly make the GPF. not to mention Shen/Zhao, they've led the way for "development" of Chinese pairs skating. Lu Chen, of course, is to thank for her mark on Chinese skating back in the day, but if Hersh is so concerned with skating development, he can't possibly leave out the Chinese Skating federation.

Also, he fails to mention the US's lack of medal contenders, or even top 10 contenders in Pairs and Dance. he only mentions that the men aren't doing too well, which is also a bit of a farce.

i think its much too early to name this the season of gloom. the Japenese ladies, the Chinese pairs, the US ladies, the Russian men, the European Dance teams, they all add up to a very diversified sport. sure, there is no one big name dominating skating at the moment, but maybe that's a good thing?

also, with some big names missing for the beginning of the season, such as Michelle Kwan, the season can only get better. we've only been through 2.5 GP events so far, of course its going to look sparse in the post-Olys season.

in fact, i think this season looks much better than the post-Olys season in 99.

[Debbie S]

I was reading through Helene Elliott's LA Times Oly update article and I saw a note at the bottom that Irina Slutskaya is making her "season debut" at the USFSA pro-am on Dec. 13. I guess that means she's not doing her GP events? (Talk about a thin GP Final - I guess it'll be Sasha's to win or lose.) There's also a note about Hughes and Yagudin confirming for both pro-ams and some recaps of Bofrost and the Lalique fields.

Scroll down to the bottom for the skating stuff - you also need to register, if you haven't before

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-olycol15nov15,0,3307776.story?coll=la%2Dheadlines% 2Dsports

[Emanfan]

Why would Irina not be doing GP events? She is scheduled for Cup of Russia and NHK.

[olivia]

That's very strange (about the Elliott article). I can't imagine Irina not competing at her GP events, and Elliott's info is generally very accurate. She covers most, if not all, of the figure skating news for the LATimes. ?????????????

O-

[nits]

As far as I know, Irina is still scheduled for Cup of Russia......and I can't wait to see her new programs! I read she may be going for the 3/3 combos. I'm hoping she'll at least land one, we haven't seen a 3/3 from her in a long time.

[loveskating]

Well, Hersch is sure consistent on his music choices, LOL! He likes the unusual, the not well known!! I guess I was wrong, this is his schtick, not a 'cheap shot' at all.

I, however, LOVE Sasha's music choices this season...for her, I think they are extraordinary because both are extremely, extremely difficult to skate to, to hold the line on, especially the LP Rach.

Personally, I'm still waiting for a skater to skate to vissi d'arte. preferably in exhibition, and preferably by Renata Tebaldi.

I love the season so far...loved the two 3 axels landed by ladies, loved A.P. and her true lutz, adored Sasha's mesmerizing skating, for I've never seen ANY skater push the issue of quality to the limits she has, on all sorts of levels; I enjoyed seeing Sandhu skate a clean short, loved seeing Takeshi, so deserving, finally win and land 2 quads in his LP, and I'd love to see Abt take some gold as well, but just seeing him skate is enough.

Joubert surprised me, and IMHO, he has the basics and shows a lot of star potential.

I've enjoyed seeing the 'new' pairs...Langlois and Archetto and Pang and Tong and the other Chinese pair...and the magnificent technique of T&M...its not SKATING that is lacking, its the cat fight that is lacking, and I'm happy for that.

I liked ABC's more laid back and fun loving approach to the commentary and fluff at Skate Canada, just loved it.

Its like this, Mr. Hersch...the world economy has gone global, in the economic base, and culturally, things always change when the economic base changes...things in skating are not going to be as they were during the Cold War...they are going to be different, and while I don't know exactly how, I just know that.

Why? Because I came of age in the south, in Texas, during the 1960s, and I saw a HUGE change in the economy and then the culture changed as well, that's why, so I know how these things go.

[Gaela]

I'm thrilled with the new season and can't wait for the GPF and Worlds--things are changing. Last season the spots were pretty much guaranteed excep t for bronze in ladies and men; this season there's room at least for silver and bronze in the men's (I'm assuming Plush has gold, but the next two are going to be fought for). Women's could have some surprises. Dance is open, for now. Ladies. . .well it'll be interesting.

Brian Joubert and Pang/Tong and G/G, and the Bulgarian dance team are emerging. Takeshi and Abt are fighting to stay on top. Yoshi Onde is mkaing a break for it. Sasha Cohen has arrived.

Shawn Shawyer will arrive at Nationals in Canada.

Who's bored?

And I didn't know that Skate Canada was ailing for money, either.:?? :??

[donnamarie]

<< Brian Joubert and Pang/Tong and G/G, and the Bulgarian dance team are emerging. Takeshi and Abt are fighting to stay on top. Yoshi Onde is mkaing a break for it. Sasha Cohen has arrived. Shawn Shawyer will arrive at Nationals in Canada. >>

I agree with all these, and also the new pairs team from the Ukraine who were at Bofrost. There are several new, exciting skaters coming up, enough to keep me interested.

[SkateGuard]

It's just sad that Hersh has to be so negative...there are so many Chicago-area skaters who have emerged this season: Evan Lysachek and Natalie Mecher on the Junior Grand Prix, Ben Agosto is originally from Chicago, and Volchkova and T&M both train in the Chicago suburbs. And don't forget the Chicago Jazz, who will be going for their third straight national title in junior synch!

Erin
(who would love to see the Trib replace Mr. Hersh so that he could cover his favorite sport--track!)

[Lee]

Ah, yes, Skate Canada is in the throes of economic doom and gloom...and sitting with a $15 million dollar annual budget. Skate Canada has a great deal of sponsorship dollars flowing in -- money is not the issue. Training methods and skater development programs have been undergoing changes for the past 5 years and we are just starting to see the results of this at the senior level.

As usual, all we have here is another journalist going off half-cocked without all the facts -- or putting the spin on them he wishes to justify his position. :roll:

[memememe76]

In the last 10 years, no Canadian woman has finished higher than eighth at the world championships. In the last five years only a fading Elvis Stojko has been higher than eighth among the men. No current Canadian pairs team has finished higher than eighth.

The guy needs to check his facts straight. Josee came in fifth in 1992 and 1994. And Wirtz & Wirtz, a current pairs team, came in 6th in 1999.

[bleu]

Lee -I guess Hersh is at it again...
Two weeks ago, I read an article in which Lois Stong was very optimistic about pairs skating in Canada and the USA...YES! the United States of America. He predicted these two to be dominant in the near future. Did Hersh mention the Stong's stats - 16 pairs teams(junior and senior level) and a pretty talented US team on the junior level. Nooo...he is on to the usual topics...bad music selection. :roll:

[adrianchew]

I have to think I've seen more skating at different levels than Hersh has this season - much much more. Maybe if Hersh would start attending events at all levels in both countries, he might be able to get a more accurate feel before chiming away. Right now he sounds more like a pretty knowledgable fan of skating in a reporting role, but not with any real involvement in the grassroot levels. ;)

[Jem X]

Phil Hersh is the Chicago Tribune's International Sportswriter. This means he covers all the international olympic event sports, not just figureskating. He'll probably cover speedskating, skiing - alpine and freestyle, gymnastics; in the summer he covers track and field - you get the idea. I think he enjoys figureskating, which is why he seems to write a lot of articles about it. I doubt that the Chicago Tribune would want him to spend his whole winter covering figureskating, which is pretty much what most of us on this board would want. I enjoy all of his columns, not just on figureskating. I am happy that he gives as much attention as he does to figureskating - our other big Chicago paper rarely if ever mentions it.

[SkateGuard]

Adrian, you are exactly right! I am a Chicago-area skater, and I have _never_ seen him at a rink. That's why he frustrates me so much. He hasn't written an article about a local skater since Deanna Stellato was competing. (I don't count Tim Goebel, since he hasn't lived or trained in Chicago for over 10 years)

The best example (and this is a good week for it) was 2002 Midwesterns. They were held in Northbrook, which is no more than an hour from the Tribune Building, yet Mr. Hersh couldn't spare the time to drive up the Tri-State Tollway to attend a single event. Considering that 1. It was an Olympic year and 2. The events were abnormally strong because of withdrawing the US skaters from the JGP after 9/11, I expected him to be there. It's a shame he missed it--the AP meltdown would have been right up his alley, and he would have gotten the exclusive.

Sometimes I wonder how much of his column is dictated by the Chicago Tribune. I mean, we get more Notre Dame football coverage than U of IL--figure that one out!

Erin

[duane]

on the one hand, i agree with hersh. i'm one who loves competition. i dont like it when one skater is so much of a favorite above everyone else, and with the likes of michelle, irina, sarah, yagudin, and timothy being out for whatever reason, i am not looking at the GP series with the enthusiasm that i have in the past.

regarding sash, i disagree. i actually like when skaters use often-used music, because it allows us to compare interpretations (and create threads, make critiques, etc. :) ). i think sasha's uniqueness shines thru with music previously used by others.

regarding Canadian skaters, i am surprised that no Canadian male has, say, taken over the reigns, especially with the history of Canadian male skaters. a canadian male was usually somewhere on the podium--and many times on top--at the top competitions. to many, kurt browning is the epitome of a complete male skater; elvis was waiting in the wings, and was the skater who forever upped the technical merit in mens skating. it would have been great if another Canadian male skater had been waiting to take over the reigns from elvis, keeping the impressive streak of a Canadian male on the podium intact.

[Gaela]

On the one hand, i agree with hersh. i'm one who loves competition. i dont like it when one skater is so much of a favorite above everyone else, and with the likes of michelle, irina, sarah, yagudin, and timothy being out for whatever reason, i am not looking at the GP series with the enthusiasm that i have in the past.


This doesn't really make sense. If you don't like it when one skater is so much of a favorite, as in Michelle, Irina, Yags and Timmy--well then you should be looking forward to the GP series with loads of enthusiasm because they are all not going to be there.

But you say you love competition and are not enthusiastic about GP series? :roll:

[adrianchew]

Originally posted by Gaela

This doesn't really make sense. If you don't like it when one skater is so much of a favorite, as in Michelle, Irina, Yags and Timmy--well then you should be looking forward to the GP series with loads of enthusiasm because they are all not going to be there.

When did Irina withdraw from the GP series? As far as I now she's scheduled for Cup of Russia and NHK Trophy.

I'm looking forward to seeing more of the GP series myself - Cup of Russia and NHK will be interesting... Arakawa will make her debut, McDonough will likely qualify for the Grand Prix Finals. Sasha/Irina matchup at CoR, Yoshie/Fumie/Irina at NHK - its about to get interesting! 8-)

[Annes]

Hah! yes, no Canadian Lady has done better than eighth at worlds...but I think the very fact that we *do* have Jen R. doing well at Worlds is a good sign...at least she is no longer finishing 19th, at least we are sending TWO ladies to worlds...and THREE to Jr. Worlds...
What's with his dislike of Sasha C.? He sort of fails to mention her brilliance with the 'overused' music.

[danibellerika]

Originally posted by Annes
What's with his dislike of Sasha C.? He sort of fails to mention her brilliance with the 'overused' music.

I totally agree with you on that one.

[duane]

Originally posted by Gaela
This doesn't really make sense. If you don't like it when one skater is so much of a favorite, as in Michelle, Irina, Yags and Timmy--well then you should be looking forward to the GP series with loads of enthusiasm because they are all not going to be there. :roll:

yeah, you're right. the GP series will be very competitive for sasha without michelle, irina, and sarah...and with yagudin and tim absent, plushenko's chances of winning the GPF are very slim. :roll:

[Chitta]

I can swallow this article a whole lot better than most of his typical fare, as usually he doesn't miss an oppurtunity to make some wisecrack or take some cheapshot at Michelle. I've accused him of being biased against & disrespectful of her (this, after all she's contributed to the sport) , so maybe one of my emails got thru to him, as here at least he demonstrates a measure of respect for her.

[Gaela]

Look up above a few posts--the poster I was replying to is quoted exactly. This poster said that Irina was out for the season, and I was thinking more about the concept than the actual names when I responded that it didn't make any sense.

Does she/he make sense?:roll: :roll: