Ice Dance?

[isakswings]

This summer, there is a coach who is teaching ice dance once a week. Dd is going to give it a shot and see if she likes it. Her private coach thinks it is a good idea too. I don't know if she will like it, but I think it will be a nice addition to her training. The class is an hour long and the cost is affordable. She'll attend one class next week and then she will be off ice for 3 weeks while she is away on vacation - my dad is taking my kiddos to Disneyland. :)

She is working on MIF and trying to learn footwork. Ice dance should help her develop better skills too, right? Just curious if anyone else takes ice dance in addition to freestyle lessons. If so, did your skater and you, notice a difference in their skating?

Thanks!

[sk8tmum]

Pretty much normal for the skaters around here to do all 3 disciplines. Good and bad to it ...

a) if she hates it: well, 'nuff said. Lots of kids really like it and enjoy it - it can be quite a bit of fun.
b) make sure it is taught properly, i.e. with proper edges, kneebend, carriage, posture, musicality and learning the actual dance steps instead of "swing from this edge to that edge, shift your hip, swing your butt and smile".
c) should learn them solo and partnered.

Anyways, my only caveat is that I have seen some kids get overwhelmed ... with OMIGOD SOMETHING ELSE TO DO AND TO WORRY ABOUT!

Frankly, the biggest improvement to my skaters' footwork has not been from ice dance but instead from dedicated lessons to learning edges, turns, stroking and carriage (yes, I admit it - PATCH SESSIONS). My DS does NOT do dance, but, he has better edges and that than most as he is taught these explicitly ...

[Isk8NYC]

My kids do all three disciplines, but they've been focusing on Dance and Moves for the last few months. When their new skates come in (sigh $$) they both want to concentrate on Freestyle for a while.

Initially, learning the dance patterns for the first time ever is overwhelming, especially if the skater is learning Moves patterns and a new Freestyle program.

On the other hand, it helps the skater learn new skating programs/patterns better and be less challenged by new things.

Summer's a great time to try new things, so I hope your daughter enjoys the class.

[Mainemom]

DD started dancing a couple of years ago and really enjoys it, particularly now that she has reached the Silver dances as she finds them more interesting and fun to do than the lower level ones. It has made a wonderful difference to her posture, knee motion, and power - when you have to get from point A to point B in x number of beats, you make it happen! It's also nice to have something else to work on when you are too sore to jump and are just sick and tire of MIF. On the other hand, I'm glad we waited until she was secure in her edges and was mentally mature enough to handle the nitpickiness of her dance coach. Group lessons will be a great way to find out if your DD likes it or not.

[isakswings]

Thanks for the replies! We're approaching the dance thing as a fun addition to her training. I figure, if she likes it... GREAT! If she doesn't, that's OK too! The teacher teaching it is good and my daughter has had her for LTS and likes her.

We are trying a few new things this summer. She's taking a stroking class, she's trying pilates, she just resumed her off ice class and then she's trying ice dance too. Dd is not competing until September, so her coach is working on moves and her jumps and combo spins. All things she will need for pre-pre. I realize as I type this out, it sounds like a lot! These are all on different days and if she doesn't like a class, she can stop taking it. Plus, we are not committed to attend every week. She will also be off ice for 3 weeks...so we shall see what happens! It's fun seeing her try new stuff! I've considered taking the ice dance class too! :)

[cazzie]

All the better freeskaters that I'm aware of do both.

My daughter (she is really not the most talented skater) does both and now does solo dance competitions (which she really enjoys).

What we have noticed though is that when she is going through a ghastly jump period (e.g. over-rotated axels etc.) she can still go into a competition and for e.g. come 6th out of 18 with some botched jumps and we think its because her skating between the jumps is good and her edges and turns are good. She has also got good posture/musicality etc. which I think comes from dance.

I think it has helped her skating - although sometimes the coaches complain she looks like a dancer doing freeskating and that she has "rise and fall" of knee bend which free skaters don't usually do. (Sorry - I understand so little about skating I don't really know what that signifies).

So - maybe at some level its good for free until you have too much knee bend stuff (which hopefully a more knowledgable parent can explain to you).

[Mainemom]

I've found that dancing has helped her with her MIF as well, as I just remembered one judge complimenting her on a test with "neat feet. Must be an ice dancer." Her dance coach loved that one! I've tried to take ice dance but I found that I'm not a secure enough skater yet and it really wasn't worth the money since I just wasn't capable enough. It's definitely a goal, though.

As for the rise and fall of the knee, that was something her freestyle coach was always after her about before she started dancing. Freestyle coach says the knee shouldn't be static but always moving (unless it's meant to be and stay straight, as in a spiral or something obviously.)

[Skittl1321]

I've tried to take ice dance but I found that I'm not a secure enough skater yet and it really wasn't worth the money since I just wasn't capable enough. It's definitely a goal, though.



This is my problem too. I so want to be able to do ice dance, as something else to focus on, since i'm hitting roadblocks in freestyle and moves. However- I've already hit a roadblock- I can't do the step behinds on the Rhythm Blues. So I'll be stuck at preliminary for years, and it's just not that interesting.

(And with no partnering available, I'm kind of bored with just doing solo Dutch Waltzes and Canasta Tangos for over a year)

[phoenix]

This is my problem too. I so want to be able to do ice dance, as something else to focus on, since i'm hitting roadblocks in freestyle and moves. However- I've already hit a roadblock- I can't do the step behinds on the Rhythm Blues. So I'll be stuck at preliminary for years, and it's just not that interesting.

(And with no partnering available, I'm kind of bored with just doing solo Dutch Waltzes and Canasta Tangos for over a year)

You do know that the middle step behind is optional, right? That might make it more do-able.

I've had kids who had a difficult time w/ that step & with focused work on it they were able to get it.

You should know though, that those step/cross behind steps are liberally scattered through many of the other dances, so it's worth the time spent now to get comfortable with it.

[Skittl1321]

You do know that the middle step behind is optional, right? That might make it more do-able.



No- I didn't, but that's actually the one I can do. The other foot is the problem.

Too bad the dances can't go the other way around the rink. I often think that on moves patterns too- when the turn on the end pattern is harder than the actual move (power pulls, cross rolls)

[Scarlett]

I do both (though rather poorly) and since I started dancing, other people have commented on how much my stroking and edging have improved. Personally, I've noticed that even my jumps are more secure because I tend to skate with deeper knee bend and am more cautious of my free leg placement. I would let your daughter try both. She may really enjoy it and the only thing it will hurt is your wallet.

[Schmeck]

There was a time when my daughter was doing 2 MITF lessons, practice ice, a bit of freestyle, and ice dance, on top of junior level synchro. The ice dance helped with synchro, the synchro (being close/aware of a partner times 15 ;)) really made the ice dance easy, and the MITF made it all fit together, as she was many levels ahead in MITF compared to the ice dance.

Ice dance can only help a skater, IMO. Being able to do a turn or step to the exact spot in the music shows much better control than a singles' program where you can be off by a half beat or so. Same with synchro - try doing a level 4 no-hold step sequence in sync with 15 other skaters, compared to doing it by yourself...

[isakswings]

There was a time when my daughter was doing 2 MITF lessons, practice ice, a bit of freestyle, and ice dance, on top of junior level synchro. The ice dance helped with synchro, the synchro (being close/aware of a partner times 15 ;)) really made the ice dance easy, and the MITF made it all fit together, as she was many levels ahead in MITF compared to the ice dance.

Ice dance can only help a skater, IMO. Being able to do a turn or step to the exact spot in the music shows much better control than a singles' program where you can be off by a half beat or so. Same with synchro - try doing a level 4 no-hold step sequence in sync with 15 other skaters, compared to doing it by yourself...

Thanks! I think it will be a good thing for her. Her coach worked on moves with her today and yesterday... I noticed a change already during her lesson! I think getting better at moves will help her over all skating improve. She's going to be testing in August.. her preliminary moves and her pre-pre freeskate(YIKES... no turning back after that! LOL). I am really hoping she likes ice dance. I think it will add to her over all skating... plus it will give her something else to work on :).

[Query]

Dance can be fun if you find a partner, and you are satisfied with each other's skating, and you don't need to win.

And I've seen one Ice Dancer who danced into her 80s. Probably safer than the other disciplines.

Just go into it with both eyes open. Taken seriously, Dance is a major commitment.

The dance couples I knew, that I'm basing what follows on, competed seriously. So take it with a grain of salt!:

---

Most girls never find a male skating partner other than their paid coaches (who had better be male!) or husbands. If they do find a partner, the partner may not be as good, and may limit test and competitive level. Even as a male, but who isn't competitive level, I never found a partner.

For lifts, the lady has to stay light. Unhealthy diets that delay maturation, and dangerous surgery, are common. I think one of my coaches did both. A girl with a heavy family may be less likely to find a partner, though I think that is mostly true for Pairs.

I assume you and your DD are comfortable with close body positions. Styles vary, but hip touches hip, and upper bodies stay within a few millimeters. Accidental contact occurs. A jealous boyfriend or husband is a problem. Some partners date and marry each other, though the male is often 3 - 5 years older than the girl. Competitive stresses helped one couple I knew to a break up, as partners in both senses.

Many serious dancers supplement Ice Dance with Ballroom, adding to cost and time. Some skaters want separate skates for Dance.Dancers (or their parents) often drive large distances to skate with each other. You need uncrowded ice, and if you practice on public or freestyle ice, you may annoy other skaters.

---

Once again remember most of the above only applies if Dance is taken seriously.

BTW, I got very confused when I had one coach for freestyle and one for dance, as they had significant stylistic differences. I'm not sure, but it is possible that the upright carriage Dance trains doesn't work as well for freestyle.

[isakswings]

Dance can be fun if you find a partner, and you are satisfied with each other's skating, and you don't need to win.

And I've seen one Ice Dancer who danced into her 80s. Probably safer than the other disciplines.

Just go into it with both eyes open. Taken seriously, Dance is a major commitment.

The dance couples I knew, that I'm basing what follows on, competed seriously. So take it with a grain of salt!:

---

Most girls never find a male skating partner other than their paid coaches (who had better be male!) or husbands. If they do find a partner, the partner may not be as good, and may limit test and competitive level. Even as a male, but who isn't competitive level, I never found a partner.

For lifts, the lady has to stay light. Unhealthy diets that delay maturation, and dangerous surgery, are common. I think one of my coaches did both. A girl with a heavy family may be less likely to find a partner, though I think that is mostly true for Pairs.

I assume you and your DD are comfortable with close body positions. Styles vary, but hip touches hip, and upper bodies stay within a few millimeters. Accidental contact occurs. A jealous boyfriend or husband is a problem. Some partners date and marry each other, though the male is often 3 - 5 years older than the girl. Competitive stresses helped one couple I knew to a break up, as partners in both senses.

Many serious dancers supplement Ice Dance with Ballroom, adding to cost and time. Some skaters want separate skates for Dance.Dancers (or their parents) often drive large distances to skate with each other. You need uncrowded ice, and if you practice on public or freestyle ice, you may annoy other skaters.

---

Once again remember most of the above only applies if Dance is taken seriously.

BTW, I got very confused when I had one coach for freestyle and one for dance, as they had significant stylistic differences. I'm not sure, but it is possible that the upright carriage Dance trains doesn't work as well for freestyle.

Thanks! I think for right now, she is going to work on solo dances. I don't know of anyone who could be a partner for her at this point. :) We're going to try it for fun and see what happens. I'm not sure if she will like it, so we'll take it day to day. She likes freestyle... so we'll see what she thinks of dance. I think it will make her a more well rounded skater to learn it. We'll see what she and her freestyle coach think after she's done it for a bit. She will go to one class and then be gone for 3 weeks. After that, she'll resume the class. Should be fun to see how it goes!