Spreadeagles off-ice

[BlueIcePlaza]

Hi,

Have been reading about the virtues of practising these off-ice, to promote a more limber hip and gain overall muscular strength and flexibility to progress faster in other skating techniques and disciplines.
Should I be practising these spreadeagles on or off skates (or both) at home?
Any tips on getting gently into this on the ice, too?

Many thanks. :D

[newskaker5]

Great topic! I just learned a inside spread eagle on Tuesday. I videoed myself today and it isnt so great (no big surprise there!), but I would LOVE tips to get turnout on the ice. My turnout off ice is fine and I can do all 3 splits so I am flexible - just struggling on ice.

Also - can anyone post a video of themselves or someone else doing a correct inside spread eagle? Thanks!

[BlueIcePlaza]

Great topic! I just learned a inside spread eagle on Tuesday. I videoed myself today and it isnt so great (no big surprise there!), but I would LOVE tips to get turnout on the ice. My turnout off ice is fine and I can do all 3 splits so I am flexible - just struggling on ice.

Also - can anyone post a video of themselves or someone else doing a correct inside spread eagle? Thanks!

Well done! I've read that outside spreadeagles are easier, and I'm just a raw beginner in those. Insides sound even more torturous - or are they? :lol:

[Sonic]

Personally I find outside spread-eagles very difficult and don't have so much of a problem with inside ones.

Practising stuff off the ice definitely helps. If you warm up, do some stretches and practise getting the turn out eventually you'll develop the muscle memory for on the ice.

I guess the secret on the ice is to just aim for a little at a time, don't try and get as far as you would off the ice straight away IYKWIM, just do it bit by bit.

S xxx

[doubletoe]

Inside spread eagles are definitely easier, but you need to really push your hips forward and arch your shoulders back in order to balance out the deep inside edge.

Not everyone has hips that are built for 180-degree turnout, and if you don't, the only way to achieve it is by trying to compensate with your knees and ankles. Don't do that; it will ruin your knees. To make sure you are getting the turnout in your hips and not your knees, start in a spread eagle position on the floor (in shoes or bare feet) but with your knees bent at a 90 degree angle. Now gradually straighten your knees to come up into a spread eagle position (it's a plie, if you've taken ballet). Do your knees stay facing the same direction as your feet the whole time? If not, do the butterfly stretch or the frog stretch until you achieve the parallel knees on the plie.
Butterfly stretch: Sit on floor with back against the wall and bottoms of feet together. Bring heels in to crotch and s-l-o-w-l-y press knees down to floor and hold. I like to just rest my hands on my knees for 5 minutes without pushing, until my hips just relax on their own.
Frog stretch: Face down on floor (although I prefer bed!), knees bent and bottoms of feet together, letting the weight of your body open your hips gradually. You don't need to be able to go all the way down on this. I can't.

OUTSIDE SPREAD EAGLE - Outside mohawk entrance

1. Preparation: Holding onto the wall and facing the wall, turn your leading foot out and place it down on the outside of the blade. Now bring your trailing foot down, heel first into the instep (arch) of your leading foot. Notice how it makes your trailing foot turn out and fall right into place.

2. Now, stand in the middle of the rink, facing one end of the rink. Take a few strokes straight forward, then push off at a 90-degree angle toward the side of the rink, pushing onto whichever foot is your leading foot (the knee of the leading leg will be bent). Pushing off at a 90-degree angle will put you on a nice hard outside edge on your leading foot. You want to feel like you're almost on the side of the blade, and going in a big circle around your own leading shoulder.

3. Looking over your leading shoulder, gently swing your trailing foot in front of your leading foot to solidify the outside edge, straightening the skating leg as you do so. Now bring the trailing foot back halfway (so that it's in front of you at about a 45-degree angle), turn the foot out, point the toe and lock the knee out straight.

4. With the knee locked out straight and the foot turned out and pointed, bring the trailing foot in, heel first, to the instep of your leading foot (the skating leg is already locked out straight). The trailing foot should fall into place and turn out once it is on the ice. Make sure you shift at least half of your weight (if not more) to the trailing foot once you put it down. Try not to keep looking down at the ice once you've brought the trailing foot into place. Once you're used to the foot placement, you should be able to keep looking over your leading shoulder the whole time.

5. Look over your leading shoulder and pull your leading shoulder back. This will solidify your outside edge.

6. Now squeeze your butt in and try to pull your thighs closer together to make the position more attractive (this part will probably take awhile to achieve). Also, the smaller the circle, the more you will be able to lean back and the straighter your body line will be.

[NoVa Sk8r]

Inside spread eagles are definitely easier, but you need to really push your hips forward and arch your shoulders back in order to balance out the deep inside edge.I'm sorry; that's just incorrect. Maybe your coach or someone else told *you* to do that (perhaps you were doing it slowly--it's much easier with speed--and needed to lean back to counteract the forward lean?), but it's wholly unnecessary. While I'm certainly not an expert at the inside spread eagle, I've been doing them (successfully) for years and have never needed to arch my shoulders. In fact, that ruins the line of the eagle. Watch Boitano do his inside eagle, and you will rarely, if ever, see him arch his shoulders. Sometimes Wylie arches his shoulders, but I think that's for dramatic effect, not done out of technical necessity.

[Isk8NYC]

Hi,

Have been reading about the virtues of practising these off-ice, to promote a more limber hip and gain overall muscular strength and flexibility to progress faster in other skating techniques and disciplines.
Should I be practising these spreadeagles on or off skates (or both) at home?
Any tips on getting gently into this on the ice, too?

Many thanks. :D
I've been stretching after skating, while my muscles are still warm. It's really helped my spreadeagles. I use a high bleacher bench to get into the position with my skates on and really stretch until I "feel the burn." I also stretch these with my sneakers on - just have something at waist height or so to grab if you lose your balance.

I also do ballet plies (sp?) to further turnout the hips and knees. At home, I've been using a balance ball to stretch side-to-side. Essentially the same thing as the butterfly stretch, I would think.

I do a two-foot glide with the left leg crossed behind, curving to the left. Bring the left foot to the back, performing a 3-turn with the left foot. Now you're skating on LBI and a RFI edges. Stretch and hold the two edges; you have to tighten your buttocks and lower back. (Those situp/crunches are paying off, too!)

Obviously, you can just reverse things if you want to do the spreadeagle with your left foot going forward. I've been trying to master both ways.

Only recently have I begun doing this with an inside mohawk. It's more clumsy for me than the other method, but I wanted to master different entrances. Plus, I get more mohawk practices.

If you have a friend about the same height, it's fun to do a two-person roundabout and hold those inside edges while you go up and down. Helps stretch the hip flexors and is a lot of fun!

The roundabout is hard to describe - kids do it all the time, but not many adults. It's the move where two skaters hold hands with crossed arms. They then pump in a small circle facing each other. When they've built up speed, they both glide on inside edges, bend their knees to go up and down. If you lean back, physics makes you go even faster and you get dizzy.

[Casey]

Any tips on getting gently into this on the ice, too?
Bend your knees a lot. Yeah, you should hopefully get to the point where you don't have to, but it will both bring you closer to the ice so you have less distance to fall, and makes it possible to turnout more with less flexibility. I can't do outside spread eagles with straight legs yet... :/ I think it takes a lot more stretching that I haven't been doing. :P

[doubletoe]

I'm sorry; that's just incorrect. Maybe your coach or someone else told *you* to do that (perhaps you were doing it slowly--it's much easier with speed--and needed to lean back to counteract the forward lean?), but it's wholly unnecessary. While I'm certainly not an expert at the inside spread eagle, I've been doing them (successfully) for years and have never needed to arch my shoulders. In fact, that ruins the line of the eagle. Watch Boitano do his inside eagle, and you will rarely, if ever, see him arch his shoulders. Sometimes Wylie arches his shoulders, but I think that's for dramatic effect, not done out of technical necessity.

No, nobody ever told me to do that, and maybe I am doing it wrong. I can only tell you what it FEELS like to me when I do it, and that's what I feel. By "arching" my shoulders, I mean pulling them back a little, not letting them hunch forward. Here's the position:
http://ca.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/compadultsk8s/photos/view/1eee?b=10

[NoVa Sk8r]

And as I recall from Nats, you have a nice spread eagle. 8-)
But if anything, I think it's more importnat to focus on the lower back.

[doubletoe]

And as I recall from Nats, you have a nice spread eagle. 8-)
But if anything, I think it's more importnat to focus on the lower back.

Yes, that's true. I just think about pushing my hips forward rather than arching my lower back (like the beginning of a layback spin). That automatically arches my lower back while opening up my hips and counter-balancing me against that lean into the circle.