spin difficulty

[froggy]

Hi and happy Labor Day to all. What is the progression in difficulty of spins (beginning from a very basic two foot spin)??

[Kit kat]

i think its
two foot spin
one foot spin
scratch spin
backspin?
sit spin
camel spin
layback
flying camel
flying sit

i dont know where the illusion or biellmann fits in.
hope this helped!

[sunshinepointe]

For me it's been -

two foot spin
one foot spin
forward scratch spin
change foot spin (haven't worked on this yet though, my coach skipped it for no good reason)
sit spin
camel spin - I'm pretty much stuck here so the rest is me assuming ...
layback - I might get this before the stupid camel...
back scratch
back sit
flying camel
flying sit

[Skate@Delaware]

When we started working on our forward scratch, our coach had us working on our sit; the logic is that one helps the other.......more for finding that "sweet spot" to spin on more than anything else!

PS-she had us do both spins starting from a t-position (i.e.-no back crossovers, just the 3-turn and spin).

[ferelu]

For me it was:

1. Two foot
2. Forward one foot
3. Back one foot
4. Back scratch
5. Forward scratch
6. Sit
7. Camel
8. Layback
9. Illusion or Flying camel, I was given a choice
10. Flying sit
11. Beillmann

That was the other I was taught, not the other I got them. I'm still waiting for that back scratch.

[kayskate]

In general:

2-foot
1-foot
1-foot back
upright change foot spin (forward to backward)
forward scratch (however, it depends on how good a scratch. A blurred scratch may come significantly later, as it is very difficult)
back scratch (ideally scratch spins should come together, but a strong back scratch seems to be linked more to learning multi-rev jumps than a spinning hierarchy. Again, a blurred/fast bscratch is very difficult)
sit
camel
attitude
layback (women)
sit-change-sit
camel-change-camel
solo back camel
flying camel
illusion
flying sit
death drop
catch camel variations
Beillmann
flying reverse sit (does anyone do this anymore?)

Various other combos are learned around the flying camel stage. This has been my experience. Some ppl never get a Beillmann, of course. It seems the basic positions are learned before flying spins and most combos other than the very basic ones listed above. Butterflies will probably work in w/ flying camels.

Basic pivots are usually learned as a stepping stone or entrance into 1-foot spins forward or back.

Kay

[crayonskater]

Dumb newbie question: What's the difference betweeen a 1-foot forward spin and a forward scratch spin?

[figure_skater]

dont worry most beginners confuse them...

a ONE-FOOT is when you hold your foot next to the knee that is spinning
(right leg up if u spin counter-clockwise)

a Forward SCRATCH is when you hold your leg out then cross it at knee height over your spinning leg (over your left leg) then bring it down so its crossed at your feet

hope that helps ;)

[crayonskater]

Same edge, just different free leg position?

[BelleOnIce]

Can also be called a corckscrew?
Im from the U.K and I was confussed by scratch spin but from figure_skaters description I am pretty sure it is what I know as a corckscrew.
Belle

[Perry]

kayskate, by flying reverse sit, do mean a flying change sit (ie, a cc jumper would takeoff on the LFO edge and land on the RBO spinning edge? Or do you mean, for a cc jumper, to takeoff from the RFI edge and land on the RBO spinning edge (same foot, jump into a back spin, essentially). I can do the latter, and I'm guessing more people will start doing them, since it's heavily rewarded by the new judging system. Can't do a flying change sit to save my life, though.

And figure_skater, the difference between a one-foot spin and a scratch-spin is largely regional. For what you call a scratch spin, I call a scratch spin as well, though my freestyle coach (who competed in the Olympics and is by no means a beginner) calls it a one-foot spin.

[kayskate]

kayskate, by flying reverse sit, do mean a flying change sit (ie, a cc jumper would takeoff on the LFO edge and land on the RBO spinning edge? Or do you mean, for a cc jumper, to takeoff from the RFI edge and land on the RBO spinning edge (same foot, jump into a back spin, essentially).

In my understanding a flying reverse sit takes off like a basic flying sit, but the skater changes feet in the air. Rather than landing in a forward sit s/he lands in a bsit.

BTW, I have also heard a scratch spin called a 1-foot spin. To me, teh differentiation comes from speed of the sit. In a scratch, the cross over and push down when done well generates a lot of speed.
Kay

[doubletoe]

A lot of beginning skaters take a long time to get the reverse spin. My order of progression has been:

2-foot spin
1-foot forward spin
sit spin
reverse spin
camel spin
change foot and camel-sit combination spins
flying camel

I have avoided the layback so far. My body just doesn't want to do that!

[pennybeagle]

In my understanding a flying reverse sit takes off like a basic flying sit, but the skater changes feet in the air. Rather than landing in a forward sit s/he lands in a bsit.


Yep, that's a flying reverse sit. I've seen several skaters doing this at my rink as their second flying spin (usually along with a flying camel) in lieu of a flying sit or a death drop. I've also heard from some coaches that this is actually an easier spin to master than the "regular" flying sit for many skaters.

I think the order in which a skater learns their spins really depends on that particular skater's strengths and natural spinning tendencies. I, for one, had enormous difficulties learning the back spin, and learned many forward spins while trying to get my backspin to work. So, I think my progression was:
two-foot
one-foot (free leg at ankle)
forward scratch (free leg crossing in front, with increasing rotational speed)
forward sit
forward camel
camel-sit combinations
forward layback
camel-layback and catchfoot combinations
back scratch (free leg in front, jump rotation position)
sit-back sit combinations
solo back sit
back one-foot (free leg open or at ankle. Yes, I'm weird.)
flying sit
flying camel
camel-back camel
solo back camel
back attitude
back camel catchfoot
illusion (work in progress)
change edge spin (work in progress)

[kayskate]

I, for one, had enormous difficulties learning the back spin, and learned many forward spins while trying to get my backspin to work.

I also could do a remedial bspin very early on but it was usually an unintentially inside edge. I really did not get a good bspin until I learned the bcamel. It is virtually impossible to do a bcamel on an inside edge. IMO, it is much harder to change a back camel from an outside to an inside than to change edge in a forward camel from inside to outside. A kneeling position in the forward camel allows you to rock back on the blade and hit an outside pretty readily.

I learned the camel-sit and camel-layback early on too.

Flying reverse sit may be easier than basic flying sit from some skaters b/c is is similar to an axel. Not that I ever had a decent axel. I could never really get the flying sit. However, i used to do a camel-jump-sit. All forward spins. It was a pretty cool jumped transition.

Kay

[LoopLoop]

IMO, it is much harder to change a back camel from an outside to an inside than to change edge in a forward camel from inside to outside. A kneeling position in the forward camel allows you to rock back on the blade and hit an outside pretty readily.


I find the opposite to be true. The back camel is one of my favorite spins, and I sometimes end up switching to a FI edge without even really trying. I've been working on an outside camel intermittently and cannot get it to work. At all.