greg/pet lead team to the 2006 olympics

[what?meworry?]

belbin/agosto will not be eligable. lang/tchernychev history.
no other team even close at this time.
who'd have guessed! yikes! (and other things left unsaid at this time.)

[icedancer2]

Interesting.

MAYBE Tanith can get her citizenship (?)...

MAYBE Peter will get a new (American) partner and they will skyrocket to the top of the heap...

MAYBE another American team will come up faster... ?

I think with dance you never know who is going to show up and when.

[DancinDiva]

I personally do not see what is so scary about this. They are a very lovely team that is obviously dedicated to improving their skating. They already have good speed, nice posture, and plently of poise, presence, and maturity. Yes, they need to add some difficulty to their programs, but as they showed this past year, they certainly are capable of doing that. They made so much progress between 4CC last season and Skate America this season, and improved further between SA and Nationals, and I'm sure they will continue to improve over the next two years. Do I expect them to medal at the 2006 Olympics? Probably not. But honestly, who was the last US Dance Team to medal at the Olympics anyway? But I feel that by then they will be fully capable of delivering a very respectable Olympic performance, and I see no reason for US fans to be scared or embarassed to have them representing US Ice Dance. I myself will be proudly cheering for them from my living room!

[IceDanceSk8er]

Originally posted by DancinDiva
I personally do not see what is so scary about this. They are a very lovely team that is obviously dedicated to improving their skating. They already have good speed, nice posture, and plently of poise, presence, and maturity. Yes, they need to add some difficulty to their programs, but as they showed this past year, they certainly are capable of doing that. They made so much progress between 4CC last season and Skate America this season, and improved further between SA and Nationals, and I'm sure they will continue to improve over the next two years. Do I expect them to medal at the 2006 Olympics? Probably not. But honestly, who was the last US Dance Team to medal at the Olympics anyway? But I feel that by then they will be fully capable of delivering a very respectable Olympic performance, and I see no reason for US fans to be scared or embarassed to have them representing US Ice Dance. I myself will be proudly cheering for them from my living room!

I don't think what?meworry? was commenting that Melissa and Denis were scary...just the dance situation in the US is scary.

[Debbie S]

Will he (Pethukov) have U.S. citizenship by 2006? It was only this year that he was allowed to represent the U.S internationally (Worlds and GP events).

I think it's more likely that G-R/M will lead U.S. dance at the '06 Olys. Of course, it's highly possible that Tanith Belbin's citizenship process could be moved along a little faster, courtesy of USFSA lobbying.

[DancinDiva]

This was not their first year on the GP circuit, they competed at both Skate America and Skate Canada last season. From everything I have read, Denis will have US citizenship in plenty of time for the Olympics.

[icyboid]

Maybe Ben and Peter can team up and be the first male/male team to medal in dance. *ba-dum-ching*

[icedancer2]

Originally posted by icyboid
Maybe Ben and Peter can team up and be the first male/male team to medal in dance. *ba-dum-ching*

I like it!!!

[what?meworry?]

why, icyboid, how apropo!
Originally posted by icyboid
Polly Pooperak Move of the Month:
the breast-popper (a.k.a. the "Janet")

[IceDanceSk8er]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
why, icyboid, how apropos!


now,then,is a red dress mandatory?

I don't think the red dress comment was appropriate.

[what?meworry?]

Originally posted by IceDanceSk8er
I don't think the red dress comment was appropriate.
that's why i took it out before i saw your post, however it is highlighted on their official website ("the" dress)(edited 2/26 to add):
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/. website "cover" photo.
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ja4.jpg http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ja3.jpg
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ap6.jpg

honest, for real, as of today (being the 2/26 edit), these photos are on their website! ain't pixel editing grand! (madam, please send the check for this brilliant publicity stunt to: what?meworry? c/o skatingforums.com)

and now,icedancesk8er, you have reinstated the comment! interesting.
your choice to keep it there. you can edit your own post, including the quote.

[IceDanceSk8er]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
that's why i took it out before i saw your post, however it is highlighted on their official website (the dress). and now you have reinstated the comment! interesting.

First of all, I do not have the ability to edit your post or anyone elses, so what you find "interesting" is purely a matter of what the board allows me to do, such as quoting you and others. Perhaps you should enlighten us as to why you enjoy taking pot shots at Melissa and Denis. Now that would be interesting.

[what?meworry?]

read your pm.

you can edit your own and that is now the only place it resides, your choice.
(2/26 edit: well i guess this is now moot, given that i've linked their website photos. so go ahead, keep your reference in, don't edit it out.)

because, like many screwball situations, that was a classic. and, there was a load of fun poked at the time---everywhere---here, other forums, you name it. you were there!

[IceDanceSk8er]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
read your pm.

you can edit your own and that is now the only place it resides, your choice.

because, like many screwball situations, that was a classic. and, there was a load of fun poked at the time---everywhere---here, other forums, you name it. you were there.

If we are here to poke fun at a red dress, where does it end? Is Tatiana Navka next? Lets talk about topics and issues that has some substance and intelligence. Talking about a dress is just plain silly.

[what?meworry?]

Originally posted by IceDanceSk8er
If we are here to poke fun at a red dress, where does it end? Is Tatiana Navka next? Lets talk about topics and issues that has some substance and intelligence. Talking about a dress is just plain silly.

ok, i'll bite. tell me about tatiana navka? i must have missed something.

[IceDanceSk8er]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
ok, i'll bite. tell me about tatiana navka? i must have missed something.

I am not going to touch that one. I'd be just as guilty as you are if I did.

[what?meworry?]

Originally posted by IceDanceSk8er
I am not going to touch that one. I'd be just as guilty as you are if I did.

hey, that's not fair! i haven't a clue! ok---so send a pm. darn, you're mean. not fair, not fair!

read you other pm.

[IceDanceSk8er]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
hey, that's not fair! i haven't a clue! ok---so send a pm.

read you other pm.

"life's not fair. don't whine, work harder"

[what?meworry?]

Can anyone actually translate this morosov interview?
what does it say about greg/pet?

http://www.nevasport.ru/articles.php?id=4200

i'm accepting it on good faith that this is the interview it's supposed to be.

(by the way, i finally captured the photos of which i was speaking above, from the official website and edited them into the verbal comments. for some reason, i couldn't post the actual pix within the post, just the links.)

[what?meworry?]

Originally posted by DancinDiva
This was not their first year on the GP circuit, they competed at both Skate America and Skate Canada last season. From everything I have read, Denis will have US citizenship in plenty of time for the Olympics.

yes, because he married melissa. as jimmy young put it...sandy was wise to suggest they get married rather than just live together when they fell in love after skating together for a while. others, such as naomi and peter, chose the latter.

because of that, he only needed to wait 3 years for citizenship. tanith, by contrast, did not marry ben. therefore she must wait 5 years.

this is stupid. we should change this. either both wait 5 years, or both wait 3 years. just what is the justification for the differential between married to citizen and not married to citizen. gosh, it takes 5 years for a canadian to learn english or sumpthin'?

[SkateFan123]

Originally posted by Debbie S
Will he (Pethukov) have U.S. citizenship by 2006? It was only this year that he was allowed to represent the U.S internationally (Worlds and GP events).

I think it's more likely that G-R/M will lead U.S. dance at the '06 Olys. Of course, it's highly possible that Tanith Belbin's citizenship process could be moved along a little faster, courtesy of USFSA lobbying.

Lobbying efforts didn't work for Rene and Gorsha, why should they work now? Tanith has to wait. I have no problem with that at all, and apparently, she doesn't either. She could have applied sooner but she didn't.

[pairs_guy]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
belbin/agosto will not be eligable.
I thought Belbin had double citizenship?? I remember them saying that on t.v. She must have a U.S. citizenship or they would not be eligible for worlds, right? This doesn't make sense if she doesn't have her citizenship because if she can't go to the olympics because of that she shouldn't be aloud to go to worlds either! She should have stayed in Canada! :D

[what?meworry?]

she will have dual citizenship and i think the timing is such that usa citizenship will be granted just after the cutoff time for the 2006 olys. that's why it may be possible to squeek it up a bit. i would think everyone who wants to see that happen, because it would greatly benefit usa ice dance, should start a letter-writing campaign or call their congressman. this is different from gorsha/renee in the contrast of reqired timing for two teams, one shortened by marraige, one longer for whatever reason.

actually, after fulfilling a short waiting period after representing another country internationally (a year) non-citizens may represent another country in pairs or dance internationally---worlds, grand prix, etc., as long as the partner is a citizen of that country. it is only the olys that require both the have citizenship of the country they represent.

[SkateFan123]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
she will have dual citizenship and i think the timing is such that usa citizenship will be granted just after the cutoff time for the 2006 olys. that's why it may be possible to squeek it up a bit. i would think everyone who wants to see that happen, because it would greatly benefit usa ice dance, should start a letter-writing campaign or call their congressman. this is different from gorsha/renee in the contrast of reqired timing for two teams, one shortened by marraige, one longer for whatever reason.

actually, after fulfilling a short waiting period after representing another country internationally (a year) non-citizens may represent another country in pairs or dance internationally---worlds, grand prix, etc., as long as the partner is a citizen of that country. it is only the olys that require both the have citizenship of the country they represent.

I know the current rules for Olympics. But how is Tanith/Ben's situation different from Renee/Gorsha's.

The marriage rule was designed to help married couples get citizenship issues behind them so they could go one with live. Without marriage, the 5 year rule was designed as such so people didn't jump countries without thinking about it. Tanith's dual citizenship is not significant in the equations. It's good for her, however.

I fully agree that Tanith and Ben will be great Olympians and their success will definately help the US Ice Dancing Team in the future. I still don't want my tax dollars spent on this type of issue. I want my Congressman spending time working on more important issues that affect far more of the population that just figure skating.

Not that skating is not important or that sports are not important but not as important as national security, taxes, jobs, and health issues. That's where I want my tax dollars spent. It's just a matter of priority.

I'm sure that Tanith and Ben will eventually make the Olympics and be quite successful. They are a great team!

[what?meworry?]

Originally posted by SkateFan123
I know the current rules for Olympics. But how is Tanith/Ben's situation different from Renee/Gorsha's...

it's hugely different. back then, the battle was over the unfairness of russian male ice dancers displacing our home-grown variety.

now with both these couples, the "foreign partner" situation is not the issue. each team has one partner who is a citizen of another country seeking usa citizenship in order to represent the usa in the olympics.

further, the partner-from-another-country is now totally accepted as part of the fabric of our dance scene. just count the teams!

the ONLY difference here is that pet. married greg.!

it's time to be honest about this. the differential in timing of citizenship for the 2006 olys is so absurdly little as to make almost meaningless any objection to tanith's citizenship being accelerated.

this married vs. not married to a usa citizen differential of 3 vs. 5 years is rediculous. if greg and pet had not married so quickly after getting together, neither team would be eligible. after all, most couples do live together for a while and/or have a period during which they are engaged, and so on.

[Ellyn]

I expect that the immigration status of the next-best US ice dance team, much less the US ice dance scene in general, would be of little concern to the lawmakers who would consider granting an exception to a member of the best team.

If they're going to weigh issues of fairness in making an exception for Belbin, it would be in comparison to all immigrants, not just other ice dancers.

[what?meworry?]

which is also a pretty good reason to grant the exception to tanith. it won't hurt greg/pet and will help usfsa, a respected organization, enormously in the international arena. i don't think the olympics goes unnoticed among our congressmen.
[ellyn, you noted Originally posted by Ellyn
I expect that the immigration status of the next-best US ice dance team... i'm not sure what you meant (perhaps you thought l/t would have won?), but tanith and ben are natl gold medalists.or were you referring to greg and pet?]

besides, the general idea of bringing the waiting time into alignment for married to and not married to citizens in general is quite a reasonable topic for discussion for all individuals in this situation, not just ice dancers.

by the way after linking the greg/pet official website to the chat board, i noticed that 2/3rds of the posts are from their board admin, dancindiva03, and their official webmaster joseefan. actually half are from the administrator hamiltonbrowningfan/tonichelle alone.
http://pub117.ezboard.com/bpassion
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/. website "cover"
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ja4.jpg http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ja3.jpg
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ap6.jpg
(commissions from web advertising profits may be sent to: what?meworry? c/o skatingforums.com)

[IceDanceSk8er]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
which is also a pretty good reason to grant the exception to tanith. it won't hurt greg/pet and will help usfsa, a respected organization, enormously in the international arena. i don't think the olympics goes unnoticed among our congressmen.

besides, the general idea of bringing the waiting time into alignment for married to and not married to citizens in general is quite a reasonable topic for discussion for all individuals in this situation, not just ice dancers.

by the way after linking the greg/pet official website, i noticed that 2/3rds of the posts are from their board admin, dancindiva03, and their official webmaster. actually half are from the administrator alone.
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/. website "cover"
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ja4.jpg http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ja3.jpg
http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/gp-03nats-ap6.jpg
(commissions from web advertising profits may be sent to: what?meworry? c/o skatingforums.com)

You really don't like this team, do you?

[SkateFan123]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
it's hugely different. back then, the battle was over the unfairness of russian male ice dancers displacing our home-grown variety.

now with both these couples, the "foreign partner" situation is not the issue. each team has one partner who is a citizen of another country seeking usa citizenship in order to represent the usa in the olympics.

further, the partner-from-another-country is now totally accepted as part of the fabric of our dance scene. just count the teams!

the ONLY difference here is that pet. married greg.!

it's time to be honest about this. the differential in timing of citizenship for the 2006 olys is so absurdly little as to make almost meaningless any objection to tanith's citizenship being accelerated.

this married vs. not married to a usa citizen differential of 3 vs. 5 years is rediculous. if greg and pet had not married so quickly after getting together, neither team would be eligible. after all, most couples do live together for a while and have a period during which they are engaged, and so on.

Having just gotten married this past year, we did not live together before the wedding. Two of my three children got married recently too, and they didn't live together first either. The third child is single still. I guess we're not "most couples".

[what?meworry?]

Originally posted by IceDanceSk8er
You really don't like this team, do you?

not so.
this is the first time any thread about them has stayed active and received responses. last time i think there were two responses, lots of views, and it disappeared. it was started by dancindiva last fall.
(edit. to add)
http://www.skatingforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7&page=15&sort=lastpost&order=&pp=25&daysprune=365. Scroll down to the 9/27 thread.
http://www.skatingforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=128678#post128678
this is the first time their website has been linked (they have chosen their own content for their website) and anyone can view it. the link just made it easier to find. http://www.theskateblade.com/gregory-petukhov/
http://pub117.ezboard.com/bpassion
they are silver medalists now with l/t gone. they will go to the olys even if b/a go also.
i don't get your line of reasoning at all. if it is about my lobbying a case to change the waiting time for citizenship to 3 years for everyone, and/or easing the antiquated rules for tanith, that doesn't prevent greg. and pet. from going, it just lets b/a go too which would be even better for usa dance.
right now, since its inception last november, there are 20 registered fans on their chat board, a third of whom have not posted since saying "hi" on the first couple of days and only 3 of whom are particularly active accounting for most of the 150 or so posts. they will probably have a lot more very soon.
i don't see how any of this hurts them.

[what?meworry?]

Originally posted by SkateFan123
Having just gotten married this past year, we did not live together before the wedding. Two of my three children got married recently too, and they didn't live together first either. The third child is single still.I guess we're not "most couples".

you make a good point, of course, but i offered a couple "norms" to cover the majority---living together and/or being engaged for a while before getting married:

Originally posted by what?meworry?
...married vs. not married to a usa citizen differential of 3 vs. 5 years is rediculous. if greg and pet had not married so quickly after getting together, neither team would be eligible. after all, most couples do live together for a while and have a period during which they are engaged, and so on...

i was mostly referring to the skating couples in general...wylie, kerrigan, lang/tch (just lived together), pun/swallow, who may have lived together or been engaged for a while first. i just couldn't think of any other such quickie marraige within the skating world.

[icedancer2]

Originally posted by what?meworry?
...wylie, kerrigan, lang/tch (just lived together), pun/swallow, who may have lived together or been engaged for a while first. i just couldn't think of any other such quickie marraige within the skating world.

Are you implying that wylie and kerrigan were a couple? Really?

[what?meworry?]

no. it was a poorly structured sentence even with the commas and slashes. when they, as individual skaters met their respective future spouses, there was a period of "courtship" so to speak. i was thinking about the general community of skaters, not just pairs/dance. add zimmerman, add hamilton, and many others who took more time between meeting and getting married whether they lived together and/or went through an "engagement" period, they took longer before tying the knot.

[Josef6]

what?meworry?,

As Melissa and Denis' webmaster, I couldn't help but step in here.

I honestly do not care how much you decide to bash myself, but your relentless taunting of Melissa and Denis is bordering on obsessive. Why you feel the need to pull up past topics from over a year ago, count posts on their message board, etc. is beyond my comprehension. You've been saying the same things for what feels like decades, and I just don't understand your motive.

Out of curiosity, I would just like to know one thing: What exactly is your goal with these posts such as above in this thread, making pot-shots at Melissa and Denis' marriage, amount of fans, website, etc. etc. If it is to prevent Melissa and Denis from chasing their dreams and advancing in this sport, you are on the losing team. They have worked far too long and too hard for that.

(BTW, on a semi-related note, my user name on here used to be Josef, but I have since had to get a new account due to some computer problems.)

[DancinDiva]

Well said, Josef.

[SkateFan123]

Originally posted by Ellyn
I expect that the immigration status of the next-best US ice dance team, much less the US ice dance scene in general, would be of little concern to the lawmakers who would consider granting an exception to a member of the best team.

If they're going to weigh issues of fairness in making an exception for Belbin, it would be in comparison to all immigrants, not just other ice dancers.

Well said, Ellyn!

[what?meworry?]

first of all, ellyn,
it was of interest and concern to lawmakers back when there was an effort to get gorsha and renee to be able to represent the usa. i was involved in the lobbying effort at the time and it was not at all considered frivolous. it also almost worked. it is well known that a portion of the skating community vigorously opposed it for reasons already mentioned above. i believe the people who opposed it at the time truely believed it would hurt our dance program for the usa guys. it has not. it has elevated our standards and success internationally, which those of us who wished to see it happen believed it would.

i do believe that tanith's situation and the times are very different from then (please reread my previous post about this) and there is a good chance it could happen. i'm sure they're making effort and would not turn it down if the opportunity presented itself. i believe the contrast of these two teams is a significant point worth making regarding the inequity of waiting time, particularly now that greg and pet are assured a position for the 2006 olympics with lang and tchern out of the picture for sure.

as to your website josef,
i have not criticized it at all, i have highlighted it giving it significant exposure. tell me how many more hits you've gotten since it was linked. anyone can and no doubt has looked at it in its entirety. clearly you and the team are proud of it. if you feel anything i have highlighted to give it publicity is not in good taste, i can only say that you and they are the only ones who have the ability to change it. the website and chat board were put out on the web by you for everyone to access. i have just linked them to this location.
your website is well made relative to other skater sites. i don't understand the point of so narrowly a focused (one team) chat board, but would anticipate membership growth from the exposure here.
everything i have presented is factual---discussing wise and well timed decisions as pointed out by others. why are you reading it as "pot-shots."

again, my goal is to contrast these two teams who by chance of a quick and timely decision to marry for one, will have different outcomes regaring the 2006 olympics.
i am trying to highlight the absurdity of NOT having our GOLD medalists allowed to go to the 2006 olympics because tanith is not married to a usa citizen and therefore has had to wait two additional years---5 years--- for her citizenship (and just missing the cutoff by a very little time) compared to denis who had to put in only 3 years. i happen to think there is something terribly wrong---inequitable if you want a polite expresion---about this.

accelerating tanith's citizenship by just a little bit of time so that they can also go the the 2006 olys will not hurt greg and pet's chance to go---we can send two teams. having BOTH our GOLD (b/a) and silver (greg/pet) medalists, not our silver and bronze or pewter medalists go to the olympics, will truely benefit usfsa and our standing internationally in ice dance.

so you see, it actually ain't all about greg and pet!

my goal is to see the TOP TWO teams, our gold as well as silver medalists, be allowed to go. the tale of two teams happens to be a very good vehicle to highlight this and what is needed to achieve this.

why would we want anything else?
greg and pet are not prevented in any way from pursuing their dreams by b/a also being able to fulfill theirs.

[what?meworry?]

i have recentaly heard rumors/gossip of dissatfication with morosov and a return to hess. hess has been continuously listed as one of their coaches even though she was not the primary or active coach for the team for quite a while.

since they did not rank in the top 10 at worlds, is there any credibility to the rumors of their leaving morosov to return to colorado springs to work with hess now that she has actively reentered the coaching arena?

[Smiley0084]

what?meworry?,

As Melissa and Denis' webmaster, I couldn't help but step in here.

I honestly do not care how much you decide to bash myself, but your relentless taunting of Melissa and Denis is bordering on obsessive. Why you feel the need to pull up past topics from over a year ago, count posts on their message board, etc. is beyond my comprehension. You've been saying the same things for what feels like decades, and I just don't understand your motive.

Out of curiosity, I would just like to know one thing: What exactly is your goal with these posts such as above in this thread, making pot-shots at Melissa and Denis' marriage, amount of fans, website, etc. etc. If it is to prevent Melissa and Denis from chasing their dreams and advancing in this sport, you are on the losing team. They have worked far too long and too hard for that.

(BTW, on a semi-related note, my user name on here used to be Josef, but I have since had to get a new account due to some computer problems.)

Why not Josef? She did the same with L/T, I'm sure she just needs someone to take their place now that L/T are gone. I hope Melissa and Denis kick *** in the future and one day become national champions. They have the talent and drive.

[what?meworry?]

smiley, you are clearly a fan: http://pub117.ezboard.com/fpassionfrm2.showMessage?topicID=26.topic
and that's fine. but there are others who feel that there is a fundamental unfairness that belbin/agosto would not be able to compete in the 2006 olys because belbin must wait 5 years compared to pet's 3 years just because gregory married him shortly after they began skating as a team. (by the way, who are the "has beens" greg/pet should displace?)
their site has gained 2 additional fans since first highlighted on this thread on 2-21-04---20 to 22.

to recap the basic premise:
...again, my goal is to contrast these two teams who by chance of a quick and timely decision to marry for one, will have different outcomes regaring the 2006 olympics.
i am trying to highlight the absurdity of NOT having our GOLD medalists allowed to go to the 2006 olympics because tanith is not married to a usa citizen and therefore has had to wait two additional years---5 years--- for her citizenship (and just missing the cutoff by a very little time) compared to denis who had to put in only 3 years. i happen to think there is something terribly wrong---inequitable if you want a polite expresion---about this.

accelerating tanith's citizenship by just a little bit of time so that they can also go the the 2006 olys will not hurt greg and pet's chance to go---we can send two teams. having BOTH our GOLD (b/a) and silver (greg/pet) medalists, not our silver and bronze or pewter medalists go to the olympics, will truely benefit usfsa and our standing internationally in ice dance.

so you see, it actually ain't all about greg and pet!

my goal is to see the TOP TWO teams, our gold as well as silver medalists, be allowed to go. the tale of two teams happens to be a very good vehicle to highlight this and what is needed to achieve this.

why would we want anything else?
greg and pet are not prevented in any way from pursuing their dreams by b/a also being able to fulfill theirs.

tsk tsk. how soon we forget.

the whole point was to support belbin/agosto's deserved opportunity to go the the olympics in 2006 by contrasting the "tale of two teams."

one would assume greg/pet are confident enough in their own abilities to secure the other position!

naomi demonstrated her true motives quite clearly at this past nationals and with the announement of the anticipated blessed event. she's quite happy now.

and let us now try again:

...why would we want anything else?
greg and pet are not prevented in any way from pursuing their dreams by b/a also being able to fulfill theirs.

the rumor came directly, live and in person, from "one" of their supplementary coaches!
no, of course i won't reveal the source!

belbin and agosto will pave the way for other dance teams. actually they already have.

they should have the opportunity to compete in the 2006 olys for all the reasons presented in the above thread. that will also greatly benefit usfsa and the dance teams who follow, including greg and pet.

that pet. should only need to wait 3 years while belbin waits 5 just because he quickly married gregory, is absurd.

[Reckless]

There are a few other significant reasons why Tanith's citizenship issue is different from Gorsha Sur's.

By 2006, Tanith will have been in the US for eight years. (She and Ben teamed up in 1998.) Under normal application procedures, she would have been a citizen if she could have applied for her Green Card immediately. Two quirks prevented that. First, she could only apply for a Green Card under the extraordinary skills exception. Yet, to satisfy that criteria, she needed to show some skating results. But under ISU results, she had to sit out a year. Thus, she had to wait one year to be eligible to compete and one more year to obtain results. That delay prevents her from being eligible for 2006. No such delay existed for Sur or Tchernyshev. They already had results from Russia, so could apply immediately.

In a way, this could be seen as a bizarre situation, since it penalizes a team like Belbin and Agosto who teamed up early with an intent to develop together and represent the US, but encourages other skaters to look for partners who already have proven results. IIRC, Sur teamed up with Roca in 1991 and only regained amateur status in time to compete at US Nationals in 1993. He then sought expedited citizenship for 1994. The difference between eight years and three years is significant.

There is another significant difference between now and when Sur sought to expedite citizenship. At the time of Sur's application, the US only had one team eligible for the 1994 Olympics. By contrast, the US will certainly have two, and possibly three, dance teams in Turin. That will be due, in large part, to B&A's efforts. If the US does not have them at World's next year, it might even be lucky to wind up with two teams at the Olympics. (And I say that with the belief that G&P have improved dramatically in the past year.) So it is not as if any team that has long been on the international stage would be knocked out by B&A. So that is a marked contrast from 1994, when Roca and Sur would have gone to the Olympics and Punsalan and Swallow would have stayed home.

[Smiley0084]

smiley, you are clearly a fan: http://pub117.ezboard.com/fpassionfrm2.showMessage?topicID=26.topic
and that's fine. but there are others who feel that there is a fundamental unfairness that belbin/agosto would not be able to compete in the 2006 olys because belbin must wait 5 years compared to pet's 3 years just because gregory married him shortly after they began skating as a team. (by the way, who are the "has beens" greg/pet should displace?)
their site has gained 2 additional fans since first highlighted on this thread on 2-21-04---20 to 22.

to recap the basic premise:


tsk tsk. how soon we forget.

the whole point was to support belbin/agosto's deserved opportunity to go the the olympics in 2006 by contrasting the "tale of two teams."

one would assume greg/pet are confident enough in their own abilities to secure the other position!

naomi demonstrated her true motives quite clearly at this past nationals and with the announement of the anticipated blessed event. she's quite happy now.

and let us now try again:



the rumor came directly, live and in person, from "one" of their supplementary coaches!
no, of course i won't reveal the source!

belbin and agosto will pave the way for other dance teams. actually they already have.

they should have the opportunity to compete in the 2006 olys for all the reasons presented in the above thread. that will also greatly benefit usfsa and the dance teams who follow, including greg and pet.

that pet. should only need to wait 3 years while belbin waits 5 just because he quickly married gregory, is absurd.

Four words: You. Have. problems. Dude.


As far as the citizenship issue, well Denis and Melissa getting married had nothing to do with the citizenship process itself, it sped up the GREEN CARD process. Some people seem to think it's some how "wrong" for Denis to become a citizen just because he and Melissa got married. What were they supposed to do???? Deny their love for each other so people won't accuse them of such things??? When G/P got married NO ONE would have predicited they would be where they are today, they were a huge surprise, and by the time they started getting results they were already married, so that "they got married for his citizenship" hyperbole whatmeworry is implying doesn't wash with me. Peter had to wait nine years, Gorsha had to wait his turn as well, and I'm glad they did and so does Tanith, and every other person trying to become a citizen. I remember some one mentioned they could go to the IOC and have the rule changed about citizens competing at the olys. If she can compete at worlds why not the olympics? But seriously I think setting a precendent for the entire nation is much more important than ice dance, sorry.

[Reckless]

Four words: You. Have. problems. Dude.


As far as the citizenship issue, well Denis and Melissa getting married had nothing to do with the citizenship process itself, it sped up the GREEN CARD process. Some people seem to think it's some how "wrong" for Denis to become a citizen just because he and Melissa got married. What were they supposed to do???? Deny their love for each other so people won't accuse them of such things??? When G/P got married NO ONE would have predicited they would be where they are today, they were a huge surprise, and by the time they started getting results they were already married, so that "they got married for his citizenship" hyperbole whatmeworry is implying doesn't wash with me. Peter had to wait nine years, Gorsha had to wait his turn as well, and I'm glad they did and so does Tanith, and every other person trying to become a citizen. I remember some one mentioned they could go to the IOC and have the rule changed about citizens competing at the olys. If she can compete at worlds why not the olympics? But seriously I think setting a precendent for the entire nation is much more important than ice dance, sorry.

Peter should not have had to wait nine years to obtain citizenship. Why he didn't apply initially when he was with his first American partner is a mystery. Perhaps he wanted to keep his options open in the event he decided to return to Russia. It also was a non-issue as a practical matter, because he and Naomi were not close to competing in 1998 and he obtained citizenship by 2002. Had the Olympics taken place in 2000, I think there would have been a push to speed up his citizenship for the same reasons I think Tanith's citizenship should be granted (i.e., he was here long enough and the US's placement at the time was in part due to his and Naomi's efforts.) And I suspect most people would have supported him.

[what?meworry?]

There are a few other significant reasons why Tanith's citizenship issue is different from Gorsha Sur's.

By 2006, Tanith will have been in the US for eight years. (She and Ben teamed up in 1998.) Under normal application procedures, she would have been a citizen if she could have applied for her Green Card immediately. Two quirks prevented that. First, she could only apply for a Green Card under the extraordinary skills exception. Yet, to satisfy that criteria, she needed to show some skating results. But under ISU results, she had to sit out a year. Thus, she had to wait one year to be eligible to compete and one more year to obtain results. That delay prevents her from being eligible for 2006...

...There is another significant difference between now and when Sur sought to expedite citizenship. At the time of Sur's application, the US only had one team eligible for the 1994 Olympics. By contrast, the US will certainly have two, and possibly three, dance teams in Turin. That will be due, in large part, to B&A's efforts....

...it is not as if any team that has long been on the international stage would be knocked out by B&A. So that is a marked contrast from 1994, when Roca and Sur would have gone to the Olympics and Punsalan and Swallow would have stayed home.

thank you, reckless, for this info. :bow:
i didn't know about the "extradordinary skills" aspect of naturalization process.

i did know of the historic differences, but you explained it very clearly.

that plus the inequitable married vs. not married...etc. really points up the need for, first of all, an exception for belbin, and additionally, the need to bring married vs. unmarried inequity to light for all immegrants.