Thoughts on figures

[~*balletic*~]

[color=green:67a07b222d]I am one of those people who thinks figures should be brought back.
Not necessarily in competition. I do feel they should be part of a skater's training regimen from the beginning. My opinion is that Moves in the Field does not give skaters the same edging and control as figures.
Stroking class is good, but figures teach patience and discipline, and I think it's been a loss to our young skaters not to experience it.[/color:67a07b222d]

[duane]

i've never worn a pair of ice skates in my life, and i didnt become a fan of FS until way after figures were removed, so i'm definitely no expert on the subject. :) however, many fans consider some post-figures skaters as all-time greats. i'm not sure if having figures as part of a skater's training regimen is for the better or unnecessary.

i do agree that figures shouldnt be in competitions. not only are they BORING to watch, but imagine the huge increase in judging controversies!

[A.H.Black]

I wouldn't be averse to seeing figure in some form return to skating. I know that for many years the USFSA tried to keep them around. Like balletic I believe there is value in the discipline and concentration that comes from doing figures. I recall hearing that most skaters increased their grades at school as they increased their ability in figures. A valuable result even if the skater can't freeskate worth a lick.

Many skaters have been praised for their technical abilities sinces the demise of figures, but many mature, former skaters have decried the lack of basic edges and even stoking that figures helped to develop.

That said, I don't think we will see a move to include figures again because of the same reason they were eliminated - money; both the inordinate cost of learning and practicing them and the lack of revenue that they produced.

[Inside Edge]

There is a style of skating that is quickly becoming a lost art and I wonder if it is related to the demise of figures. Examples of this would include the quality of edging and line of skaters such as Paul Wylie, Brian Boitano, and Josee Chouinard. Most skaters over 30 have this quality. Compare the quality of today's spead eagles with those of the past. I can't quite put my finder on it, but something is missing. There is something special about the skating of some of the older skaters even though they do not have the jumps - - - other examples include Brian Orser, Karen kadavy, and Yuka Sato.

Another way of looking at it would be to put it this way - - If you had to watch a 4 minute program with out jumps, who would you prefer to watch - - Tim or Brian? Dorothy or Sarah?

I am against having figures in competition, but they may be useful in training.

[Figureskates]

I also vote for the return of figures, but as stated above, not part of competitions.

They should be made part of an overall training program. maybe not to the same degree as they were 30 years ago, but enough to improve edge quality and control..

[trixie]

Don't even get me started...I don't have time today !!!

[manleywoman]

I just bought a scribe and figure blades, and will be starting figure lessons in about a month to pick up where I left off! I think it will greatly improve my edges (as it would anyone elses). Interestingly, a teenager at my rink is also taking up figures, since she's passed all her MIF and Freestyle tests! So she and I may do group lessons together to save money.

[Bailey]

I used to teach, and when moves in the field was brought in, we found that we had to teach the figures before we could use the skills in the moves in the field exercises. For example, a skater can't put a bracket turn into an exercise without first being able to do a bracket turn. The best way to teach the skill is to isolate it - like in a figure. So, we were doing it anyway...

[Mazurka Girl]

I always liked figures & would be happy to see skaters return to patch, although not tied into qualifying FS competition. Unfortunately, rinks are not going to offer patch time when they can't fill the ice, & they can't fill the ice unless it's mandatory for skaters to do it for competition levels. So it's catch as catch can for everyone to find their own little "patch" somewhere. Sometimes I see skaters doing figures for their warm-up at the beginning of a session.

[garyc254]

[quote:4bd6b79c2d="manleywoman"]I just bought a scribe [/quote:4bd6b79c2d]

Alright!!!! You got your scribe. :D

I was feeling guilty since I asked on a different forum and barely beat you to one.

[Lee]

There were several reasons why figures were dumped. Part of it was how absolutely snory boring it was, especially for young skaters, and another part was how much time had to be devoted to figures, especially in terms of ice time (and expenses).

Bailey's right -- if a skater is going to learn to do the MITF (or Skating Skills in Canada) properly, they need to be taught the turns and edges in isolation anyways -- that's just simple common sense in teaching progressions! However, by not have 'patch' sessions, clubs are allowed greater flexibility in scheduling ice time and can try options like having dance and skills/MITF at the same time.

I think skaters who have coaches who take the time to push the *quality* of the turns and edges they learn in MITF/Skating Skills are much better off. I also think the standards for passing these tests need to be reconsidered and toughened up.

As far as that goes, I think Skating Skills should be made mandatory in Canada -- quite often as soon as a coach identifies a skater as a possible competitive freeskater, all dance and skills lessons get toasted. So much for learning any decent edging or footwork skills...

I do know some skaters who did very little or nothing in figures (Brat Daughter is only one example -- only got 1st figure before they were dumped), but had picky coaches for Skating Skills and Dance. They have excellent edging, turns and footwork. It's all in the coaching...and the judging. As soon as the sport puts more emphasis on the footwork, edging and in-betweens, then maybe we'll see more of a focus on that in training. JMO, of course...

[kar5162]

I'm in agreement with Lee here. I think MIF tend to not be judged hard enough - particuarly when it's a cute little kid who they know can do the jumps testing. In the US, Intermediate moves has brackets in the field - the skater must do all 8 bracket turns. Now, if they really wanted to, they could raise the standard and say that those brackets must be clean. In reality, most tests I've seen are not, and I've seen a few tests where the brackets were obviously not done on the right edges. If they inist on clean edges and footwork over speed and # of jumps landed, basic skills will improve because kids and coaches will work on them...if not, they won't.

[MissIndigo]

[quote:88da9a0a18="manleywoman"]I just bought a scribe.[/quote:88da9a0a18]

You mean you can still find them for sale? 8O I still have mine from about 14 years ago, but having heard of buying one just now, wow!

[TashaKat]

[quote:b44c7b3cb4="kar5162"]I'm in agreement with Lee here. I think MIF tend to not be judged hard enough - particuarly when it's a cute little kid who they know can do the jumps testing. .[/quote:b44c7b3cb4]

Come over to the UK! They're pretty tough on Field Moves here! Certainly at my rink and I'm sure at others too! The standard of the Field Moves test is definitely higher than the equivalent level Elements and Free!

I hate figures, I was crappy at figures (didn't do them for long) BUT I can see how they were very helpful for the basics. Unfortunately they ARE boring to watch.

One of my pet peeves is the quality of basic skating in Free these days .... I once saw a televised programme with Dorothy Hamill ...... she didn't jump but BOY was she captivating .... such flow, grace, elegance ....... wow! Do I want to be able to skate like her or one of our current eligibles? No contest!

I doubt that figures will ever be brought back, things have changed too much to put emphasis on multi-rotational jumps, something, somewhere has to give. You can't study figures AND be doing doubles by the time you're a teenager. Until the system changes from trying to push skating as purely a sport (look! we can go higher/round more times) we won't have many Free skaters with good basic skating and (IMO) we'll have more kids injured, you can't put that amount of stress on a developing body and not have consequences somewhere down the line! I know that it sounds like I hate jumps .... I DON'T ..... I do Free myself but cringe at some of the 'skating' that I see, even at the upper levels.

At least Dance puts emphasis on good edges etc, let's just hope that 'they' (I dance too!) don't lose sight of this too!

[Bailey]

Everyone is right. At the national/international competitive level, they were dumped because they were not 'made for television.' While at a younger level, I believe it was only 24 skaters on the ice to do figures - but with moves in the field/skating skills you have have more skaters using the ice making it more time/cost efficient. For these reasons, figures will never make a come-back.