So yesterday I had a fantastic practice session. I ran through my moves and they went mostly well. I spun for a long time- scratch spin, backspin!, worked on the camel and attitude spin. (Still can't do sit spins because of my knees) and I came to a realization, one I've known for awhile, but haven't really thought about.

I don't like to jump. It just does nothing for me. I don't get a great feeling from jumping, I don't enjoy working on jumps. I really couldn't careless about them. But I love to spin and I love working on moves.

Right now I haven't really had much interest in ice dance. I chatted with a dancer at the rink, and we both laughed and agreed its because the beginning dances are boring. But I'm wondering if I should maybe work through them to get to the more interesting stages of dance. I'm thinking freestyle is not for me.

I want to keep working on MITF- I want to test as high as I can. (Not to mention be a bit more balanced so that I can do better in synchro!) I know I have to keep taking freestyle lessons because I want strong spins. I'll work on the jumps in group classes so I can compete at my low low level, but I don't know if freestyle is the place for me.

So what do you think? How did you decide what to do with your skating? Do you recommend dance? Should I just practice the durn jumps anyway?

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-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

I would give dance a shot. If anything, it will make you a better freestyle skater, and you might find out that you enjoy it. When I watch freestyle skaters, I can tell right away, for the most part, who does dance and who does not by the way they carry themselves.

You could also compete interpretive events, where there are no requirements so you don't have to jump at all if you don't want to. Or keep working on the jumps, maybe they'll come along and you'll like them.

Or is there a synchro team in your area? I hated jumping as a kid, turned to synchro, and that took me a lot farther than freestyle ever would (senior division, international competitions, nationa medals including gold).

Now that I'm doing freestyle again as an adult, ironically I can jump really well, spinning and I have a love-hate relationship.

Thankfully there is an adult synchro team in the area- and I do skate on the team. It's only once a week though, so I take other lessons too.

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-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

Is there a group dance class that you could take? One of the way folks get into dance here is that they start in the group lesson where they learn the first couple of dances in a group setting before going to private dance lessons....

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Skating Dreams

"All your life you are told the things you cannot do. All your life they will say you're not good enough or strong enough or talented enough; they will say you're the wrong height or the wrong weight or the wrong type to play this or be this or achieve this. THEY WILL TELL YOU NO, a thousand times no, until all the no's become meaningless. All your life they will tell you no, quite firmly and very quickly. AND YOU WILL TELL THEM YES." --Nike

No- there are no group dance lessons, unfortunately. (hmm... maybe I should put that into the suggestion box) Actually there aren't really very many dancers at our rink. We have one older woman who dances and has managed to recruit a younger man to dance with her, and then some coaches who have danced here and there, but not much dancing at our rink. At least one (maybe 2?) coaches have their dances through pre-gold though, so there is someone there with some expertise.

I was thinking about asking my friend if she'd like to do a semi-private with me, just to make the foray into dance less expensive.

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-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

Like you, I'm a little tired of jumps. They just don't interest me much anymore.

But then dance hasn't interested me much either. When we had group lessons for adult dance, I was in a class with people who were just learning crossovers. The adult dance sessions have long since been discontinued.

There just isn't much dance here at all - especially after my former coach left. (She was TALENTED in dance and wonderful to watch while she practiced!) I did find the beginning dances dull to practice, but perhaps that reflects on a lack of discipline on my part.

So I'll be watching this thread because I'm in the same predicament. In the meantime, I've been practicing MIF and learning advanced turns.

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Bill Schneider

I would totally take a dance class (provided it was onSaturdays when I can get to the rink, LOL!).

Hey... maybe if the synchro team ends up taking a break for the summer, we can recruit the "new" Courtney to teach us ice dance during the synchro slot???

You know I'm not much for jumping, either... but I love skating to music!

It's all about you isn't it. Maybe I have another friend who wants to ice dance that I was thinking about
Well I was thinking Saturday morning freestyle too (since I thought you only did lessons with your main coach every other week). We should ask!

Wednesday might be fun too- but I bet if we don't lose synchro we will lose the LTS ice for the summer. Unless LTS offers a dance class- maybe we should talk to Sue about that (though I think semi-private might be better)

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-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

I've been learning ice dance since I was in LTS - thankfully our rink has a solid dance community and I was dragged out onto intervals pretty early on! I also have a weekly freeskate lesson, but there's no question that I prefer dance.

I am still at a fairly low level - I haven't hit the ISU dances yet - but I have to say that, with very few exceptions, I don't find the beginner dances to be boring (yet!). Yes, the patterns are relatively easy to *step* through, but there is a big difference between stepping them and dancing them. I find real satisfaction in getting the edges and lobes as deep as possible, and adding more power and speed - and then learning to control it all so that the pattern still fits in the rink!

Perhaps there are dance clubs or socials at a rink in your area? Dancing with someone is another challenge entirely - and I'm sure I wouldn't enjoy dance as much if I didn't have that option.

Don't forget that as well as compulsory dance, there are also ODs and free dances to work on, so there is massive scope for creativity and working on programs too.

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"Every revolutionary idea seems to evoke three stages of reaction. They may be summed up by the phrases:
(1) It's completely impossible.
(2) It's possible, but it's not worth doing.
(3) I said it was a good idea all along."
- Arthur C Clarke

It's really too bad you don't have more dance in your area - we have quite a few active dancers in Portland and weekly social sessions plus several "ice-dance weekends" a year, which makes learning dance all that much more interesting.

We have at least 8 coaches in the area teaching all levels of dance, which is great, too. Unfortunately it is pretty hard to get started, though - we rarely have an ice-dance class, which is a great way to start to learn the patterns.

It's true that the lower dances are pretty dirge-like, although they don't have to be that way. The music tends to be off-putting to many people, although there are CDs out there that have more "modern" music set to the dance beat - by modern I mean anything from "MellowYellow" (Donovan - '60s folk-singer) to popular songs from the 80s and 90s... I should get one of those CDs... someone should sell it... - it makes it more fun to dance if the music is good and believe me, the music generally gets better the higher up the dance ladder you go.

And there is always something new to learn. AND you rarely have to leave the ground, except if you are doing OD and FD where lifts are required.

I would hate for anyone to have to lift me!!

Good luck in your pursuit.

I LOVE dance!!

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Is Portland the only city with it's own ice-dance website? http://www.pdxicedance.net/

skitl - a trip to Chicago wouldn't be too far out of the realm of possibility. Lots of ice dance here.

Wow!!!! How can anyone not like to jump???? Jumping is what drew me to skating. If there's one thing I hate, it is MITF. I do love footwork because it's intricate and interesting but moves just plain suck!!!!

Okay now that I got that out of the way. . . LOL Maybe you should take an interest in ice dancing. Use those beginning dances as a way to get used to the boot/blade setup on dance skates. . . It feels really far forward. I tried them and kept falling backwards. I ran back to my Gold Seals immediately.


BlackManSkating

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Proud to be one of the few black men out on the ice

Goals
Pass my Silver Moves Test
Finish Choreography for Silver Program
Land a Clean Double Toe and Double Lutz
Work on Double Axel and Rockers
Speed up back Camel

But you'll never be really good at skating until you have mastered them! Plus working on your Moves - or on ice dance - will improve your jumps and footwork more than anything!

I love dance, but there's no question that it's difficult. Every single edge matters, and every body part has to be "just so". And when you are as un-body-aware as I am, that's not easy! Plus, of course, you have to be able to skate to all sorts of different rhythms and dance types - you can't just stick to the kind of music that suits you the way you can in free skating.

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Mrs Redboots
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I love my computer because my friends live in it!
Ice dancers have lovely big curves!

Because I'm not a jumper Even when I danced I was always the one who excelled at turns and could barely get leaps off the ground. Add ice and blades to that and my "good" jumps are like 2 inches high. It's just not entertaining for me to keep trying them. I don't dislike freestyle though- I LOVE LOVE spinning. And I guess liking MITF is just weird

I won't get dance blades anyhow- the cheapest ones are still more expensive than the blades I use. (Though right now I'm in Gold Seals, but they came with my used skates. I certainly won't buy them!)

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-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

This is one of my worries. When I danced, I was really good at telling what the rest of my body is doing. Add skates in, and I have no idea which parts are even still attached.

I think dance will be good for me, and I've talked to an instructor about a once a month lesson. I'm a bit worried about my knees though- as I think proper knee bend is going to kill them as much as jumping did.

__________________
-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

Dance is definitely good for your skating whether you keep up any freestyle or not. It has huge benefits in improving your posture and basic skating skills which really matter, especially in low level competition. It can be as hard on the knees as jumping (I have a bad knee and I do both so........) and my boots which I've had for two years started hurting me again (blisters on the outside above the ankle) once I really began to get the idea of 'proper' knee bend.

I started in ice dance, though people often told me I looked like a freeskater (maybe a polite way to say I lacked elegance and grace) as I was totaly scared of jumping. The problem was, I found the low level compulsories incredibly boring. We have no men at our rink now - I used to dance with one whose wife made him give up sadly - and dancing with a partner was the only thing that made even the low level dances fun.

In the UK we are lucky to have quite a strong solo dance culture (although I still can't get my head round the logic of simply splitting the partnered dances rather than having proper solo dances) and an opportunity from a low level to do solo variations, ODs and free dances. Those are fun and the only reason I still keep doing dance.

I started jumping after about 3 years of skating - I found as I gained confidence and got much faster in my skating, my 3 turns just wanted somewhere to go and that turned out to be upwards!

Now I love learning jumps.

I dance and free skate in the same boots and blades; GAM95's and MK professionals.

you definitely don't need dance blades/boots to start dancing. Some people never switch. And maybe your coach can work not only on patterns but also exercises which will make you a stronger skater & will get you ready for both moves and dance. Even though I'm a dancer we mostly do exercises, which I find very interesting. We only ocassionally run patterns. It's a training method that has worked well for me, & keeps me from getting bored.

I know a skater (coach) who tested (and passed) Golden Waltz in freestyle blades.

FWIW, I have heard rumors of a proposal in the works (still in committee) to revise the music for one or more of the low level US dances.

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American Waltz... Once, Twice, ???? ...

Q: How many coaches does it take to fix Jen's Dance Intro-3 Problems
A: 5 and counting...

Unless you decide at some point that you 100% don't want to do any freestyle anymore, AND you happen to need new skates anyway, there's no reason to go to dance boots/blades until at least the Pre-Silver level, IMO. I had a coach who had passed all his Golds and had never had dance blades. I also had a friend who didn't get dance blades until she was on her Pre-Golds.

I'm certainly not going to argue that the beginning dances are somewhat boring, and that the music is terrible, but it really does get better. When I started dance, I thought the lower dances looked boring and I was hoping to just "get through them" and start doing the fun ones. Once I realized how much harder the Prelim dances were than they looked... maybe I'm not normal, but I really did enjoy them once I realized they were actually hard! There are a lot of things to think about at once, especially when you're new to dance!

If you have a chance, go watch some Pre-Silver and Silver level dancers. The Fourteenstep, the Tango, the Rocker... sometimes it's easier to overlook the lame qualities of the lower dances when you've seen how much more fun the higher-level ones look.

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Shae-Lynn and Victor: We knew you were champions, and on 3/28/03 the whole WORLD found out! Thank you for twelve wonderful years!

I like to jump but can't now thanks to injuries so I've been doing dance for the last 8 months. While it's incredibly boring at the bottom level, it's better than not skating at all and it's exercise. I'll agree that part of the problem is the bland music (and if anyone has a CD with Pre Dance music that's better than what USFS offers, please let me know and I'll pay $$ for a copy) but it's also the sheer repetition that irks me.

That said, though, my knee bend and edges and flow have improved which is good as has my ability to do turns at speed.

And I'm doing it all in standard freestyle boots and blades.
It does frustrate me to be using my Master-rated coach to teach basic dance but, as I said, it's better than not skating at all.

You'll get no argument from me. I agree wholeheartedly! I hate moves because they are boring, not necessarily because they are difficult. My coach teaches me MITF, footwork and other exercises because height and rotation come from controlling and pressing the edge, not from jumping. So I fully understand the need for MITF. Doesn't mean I gotta like it. LOL!!! Jumps are where it's at!!!!


BlackManSkating

__________________
Proud to be one of the few black men out on the ice

Goals
Pass my Silver Moves Test
Finish Choreography for Silver Program
Land a Clean Double Toe and Double Lutz
Work on Double Axel and Rockers
Speed up back Camel

Oh good! We use the ISU music here in the UK - same music for Dutch, Willow, British and European waltzes; Rhythm and regular Blues; Canasta, Fiesta and Silver Tangos; Golden Skaters' and Westminster Waltzes; Swing Dance and Rocker Foxtrot.... and it is sometimes very difficult to have to adapt to US music at the Mountain Cup and similar international competitions. Especially for the Swing Dance, which you do far more slowly in the US.

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Mrs Redboots
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I love my computer because my friends live in it!
Ice dancers have lovely big curves!

You can't know till you try. A lot of people seem to start with classes on edges (which is what many group ice dance classes actually teach, to avoid falls and deal with gender imbalance) and power skating, which can apply to both.

Finding a partner is the central thing in dance.

I'm a guy, but haven't managed to find a partner.

Will you find a partner? Do you have a partner (and their coach) in mind, and have you talked it over with them? You more or less have to take from the same coach.

It's easier to find partners in off-ice dance. Cheaper too.

There will be no partner.

If I want to test with a partner we do have a coach who was a high level pairs skater and just did his preliminary tests with some other girls, so I could probably ask him, then pay him to skate with me. However, this would be a mostly solo pursuit (or partnered with another lady for shows- there have been a few of those)

__________________
-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

Solo dance is very popular here in the UK, and is one of our disciplines at the highest levels.

Some things are a lot harder with a partner who's all over you like a cheap mackintosh - although, to be fair, other things are easier!

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Mrs Redboots
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I love my computer because my friends live in it!
Ice dancers have lovely big curves!