Wierd advice from supposedly qualified coaches? - Page 2

vesperholly · #26 03-19-2006, 10:51 PM

Well, I had a coach who was absolutely convinced that Michelle Kwan never skated Red Violin in competition.

I spent a good five minutes trying to convince her that not only did she use it in competition for an entire season (99-00), she won Worlds with it, AND did a triple-triple at Worlds! I don't think she really believed me, even though she conceeded the point.

Isk8NYC · #27 03-20-2006, 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbny

I hate teaching BXO's picking up the foot, but I've learned through experience that that particular method works very well for some students. I usually watch my students on their B half swizzle pumps to see which technique I will start them with, and can tell pertty quickly if I need to switch them to what I call "pull under" rather than cross over or vice versa.

I've started using that technique, too. (I've totally ripped you off DBNY!

) It forces the kids to balance on their inside foot without the outside foot's assistance. (Inside/outside the circle; not edges) I've always hated teaching those "lift crossovers" but here's a good use for them. Backward stroking isn't enough of a "drill" for the kids that struggle to balance, so I use this as a next-level drill.

Isk8NYC · #28 03-20-2006, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xofivebyfive

Whoah, you aren't supposed to pick up your foot for crossovers? That's so weird.. I can't even imagine not doing that. I mean, I was teaching myself to do foward crossovers during public skating for the past couple of weeks, and I was trying to do it without picking up my skate today and it was so akward..

No, no, no - we're discussing BACKWARD crossovers. There is a drill for forward that uses the swizzle/crossover, but it's pretty tough for beginners.

Quote:

Originally Posted by twokidsskatemom

I think ISI teaches them one way in Beta, USFSA basic teaches the other way.

Correct (as usual) I teach in a USFSA group program currently, so I have to make sure they can do them without the lift, but I'll use the BACKWARD lift/crossover technique as a "drill" to build up the students' balance.

twokidsskatemom · #29 03-20-2006, 11:19 AM

Correct (as usual) I teach in a USFSA group program currently, so I have to make sure they can do them without the lift, but I'll use the BACKWARD lift/crossover technique as a "drill" to build up the students' balance
Awwwwwwwww Thank

One of the advantages of having skaters who compete/test in both ISI and USFSA.Have all the rulebooks and read them !!!!

sunshinepointe · #30 03-20-2006, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isk8NYC

...but I'll use the BACKWARD lift/crossover technique as a "drill" to build up the students' balance.

When I first started working on back crossovers with my new coach she wasn't happy with my edge quality so she had me do the "steppy" method to make sure I was on the right edge at all times. In the non-steppy method it's easier to cheat the edge, but if you make em steppy it's almost impossible to cheat. Lesson learned!

doubletoe · #31 03-20-2006, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skate@Delaware

Several of the coaches went to a PSA seminar and learned that the "correct" way to pick in is between 3-5 pm position (assuming you jump CCW)... Have you ever tried this? It's an accident waiting to happen. I don't think this is ever changing for me. I'm sticking with 6 pm position.....

I totally agree with the 5:00 picking position on the toeloop. . . if you rotate CLOCKWISE!

xofivebyfive · #32 03-20-2006, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenix

it's backward, not forward. Forward, you always pick up the foot.

Backward, ISI requires the outside foot to lift and step over the inside foot. Later you would change this to the "true" back crossover, where the foot does not lift ("pull unders" is a good way to explain this, I like it!). I agree w/ dbny, w/ some students it works better to teach this way, but I only do it if they can't get it the other way. Eventually they'll have to switch to the "pull under" version regardless of how they start out.

Ohhhhhh. Okay.

doubletoe · #33 03-20-2006, 05:40 PM

I fortunately haven't ever had to deal with this mis-advice myself, but I know 2 adult skaters who have been told by their respective coaches to stay "on the circle" and/or curl their axel takeoff ege. Not surprisingly, their axels just got worse instead of better!

dbny · #34 03-20-2006, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenix

Backward, ISI requires the outside foot to lift and step over the inside foot. Later you would change this to the "true" back crossover, where the foot does not lift ("pull unders" is a good way to explain this, I like it!). I agree w/ dbny, w/ some students it works better to teach this way, but I only do it if they can't get it the other way. Eventually they'll have to switch to the "pull under" version regardless of how they start out.

I just want to point out that it is perfectly legitimate to lift the crossing foot on BXO's, and if you watch elite skating, you will see pretty much all the Europeans do that, even though it is just a tiny bit right at the end of the XO.
I asked my coach about it, and she said it was purley a matter of style, but then, she is also the one who told me that progressives were an illusion

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