i started skating when i was 4 1/2 and i finished basic skill by around 51/2 which is around when i went 2 my first competition and i came in 2nd and i loved it..i'm 13 now and i'm a intermediate skater.

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<3 alwayz..Heather

Absolutely on the mark with this comment -- body and mind beats birthdate!

I teach two tots under 3 years old. The boy absolutely LOVES it and is streaking around after 3 lessons. The girl absolutely LOVES it but isn't as strong a skater. She just needs more time and practice. But a 30 minute lesson is a tad too long. 20 minutes is perfect for most of the tiny tots.

I also teach a few 5 and 6 year olds that won't pay attention because they're so focused on keeping Mom or Dad in sight (or grip!)

I started all of my girls on the winter ice puddles with helmets and boots as toddlers. My oldest I began group lessons at 4, mainly because I was teaching and didn't have a sitter. She HATED it and was a major distraction to me. I waited until she SHE asked to take lessons again at age 11. She loves it now. When my little ones asked for lessons at the same time, I let them join but set down the ground rules. They're terrors on the ice now, asking to go everytime I teach or we have a day off. (I'm at a nicer rink now, too)

One of my kids has the "competitive spirit" that would let her go far, but the other two could care less. Remember that every kid is different and you have to let them take the lead. As long as they're having fun and getting exercise, you're doing the right thing.

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My friends' son started skating practically before he could walk (almost literally!), he was in the rink panto at 18 months old!! Mind you, mum is a coach and uncle is a coach and ex national champion .....

He's not pushed as such, in fact they didn't particularly want to encourage him to skate but he loves it, especially the attention from all the 'babes' (that's one boy who won't have problems relating to women when he gets older!). His mum 'teaches' him but only in short bursts, there's nothing serious because he's too young but he loves to mimic everyone else. He won his first competition at TWO!!!

If only I'd started at that age ..... sigh!

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The best whisper is a click

My ex-coach's daughter first competed when she was 14 months old in Tot 1! She has now just turned 3 and is working on her crossovers. Obviously it was natural for her to start skating but even if her mom wasn't a coach, I don't see anything wrong with it. An 8 year old girl at my rink started skating when she was 2 (and started stretching then as well) and is now a pre-juvenille competitor through 2lutz (although cheated) and a spiral that rivals Sasha's.

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- Ashley

To the original poster:

I think it's great for kids as young as possible to learn the basics...stroking, crossovers, good posture, maybe shoot the ducks, 3-turns and the like. Most people who've read my posts on the other thread know that I am personally not for young kids doing difficult jumps (ie doubles and up), because I don't believe it's good for their bones (although I'm no doctor, it's my humble assumption), also, with growth spurts, it's common to lose jumps which will frustrate a LOT of skaters into quitting (especially considering there isn't just one growth spurt, and it's classic to lose jumps every 6 months while you're growing!), there's also kids burning out too early before they even developed an artistic expression side (or are old enough to enter Nationals)...I don't think kids competing before 10-12 years old is really worth much other than stage experience, which they can get in less taxing areas such as ballet or even drama...

I think that as a basic rule, because it's such a physically and emotionally taxing sport, the child should be old enough to have strong bones and a strong mind, and really know what they want out of the sport. That's the day it's worth getting serious, and it's different for every child. The strong bones, however, don't come early enough for most parents (and some kids), though.

-FadedStardust

This is something I've been wondering about. My impression is that most people seriously involved in this sport would strongly disagree.

My 5yo daughter has expressed interest in competing, but I think she really sees it as "performing". She spends a good bit of her public session ice time "dancing" to her own improvisational choreography and eagerly looks forward to her dance recitals. I don't want anything to spoil that enthusiastic self-expression and I worry that there would be no way to truly insulate her from the high pressure nonsense that goes on even at very low levels. I know some other parents at our rink think I'm slightly paranoid. Fortunately her coach (who has some pretty high level dance coaching experience) has a very low key approach with little ones.

Is a child who only skates once or twice a week and rarely, or never, competes until 8 or 10 going to be at a huge disadvantage if they decide to get serious at that point? I've kind of had the attitude that if she's really talented, there's no rush, and if she not really talented, well, there's no need to rush either.

Originally Posted by fadedstardust
...I don't think kids competing before 10-12 years old is really worth much other than stage experience, which they can get in less taxing areas such as ballet or even drama..


but if you have a child that doesnt want to do those things but wants to skate, what should you do? make them do something they dont want to do or let them enjoy something they love?

Surely that depends on the competition, no? I agree, I hate to see young children being "hothoused" and made to practice for hours, and yelled at if they goof off for a second - but, oh, how they love having a little programme to show off to Mummy and Daddy, and many of them love competing as well - a chance to dress up in a frilly, sparkly dress, be allowed to wear make-up (don't underestimate the joy of that for the under-tens!) and loads of glitter in their hair! And they learn that taking part is what matters, and winning isn't everything. Plus the whole competition atmosphere is such fun, and so different from tests, which tend to be a Serious Business.

I'm sure there's a "window" for that. An 11-year-old friend of mine took part in her first competition on Tuesday evening. It was only the annual "Hop, step and jump" that they all do - at that level, they were asked to show a cherry flip (toe loop), upright spin and forwards spiral, each element being performed individually and in turn, and with closed marking (unusual here). For the record, the Over-Level-1s had to do a salchow, sitspin and back spiral, and the Level 4 and Over were asked for an axel, a combination jump and a combination spin.

Anyway, 11-year-old N skated very well and came 2nd out of 4 - and was almost in tears of disappointment. I pretended not to notice that, put my arm round her, grabbed her medal, and said, "Oh my GOODNESS, you came SECOND! WOW, that's FANTASTIC, you must be SO PROUD of yourself - aren't you proud of her?" to her mother, who backed me up no end and also made a Great Big Noisy Fuss of her daughter. Mother was very pleased - but very little comforted N. How do you explain to a child that age that winning isn't especially important in the scheme of things, and to skate well enough to come 2nd in your very first competition is absolutely brilliant? And not just explain, but explain it so the child knows she's done well, not just pretends to believe the grown-ups?

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Mrs Redboots
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I love my computer because my friends live in it!
Ice dancers have lovely big curves!

Personally, I agree with you. Most of the young skaters I know who are fairly serious about skating (I'm talking maybe 4-9 years old, between Basic 7 or 8 and Freestyle 3 or 4) compete at Basic Skill competitions all over our area. Other than, like you said, getting better with stage presence and performing, I don't see this as necessary. It is fun for the kids, but I worry sometimes that the kids who do loads of Basic Skill events get too used to winning or placing, since everyone in these events gets a medal. It's big shock for an eight-year-old to do her first "real" competition and place sixth out of eight ot whatever! I think parents and coaches need to do a lot of preparing for that possibility.

I think for young beginners, doing a Basic Skill event at their home rink can be a great experience. But the running all over the region to Basic Skill after Basic Skill seems like overkill to me. Like you said, there's plenty of time for that if they decide to continue in the sport.

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Shae-Lynn and Victor: We knew you were champions, and on 3/28/03 the whole WORLD found out! Thank you for twelve wonderful years!

Yeah, forcing a 4yo to take ballet would be a disaster. I feel fortunate that over the last year my daughter has become interested in gymnastics, ballet, soccer, swimming, children's theatre, you name it. But then I still struggle with how much is too much.

There are a couple of 5-6yo at our rink who basically skate full-time. They have progressed very quickly, I think mostly due to their incredible focus. In one case, I know for sure the child is setting the pace. I'm not sure about the others. It's a beautiful thing to see a child doing something they love.

There are also a few 10-12yo who have skated full-time their whole childhoods and really look as if they've reached their maximum potential. Some of the other parents and coaches say very unkind things about both the children and their parents. Ugh. I'm sure they must have looked like prodigies when they first started out. Whenever I see them I am thankful my daughter has interests in addition to skating.

My kids did their first competition a few weeks ago. They've done shows, but only in a group situation. The teenager was terrific, although very nervous. But, she's asked to enter more competitions!

My little ones (6 yrs old) absolutely LOVED doing the Tot competition. Yes, they skated against the book or each other, but this was a very, very small competition. It was a perfect setting for them to learn about sportsmanship and stage presence. They learned to be kind, not gloat, and to contain their jealousy. They also liked being the center of attention -- they were "mike hogs" at our Church's Karaeoke night last weekend!

I wouldn't enter my kids in EVERY competition, but 2 or 3 each year is fine. It gives them a goal to work towards and it was a lot of fun!

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Age should not be an issue when you're considering what age to start competing at. They have to be both mentally and physically ready, and that is a choice that the coach and parent should make when the time is right. I would think that waiting until you are 10-12 years old could put you at a real disadvantage when competing as there are so many things you need to learn how to do. I also think that younger skaters are more willing to skate out on to an empty piece of ice in front of judges, parents and other competitors for the first time, but as kids get older that tend to becomes more self-conscious. Just learning how to present yourself and what to do if you fall, is something that you can only learn by competing. Learning to accept that you didn't skate well and were placed lower than you expected is a hard lesson, but it should then be followed by going back out on the ice next week and continuing to train.

The parents and coaches who expect/demand too much of their young skaters are where the problems start. They need to be encouraged to learn that competitions are a way for them to measure their progress. Having a bad skate and watching how they respond to it can provide feedback to the coaches and parents so they can evaluate their emotional state and use that to improve how they train and prepare them for the next competition. Coaches have to learn how to handle their skaters at a competition as they all respond differently to the stress and need to have their own pre-competition routines. Parents also need to learn how to be positive and remain positive even if your child doesn’t skate well.

Young skaters need to have a positive environment in which to compete, both before and after the event. The coach coaches and the parents provide the unconditional love even in the face of a poor outing. Let the coach discuss what went wrong and what needs to be fixed after the event, not the parents. As parents, we buy the stuffed toys and the ice cream, and that’s a much better job!

There are a couple of 5-6yo at our rink who basically skate full-time. They have progressed very quickly, I think mostly due to their incredible focus. In one case, I know for sure the child is setting the pace. I'm not sure about the others. It's a beautiful thing to see a child doing something they love



I so agree with you great statement !!!!!!!!!!
My dd pretty much skates full time, HER choice.
Yesterday at the rink there was a coach from another state who comes here once a month to coach some ice dancers.
He said to us..... boy i wish some of my competeing kids had the work ethic and love of skating that you can see from your daughter.

ITA re the jumps but, unfortunately, any kid going into Free/Pairs NEEDS those jumps if they're going to compete at anything more than the lower levels. I, personally, think that working the multi rotational jumps at an early age is more than likely going to lead to problems in the long term.

I DO, however, disagree with you saying that ballet is less taxing! Ballet can be just as taxing on the body as skating, in different ways, obviously PLUS in ballet you don't get away with being one sided as you do in skating, you have to pirouette, jump and EVERYTHING as equally as possible on both sides.

I started doing ballet exams and competitions from about the age of 4, I wanted to do it and I wasn't pushed. I was VERY lucky not to have a 'ballet' mother! My parents were supportive but were not the kind to see one glimmer of hope and have my future for the next 10 years mapped out for me. As someone pointed out, jumps go, especially for girls when puberty strikes, then there's boys ..... how many promising girls have given up to 'get a life'?

I'd hate to think of 5/6 year olds skating 'full time'. I've no problems with them working, I think that skating is good for self discipline as well as for the actual skating, but they still need a childhood at the end of it all. I sincerely hope that full time means that they are there after school rather than there INSTEAD of school (it happens, the last girl that I knew who dropped out of school to skate has amounted to a big fat zero in life as well as in skating). What a waste

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The best whisper is a click

I'd hate to think of 5/6 year olds skating 'full time'. I've no problems with them working, I think that skating is good for self discipline as well as for the actual skating, but they still need a childhood at the end of it all. I sincerely hope that full time means that they are there after school rather than there INSTEAD of school (it happens, the last girl that I knew who dropped out of school to skate has amounted to a big fat zero in life as well as in skating). What a waste
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We hs, and my dd does skate 5 days a week. That has nothing to do with her school, she still does lots of school things, but it doesnt take me 8 hours a day to teach her.
We skate during the day as ice time is cheaper.But again, she still has school We dont feel hs is waste of anything.

I completely agree with your thoughts. He's probably an exception to the rule, but Johnny Weir started skating when he was 12 years old (which in skating is wheelchair bound! Although males do get more of a break than females, which really shows you how stupid the whole "you must start early to make it" theory is, cause it really doesn't matter what gender you are, actually I bet most females pick up the sport faster than males). Maybe it isn't so much an exception to the rule as it is that not many people start that late because there's some beliefs that if you do, you'll never make it, so they don't even bother. I bet that if more 12-15 years old were encouraged and told they had as much of a shot as someone who started at, say, 5, it wouldn't be so much of an exception to have started at 12 and made it to the top. It really just depends how fast your kid learns, you know? And the speed of learning changes with age, too. Either improves or worsens. Of course, basic skill competitions are okay when you're younger than that, I'm just around a lot of 7-8 year olds doing doubles and going to so many far away comps and having cell phones and laptops (I'm NOT joking) that I really imagine the worst when I hear "kids starting early"...I always think..doubles, triples, monthly high stress comps, jaded 6 year olds going on 50...that's what I'm around. And I really don't think it's that great for the skater in the long run. But a couple fun basic comps a year and some group and mommy and me classes as young as 4-5 is fine...if they have fun! I just don't think you really get serious as in "this is my goal, this is what I want to do with my life" until later on, maybe 14 or 15, when the kid can truly understand and make that decision for him/her self.

All in all, within a reasonably degree, I don't think starting older really hinders you. You have advantages like more responsiblity, stronger muscles, independence, and the like, that a 10 year old most likely doesn't have yet. It all goes back to how much you're willing to work. That willingness also, usually, increases with age. I'm off my soapbox now.

-FadedStardust

I've done ballet for a long time too, it's actually helped my skating immensly. I guess it isn't less TAXING, and when I mentioned ballet I was definitely thinking of ballet without pointe for the young ones (ie: before 10 yrs old) but there's you know, no toe pounding, no hip grinding from loop jumps, not as much falling....it's what I meant by better for younger kids, you know?

My left pirouettes always sucked.

-FadedStardust

basic comps a year and some group and mommy and me classes as young as 4-5 is fine...if they have fun! I just don't think you really get serious as in "this is my goal, this is


as a mom I dont agree at all.I trust my kids and if this is what they want, then its what they want.
people change careers 5 times during a lifetime . If this is what my kids want for now, then as a parent im there to support them, not to tell them how i dont trust how they feel.There is nothing wrong with kids having a life purpose and goals. would take a kid skaters any day over a 13 yo doing drugs or having sex.Wpuld much rather have a 6yo who loves skating then a 6yo who plays computer games after school and watches tv the rest of the time.
if at 10 she wants to do something else then she can. If at 5 she wants to skate, they she can skate.
And yes, some skaters started late.And a ton started early.every child is different. Some kids want to do this, some kids wants to compete, and its not the parents pushing them as much as the parents allowing them to make small choices about their lives .small choices go to bigger choices as they get older.

you're younger than that, I'm just around a lot of 7-8 year olds doing doubles and going to so many far away comps and having cell phones and laptops (I'm NOT joking) that I really imagine the worst when I hear "kids starting early"...I always think..doubles, triples, monthly high stress comps, jaded 6 year



cells phones and laptops have nothing to do with skating.How many non skaters have those? go to any school and see but its a non skating issue.Its a parenting issue.

I agree that if it's what the kid wants, then they should get to do it, however I disagree that a 4 year old should have a career. At that age, it should be a hobby. No matter how serious they are about it, it shouldn't be their life. Playing with other kids, going to school, learning valuable social and intellectual skills should be their job at that age. Nothing more.


As far as the cell phone and laptops, I'm simply implying that a lot of very young very serious skaters are robbed of their childhood through the intensity of this sport. The accesories are merely imagery. I'm not attacking you in any way, your child is in basic skills, that's a great place for a 4 year old to be. She's not doing anything to hurt herself at that level, so that's great, and your attitude that she can quit when she wants to is great also. I'm talking about many other children that are not in that same situation. And trust me, there's way too many.

-FadedStardust

This is ot, but a child doesnt need a school to teach them or have them have social skills.That is part of what parenting is about.putting a bunch of 5yos together ina room and really doesnt teach them the right social skills.
I didnt mean this was her career, just that right now this is ahuge part of her life.She has friends, goes on field trips, has hs gym time, hs coop, goes to church,playes with her brother, and does lots of things non skating.
She also has no tv in her room, will never have an xbox or gameboy, and plays outside alot.She will not get a cell phone or laptop either.
She reads and does math on a first grade level and we live in a state that does test hs.We teach her how to behave, we dont really want a school to do that.

Excuse me! I wasn't talking about your kids and I wasn't talking about home schooling (I PRESUME that's what 'hs' means ...) I was talking about kids that are COMPLETELY taken out of school to skate and my comment was actually about a specific, now ex, skater that I know! I am, as are you, entitled to my own opinion!

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The best whisper is a click

LOL ..... let you off!! I was thinking of my days (from the age of 10) en pointe with toes bleeding, not able to use animal wool or gel pads and THEN having to soak them in surgical spirits!!! To this day I won't show my feet in public

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The best whisper is a click

I dont think i said you couldnt have your own opinion. I just stated mine.Pretty boring if we all had the same thoughts dont you think ?In most states even if a kids skates, there are still rules that HOME SCHOOLERS have to follow.even if someone leaves schools there are still state rules I guess unless said child is over 16.

Homeschooled kids, for the largest part, are very well adjusted and intelligent, well spoken individuals (most of the time more so than their public school counterparts). I didn't mean to leave that out of "schooling" in general, it was included in what I'd consider going to school. Your kids are lucky you do that for them.

-FadedStardust