I haven't tried to teach this yet myself, and I'm not sure I can convey it only in words without a demo, but here goes. First, you have to be aware that the direction you are going to move in is backwards, not forwards, so don't start from anything moving forwards. Second, you must have your weight over the skating hip (big surprise), and anything that pulls your weight out and away is going to pull you onto the FI edge (notice that in elite competition, when they change edge from the BO, the free foot uncrosses and is usually out away from the skating foot). Assuming a CCW spin, stand on two feet with your R foot slightly pigeon toed. Push off with the L foot into what is almost a B pivot on the R foot. As you push, bring the L foot over the right into the crossed position. Keep the L foot parallel to the R foot so as to keep the hips closed. The L arm is in front, with the R arm to the side. As you push off, bring the arms in, hands meeting in front, elbows down. If you feel your weight start to shift to the FI edge, jump out of the spin (from your toe), onto your toe as if you were landing a loop.

The thing that impressed me the most is that there is never any FI edge happening. I think that if you've already got that problem it's going to be very, very difficult to beat, especially if you can't feel the difference.

OK, I just got up and started doing the spin following what I have written (to see if I have gotten it right) in barefeet on my wooden floor. It actually felt really good. I'll have to try it in skates, but not tomorrow, when I'm working most of the day and sure to be exhausted.

Skittl1321
Congrats on your great job with the tots! I know the feeling - some classes are just like that and there's nothing you can do except keep going till they end. I'm worried about your leg. IMO, you should get to a doctor and have it checked out. If it is a stress fracture, it might get worse if you don't rest it.

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Thanks for the description - it was really well described, dbny.

I totally agree with you on the problem on feeling the edge differences; it seems like there is a very small window at the early learning stages to get the right feeling - or not - else the bad habit gets difficult to erase.

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Keep Evolving. "From this moment forward, every voice that told you - You Can't - , has been silenced." - Freedom Writers

Wednesday
Sparkly:

Put in another 3 session day but not all of it was my skating. The first two sessions where the Big and Little Skate and CanSkate. I don't know if the Kids in Big and Little Skate are getting anything out of it. At least one 2 and half year old was so tired today, he looked as if he could go right back to the nap his mom woke him out of just before the session. Another kid was duck walking all over the place with his dad. CanSkate was more successful as I got to be with the group of kids that could move on their own even though we are still finishing Level 1. Some of the kid's in Level 1 were able to skate backwards by twisting their hips, butt and knees. Others were still at the walking backwards stage. But most all of them were able to jump while moving forward. Played "What Time is It Mr. Wolf?" and "Green Light, Red Light" with them and that's when I say them do the best stopping and jumping. Then the coach who is in charge of the group took them once around the rink at the end playing "Follow the Leader".

My session. Got to be there for the whole session. Was able to play my music twice. Two thirds of the ice were usuable for my freeskate. That's where I skated at about 80% today even though when my music wasn't on, I had to restart a few times because of skaters getting into my program's path. I actually saw them coming down the ice down the middle as I was going around the corner to set up for a jump and had to stop just before taking off the ice.
Got my head to stop doing the brain freeze when going into the waltz/mazurka/salchow/toe loop so that I don't keep doing a salchow/toe loop or waltz/toe loop or try a waltz/loop. And then I put it into my FS program where I had the lone waltz jump which I originally wanted to have the waltz/loop. Because of this I had to slightly change the set up going into the first jump because I needed more ice at the end of the rink to fit it all in.

Got the loop jump to work in my program twice.

Dull:
Feet were frozen because I left my skates at the rink under the stairs of the other pad and didn't bother to warm them up with the blow dryer before putting them on. I also didn't move all that much during the first two sessions.

Had to share ice again with kids that should be on CanSkate and not on the StarSkate session (but they at least help pay for the ice/session). This meant that once my program got to the side of the rink on which they were, I had to abandon my program elements and just skate forwards. The abandoned included my much quicker sitspin. I just moved slowly waiting for my music to get to the point where I cross the line to the other side so that I could do my freeskate elements in my program again without fear of running some poor kid over who should be on a CanSkate session.

Didn't work on my sit/pancake spin today but did get my freeleg closer and at one point touching the knee of my skating leg while at 90 degrees or less which did get me spinning like a top. I don't know how many revs I did in my sit spin.

Didn't work on the camel spin because of the CanSkaters being on the ice. I was just too nervous about slicing a child.

Thursday
Sparkly: going to get to skate with adults. But at least I have I have intelligent conversation when I want to take a break from working on elements in isolation.

Dull: Not many of them freeskate and most just skate around the outside near the boards, so that leaves me with little ice in the middle. That's right I can't run through my programs because it is a Public Adult Session.

I'll tell you how it went later.

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"It's not age that determines but the heart." "Skating is not just a sport for the young but it's a passion for the soul of the young at heart." Brigitte Laskowski

I am a nomadic adult skater who is a member of Windsor FSC (Skate Windsor) WOS SC again since Sept. 1st, 2008.

http://eastcastlemusic.tripod.com

Singerskates Sports Music Editing

This is exactly the way it's taught at our club, with the difference that because of the Dutch testing system where the backspin is not tested separately, but only a changefootspin, you first do a ccw 1-foot spin, then put both feet down and push off with the left foot onto the back outside edge of the right foot. You actually can't do an inside edge from the 1-foot spin without travelling out of the spin (in a forward direction) so you'll know immediately if you're on the inside edge.
When they practice the backspin separately they call it a "spin from standstill" I think but they haven't had our group do it yet.

I agree - don't mess with fractures!!! I had this pain in my leg that just wouldn't go away and turned out to be a fracture in the end after all, and now they're saying that if like, within the first 3 months of it happening the foot would've been put in a cast and the weight kept off it, I would've been back to jumping within 6-8 weeks and this way, it'll take about a year...
Don't mess with fractures!!!

Thanks! This description sounds very thorough to me. I was standing at my desk while walking through what you wrote (my coworkers already know I'm crazy and I skate on the carpeting ). I can already feel that I was not standing with my weight completely centered over my skating hip before. So thank you again. I'm going to print this out and take it to the rink this morning for my lesson!

Sparkly WOW! I got to see some amazing skating on our freestyle session yesterday. Girls were visiting from regionals, and more than a few of them were throwing triple-triple combinations around, and doing spins like I've only seen on TV.

Dull Um, with that insane session the lesson was a bit of a waste. It's hard to learn when you feel like you are going to get killed at any minute. I knew that they weren't going to hit me- but I was worried I step into their path. I did get a little bit of work on choctaws in, and got a compliment that my speed into my jumps was picking up.

Slightly GlossySynchro also went well- I can moonwalk now, but we do it so fast in the program, that I can't do it. I'm also getting a lot better at wrong side half jumps- so that's a plus. I still can't get my backward lunge, and now it looks like were doing one of those spinny lunges, which I also can't do I'm definetly the weakest link- but I think the team is small enough, that they are still glad I'm there.

Bright Shining Sparkly Quarkiki's baby is the most adorable little thing I've ever seen! She's so beautiful, and spent the time we were cooing over her, playing with her hands, yawning (ohhh so cute) and playing with her tongue.

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-Jessi
What I need is a montage...
Visit my skating journal or my Youtube videos (updated with 2 new videos Sept 26, 2009)

Sparkly: yay, good practice and lesson today. I have to do a double three turn in my program and it was pretty good, and the rbo three was pretty good. My toe loop came back from vacation. Apparently my backspin is good enough to pass bronze - though it's far from pretty, does the bare minimum of revolutions and I am not sure I'm on the correct edge. I was worried about it though cuz that spin has been a BEAR for me to learn.

Dull: sheesh one wrong step in my program and then I messed up the rest completely! Two footed loop and stuck it in the wrong place.

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Revised Official 2010 Goals checklist
Skate __
New boots __
(lowering the bar for 2010 as I haven't skated in a year)

Dull: Ears were still a little plugged up - which effected my balance - which trashed my spins

Sparkly: REALLY getting comfortable on backward edges - more control and more SPEED! (What the hell am I going to do with all this speed?)

Dull: Couldn't seem to get the timing for Toe Loops this morning, though they were pretty good in off-ice warmup

Sparkly: Worked out a new footwork sequence that I like and I'm not far off the tempo even now.

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Dianne
(A.O.S.S.? Got it BAD! )

Sparkly: HOORAY!!!!! My rink reopened yesterday! I skated this morning on brand new ice. No hills, no huge lumps, and they painted our club logo in 2 different places in the ice. My spins, both backward and forward were some of the best they have been, which is wierd since I have not skated for almost 2 weeks - I got tired of driving an additional 15 miles to the other rink, although I am glad they helped us out while my rink was closed.

Dull: The ice still needs additional building up and smoothing out. I also could not jump since I slipped and feel in my kitchen this morning and banged my knee on my landing leg. It didn't hurt while I was skating, but a couple of the muscles are a bit stiff, so I didn't want to take any chances on a bad jump landing putting too much stress on my knee.

Dull:
- Half the rink melted away (and they're having 3-day championships in hockey this weekend, so there were a lot of manager-type people running about the rink speaking English and the entire rink staff was there trying to fix the problem)
- Left ankle still hurts in the skates, and the healing blisters itch like mad.
Also, camel seems a little, well, gone. Well it's not gone, but it used to be better, I can't seem to get a good hook, travel all over the place, plunge my nose, drop the free leg, etc. Maybe the ice was bad, I don't know.

Sparkly:
- My backspin and changefootspins, my scratchspin, my camel-sit.
- The fact that I'm at about 95% of the motion range I had before the broken ankle WITHOUT feeling pain.
- Talked to a 20-year-old girl at the rink and explained that indeed she would not need special skates (other than her current ones) to join a skating club and that yes, we do have people her age training at her (beginners) level and she felt the monthly fees we pay were acceptable as well. So we might have a new adult member sometime soon.
- Did slalom between the cones they used to separate the melting part of the rink from the functional part.
- Off-ice I can now grab my skate with both hands for the bielman, on ice I can't yet.

- Caught one of the managers saying that besides the 400-metre track for speed skaters which will be ready next year, they're also building a PRACTICE RINK! This would about triple the size of our rink, and our club might get extra ice time - we're desastrously short on ice time right now (sharing the rink with a show-skate club, large ice-hockey club, speed skaters, shorttrackers, government programmes for children and retired-aged and poor people, public sessions, schools, etc).

Hmmm, ...maybe I'll postpone retiring and save money for a few more years.

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Bill Schneider

Dull: I knew the dullness would come in to counter all of the progress I made on Tuesday. Unfortunately, I've been sick for the past 2 days and I decided not to skate. I'm trying to get back on the ice tomorrow if my body will allow it.

Sparkly: Still excited about my fully rotated but two-footed double axel. It's one step closer in the right direction.


BlackManSkating

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Proud to be one of the few black men out on the ice

Goals
Pass my Silver Moves Test
Finish Choreography for Silver Program
Land a Clean Double Toe and Double Lutz
Work on Double Axel and Rockers
Speed up back Camel

Bill - Nah. Sooner you retire, the sooner you'll be sharing YOUR ice time with the spritely college students! LOL (That's what the retirees told ME when I was a spritely college student - I was using THEIR ice. LOL)


Skated on a wonderful skating session today, only a handful of people on the ice and I could avoid them easily. Saw one woman doing figures! Ice was great - not too hard, not too soft - and my toe scratching didn't reverberate. Very nice overall.

Dull:
My blades need sharpening and I don't know where to take them.
As a result, my spins are traveling and my threes are scraping.

Sparkly:
Decent MITF practice, albeit limited because I wasn't keeping track.
(One of these, two of those...whatever I felt like doing.)

Sit spins were weak; no wonder since I've been off the ice so long and I sit in a chair all day working.
(I actually miss the eight flights of stairs to my office.)

Camels were surprisingly decent, even the back ones. They traveled, but they had the right feel to them, position-wise.

Only tried waltz jumps; have to get my strength back and lose the 5 lbs I've gained before I get back to jumping seriously.

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Well, I am not near retirement anyway. This thing called a 'mortgage' prevents that from happening anytime soon. Sigh.

I have also observed that there are absolutely _no_ spritely college students up for the 6:30 a.m. sessions. Plenty in the afternoons, though!

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Bill Schneider

sparkly
loop is good
today, my spins were quite good
I actually did about 2 revs in an OK-ish position on a sitspin! turns out my arms were hanging around and throwing me off balance. as soon as I fixed them, it's soo much better.

dull
loop from back entry is very bad
coach taught me some really simple footwork sequence, which I just can't get into my head!!! it's like, a little waltz jump/bunny hop thing, then your right leg has to be over your left leg or put down or something and uhh I don;'t get it........ oh well more practice needed I guess.

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Sparkly: I'm going to be taking my pre-pre moves test in 2 weeks!! It is a long time coming, after a 5-6 year hiatus, I relearned most of the moves this summer. So here goes nothing.

Dull: I'm probably not competing this year. I thought I would but other things have come up that have put that off till next year. It is probably for the best, giving me more time to pass tests. Edges were good, but I need to make it back to the axis without coming to a screeching halt. Waltz 8 was improved as well especially on the clockwise side, although the whole pattern needs to be much bigger. Overall, everything needs more speed and confidence.

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~Always Dream!~

Check my progress at www.freewebs.com/sk8tegirl06

Wednesday Night

Sparky

-my spins

Dull

-everything, I was so tired from staying up the night below to work on a slide show for an english assignment, then the teacher wouldn't even let me into my hotmail to get my slide show to show the class because we're not aloud to go into hotmail.(I don't stand why they just don't block the site)

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2014 and 2018 Olympics here I come!

Skating, skating all day long, skating, skating all night long! May seem tiring to some people but not me, it's my life!!

Goals: Triple Loop, Novice Competitive, Sr.Silver Dances, Gold Artistic, and top 3 at Sectionals

Sparkly - MIF feeling good, hope I can test soon. Not going to test in October, as my daughter is testing then, and I want to be there to support her, not be a nervous wreck over my own test.

Dull - getting a few good rotations out of my camel spin, but I need to get my leg up farther. Anyone have any good exercizes for that? I'm trying to put a weight on my ankle and get into spiral position on the floor. But I'm not sure that is helping. I think I also need more flexibility. But the stretching I'm doing seems to be all hamstrings and hip flexors, but not the right muscles for the spiral.

Also dull - still energy level issues.

Sparkly- Axel is getting much more consistent! 50/50 is about the worst that it gets now! I'm also getting through my program all the way (doing bell jumps instead of axels for now). My double salchow is up to a salchow and a half, and I'm landing it on one foot. I'm calling it a very cheated double to make myself feel better about it!

Dull- Very tired this week, and I spent a lot of time fooling around with my fellow axel strugglers.

Sparkly Spins, I was actually getting my foot crossed over for a proper spin today, whereas it's normally bent up in front. Started sit spins too, going way too fast though and have to slow down!

Dull Spinning was the only thing I could do as the rink was a packed public session with crap ice and no space!

Questionable I do my fwd spin on my right leg, does this mean I should be back spinning on my left?

Technically, yes. Your right-footed forward spin turns CW-Clockwise, so your back spin should be on your left foot also turning CW-Clockwise.

If you're really talented, you could do a back spin on your right foot, turning CCW-Counter-Clockwise. j/k - it's really hard to spin in the other direction.

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No our government programme for retired-aged people is more like "learn not to be afraid of the ice, it doesn't bite".
they only do forwards and backwards stroking, I've never even seen them do x-overs.

I can do a cw backspin of about 3 revs but not a cw 1-footspin... And I'm ccw. How weird?

Ahhhhhh thank you, I was starting to do it on my right leg, and wondering why it felt like I should be doing it on the other!

If you can spin your back spin on your right foot and your left, you've got a feature to your spins under IJS. One of the kids in our region uses that as a feature in her L3/4 change combination spin and it's quite nice.