Juvenile skaters can no loinger compete with triples in the US (I think you are in Canada, Virtual?). It doesn't stop them from working on them, though, that's for sure.

Out of the juv from last years Jr nats I think only one had a D/A.Dont need it at juv level here in this country.They do seem to have doubles doubles, although not all landed.In fact I know a few of the high level juv girls and they might be working on a D/A takes a long time.
Ashley Wagner now 17, took 4 years for hers and didnt have it at age 10. Hope is not lost ....

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I skate at a rink where there are a lot of home-schooled kids who train all day (some are local, some families moved here, some are from a few hours away and mom and the kids come during the week), and a lot of other kids who go to school and spend the rest of their time at the rink. 9 of our skaters went to junior nationals last year (a pairs team, 2 dance teams, an intermediate boy, an intermediate girl, and a juv girl). All of these kids, and even a lot of the kids who are NOT making it out of sectionals or even regionals at the juvenile or intermediate level have already passed their junior senior moves, most of them senior, and they're on silver, pre-gold dances or higher. The intermediate lady (who is 14 now and actually skipped up to junior for this year) just passed her last gold dance a few months ago.

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2010-2011 goals:
Pass Junior MIF test
Don't break anything

Similiar situation north of the city of Chicago - Juvies and Intermediates making JNs, Novices, Juniors, and Seniors making at least Sectionals, a couple of World competitors who switched countries. Many are homeschooled. Parents work two jobs each of one kid that I know - drop the kid off at the rink @ 5:45 AM in the summer with two meals and snacks in a cooler and the other parent picking up at 5 PM. Luckily, one of the World level competitors has a car her parents bought for her and she's nice enough to offer to drop some of them off at home/gym.

No offense to anyone, but that doesn't sound like a real fun childhood to me!

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You miss 100% of the shots you never take.--Wayne Gretzky

Not my kids, so no offense taken. It can't be much of a fun life for the parents either if they are working 2 jobs each.

This is why I'm not sympathetic that 10 year old doesn't have the money to train for this kind of life. I save that for the kid who does have to live that life!

j

I was thinking the same thing about the ice time! I also agree about the apartment and schooling.

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skating mom to 3 angels on earth and 1 in heaven

Wow. If we did an hour long lesson with dd's coach, it would be $50/hr and freestyle ice time is 5.00/hr. I'm feeling very blessed to live in a area where the lessons are cheaper and ice time is also less expensive! WOW.

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skating mom to 3 angels on earth and 1 in heaven

Way off the subject, but I'd just like to point out that a coach approaching you about taking lessons while you are already with another coach is highly unethical.

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- Ashley

I would bet if you asked, 80 percent of them woudnt change anything.I would doubt one high level skater would say I wish I hadnt grown up like that.If its their passion, you cant get them off.
I wouldnt have my skater at the rink all day,but we spend a few hours every day.
I think the poster was speaking about Summer training. That is what happens at major rinks.

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http://www.youtube.com/user/alaskanmom

Yes, but who's to say that a child of ten, good or not, will still be enjoying skating in three years time? My coach was saying this morning that, if a skater is to survive puberty (and the vast majority don't), they really need to have a least one triple before it hits - and even then, it's a holding operation for four or five years and many give up. At least until adulthood....

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Mrs Redboots
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I love my computer because my friends live in it!
Ice dancers have lovely big curves!

My coach had a childhool like that. She begged her mom to let her go away to another training place and live with the coach. Her mom said no and she's thankful. She also is NOT going to let her kids do what she did.

j

I totally agree, my dd is a synchro skater and it is a blast. It isn't cheap, you still have to keep your skills up, but the level of lessons and $$ is different than competitive solo freestyle.

Again, there's a difference between advanced and elite. There are many, many advanced (ie: high-test) skaters who never become elite (making it to Nationals), especially in ladies' singles.

The blunt fact is that skating is expensive. If you can't afford it, you can't afford it and that's all there is to it. Find a cheaper sport like running or soccer (although I think you'll find that becoming "elite" there is expensive too).

As for how other people afford it, well, I know for a fact that Kitty and Peter Carruthers' parents triple mortgaged their house and Mr. Carruthers literally went door-to-door at local businesses hunting for sponsors. Nancy Kerrigan's dad worked three jobs. Even the parents I know who are well-off (as in lawyers and doctors and other high-income profressions) make major sacrifices (working multiple jobs, foregoing family vacations, etc.) to further their children's hopes.

If you're not willing/able to do that, then the chances are pretty high, that, no, your child might not become elite.

But then the chances are just as high that your child won't become elite even if you poured money on her like water.

Thanks, twokidsskatemom.

No. But it seems my dd would like to have it. I have been toying with her the ideas of other sports, like golf or ballet or baseball. She told me she likes other sports, but compared to skating, she loves skating more. She would like to sacrifice for it.. She told me if it is money, she had to quit but does not mean she agree to quit. She told me in that case she had no choice. She told me skating is her things.

Sorry, I need to correct my original post. It was not the other coach approached us directly. It is my DD's coach suggested that by going one class with the other coach would be an enchancement for her.

Thank you for your affirm my thought that money is key here. What surprised me is it becomes such big impact even in such early stage. For God Sake, she is only 1st year Juv, which is lowest qualified level. Other sports, only when you get into really high level, you feel the pain of money. Not in the first qualified level like skating.

Yes, all these discussions clear my mind. That we can not sacrify everything, including my other younger child's benefits for my DD skating. We can not endure our family apart in order for her inch forward in skating. We can not drain our finance to foot her skating bills so that she has some fair playground to have a chance be elite level in this sport. We are just not a qualified elitable skater parents. On one hand, I just wish we would have someone like you guys/ladies to give me reality check when we started her skating. We would never keep her hope so high if she had only stayed in ISI.

On the other hand, I would really hope that USFSA could do something to change the system. If skating can be varsity sport, it would give more accessibilities for kids to advance in elite path. Even expensive sports like tennis, golf, our public schools district have team and tournaments for them. That way, kids can get some free or discount fees for the lessons and continue to paticipate highly competitive events without give up too early because of money. Won't USFSA know that if you can get more competitive kids to compete in the event and stay in the sport longer, you could get more high quality athletes? I guess nobody feels the need to push this sport to be more accessible (for elite level) is because whatever the system now it still provides USA enough elite skaters in the world and olympic games.

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"Become the change you want to see in the world. Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever." - Mahatma Gandhi

Thank you for your frank words. I really wish our skating school and coaches would warn us first thing about this before we started.

Actually, in this skating case, if you have money you are lucky to be able to buy such not happy childhood life in some people eyes.

My dd has all doubles. She got her double flip and luz last year. The quality and height are much better now. But she always has problem with double toe. Her coach told me she got her 1st very very clean double toe last week and the height was huge. She did not know I planned to have my daughter quit in working towards elite level yet.

My DD started working double axel last Dec. She started to work on trip sal in past 3 months. They are not consistent enough to be in the program yet. She had level 3 spin and level 2 foot work in her program. Her coach told me that we should prepare two years staying in this level becasue she did not see my dd can make it to national this year which is true after we were in that big competition. She told me my DD had a great chance to make to National next year in Juv level. That made my jaw drop too. I can't imagine we spend that much amount of money for two years in the same level. After the reality check, we definitely price out for the elite level.

To be honest, at the beginning, I felt sad because I thought we were not good parents because we just could not sacrify these much. And it was so much out of our capability and comfort zone. But now, I know we are not the handful few families been priced out. It is norm. I hope this would help my DD to smooth out her transition.

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"Become the change you want to see in the world. Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever." - Mahatma Gandhi

What I see here is just a matter of mixed up goals/priorities. What is more important to you? Having your daughter compete at the national level, or providing her with an activity through which she can learn important lessons (hard work, discipline, responsibility), make friends, and have a good time? I'm sure most of us who grew up in this sport will look at those things as far more important than any medal we ever won.

And you mention that skating should be a varsity sport--it actually is a growing sport in many high schools. Schools will have skating teams that compete much like a swim team or track team--placement individual events earn points and the school with the most points wins. I don't know about its popularity in Chicago but it is pretty big in Michigan and seems to be growing where I live in Ohio. This is something that's come up within the past 5-10 years. Skaters, however, usually still have to pay their own ice time and coaching. The school may have some practice time that's booked cheap or at no cost to the skaters and a coach to work with all the skaters during that time, but I'm sure that varies.

This carries on to college, where there are many schools participating in the intercollegiate conference. Competitions run much the same way, with skaters competing in individual events at their level (all are offered, from pre-prelim through senior free, solo dance, and other events). Figure skating is not recognized by the NCAA so scholarships are not available, and what it costs varies depending on the school (the college I went to paid 100% of our travel/hotel, food at competitions, entry fees, and for the 2 coaches who traveled with us, we paid for our ice time--a whopping $2.50 for a 45 min session, and we also paid for our private lessons. The school I went to for graduate school gave us all the free ice time we wanted).

Synchronized skating is also a rapidly growing college sport, again, not yet recognized by the NCAA so scholarships are available, but there are a few teams who are fully-funded varsity sports (down to skaters being given new skates every other year), and skaters' out-of-pocket expenses on teams at other schools who are not varsity teams varies from a couple hundred dollars for the whole season (everything included) to a couple hundred dollars per month. Many teams compete at the collegiate or open collegiate levels, and there are also a few teams competing at the senior level.

There is also the national collegiate championships held each August (not related to the intercollegiate conference, which has its own national championships), which is for junior or senior level skaters who are full-time college students. I am not sure what the requirement to qualify for this is.

So there are many opportunities out there aside from training to be an elite skater and spending your whole entire life in an ice rink.

__________________
2010-2011 goals:
Pass Junior MIF test
Don't break anything

What about your DD just doing the elements and freeskate for testing in the competitive stream for the next few years. Then maybe she could get all her spins, jumps, footwork and spiral sequences to the highest level posible, so that by the time she's 16 she could pay for her own skating by coaching part-time. Just keep her out of any competition in which she has to travel for the next few years but still keep her in the competitive stream test wise.

Have you thought of having your DD becoming a model to offset her skating costs? She could also do neighbors' yard work at age 10 as well. Let her learn that skating costs money by making some money of her own. And if she's doing all doubles, what about your DD program assisting at her club's rink this year. Some clubs pay $5 an hour in ice time credits for program assisting. She could be helping the Learn To Skate program and getting the ice costs down which in turn helps her become a skating coach later in life (16 or older once coaching tests are passed) and save you money. You should talk with your DD and her coach about her program assisting the Learn To Skate and Snow Plow SAM classes.

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"It's not age that determines but the heart." "Skating is not just a sport for the young but it's a passion for the soul of the young at heart." Brigitte Laskowski

I am a nomadic adult skater who is a member of Windsor FSC (Skate Windsor) WOS SC again since Sept. 1st, 2008.

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You want to get a 10 YEAR OLD into modeling???

How about she just be a little girl?

j

Please tell me where you went to college and graduate school. I had no idea that some colleges had these kinds of programs.

Been there done that. Our skater was somewhat successful at juvenile but aged out, to look at the possibly years of pre-novice during growth spurt while getting better jumps was just too much. We did a re-mortgage along the way.

We were entranced by the sport, I can't explain it. You're in that rink atmosphere, the coach suggests an extra ice session, although knowing that money is tight and you know it's the right thing to do so say yes what the hell, the coach bill comes in, the coach is kind and gives you a payment plan and then you're sitting in the bank office considering how much equity is in your house and how many more years that might cover and you talk with other people at the rink doing the same thing and think it's normal. You wonder how the people you work with manage to go to the Dominican every spring and have decent cars and eat out for lunch every day, their kids play house league hockey with their friends and hang out all summer.

Eventually you wake up.

I take most of your posts with a grain of salt but you're crazy.

I do know some folks whose kids have done modeling. I thought it was kind of creepy though.

Plus while it's nice for kids to understand the value of money and take responsibility, it's not really a 10 year old's job to decide whether to fork over thousands of dollars to become an elite skater and then come up with the money--that's what parents are for.

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You miss 100% of the shots you never take.--Wayne Gretzky

I don't know, my 13 year old is well aware of what her horse showing expenses are and she has said she would be interested in modeling to help with the cost. What is wrong with it really?

She is 6 foot 1 inches tall- so it really is a good idea.