I skate at ladies gold and recently I have just had a lot of problems, boots, blades, and health. Over the last year I have started dancing and it has been very helpful w/ my power. So here is my dilema: all my doubles are cheated about 1/2 to a 1/4 I land the on the right foot and can do combinations out of them but, I hate doing cheated jumps. I can do them clean but the consistency is so poor. So I am thinking of doing no doubles, when I did it today it was really nice solid jumps more time for my spins no interruption of flow, 3 solid axels one in combo w/ another and another alone. What do yall think? Doubles or not? I probably won't make it champ gold w/ the easier program but it would be a better, cleaner skate and I think that's more important.

la

I suppose that it all depends on what you want at the end of the day. It sounds like you put the quality of your skating over medals and I say good on you That's the way that I would want to do it, I can't see any point in putting something out there that isn't correct THOUGH you do still have to push yourself, I wouldn't want to go out and do an easy peasy programme either!

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The best whisper is a click

This is my opinion, but if you are more comfortable with doing only the axels and no doubles, than go for it. At Mids last year a lady qualified for AN in Ladies Championship Gold with only an axel and no doubles. Her program was beautifully skated with great spins and footwork. Remember, skating is not only a jumping contest! Or, at least, it shouldn't be!

Welcome to the dance world! See ya' at Mids!

na

I am skating gold this year too. My doubles are not coming together for me either so unless a miracle happens in the next month, my Gold program is going to be "double-less" this year. I only have 2 axels in mine.

My coach will only allow me to put a double in if I can get it consistantly 1/4 turn or less cheated. Right now if I manage to land on 1 foot, it's usually a full 1/2 turn cheated and my coach says "no go" to that.

At Pacific Coasts, I have seen people qualify with no doubles too. I don't expect to this year as the rest of my skating isn't "Gold" quality yet either, but it will be fun to try!

I totally hear what you're saying. I am in Masters and have no doubles! I can do them, but I stress out too much over them, making them horribly inconsistent, and thus the rest of my skating suffers. I decided to do a program with all singles just so that I can enjoy my freestyle skating again!

So it really comes down to what you want to accomplish. I know I don't have a prayer of placing well against skaters doing loads of doubles, but that's not my goal; it's just to skate a pretty program sans stress.

But as a judge too, I can tell you that any cheated jump you do won't be counted and will only mar the look of your program. I'd rather see a beautifully done single than a poorly done double.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

When you say "doubles", does that mean you have more than one in the program? What if you took out all but one, & were able to focus only on that one to try & see if you can get it clean before nationals? You have 2 months....and you can always pull it later if it isn't working.

On any given day I land clean double sows and toes. In competition at my best I have landed 3 very clean doubles. Recently, I skated a solid program but it had two cheated sows one 1/2 the other 1/4. I land them on the R foot w/ a good exit but it annoys me. I don't generally fall on them but w/ the rest being so strong I just don't want deductions for random jumps I can land 1out of 4 times. The randomness keeps me from focusing on just one they are equally flakey. I just want input as to what is preferred, I like clean solid programs myself, and I plan to keep practicing the jumps, just in case. Last year I did really well in gold ladies II w/ only one double attempt that I just sat on. I managed the top 5.

Ever so perplexed.

la

Thank you!

I probably won't have any doubles again this year, either. My 2sal is now fully rotated, but right now I am landing 90% of them on my backside. So, unless I have a major breakthrough in the next four weeks, I think it's too risky for me to put it in. Instead, we have been working on improving the difficulty of my spins, singles and choreography.

Cosk8er - good luck on trying to figure out what to do. I learned a very valuable lesson last year at Lake Placid. That is to do what I feel comfortable doing in my program, and not worry about what everyone else is doing. When I did that at Mids, I skated my best program yet. When I worried about the others at Lake Placid, I crashed and burned (literally). After all, it's all about showing them that you love to skate, right?

(Looking forward to seeing you in Colorado! )

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"The only place where success comes before work is in a dictionary." -- Vidal Sasson

"Never give up on a dream just because of the time it will take to accomplish it. The time will pass anyway." -- Unknown

I'm gonna go against the grain and say put them in if you eventually want to compete with them clean. I mean, the goal should be the end result- so what if you don't place that well this year. I guess I see it this way: if you're going to place badly because you are only doing singles, why not place badly because you're doing bad doubles which will be downgraded to singles anyway? The one difference is that the more you do your doubles in competition, the more reliable they'll be and the less of a big deal they will be to land. And if you start doing them at competitions, under pressure, all the time, they won't be an "option" and your mind will start to look at them differently. After a while they won't be stressful anymore. I think as long as you are doing them to improve, there's nothing wrong with putting them in, it's not like you are PURPOSEFULLY cheating them JUST to have them in your program, it should be a learning experience. I don't find anything rewarding about coasting through a program even if it's done perfectly if I know I omitted something because I couldn't do it/was afraid to, but if you just want to go and enjoy a clean, stressfree skate then go for it. I just wouldn't see how that would help you in the long run, and you can always enjoy your skate at a less important competition where it doesn't matter as much.

I think I would suggest best of both worlds - if you (and your coach) reckon you've a chance of landing clean doubles this year, then leave them in your programme until the last week before competition. If they're still not working, then remove them and replace them with singles. You can put them back in again after the competition!

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Mrs Redboots
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I love my computer because my friends live in it!
Ice dancers have lovely big curves!

I was thinking a bit about what you said, fadedstardust, and I was wondering where you think someone should draw the line. I think of Johnny Weir, and Michelle Kwan, who rely on their own strengths and don't do the more riskier, unreliable elements. They are placing above skaters who try, and fall. Of course, they both have that "something special" that the average skater doesn't have.

Myself, I would rather keep a double out of my prgram than to put in a double that I know is only a 1 and 1/2 (and I mean a consistent 1 and 1/2, not an occasional occurance), or one that I am still falling regularly on. To me, a program with consistently underroated jumps, or falls, is a distraction. Right now, I could put a program out there with a double sal fall, and 1 and 1/2 jumps toe through a lutz - but I would only have proven that I am a master of zero double jumps.

I don't mean this to be a criticism of folks who have a diffierent opinion from me - everyone does the best that they can do for themselves. It is obvious that even the judges can't come to an agreement on this issue, because often adult gold scores are all over the place, between those who attempt doubles and those who don't. I'm just trying to feel out others feelings on the issue.

Thanks.

Edited to add: I'm not talking about jumps you can do in practice but are unable to do in competition. I'm talking about jumps that are 1 and 1/2 or falls regularly in practice.

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"The only place where success comes before work is in a dictionary." -- Vidal Sasson

"Never give up on a dream just because of the time it will take to accomplish it. The time will pass anyway." -- Unknown

Well all the advice has been very enlightening, I need to see both sides of the coin. My doubles are very inconsistent but when I do them right about 50/50 this week they are very clean. I will probably do a conservative program if there is a qualifying round and then for final round I will probably do 2 even though I have 4 planned. If the first 2 go well I will just change mid stream and then do easier solid jumps for the remainder. I am very fond of my ending spin and I don't want it cut short by running late or sliding across the ice backside first.

la