salchow----3 turn or mohawk entry?

[Figureskates]

What prompted the question is that I do a mohawk entry into a half flip and I was surprised last summer how many people do a 3 turn entry.

I am currently trying 3 turn entry into the salchow but I am having trouble holding onto the edge after the 3 turn. I seem to have more control with a mohawk and debating whether to use the mohawk instead.

Any thoughts?

[jp1andOnly]

if its more comfortable do the mohawk

[shutterbug]

Originally posted by Figureskates
What prompted the question is that I do a mohawk entry into a half flip and I was surprised last summer how many people do a 3 turn entry.

I am currently trying 3 turn entry into the salchow but I am having trouble holding onto the edge after the 3 turn. I seem to have more control with a mohawk and debating whether to use the mohawk instead.

Any thoughts?

I initially learned the salchow off of a mohawk because I had trouble holding the check after the 3 turn. As my skating became stronger I was able to do it using the 3 turn entry as well. It's nice to be able to do both - gives you more options when putting together a program.

Start by doing it whichever way feels best. You can always try the other entry when you feel like a new challenge.

[dooobedooo]

I think it is easier to check the turn before the Salchow if you are doing a mohawk, and you need to check it to make sure you do not go round too far on an edge and miss the jump entirely.

If you want to try it from a 3-turn, suggest you practise doing LFO3 with strong check first.

Don't think it makes any difference to your marks in test or competition, though.

[dbny]

In roller skating, many years ago, we did a Sal from a back crossover. Has anyone seen that on ice?

[CanAmSk8ter]

Originally posted by dbny
In roller skating, many years ago, we did a Sal from a back crossover. Has anyone seen that on ice?

No- but now I'll have to try that this afternoon! :D

[Mrs Redboots]

Originally posted by dooobedooo
I think it is easier to check the turn before the Salchow if you are doing a mohawk, and you need to check it to make sure you do not go round too far on an edge and miss the jump entirely.. Like my Salchow which goes right round and then I hop backwards! At least, that's what happened last time I tried one..... :D

[TreSk8sAZ]

My coach always threatens to make me do my salchows from a mohawk instead of my normal LFO3 (It's a threat because I DESPISE mohawks). The reason for this is with my LFO3 I have a tendency to swing my free leg through to start the jump, rather than checking the 3-turn and using the proper edge. If I had any control on my mohawks, I would do salchows from those simply because it gets me in a better position and allows for less mistakes. HOWEVER, that is just me! and this is my worst jump :evil: (I find lutzes much easier, lol!). It could be completely different for you! Best of luck!

[Debbie S]

When we were learning the salchow, our instructor had us do an exercise where we would do the 3-turn and hold the inside edge with our free leg behind us, but try to stay on the circle (we practiced along one of the hockey circles). In other words, not veer around too quickly. He wanted us to get in the habit of holding the inside edge and not taking off right away, but also controlling the edge so we didn't start rotating backward. The turn on the BI edge should be gradual, and you should be bending your knee so that you are ready to jump as soon as you face forward.

[candace]

I learned how to do it from a 3 turn I did single and doubles that way. Than I changed to the mohawk for my double and trpile salchow. I think it is easier to do it from the mohawk. Easier to controll. Do what fells better to you.

[spicyicey]

I learned a 3 turn for the single and the double. I switched to a mohawk because I was having trouble controlling the 3, then I went back because the jump was too small, and now I'm back on a mohawk, for good this time. ;) (can you tell the salchow is one of my least favorites?)

I have seen the salchow from the back crossovers - I know one coach who seems to teach it that way. I have to say I personally don't really like it. A friend of mine used to be able to hold the back inside edge of the entry all the way around the hockey circle, and then do a double salchow out of it. That was impressive.

I think the 3-turn vs. mohawk dilemma is totally personal. I seem to notice most skaters in my club use mohawks once they get their double, but definitely 3-turn for singles and learning the double. If you feel more comfortable one way, then use that one.

[Aussie Willy]

I generally do a salchow from 3turn but also do them from mohawk. But I do find the mohawk harder for the simple fact I have not practised it as much as the 3turn. However it is good to do the mohawk if you are doing a step sequence into the salchow.

BTW - how do most of the top skaters do a salchow?

[singerskates]

I tried to do salchow's from a 3 turn and they just didn't get off of the ice. Then once I learn to do the mohawk, I tried to do a half flip from a mohawk. Then I did the salchow from the mohawk, way easier to control. Guess, I won't have to switch ways of doing my salchow when I start doubles.

[shutterbug]

Originally posted by dbny
In roller skating, many years ago, we did a Sal from a back crossover. Has anyone seen that on ice?

Yup, have used this entry too (how can you tell my coach gets bored easily, LOL). Definitely not the easiest way to go into a salchow, but it feels very cool once you get the hang of it. I wouldn't recommend it for someone just learning the jump though. A good time to try it is when you're learning BI3's as the mechanics are similar.

[NickiT]

I learned to do a salchow from a three turn entry but a few months ago my coach wanted me to try it from a mohawk. I have to say I never found it easy this way but it did stop my salchow from going swingy. I am back to the three turn entry now but I really should work on it from a mohawk as well.

Nicki

[Skatingsarah]

I started off with a 3 turn myself and changed it to a mohawk then I changed coaches and it is back to a 3 turn. I think whatever is comfortable is better. I like the 3 turn better because my free leg isnt so far behind and out to the side where my bad habit in the mohawk is to push my leg further back in the change of foot. So far the 3 turn is working as best for me but it is always different for others.
-Sarah

[icenut84]

Originally posted by Aussie Willy
BTW - how do most of the top skaters do a salchow?

They do it both ways, as far as I can tell. Most seem to use a 3 turn though.

3 turn - Michelle, Irina, Sasha, Sarah, Plushenko, Yagudin
Mohawk - Tim G, Elvis (?)

I think most of the top skaters use 3 turns.

[TashaKat]

If you're used to doing sals from 3-turns trying them from mohawk can be an, erm, revelation :oops: I was always told that I spun the salchow off the end of the 3-turn but didn't realise how much until I tried it from mohawk from pairs and felt stuck :roll: I quite like doing them from mohawk now and it DID make me work on checking the 3-turns better!

As dooobedooo said it doesn't matter what you do it from in competition/test (unless it was specified) as it's the EDGE that counts not the footwork before it :)

x

[flo]

I do a three turn. I, like Debbie was taught to hold the back inside edge in practice to gain control over the edge. I use the three turn for doubles as well, and also throws. I like the timing of the three turn.

[flippet]

I prefer the timing of the three-turn as well, something about it feels natural to me. (Sal is my favorite jump.) I've tried the mohawk, and can't really get the jump to work that way. (I probably need to practice it with a mohawk--not being able to do it decently probably means that I really do swing a bit too much with the 3-turn, but hey, we all have our quirks! ;) ) I do my half-flips from a mohawk--I like the straight-line feel. Full flips I can do (well, try!) from either entry equally well.

[Synchroprincess]

I do a 3turn but while working on my double salchow ive done it w/ a right back power 3 and then check into the salchow. Is that waht you guys mean when you say do it from crossovers? Im not picturing it...can someone help me out here ? lol

[Elsy2]

I also like to try them from from a power 3 and check into the salchow, but I don't think they mean that about the back crossover entry. Anything that puts you on a LBI edge can take you into a salchow. I've been trying forever to do it from a LBI spiral...you drop a bit out of the spiral and jump. I keep tapping my toe down though, but I'll get it someday. I would guess on the back crossover entry you would just do back CCW crossovers, hold a LBI edge at some point and jump.

[Figureskates]

I had my lesson this morning and coach would rather have me stay with the 3 turn entry. She told me I am going to have to get use to holding the back inside edge after the 3-turn. I have a nasty habit of rushing the jumps and she feels this is the only way she can effectively slow me down.

It must be working becasue I was able to do a couple of decent ones that she was pleased with. (And when she is pleased with something you know you are doing it right).

I am still inconsistent as a lot of the times I end up landing out to the side rather than straight forward (not enough rotation). Eventually it will all come together. I at least want to have a decent Sal and at least a rudimentry toeloop before I head for Lake Placid this August. The message is that you better practice your brains out because we are going for the pre-pre freestyle in September.

[BittyBug]

Have you tried counting out your entry? 1 - 2 - 3 on FO part of the 3-turn, and then 4 - 5 - 6 on the BI edge after the turn before you jump.

[Figureskates]

Bittybug, to be honest, I have not thought about doing that. It makes a lot of sense and I am going to try it next time out on the ice.

Thanks for the suggestion.

[dbny]

Originally posted by Synchroprincess
I do a 3turn but while working on my double salchow ive done it w/ a right back power 3 and then check into the salchow. Is that waht you guys mean when you say do it from crossovers? Im not picturing it...can someone help me out here ? lol

Nope. Assuming you jump CCW, do a CCW B crossover, hold the LBI edge, and jump.