Backspin Support Group Dec 2002

[jazzpants]

I figure it's time to start this back up again!

No, this is not a support group for our friend Backspin! (We all like "backspin", right!?!?) :D ;) This is a support group to deal with the triumph and tribulations of learning/doing THE backspin!!!

All my coaches and I have been focused more on 1) my loop jump and 2) my moves in the field, so I haven't done much lately on it, coaching-wise.

However I've been practicing it. It's not soup yet, but primary coach is happier about it. He definitely sees improvments on it. My problem now is not getting to the BO edge. It's STAYING on that BO edge that's the problem!!! :P (Help!?!?!)

[singerskates]

Out of three tries in my freeskate program , I was able to get one rotation once before switching to my forward edge for 3 revs. I can see that I'm going to be doing not just a backspin but a combo backspin(3 revs)/forward spin(3 revs or more) someday. but when, I don't know. For now it's 1 back and 3 forward. Can't seem to do the backspin without going for the forward spin combo. I also think I have an easier time attempting the backspin when not even really trying or thinking about it.

[Elsy2]

I was watching a friend of mine working on her backspin with her coach with the same problem you describe. You could definitely see her shift her weight and rock to the inside edge after about one rev. on the outside edge. Why don't you have your coach video you. Sometimes that really helps to see what your doing.

[melanieuk]

I'm back on the ice tomorrow after having a whole week off.
Before I went off, I was having problems with the backspin again - losing my ratio of 50/50 to a paltry 20/80 or less.
My problem is more that I go to the back of the blade when I pull in. I also rush the 3turn (involuntarily I assure you) and don't wait till I hit the BO edge, so I'm trying to spin forwards. YAK YUK YAK!! :??

Anyway, as often happens when I'm off ice for a few days, I always manage to skate a little better when I return.
I hope that is the case here.:roll:
I am seriously lagging behind all my wee skate pals and desperately want the axel back and a decent backspin (yeh yeh, how many months have I been saying that? :cry: )
I just need a hypnotist to get over the fear of it....

I wonder if anyone else have ever used a hypnotist to evercome fear of jumps??:?: :??

[singerskates]

On Thursday, I found this neat little exercise to get on the back edge. What I did was deep alternating inside edges doing four of them in a row and on the last one you let yourself stay on the right inside edge a little longer to do the three turn. Now if I could just get my freeleg to lift and cross the right leg to stay on the back edge for more than one rotation. Maybe today. Here's hoping.

[melanieuk]

Originally posted by singerskates
On Thursday, I found this neat little exercise to get on the back edge. What I did was deep alternating inside edges doing four of them in a row and on the last one you let yourself stay on the right inside edge a little longer to do the three turn. Now if I could just get my freeleg to lift and cross the right leg to stay on the back edge for more than one rotation. Maybe today. Here's hoping.

Back on the ice after 7 days.
The backspin didn't return. :(

I tried this exercise and it made not a bit of difference - somehow I think my errors are now too deeply etched in to my muscle memory....anyway, I'm sure this method helps for others, but not for me. :roll:
I am getting really frustrated with it.
I can make myself go on my toe (and nearly take myself out when I get stuck) or else I'm back on the blade or on inside edge after the 3 turn.
I do the FI 3 turn D E A D S L O W , keeping the free leg trailing back...it doesn't work. Nothing works.
((Despondent icon :cry: ))

[dani]

Originally posted by melanieuk

I just need a hypnotist to get over the fear of it....

I wonder if anyone else have ever used a hypnotist to evercome fear of jumps??:?: :??

I tried that!! My therapist made me a hypno tape to listen to. This was at the beginning of my skating career. I do think it helped. It involved running through the jumps and visualizing everything.

Sorry the practice didn't go that well. :-(

Hugs!
Danielle

[The Ice Demon]

Um backspin either happens or it doesn't for me - i still can't get it consistent.

A couple of hints that help me sometimes are as follows - i don't know if they'll help anyone else but here goes

**Keep arms low - ie on a 45 degree angle pointing down to the ground - if i let my arms go to high on backspin i am doomed - i drop right shoulder and splat.

** Tuck elbows in - this also helps with keeping arms low - otherwise I spin like a wobbly top with absolutely no centre.

**Suck tummy in to spine - it stops me flopping over at the middle which is probably because i have weak abs - it also pulls my weight to the centre more.

**Slow down!! (My coaches favourite comment for me) Go into 3 turn slowly and really hold that edge long and deep.

**Don't let your arms swing too far around (ie beyond 180 degrees wide keep them in a circle in front of you like you are hugging someone.

**When you pull in, pull in to your right side - ie i pull every thing towards my right boob! (LOL) It helps me keep my balance where it should be.

Hope these hints might help someone even a little bit. I hate to count the hours i've spent on backspins and still can't do them consistently.

:cry:

[sk8er1964]

Originally posted by The Ice Demon
**Slow down!! (My coaches favourite comment for me) Go into 3 turn slowly and really hold that edge long and deep.

Boy, do I ever hear that one a lot :?? !

[jazzpants]

Me too! Me too!!! :lol:

[melanieuk]

**When you pull in, pull in to your right side - ie i pull every thing towards my right boob! (LOL) It helps me keep my balance where it should be.
The Ice Demon

Thank you for that. I didn't think of that. I do everything else you suggested already. I'd pull everything in to my left side though! (CW skater)
This one may be the answer! :?: ;)

[melanieuk]

I tried to pull everything in to the left side of me.
No joy.
A skating buddy took pity on me ( I was getting emotionally distraught by then) and he spent some time willing me to get it, pointing out what he thought were errors.
My backspin has regressed. :(
Even coach only managed to get one out of me. :(

[melanieuk]

It's getting worser and worser!

Ok it's getting worse and worse. I'm at end of tether with it.

Muscle memory **for the wrong thing** has occured and I'm now automatically doing it wrong.

After the 3 turn, as I move my free leg to cross over (and turn the hip out), the skating edge falls to the inside or the back of the blade, and there is no possible salvage for it.

I got 2 out of about a zillion today, and I have no idea how I did it. :evil:

[melanieuk]

I will never fathom how people can do a backspin-2loop-backspin.
I have been in awe of this skill since I first saw it done in front of me when I returned skating as an adult.

:bow: to those people! :bow:

[kayskate]

Originally posted by melanieuk
I will never fathom how people can do a backspin-2loop-backspin.


I have never seen this done by an ice skater. I have seen it on quad roller skates. Sounds very cool though. Is this a training method for the 2loop?

Kay

[melanieuk]

(((Kay)))
A few of the "elite" skaters do it. I first saw it done by skaters from Centrum which once was Scotland's "elite" ice centre.
I'm sure I've seen international skaters doing this in warm ups or practices before a competition.
It is an exercise they do to "warm up" (lol)....I suppose to get a good snap or pull in and tight backspin position for the triples? It must take so much control.
Other kids do a single loop from a backspin, then backspin again.
I've tried this - another desperate measure to try and get the backspin - but it is beyond me!! Way too scary! 8O

Other interesting things they do is skate backwards (some speed), glide on 2 feet then jump a full rev with feet side by side to land back in same position on both feet. They do this in both directions.

[backspin]

What do you mean, it's not a support group for our friend backspin??? She can use all the support she can get!! :D

Well, backspin's backspin isn't anything to write home about either. It's basically a big twizzle down the ice. I can get a decent number of revolutions (8-10), but it isn't a true backspin. I'm currently blaming my old (OLD!) skates & blades, but I'll have new in about 2 months, so then the exceuses will be over.

This week I started playing w/ a flying spin, just for something new. My theory is it may teach me to be more comfortable on that right leg, & learn to find my balance point faster/better. Guess we'll see.

[jazzpants]

Backspin...you are ALWAYS welcome on our Backspin Support Group. :P :lol:

And what d'ya mean you're not doing a "true backspin." Do you mean you're NOT on the BO edge? I can do 3 rev., but it's not a true backspin either. (Meaning that I could spin on my left foot (I spin CW) but it's not on a BO edge.) :(

[backspin]

I rock back & forth from the front to the back of the blade, leaving a little herky-jerky tracing on the ice, like semi-3turns, instead of nice little loops. That's why it isn't a true backspin. I don't stay on the outside edge, on the front of the blade.:frus:

[Chico]

Gotta go quick here as wrapping gifts is calling, but I have found that doing a backspin after a single sal or waltz jump is EASIER for me than a traditional backspin. This is also true for a change foot sit. I think this may be because I have less time to worry about the dang backspin because I'm busy concentrating on the whole skill. Either that, or I'm a total nut case. Probably the later! =-/

Chico

[jazzpants]

Originally posted by backspin
I rock back & forth from the front to the back of the blade, leaving a little herky-jerky tracing on the ice, like semi-3turns, instead of nice little loops. That's why it isn't a true backspin. I don't stay on the outside edge, on the front of the blade.:frus:

Oui vei! My secondary pointed the same thing out this afternoon during our lesson today too! She said that I'm getting close, since my FI3 entry is actually not that bad at all and I DO get on the BO edge. But I can't stay on it for dear life. I'm still trying to find that one spot on my foot that if I press on it I would backspin on my BO edge forever like Lucindah Ruh. (If she's reading this... there is a middle age woman who wouldn't mind getting spin lessons from you!) :) :) :) My poor primary FS coach has been working me for at least two years on this spin...and I'm still not getting it...so I'll bet he's doing this too -- :frus: