More skate fitting woes

[Audryb]

Right now I’m still in my first pair of skates— Jackson Freestyles, size 5 B, which I bought after my second group lesson (absolute beginner) just by trying on what the pro shop had to offer. I’ve known since I started jumping that they’re much too wide in the heel, because my heel flops around, especially on loops. I’ve added heel wedges under the insoles to push my heels up into the slightly narrower part of the heel, and have stuck those little clear heel things for high heels into them and the combination makes my heels move less, but they’re still a bit too wide.

I’ve also felt for a while like they are too narrow in the ball of the foot. I often feel like my feet can’t quite flatten out against the bottom of the skate. I’ll stand there wiggling my feet around, trying to get them to feel flat, and eventually I’ll just get used to it, or the skate will warm up and stretch enough that the feeling goes away, and I’ve never given it TOO much thought. Last night though, I was kind of curious and went to a website that sells skates online and decided to measure my feet.

I followed the instructions exactly and came up with 4.5 as the size I should be wearing based on the length of my foot, and then measured the width. My foot is 3 ½” wide, giving me a “width number” of 18. When I go to the ladies size chart though, an 18 in a size 4.5 is an EE width! I re-measured my feet and decided that I could probably read the width 1/8” narrower if I wanted, giving me a 17, which is still an E width (or a D in a size 5). I was sure I just had to be doing something wrong, and I was also wondering how you measure the heel width for split-width boots, so I kept searching and found another set of instructions for measuring the ball of the foot, this time measuring around the foot with a tape measure. That method gave me the exact same results.

The wide width does kind of make sense, since I have a couple pairs of shoes that are quite wide and the balls of my feet do touch both sides of the shoe (while my heels flop around) although I’m a little surprised, if I really should be wearing a D or E width, that I can even fit my feet into my B width skates! Now I’m a little worried that squishing my foot that much might be doing more damage than just some annoying discomfort. Also, based on how loose my skates are in the heel, I would bet I need an A or even AA width in the heel (I have really skinny heels and ankles) Does anyone else have such a drastic difference in the width of their feet? Are split-width skates even available with a difference of 4 or 5 widths from ball to heel, or am I going to end up needing customs?

Of course, this is all a bit theoretical, since I won’t be able to afford new boots in the near future, but I know when I do get them I’m going to need to be fitted by someone who really knows what they’re doing. Does anyone know a really good skate fitter within a few hours of Charlotte, NC?

[Isk8NYC]

I didn't know you were in Charlotte. If you find a good fitter, let me know. I'm in the same boat. I went all the way to Maryland for a blade adjustment that helped, but didn't resolve, my skate issues.

Try checking with the skating director at Extreme Ice - she probably knows who is the best person in that area.

[Audryb]

Good idea. Extreme Ice is where I skate, I'll talk to Jenny next time I see her. I was actually thinking if I couldn't find a good place around here, maybe next time I drive to NY to visit family I could time it to include a stop in Maryland :D

[tapping_skater]

Audryb, I feel your pain, as my feet sound like they're a similar shape.

Does anyone else have such a drastic difference in the width of their feet?

Yes. I have duck feet (and tiny ankles!). I wear a 6W in street shoes and my heels "flap in the breeze" (meaning they typically come out of the shoe entirely when walking, especially with slip on shoes).

Mine measured borderline C/D in the ball and AAAA in the heel for my current boots. The boot fitter remeasured everything to make sure he'd done them correctly. :o

Are split-width skates even available with a difference of 4 or 5 widths from ball to heel

Probably not. Been there, tried that. My boot fitter tried getting a "special make up boot" - meaning a stock boot with a few limited changes, with all of the changes being width related - but the boot maker couldn't handle that much of a width difference in a special make up boot. I had to go custom.

...am I going to end up needing customs?

Probably, if you want the boots to fit properly and can't make your current boots work with corrective padding (which it sounds like you've already done). You might also consider using the protective ankle sleeves (Bunga and a few other brands) that will take up some of the extra space in the heel.

Not sure of your age, but if your feet are finished growing, I'd recommend getting measured by the best boot fitter you can find in your area and start saving your money in case you need customs. You want a boot fitter who works with several brands, not one who just reps one brand. If you ever visit the Chicago area, I can recommend a well known boot fitter there.

From my experience, Jacksons are typically good for feet that are wide in the ball, so if you can get your narrow heel accomodated, I'd probably stick with Jacksons. There's also a new Harlick design with a wide toebox and narrow heel, but I haven't seen them in person. I'm in custom Riedells, and my feet have never been happier. But the key thing is a good fitter who measures accurately and knows how all the brands fit differently shaped feet.

Good luck!

[Query]

You can keep adjusting fit with tape and moleskin. No reason your feet need to slip around inside the boot. You can also widen your boots in the ball. Or just take out the insole, to give yourself more space, then modify the rest with tape and moleskin. See my page.

If you are willing to do that kind of modification, it is better to start a little large than a little small, because leather stretching is temporary, and needs to be periodically redone. I don't think squeezing your feet to the extant they can't flatten enough is a good idea.

If you can find a good bootfitter, he/she can hep you do the modifications.

[Audryb]

Thanks tapping_skater, that's all good info. Good to know my foot issues are not unique. I'm thinking more and more that I should make a trip to the fitter in MD that has been recommended on this board part of my next drive up to NY.

Query - I have read your many posts about modifying skate fit, and have modified the heels of my skates quite a bit. I'll probably continue to experiment with them. Where do you get moleskin? I have stuck various things to the inside of my skates, including things that are meant to be stuck in the heels of shoes, but nothing seems to stay for very long. Some of the heel pads I tried are about 1/16" thick and still not enough... that would be a lot of tape! As far as stretching the ball of the skate, I just went and pulled the insole out and measured it. It's 3" wide at the widest point, a full 1/2" narrower than my foot! No wonder my feet feel squished. I suppose any amount of stretching is better than none, but I wonder how much it's actually possible to stretch them.

[Isk8NYC]

I called about my new skates and they should be arriving this weekend! Yay! And there's a threat of snow so everything will shut down... booo!

[Query]

Where do you get moleskin?

At drugstores - in the section where you find insoles and cures for athlete's foot.

At dollar stores! I'm not sure that is the same brand or quality, but it's cheap.

Art supply and crafts stores also stock adhesive sheets of felt, sometimes in the same section with leather and leather crafting supplies.

The leather section also sometimes has an industrial strength glue called Barge cement, which has been used to make shoes and boots. You might have to sand it off if you change your mind. Also, you might make a mistake and let a little dry on the outside of the padding. It doesn't claim it is safe to have next to the skin, unlike athletic tape and Moleskin, and I've been afraid to try it.

I keep meaning to experiment with the glue in hot melt glue guns, which you can also pick up at the dollar store. Other people have successfully used it to make insoles stick (because their insole diesn't fit the the boot well enough to stay still).

If the area to be filled is very near the insole, you could stick a piece of tape under the insole, so it won't rub off, and let it extend up to the desired area.

I don't get why most boot fitters won't do this sort of stuff, though a lot of them have tools to stretch leather. I know they make a bigger profit by selling you new custom boots, or high priced partially moldable insoles (e.g., Superfeet), but in a few minutes with a few pennies worth of supplies they could make a lot of customers happy. A lot of customers would stay and buy other stuff, and the boot fitter's reputation would spread.