Commom Skating Injuries

[rsk8d]

Hi!

At Sk8Strong we are constantly adding new articles about the most common injury or off-ice training topics. Can you share which injuries that you would like to have more information about, specifically related to skating? Also, is there a specific strength training or flexibility related topic you would like information about? We will try to include as many articles as possible!

[Kim to the Max]

Hi!

At Sk8Strong we are constantly adding new articles about the most common injury or off-ice training topics. Can you share which injuries that you would like to have more information about, specifically related to skating? Also, is there a specific strength training or flexibility related topic you would like information about? We will try to include as many articles as possible!

I think for me in terms of injury, sprains seem to be how I decide to hurt myself. Other than that it's common bruises and aches and pains generally. I've had some pretty good falls that have resulted in some pretty spectacular bruises :)

In terms of strength, I am looking for core strength to help with landings as well as just general skating. I am also looking for better jump height and quicker rotation. Anything that could help would be amazing!!

[ibreakhearts66]

I'd actually be really interested to hear a bit about chronic compartment syndrome. I had it in my right leg pretty badly--the muscle actually herniated through the fascial defect (at least I think this is what my doctor was saying--something like that) and put pressure on a nerve (peroneal nerve?). I had a fasciotomy which totally relieved the symptoms in that part of that leg, but I still get cramping/burning sensations in the front parts of my shin muscles.

Anyways, I know Tessa Virtue also had chronic compartment syndrome and I wonder if it might be a lot more common in the sport than people think.

[Query]

May I suggest this USFSA link:
http://www.usfsa.org/shell.asp?cat=3&id=3&sid=23566

And this from the ISU:
http://ww2.isu.org/medical/intro.html

My most serious skating injury - a broken fibula - occurred when I fell backwards in easy backwards skating. I fought the fall, and I hit very slowly. My theory is the break occurred before I hit, and maybe contributed to the fall.

My other skating injuries have mostly been along the lines of minor bruises and abrasions that come under the category of protective clothing, like gloves, long sleeves, and long pants. Other people use foam, and Pandora has suggested skaters should be bubble wrapped, on this forum.

My approach was to learn to fall - see my http://mgrunes.com/falling.html, where I cite a number of other medical references and injury prevention techniques.

I'm sure the approach you as a PT often use - strength training, and where applicable, flexibility training and limiting - is just as important. I only recently began to appreciate that insufficient strength might be a major limiting factor that prevented me from advancing in skating skills. Some coaches had indicated it wasn't likely to be the major factor at my level, but they maybe didn't fully understand how little strength an adult without childhood athletic training might have.

I would like to learn more about strength training, and athletic training in general. A lot of people with athletic backgrounds don't realize how little the rest of us know about proper athletic training techniques. There is a lot of information on the Internet, but we have trouble figuring out which of it is likely to be useful, and in some cases, which of it applies well to ourselves as individuals.

I realize I am asking for something more general than you have in mind, and some of it overlaps with what PTs, physical trainers, certified physical trainers and strength trainers do on a daily basis, so you might not want to provide it, but it could encompass stuff like:

Good warm-ups and cool-downs. Duration, exercises, etc.

How to tell which joints in our individual bodies are already flexible enough, which should be made more so, and which would be dangerous to make more so. Likewise for strength and endurance.

How to figure out which muscles, etc., limit our flexibility, strength, endurance, and how to stretch, strengthen and improve endurance of those particular muscles. How to tell if you are succeeding in exercising those particular muscles.

E.g., it only recently occurred to me to do what I guess all athletes learn young - to stretch where I want to be more flexible, then look for muscles that are taut. It showed me, with the help of another PT, that exercises that my hamstrings and quads are already long enough, and exercises aimed at stretching them were merely stretching my joint capsules, perhaps beyond what was needed, and putting tension on my psoas, gluts, and various hip flexor muscles; but since I wasn't using those muscles significantly, they weren't warm enough to stretch. I've been stretching for 25-30 years, using yoga-type stuff, but haven't made much progress because I didn't know what to do. Even worse, I tried to stretch after warming up in a a whirlpool bath at a local pool, which of warmed up (and prepared to stretch) everything, including my ligaments and joint capsules, which apparently isn't desirable.

I don't know how to determine whether deep muscle layers, which I can't normally feel, are under tension or being used. I have only the most basic ideas in this manner. The PT was able to feel some of my muscles with his hands as I used them, but that requires a second person, and knowledge.

How to practice athletic skills, as well as flexibility, strength and endurance exercises efficiently. That sounds basic, but "learning to learn skills" are something a lot of us without the right athletic backgrounds totally lack. How often to train, order of exercises so they don't interfere with each other, etc. How much to break down motion sequences, how to put them together for proper mastery and memorization, etc.

E.g., if you study music, one of the first things you learn is how to practice musical skills - e.g., if you mess up a musical sequence 100 times, then succeed once, you have to keep practicing the success, rather than stopping after the first success. How to break things down to short sequences, how to efficiently connect those sequences into longer ones, and still longer ones, etc. How to associate breaths and pauses with learned sequences. Some of that might carry over to athletic skills.

How to move in ways that place less stress on the joints. E.g., does it make sense to learn to walk, jog and run smoothly, so your feet don't impact hard as you strike the ground, in effect turning these normally high impact exercises into low impact ones. To what extant should we practice higher impact techniques for training? To what extant can we apply the same approaches to jumping, etc.?

Different approaches to injury prevention, and how to figure out which ones work for us as individuals. I tried taking a few courses along these lines, expecting to see recipes for avoid injuries, and discovered there are many contradictory approaches to the basic questions.

I asked before why you didn't have stuff like canned video routines which gave us canned sequences to mindlessly follow. You said individual differences were too large for that to work well. Nonetheless, stuff along those lines would be still be very useful.

How about a computer program that helps us select a given routine that meets our needs and preferences (including music), that is dumped to a configuration file, then displays a workout video assembled from canned segments tuned to our needs? If the software portion is beyond your computer skills, I would love to work with you on it.

[Skate@Delaware]

I would like to learn more about strength training, and athletic training in general. A lot of people with athletic backgrounds don't realize how little the rest of us know about proper athletic training techniques. There is a lot of information on the Internet, but we have trouble figuring out which of it is likely to be useful, and in some cases, which of it applies well to ourselves as individuals.

I realize I am asking for something more general than you have in mind, and some of it overlaps with what PTs, physical trainers, certified physical trainers and strength trainers do on a daily basis, so you might not want to provide it, but it could encompass stuff like:

Good warm-ups and cool-downs. Duration, exercises, etc.
~~~~snipped for brevity~~~~
I asked before why you didn't have stuff like canned video routines which gave us canned sequences to mindlessly follow. You said individual differences were too large for that to work well. Nonetheless, stuff along those lines would be still be very useful.

How about a computer program that helps us select a given routine that meets our needs and preferences (including music), that is dumped to a configuration file, then displays a workout video assembled from canned segments tuned to our needs? If the software portion is beyond your computer skills, I would love to work with you on it.
rsk8d's Adult Training DVD would fit your needs perfectly-I use it (in variety with my other training) and have found it an excellent tool for ANY adult at ANY level of fitness. I suggest you mosey on over to her website, look it over, check out the snips shown on youtube and take a chance. Follow it for 8 weeks and then let us know how it's going.
http://www.sk8strong.com/catalog/item/6311350/6526689.htm
When I was out-of-shape and had no core stability at all everything was cr*p with my skating. After a stint with pilates, then later some weight training, my core began to get into shape. Things got better. The core is the foundation for mostly everything. You must build that first, then the major muscles next. Her dvd's follow a logical progression and work what needs to be worked safely and efficiently.

In reality, unless you are going for something scientific or doing rehab, you don't need to work down to the minute detail concerning joints. Hit the core, work the major muscles and everything else is going to provide stabilization for that work. You don't need to work every small muscle group (unless you are going into figure competition and need that look ;)).

[liz_on_ice]

Hi!

At Sk8Strong we are constantly adding new articles about the most common injury or off-ice training topics. Can you share which injuries that you would like to have more information about, specifically related to skating? Also, is there a specific strength training or flexibility related topic you would like information about? We will try to include as many articles as possible!

My most serious injury is broken wrists - one each on two occasions. Prior to that it's been mostly bruises. Wrists are small and delicate (at least mine are - they look pretty dainty for all I'm very tall) would strength training provide much protection there?

I haven't injured myself this way, but am curious about maximal hip flexibility. I've heard some people can't stretch enough for a spread eagle no matter now long they try - there is a skeletal limit. How do you know when you've reached that limit so you don't hurt yourself trying for more? Does that apply to other stretches like the splits or Y spiral, or a deep layback?

[rsk8d]

Okay, lots of questions to answer. First, thank you to Skate@Delaware for the nice recommendation for Adult Training. It was nice meeting you at Liberty and I'm glad you like the training program!

To Kim to the Max regarding "In terms of strength, I am looking for core strength to help with landings as well as just general skating. I am also looking for better jump height and quicker rotation. Anything that could help would be amazing!!" : Visit our articles page www.sk8strong.com/articles.html. I have article called "What is Core Stability Training". I also have a plyometric training tips article that I have to add in there. We have a specific Core Stability DVD that is less expensive than the original four.

To ibreakhearts66 regarding "I'd actually be really interested to hear a bit about chronic compartment syndrome. This diagnosis is something that is not very common in skaters, and one that I've come across very seldom in patients who aren't runners. I'll check into if there is a history in skaters other than Tessa.

To liz_on_ice regarding "My most serious injury is broken wrists - one each on two occasions. Prior to that it's been mostly bruises. Wrists are small and delicate (at least mine are - they look pretty dainty for all I'm very tall) would strength training provide much protection there?

I haven't injured myself this way, but am curious about maximal hip flexibility. I've heard some people can't stretch enough for a spread eagle no matter now long they try - there is a skeletal limit. How do you know when you've reached that limit so you don't hurt yourself trying for more? Does that apply to other stretches like the splits or Y spiral, or a deep layback?

Strengthening exercises for your wrist extensors and flexors would only help to a certain degree. Fractures occur very easily there because the bones are very small and are more susceptible to breaking. Also, ligamentous injuries occur very easily due to the force of a fall on a small area. If you have a habit of falling on your wrists and sustaining injuries (such as a ligament sprain), I would recommend a splint or wrist-guard to prevent excessive motion to the wrist joints.

In regards to hip flexibility, yes there is a skeletal limit to the amount of rotation you can achieve in your hip to do a spread eagle. You can stretch the muscles to an extent, but the rotation can be affected by the way your hip joint sits in the socket and the mobility of the hip joint capsule. This is definately a topic that I will delve further into in a full article.

To Query, regarding How to tell which joints in our individual bodies are already flexible enough, which should be made more so, and which would be dangerous to make more so. Likewise for strength and endurance.

How to figure out which muscles, etc., limit our flexibility, strength, endurance, and how to stretch, strengthen and improve endurance of those particular muscles. How to tell if you are succeeding in exercising those particular muscles.: This is something that I am working on putting out a DVD about. It will help skaters, coaches, etc. learn basic tests to figure out their flexibility and strength deficits are sufficient. Then, they can apply the correct exercises to help improve upon their deficits. I'm glad you brought this up. Icoachskating.com has asked for something similar, so I am building on some ideas.

As for the computerized video routines you suggested, that is a great idea, but WAY beyond my capabilities! :)

Thanks to all for your feedback. Feel free to add more!

[ibreakhearts66]

To ibreakhearts66 regarding "I'd actually be really interested to hear a bit about chronic compartment syndrome. This diagnosis is something that is not very common in skaters, and one that I've come across very seldom in patients who aren't runners. I'll check into if there is a history in skaters other than Tessa.

Sorry, I probably didn't phrase what I was trying to say well. I guess more what I'm trying to say is that I wonder if chronic compartment syndrome DOES exist more in the sport, but just doesn't go diagnosed. I was "lucky" that it progressed as far as it did so that I had a physical bulge where the muscle herniated, otherwise I wouldn't be surprised if a doctor just said I needed to stretch more or strengthen more or whatever. It seems like the actions of skating coupled with stiff boots could definitely cause this problem. I wrote to Mr. Edge about this a while back, and he published a column (http://www.usfigureskating.org/Magazine.asp?id=55&issue=42004)on it in the October 2008 issue of Skating magazine. Perhaps you could put together even a small pamphlet similar to that but with that includes your knowledge of medicine, the body and the sport? It might be a waste of your resources, but I just feel like chronic compartment syndrome might be something more skaters have than anyone (including themselves) realizes.

To Query, regarding How to tell which joints in our individual bodies are already flexible enough, which should be made more so, and which would be dangerous to make more so. Likewise for strength and endurance.

How to figure out which muscles, etc., limit our flexibility, strength, endurance, and how to stretch, strengthen and improve endurance of those particular muscles. How to tell if you are succeeding in exercising those particular muscles.: This is something that I am working on putting out a DVD about. It will help skaters, coaches, etc. learn basic tests to figure out their flexibility and strength deficits are sufficient. Then, they can apply the correct exercises to help improve upon their deficits. I'm glad you brought this up. Icoachskating.com has asked for something similar, so I am building on some ideas.



Just wanted to say that I would LOVE information on everything mentioned.

[BuggieMom]

I would be interested in information on how to prevent the problems that occur later in life as a result of skating. Our family doctor told me to expect my dd to have knee and hip problems, possibly needing replacement surgery at a very young age, like 30's. Now, I think he was being a bit extreme in that particular example, but I know there is a high probability of her developing joint problems later in life. I would like to know, as a parent, what I can have her do now to prevent that, even down to suppliments and such. When I asked our doc how to avoid it, he told me "quit skating"...not very helpful!

[Skate@Delaware]

I'm wondering if the increase in knee/hip injuries are due to the number of high level jumps being performed by younger skaters, especially before their bodies have developed sufficiently to handle the stresses. Not necessarily a boot problem but really a factor of cumulative conditions. I do think that perhaps having too-stiff boots does contribute somewhat (i.e. underdeveloped muscles of the feet can't support properly leads to overcompensation in other areas).

There are days when I feel that my boots just feel too big and clunky (they are Jackson Elites) and they feel as though they are getting in the way.

My question would be: comparing historically the average ages of skaters/boots/jumps/types of injuries between now and about 30-40 years ago-is there an increase today and what is a contributing factor? I do think that this would be too big a task, not sure if any study like this has ever been done (maybe up at U of Delaware?)

[SkatEn]

A bit late, and this isn't particularly about injuries.

Sometimes I get this "cramp" feeling in my arch. It isn't really a cramp, just really painful feeling. I do have arch supports that work most times. Could it be a strength thing?

Speaking of strength, many skaters and coaches advocate ankle strengthening as the substitute to getting stiff boots. What are the ankle-exercises for skating and how will one know if the ankle is strong enough?

Lace-bite - I know it is about the skate pressing against the shin, but are there any strengthening/stretching that could alleviate the symptoms?

[tazsk8s]

I'm wondering if the increase in knee/hip injuries are due to the number of high level jumps being performed by younger skaters, especially before their bodies have developed sufficiently to handle the stresses.

To kind of add to that, I wonder if there is an increase in back injuries among young skaters in the last few years, since IJS came about. What I am seeing at my rink is, basically every kid at the rink trying to yank a skate over their head in spins and/or spirals, whether they ought to be or not. I'm not just talking about IJS levels either...pretty much all the pre-pre's are doing some attempt at a catchfoot or Bielmann in their programs even though their basic spins such as sit and camel are still in a very basic stage. And Basic Skills kids just learning their first spirals...saw a few of them playing with blade grabbing as well.

My daughter gave up skating at age 14 right before IJS invaded the lower levels (i.e. Juv. and Int.). She was Int. at the time and her coach was trying to get her to at least add a "haircutter" to her layback, which was decent under Dick Button's standards but would have still been a level 1 under IJS. We've had her in and out of physical therapy for back issues ever since. So I'd be curious to know if this has been studied at any point.

[Query]

Sometimes I get this "cramp" feeling in my arch...

I'm not a PT like the OP. But if you feel you need to use any muscles in or around the foot to stay balanced while skating on one foot, it might be because the shape of the inside of your boot does not match the shape of your foot. I used to have to use muscles on one side of the leg to stay balanced, because there was less pressure under one side, and that used to hurt a lot. Likewise, you may be using muscles to hold your arch up, or maybe the insole shape pushes your arch up too much. In principle, excess pressure on a small spot can cause pain too. A good rule of thumb for most people is that you want all portions of the foot below the ankle to feel equal pressure from the boot. People disagree about pressure at or above the ankle (you have to be able to flex your foot forward and back to skate, and you have to be able to bend it a little side to side if you love deep edges, so some people like having extra space, even if it cuts boot lifetime), but you certainly don't want excess pressure anywhere. Except the sides and front of the toes, which probably should not have any pressure at all, because various sources say pressure there gradually reshapes them in unhealthy ways, or produces corns or foot sores. I've a sub-page on reshaping the inside of a boot to fit.

However, a foot doctor would disagree with what I just said, if you need excess pressure on some parts of your foot to keep an internal joint, muscle or ligament in a safe position. They are the acknowledged experts about individual medical needs, so if a doctor says so, it's probably right, at least for you.

I'm not sure if this applies to feet, but when I jam myself inside a kayak that doesn't leave any room to move around, I can develop cramps in my legs and hips from not moving around. Maybe you could test the hypothesis that your feet need to move to be happy by periodically taking off your boots, and flexing and moving your foot around. If that works, it might or might not prove anything, because removing your boots could fix borderline problems of other types too. In any event, I don't see what you could do about cramps from insufficient motion, other than that periodic exercise.

[Query]

(Duplicate post)

[Query]

As for the computerized video routines you suggested, that is a great idea, but WAY beyond my capabilities! :)

You could give me a list of multiple choice questions to ask, a set of videos to incorporate, and state which videos should be incorporated in what sequence, based on the answer to the questions, and I'd try to write it. E.g., a set of rules like "If answer to question 1 is A and question 2 is B, show the first 200 seconds of 'pushup.wma'". If you are interested, let's take this off-line. You have my email from when I bought some videos and a book from you.

I'm not sure how to deal with the music rights. We could do it without music. The product would be more appealing if it had the option of music, perhaps several different music choices, but it does make it harder to sync everything together. The videos would have to be at the same tempo, and one would probably have to buy rights to the music, from composers, arrangers, and performers. (You could also look for free performances of uncopyrighted music on the WWW.) You probably want music with very strongly emphasized main beats, extremely even tempos, and very simple 8/16 bar phrasing, because a lot of people aren't real sophisticated about moving to music. E.g., dance music (but latin dance music is syncopated, so some people couldn't use it), or music performances designed for exercise, like the ice dance recordings, though everyone here has heard the ice dance music too many times.

With a little work, we could have 2 or 3 tempos of each video sequence possible. If more than one musical choice exists, they would have to have about the same tempos (tempos are adjustable by fancy software), and the same number of beats/measure.

It would involve some work from both of us, including a lot of work from you. Depending on how much I would have to do, I'd either do it in exchange for a free copy, and the right to put it on my resume, or ask for a cut. e.g., I don't know much about copy protection, nor have I ever tried to write software that would run on a Mac, DVD player, cell phone or PDA instead of a windows PC, so trying to do either would involve a lot of work for me. I'm neither knowledgeable nor photogenic enough to provide any of the video sequences myself. You might need someone to video you going through the moving exercises.

Perhaps it is impossible to do a good enough job without an individual medical diagnosis. I can't address that issue, but maybe you could.

[rsk8d]

A bit late, and this isn't particularly about injuries.

Sometimes I get this "cramp" feeling in my arch. It isn't really a cramp, just really painful feeling. I do have arch supports that work most times. Could it be a strength thing?

Speaking of strength, many skaters and coaches advocate ankle strengthening as the substitute to getting stiff boots. What are the ankle-exercises for skating and how will one know if the ankle is strong enough?

Lace-bite - I know it is about the skate pressing against the shin, but are there any strengthening/stretching that could alleviate the symptoms?

A cramp in the arch can come from various factors- skates being too narrow or wide, the arch not appropriate for your foot type. I wouldn't say it's a lack of strength. It is the plantar fascia on the bottom of the foot that cramps, and it's not necessary something that you strengthen, but something you stretch or massage to help reduce the cramping. Also helpful is rolling the bottom of your foot on a tennis ball to reduce tension.

Ankle strengthening is not a substitute for getting stiff boots. It is always recommended to skaters to strengthen their ankle muscles, but not used as a substitute. There are various ways to strengthen the muscles around the ankle, using resistance bands, balancing on various unstable surfaces (1/2 foam roll, dynadisc, balance board), etc. A lot of the exercises I incorporate into our programs involve single leg stance on something to challenge your balance, therefore you are making a hamstring or a quad exercises into an ankle strengthening exercise as well.

Can't help with the lace bite- wish I could, because I had it myself at one point!

[rsk8d]

I would be interested in information on how to prevent the problems that occur later in life as a result of skating. Our family doctor told me to expect my dd to have knee and hip problems, possibly needing replacement surgery at a very young age, like 30's. Now, I think he was being a bit extreme in that particular example, but I know there is a high probability of her developing joint problems later in life. I would like to know, as a parent, what I can have her do now to prevent that, even down to suppliments and such. When I asked our doc how to avoid it, he told me "quit skating"...not very helpful!

Definately an article worth digging deeper into. The doctor was exaggerating QUITE a bit when regarding the age of knee replacement. They rarely do TKRs under the age of 50! To prevent such injuries, it is VERY important to do consistent flexibility and strength training to create a balance (and that is the KEY word) of strength and flexibility at each joint. Off-ice training is not just to improve your skating skills, it is to keep a skater healthy and injury free. My skaters all have a very low rate of injury compared to skaters who do not do off-ice, because of the balance of strength and flexibility they have developed. It is also important to be using proper equipment, evaluate the need for arch supports in the shoes and skates, have the blades mounted properly, and get new skates when they break down. Improper equipment can lead to compensations or overuse in certain muscle groups.

At some point I will tackle this topic in more depth.....

To tazsk8s and skate@delaware, I don't think we will see statistics about increase of injuries due to IJS for several years. I myself limit the number of laybacks and biellmans that my skaters do, and if a skater lacks flexibility in certain areas (lower back, hip flexors) I let their coach know what they physically can and cannot do. So these skaters with poor flexibility don't even attempt a biellman, avoiding a possible stress fracture or other injury in the future.

[Morgail]

Tendinitis! It isn't the most serious injury I've had from skating, but it's the most nagging and frustrating. It think it's fairly common among skaters, too.


Sometimes I get this "cramp" feeling in my arch. It isn't really a cramp, just really painful feeling. I do have arch supports that work most times. Could it be a strength thing?


I used to get this a lot, and still get it when my feet are swollen. I solved it in the beginning by taking out the lining in the bottom of the boots to give my feet more room.

I would be interested in information on how to prevent the problems that occur later in life as a result of skating.

I think this would be really interesting, and it would be useful to parents. Newer skating parents, especially, may not be aware of what sorts of problems may exist down the road for their child if they aren't proactive about off-ice training, rest periods, etc.

[Skate@Delaware]

You could give me a list of multiple choice questions to ask, a set of videos to incorporate, and state which videos should be incorporated in what sequence, based on the answer to the questions, and I'd try to write it. E.g., a set of rules like "If answer to question 1 is A and question 2 is B, show the first 200 seconds of 'pushup.wma'". If you are interested, let's take this off-line. You have my email from when I bought some videos and a book from you.

I'm not sure how to deal with the music rights. We could do it without music. The product would be more appealing if it had the option of music, perhaps several different music choices, but it does make it harder to sync everything together. The videos would have to be at the same tempo, and one would probably have to buy rights to the music, from composers, arrangers, and performers. (You could also look for free performances of uncopyrighted music on the WWW.) (http://WWW.%29) You probably want music with very strongly emphasized main beats, extremely even tempos, and very simple 8/16 bar phrasing, because a lot of people aren't real sophisticated about moving to music. E.g., dance music (but latin dance music is syncopated, so some people couldn't use it), or music performances designed for exercise, like the ice dance recordings, though everyone here has heard the ice dance music too many times.

With a little work, we could have 2 or 3 tempos of each video sequence possible. If more than one musical choice exists, they would have to have about the same tempos (tempos are adjustable by fancy software), and the same number of beats/measure.

It would involve some work from both of us, including a lot of work from you. Depending on how much I would have to do, I'd either do it in exchange for a free copy, and the right to put it on my resume, or ask for a cut. e.g., I don't know much about copy protection, nor have I ever tried to write software that would run on a Mac, DVD player, cell phone or PDA instead of a windows PC, so trying to do either would involve a lot of work for me. I'm neither knowledgeable nor photogenic enough to provide any of the video sequences myself. You might need someone to video you going through the moving exercises.

Perhaps it is impossible to do a good enough job without an individual medical diagnosis. I can't address that issue, but maybe you could.
There is an iPod app called iFitness where you can build a workout. It's pretty good, you can also watch video demos of the exercises as well. It's not perfect but it does work for a "build-you-own" type of workout that you suggest. As for music, I prefer using my own, as do most of the people i work out with. I also switch up my workouts every 4-6 weeks, just to keep my workouts interesting, and to keep my muscles in shape.

[Kat12]

I'd like to know more about flexibility as well. Especially...I suppose it'd be hip flexibility? I find that my problem with spirals and such doesn't seem to be my legs (if I lean forward I can get my leg higher) or my back (I can bend my back pretty well), it's the two in combination as for a spiral...would that be my hips?

[londonicechamp]

Hi Kat12

I may have similar problem as you. I can actually do my spirals alright, but according to my coach, my leg is a bit low but not that bad, though it tends to bend more when I am doing the spiral. My coach tried teaching me the camel spin once, but she said that my leg was not strong enough yet, so she gave up teaching that spin to me, for that time being.

Well, I do not often have skating injuries. The most serious one I had was the fall last Friday, when I was trying to get down low doing the sit spin, during my private lesson. Somewhat, my right foot blade caught the ice (at least that was what I thought has happened), I fell down diving forwards. Was wearing long tracksuit pants, but still the fall resulted in very red, bruised and minor cuts (not deep though).

As I just started practising sit spin last week, as my coach just taught that to me last week, I fell down loads (over 5 times) practising it. Ended up with a sore hip the day after.

One of my friends in the UK suggested that although I love skating so much, I should not be doing it more than 1.5 hours each time I go skating, (as I tend to do two hours or more), as I am more prone to knee joint problems into my 50s or so. Does anyone have any medical proof on this? Thanks.

londonicechamp

[rsk8d]

I'd like to know more about flexibility as well. Especially...I suppose it'd be hip flexibility? I find that my problem with spirals and such doesn't seem to be my legs (if I lean forward I can get my leg higher) or my back (I can bend my back pretty well), it's the two in combination as for a spiral...would that be my hips?

To achieve a good spiral position, you need to have flexibility from your hamstrings, psoas (hip flexor), and adductors (inner thigh). The lower back has some effect on the position, but not as much as the hips. If you don't have tremendous mobility in your hips, you can make the spiral more appealing and create a better line by working on your back posture. This includes arching the lower back and squeezing your shoulder blades together toward your spine.

Strength comes into play when holding the leg up. Contracting your gluts muscles will help to loft the leg and increase endurance of a spiral.

To avoid bending of the knee in the spiral, point your toes in your skate.

One of my friends in the UK suggested that although I love skating so much, I should not be doing it more than 1.5 hours each time I go skating, (as I tend to do two hours or more), as I am more prone to knee joint problems into my 50s or so. Does anyone have any medical proof on this? Thanks.

I don't know of any research has been done on this. Yes, everyone is prone to more knee problems as they get older, but it depends on your own and family medical history of knee troubles, your strength and flexibility, what you're doing on the ice, and use of proper equipment. At age 50 would I practice sit spins over and over? Probably not, but there is nothing to say you can't practice them. I would limit them to a few a session if they give you knee troubles.

[Skate@Delaware]

I don't know of any research has been done on this. Yes, everyone is prone to more knee problems as they get older, but it depends on your own and family medical history of knee troubles, your strength and flexibility, what you're doing on the ice, and use of proper equipment. At age 50 would I practice sit spins over and over? Probably not, but there is nothing to say you can't practice them. I would limit them to a few a session if they give you knee troubles.
One of my skating friends has a bum knee and limits her jumps & spins to just a few at each session. She is in her upper 40's like me and trying to keep her knees intact for a few years more!

[Kat12]

I suspect it may be psoas? Though it seems from my psoas stretch that my quads are also pretty tight (or at least I read somewhere that if you really feel the stretch in your quads, it means they're tight). Grr. I don't think it would be my adductors (though I'm sure everything could be improved) as my turnout is not-bad.

If it helps, after really "pushing" spirals, it feels sore in my bum--during it feels like there's something running from my lower back through my butt that is pulling.

[rsk8d]

Thanks to everyone and their great requests. We will start working on them soon! Happy holidays to everyone and feel free to use the promo code 'holiday09' until New Years for a 15% discount (plus free shipping) at www.sk8strong.com :)

[rsk8d]

I have added a new article per your request! :)

http://www.sk8strong.com/articles/article/6311334/135979.htm

[sdfigureskater]

A bit late, and this isn't particularly about injuries.

Sometimes I get this "cramp" feeling in my arch. It isn't really a cramp, just really painful feeling. I do have arch supports that work most times. Could it be a strength thing?

Speaking of strength, many skaters and coaches advocate ankle strengthening as the substitute to getting stiff boots. What are the ankle-exercises for skating and how will one know if the ankle is strong enough?

Lace-bite - I know it is about the skate pressing against the shin, but are there any strengthening/stretching that could alleviate the symptoms?
I used to get a horrible pain in my arches after being on the ice for about 10-15 minutes. I had to get off and remove my skates and wait for the pain to subside. I found out after doing some research that I just needed an orthodic! A company called "Superfeet" makes one that is just for figure skates...cost is about 35 dollars. I started using them in my skates and the pain vanished... I mean it was gone gone gone :) Thank goodness is all I can say, because that pain was no fun!

[rsk8d]

SUPERFEET are great!! I recommend them to the majority of my patients and skaters who don't want or need to go the route of custom orthotics. They can be trimmed down by an experienced boot fitter to fit in the skate correctly. Love them!

[rsk8d]

I will post an article on how to test your psoas (hip flexor) and hamstring flexibilty in a few days at www.sk8strong.com/articles.html

[Query]

Here is another category of common skating injuries:

Bruised Egos.

Is there a cure?

[rsk8d]

Okay, I had time to add it now. Here is the link:

http://www.sk8strong.com/articles/article/6311334/138458.htm

[doubletoe]

Great stuff, Rsk8d! Keep it coming! :bow:

[mdvask8r]

Here is another category of common skating injuries:

Bruised Egos.

Is there a cure?
Yes. Determination and a huge sense of humor.

[mdvask8r]

Great article. Thanks for posting.

According to these tests I have pretty good flexibility in both these areas. My problem is strength in the hamstring.

[rsk8d]

Thanks!

Remember that a tight psoas muscle affects a lot of things, including the reach back for toe pick jumps. High leg kicks are a direct result of psoas tightness.

mdvask8r: if you haven't learned in our programs yet, hamstring strength can be gained by single leg bridge and single leg dead lift progressions, not just from hamstring curls with free weights or a machine. We have some cool exercises to the work the muscle eccentrically.

[rsk8d]

Here's a new article for you guys; you should llike this one! It's not specifically about an injury, but about strengthening an important muscle that will prevent injury and improve skating technique. Enjoy!

http://www.sk8strong.com/articles/article/6311334/140252.htm

[Query]

I have a theory that makes sense - but I wonder if any of you guys can confirm it.

My theory is that one should consider the flexibility positions one actually needs to do what one wants, and only stretch each of the components, be they muscles, ligaments, or joint capsules, to the extant they are needed for those positions.

My theory is that you want all the components that can to simultaneously limit your motion at the extreme. E.g., if your ligaments and joint capsules are more flexible around some joint than certain muscles, the entire tension of a stretch, including accidental motions, occurs on those muscles, and they are more likely to strain (over-stretch), or tear apart, or avulse (separate in the bone) from where they are mounted.

As an example, a Yoga class may encourage you to stretch everything to the extant that it can. E.g., in addition to straight leg stretches one might actually need, one does fully bent knee stretches. The bent knee position tends to release the tension on a large family of muscles, so one is mostly stretching ligaments and joint capsules, making the muscles more vulnerable in straight leg stretches. I think this is bad.

E.g., If all you want is a straight leg split, don't practice stretching into straddle splits. If you want to be able to bend forward or back with straight legs, don't stretch forward or back with bent legs - and forget fetal position stretches. Etc.

Does this make sense to people?

BTW, I've had a lot of muscle strains. I did Yoga-style stretches for over a couple decades. My muscles aren't very flexible (probably because I wasn't using certain ones, like the psoas and gluts, so those never warmed up enough to stretch), but with bent limbs, my joints are fairly flexible. So by my theory, I did everything wrong.

I've also had a lot of ankle sprains or strains - I never had them diagnosed to determine what was over-stretched. But I have little ankle and foot flexibility, even with bent knees and hips, so I guess muscles aren't the limiting factor - though foot anatomy is so complicated I'm not sure of that. I wonder if there is something I've done that has over-stretched the muscles, but didn't stretch other components. (It's too soft a limit to be a bone shape limit.)

[Skittl1321]

I'm not sure only stretching/working the muscles you need is a good idea.

I'm going through intense physical therapy right now because weakness/inflexibility in muscles I didn't know existed are causing huge problems with my knees and hips. I've developed strength and flexibility in the muscles around them, and that causes pulling and strain.

[Query]

I'm not sure only stretching/working the muscles you need is a good idea...

But "stretching" and "working" aren't the same thing.

My problem - and perhaps yours - is that we were effectively trying to stretch muscles that we weren't working first, which is ineffective. Warm muscle is more plastic (deforms permanently) than cold muscle.

I get that you should strengthen most muscles, though we have both found out that is much harder to do for muscles we aren't aware of. Our bodies have so many different muscles whose functions overlap, that it is easy to get in the habit of not using some of them, without being consciously aware of it.

But stretching muscles is separate from working them. In your case, it seems to me that if you continue to stretch the muscles adjacent to the ones that are having the problem, that just puts more stress on the muscles with the problem. I would claim the best way to deal with your problem muscles is to selectively stretch them, and not the adjacent muscles.

The only practical way to stretch one set of muscles within a group of adjoining muscles selectively, is to warm them up more than the others before stretching, by selectively working them. All the books say you should do a general gradual warm-up of all muscles and joints before stretching, so you don't hurt yourself. Fine - but you can still consciously work the ones you want to stretch more.

Trainers often tell people to use PNF stretching now: they selectively tire out the muscle a stretch is fighting just before stretching it, so it can't resist the stretch. But I figure it also warms the muscle up so it is better able to stretch. (PNF IS dangerous if you take it too far, because the muscle can't fight being over-stretched, which is a desirable instinctive reflex, but the technique is effective.)

So I try to figure out what muscles are limiting my movement, by looking for tension when I try a short trial stretch, and then specifically work them, before doing the real stretch.

This is complicated by the fact that deep muscles (those not next to the skin) produce no sensation, unless they are overworked and made sore - so most of us don't realize they exist, or that we aren't using them. I have no idea how to solve that problem. E.g., how can I make use of my deeper glut and lower back muscles, if I can't feel them?

Anyway, this is all way off-topic from my claim, effectively that Yoga can be evil, and that one shouldn't even TRY to do the stretches you don't need.

[londonicechamp]

Well, bruises are quite common for me at the beginning. Now that I just get sored bums, rather than bruised bums, mainly due to me trying to get down lower on my sit spin.

londonicechamp

[xtenshix]

During public session on monday, after my basic 5 lesson, i was practicing backward crossovers. I managed to click my blades resulting in ramming the heel end of my blade into the back of my thigh:!: when i fell. >< Theres no visible bruising but it hurts when i bend my leg to sit on it, going up steps, and get on my bed to lie down. once i get into the desired position its fine. I've been icing it.