wishing for the bubble wrap skating outfit

[liz_on_ice]

Survey time, folks...

I'm looking for courage to get back on the ice, I don't think I can take yet another broken wrist. I don't want to think what will happen if I break them with the plates in 8O

I wore rollerblade wrist guards for a while when I started skating seriously, I never fell on them and eventually got over the fear :roll:

I've heard a theory that wrist braces can be bad because they will transfer the shock further up your arm for a worse break. I'd think the plastic bump would help distribute the shock around - and also help you slide if the ice is rough.

I will, of course, be talking to my orthopedist, but I'm looking for as much info as I can get. So, if you don't mind...

Do you wear any kind of protective gear for skating?

What kind (s) (helmet, kneepads, wrist guards, crash shorts, etc)?

If you compete, do you wear any protective gear for competition?

If so, do you explain anything to the judges (my Dr. requires it)?

Have you badly damaged something despite (or even because of) protective gear you were wearing?

(optional) What age group are you in?

[Pandora]

Do you wear any kind of protective gear for skating? Yes, the bubblewrap, of course....Pop.Pop.Pop.:D

What kind (s) (helmet, kneepads, wrist guards, crash shorts, etc)? On knees and elbows. Sometimes wear crash shorts (not bubblewrap). Got them from an on-line store.

If you compete, do you wear any protective gear for competition? :roll:

If so, do you explain anything to the judges (my Dr. requires it)?:roll:

Have you badly damaged something despite (or even because of) protective gear you were wearing? No. No injuries on ice or roller. (And I am a jumping bean!);) Love bubblewrap!:D

(optional) What age group are you in? 40-50

[liz_on_ice]

Forgot to include this link - careful, might be TMI for the squeamish

http://www.ski-injury.com/prevention/wrist_guards

[tazsk8s]

Liz, I've been wearing the Flexmeter wrist guards which are shown a little further down the page that you linked to, since coming back from my own broken wrist. They have a couple models, I have their "All Season" variety. http://www.snowboardsecrets.com/flexmeter_all_season_order_page.htm

Pricey, but worth it for me. The plastic part on the top of the guard (only one I've ever seen that has that) helps dissipate the force and keep your wrist from over-extending. They say it's kind of a seat-belt effect and after taking a couple of good spills while wearing them I see what they mean. They also have the plastic bump you mention on your Rollerblade guards as well as some wrist protection on the bottom side of the guard. Showed them to my doctor before getting back on the ice and he was happy with them. So far, so good. I don't even feel it when I fall (at least not on the wrist, and my rear-end is padded well-enough all on its own. :))

I was very happy with their customer service, I had a question about sizing and they replied right away, on a weekend even, and sent a follow-up email later to see how I was liking them.

Haven't been testing or competing since getting back on the ice, so judges have been a non-issue for me so far. I can't imagine that any judge would mind if you wore something like that though (they're rather "obvious", but so are some of the knee braces you see some of the kids wearing and the judges don't question those). Oh, and I'm 43.

[liz_on_ice]

Liz, I've been wearing the Flexmeter wrist guards which are shown a little further down the page that you linked to, since coming back from my own broken wrist. They have a couple models, I have their "All Season" variety. http://www.snowboardsecrets.com/flexmeter_all_season_order_page.htm



those certainly look like they'll do the job :)

There's also the ultracrash hand pads. I love my gel kneepads, I've landed hard on both knees and it's like landing on pillows. Not sure it is enough to prevent breaking bones. Anyone have experience with them?

http://proshop.iceskatingworld.com/proshop/product.cfm?prod=138

[Skate@Delaware]

Do you wear any kind of protective gear for skating? What kind (s) (helmet, kneepads, wrist guards, crash shorts, etc)?
Yes, Crash pads (www.skatingsafe.com)

If you compete, do you wear any protective gear for competition?
Yes, I did once, my coach doesn't care if I do or not.
If so, do you explain anything to the judges (my Dr. requires it)?
No, I haven't seen any requirement that stated whether I have to (I compete ISI).
Have you badly damaged something despite (or even because of) protective gear you were wearing?
I took a very nasty fall on my hip and was bruised for two months despite wearing my crash pads...I even had to feel my hip to be sure that I was wearing them the fall hurt so bad. Ended up going 3x weekly to the chiro for several weeks it knocked me so bad!
(optional) What age group are you in?
I will be 48 in February

[flo]

One year I made my Halloween costume from bubble wrap. I had a vest, a skirt, and a headband. I also had fragile and handle with care stickers on me. It was for a skating party.

[Query]

Do you wear any kind of protective gear for skating?

Yes. I once scratched an elbow on a fall, but didn't know it, so I didn't wash the elbow. It became infected, so I now always wear long sleeve shirts or jackets, and long pants, and gloves, for abrasion resistance. Shock resistance I mostly don't need because I do fall practice.

I once broke a leg (fibula) during a fall. It healed in 6 months, but I couldn't get over the psychological effects for another 12. In fact, I didn't start skating again until I had spent 1500-2000 hours in deliberate fall practice. That was overkill, but do believe fall practice makes sense.

Since then - it's over 10 years or so - I've had only 2 serious injuries (the infected elbow, and a muscle sprain on fall while skiing backwards). I've also had one minor bruise (roller blading), and one scratched a hand (I wasn't wearing gloves). Oh yes, a minor ankle sprain whose effects lasted a few days, from off-ice dance. I attribute my much lessened injury rate to fall practice. I'm known on this board for advocating fall practice (http://mgrunes.com/falling.html) to prevent injuries.

As for wrist injuries, let me explain, as I explained at that link, how I think they happen. When most people lose balance, they go through a sequence of actions to recover it. They

(1) bend the knees, which drops the center of gravity

(2) thrust arms towards the direction of fall. In the case of a forwards or forward/sideways fall, your arms thrust forwards. Usually the palm also thrusts outwards, so the wrist cocks back. The body is usually briefly pushed back into balance by this thrust.

(3) take a step in the direction of fall, which places the center of mass over the base of support - so they keep that balance.

This procedure usually works very well. So well that we don't practice falling enough as we move towards adulthood, and sometimes become injured when we do.

Most adults and some kids freeze in fear when they fall, and the muscles go stiff. I.E., we activate the stabilizing muscles, which mostly means the ones close to the skin - and they press down on deeper muscle and tissue layers, creating friction, and stopping motion.

Both the straight arm and the cocked wrist are dangerous positions, which can lead to broken arms and wrists, dislocated shoulders, and damaged cartilage.

It is better, if you fail to recover balance, to either

(1) continue the arm motion, so that your hands and arms go over your head (caution: may damage people who have limited shoulder range of motion, such as often occurs after a shoulder injury), and they merely skim the surface rather than take much impact

or

(2) relax and let the arms fall, and tuck and roll, preferably over one shoulder and hip, or perhaps a sideways roll - see that link.

You can get over the fear through continuing practice. You can also improve your reaction times that way, and turn the new learned response into a reflex. Reaction time is very important - most people are too slow to be safe without it, which is too slow. If you play with one of those machines that tests reaction speed, most people can get it down to .2 - .3 seconds, with a little practice, and perhaps faster with a lot of practice.

Some of us get over the fear so well we start doing really stupid things, and can get hurt again. Such is life.

What kind (s) (helmet, kneepads, wrist guards, crash shorts, etc)?

As stated above, long sleeves, long pants, gloves, for abrasion protection.

But if I weren't confident, I would wear shock protection padding of some sort. For non-competitive practice, there is nothing wrong with full hockey gear! I suppose judges might not consider that "appropriate" figure skating apparel.

If I could jump higher, or had serious osteoporosis [sp?], I would consider wear padding. A lot of skaters I know put cut up computer mouse pads under their clothing, and I see nothing wrong with full hockey gear, though figure skating judges might disagree.

I've been trying to use strength training to jump higher, and such, so I'll think about padding - but probably not. My reactions are now fast enough not to bruise or break myself on ice anymore (I like to think).

Hockey coaches have told me people still break bones if they freeze in fear, even with full hockey gear.

If you compete, do you wear any protective gear for competition?
If so, do you explain anything to the judges (my Dr. requires it)?


I don't compete.

Have you badly damaged something despite (or even because of) protective gear you were wearing?

As stated above, I scratched an elbow, and scratched a hand. The bruise occurred with full roller blading protective gear. I froze in fear again, because I had never fallen on asphalt at high speed before, and my didn't roll through my hip. The bruise lasted a couple weeks. I was wearing long sleeves and pants and gloves during the ski muscle sprain - for cold rather than abrasion resistance.

In fairness, I would never have dared to do the backwards trick skiing, the roller blading, or the dance thing without having done fall practice, and the scraped elbow occurred because I got so cocky I didn't bother with the long sleeves, so all the injuries since beginning fall practice can be attributed to the confidence fall practice created. :lol: But none of those have been all that serious. Anyway, you continue to skate despite injuries, so maybe it wouldn't have that effect on you - you already have the confidence to do crazy things. (No offence intended.)

(optional) What age group are you in?

I was 38 or 39 when I broke my leg, I'm 52 now.

[RachelSk8er]

I've never worn any protective gear, not even as a little kid back in the 80s when I was in learn-to-skate (parents weren't as protective then, now all the kids have helmets and stuff).

I've had plenty of bumps and bruises from figure skating, 2 concussions (one at 12 and one at 26), stitches in my shin from synchro, but never anything serious. Most serious injury came from another sport.

I'm 28.

[liz_on_ice]

Do you wear any kind of protective gear for skating?

Yes. I once scratched an elbow on a fall, but didn't know it, so I didn't wash the elbow. It became infected, so I now always wear long sleeve shirts or jackets, and long pants, and gloves, for abrasion resistance. Shock resistance I mostly don't need because I do fall practice.

I once broke a leg (fibula) during a fall. It healed in 6 months, but I couldn't get over the psychological effects for another 12. In fact, I didn't start skating again until I had spent 1500-2000 hours in deliberate fall practice. That was overkill, but do believe fall practice makes sense.

Since then - it's over 10 years or so - I've had only 2 serious injuries (the infected elbow, and a muscle sprain on fall while skiing backwards). I've also had one minor bruise (roller blading), and one scratched a hand (I wasn't wearing gloves). Oh yes, a minor ankle sprain whose effects lasted a few days, from off-ice dance. I attribute my much lessened injury rate to fall practice. I'm known on this board for advocating fall practice (http://mgrunes.com/falling.html) to prevent injuries.

As for wrist injuries, let me explain, as I explained at that link, how I think they happen. When most people lose balance, they go through a sequence of actions to recover it. They

(1) bend the knees, which drops the center of gravity

(2) thrust arms towards the direction of fall. In the case of a forwards or forward/sideways fall, your arms thrust forwards. Usually the palm also thrusts outwards, so the wrist cocks back. The body is usually briefly pushed back into balance by this thrust.

(3) take a step in the direction of fall, which places the center of mass over the base of support - so they keep that balance.

This procedure usually works very well. So well that we don't practice falling enough as we move towards adulthood, and sometimes become injured when we do.

Most adults and some kids freeze in fear when they fall, and the muscles go stiff. I.E., we activate the stabilizing muscles, which mostly means the ones close to the skin - and they press down on deeper muscle and tissue layers, creating friction, and stopping motion.

Both the straight arm and the cocked wrist are dangerous positions, which can lead to broken arms and wrists, dislocated shoulders, and damaged cartilage.

It is better, if you fail to recover balance, to either

(1) continue the arm motion, so that your hands and arms go over your head (caution: may damage people who have limited shoulder range of motion, such as often occurs after a shoulder injury), and they merely skim the surface rather than take much impact

or

(2) relax and let the arms fall, and tuck and roll, preferably over one shoulder and hip, or perhaps a sideways roll - see that link.

You can get over the fear through continuing practice. You can also improve your reaction times that way, and turn the new learned response into a reflex. Reaction time is very important - most people are too slow to be safe without it, which is too slow. If you play with one of those machines that tests reaction speed, most people can get it down to .2 - .3 seconds, with a little practice, and perhaps faster with a lot of practice.

Some of us get over the fear so well we start doing really stupid things, and can get hurt again. Such is life.


I looked over your link a year or two ago, it's good stuff. The second fall I took, I didn't have time to think or reposition at all. It was on a RBO edge with the free foot held in front, upper body in cross-check position, shoulders parallel to skating blade, facing outside the circle and right arm straight back. I went off the back of the blade - essentially airborn with no way to get the free foot in place and my right straight out the direction I was going. I went down so fast I didn't have time to correct anything. I was wearing ultracrash pads on my knees, which doesn't do anything for a backwards fall.

That's why I'm scared now - I don't know how I could do that better another time. :giveup:

[tazsk8s]

The second fall I took, I didn't have time to think or reposition at all. It was on a RBO edge with the free foot held in front, upper body in cross-check position, shoulders parallel to skating blade, facing outside the circle and right arm straight back. I went off the back of the blade - essentially airborn with no way to get the free foot in place and my right straight out the direction I was going. I went down so fast I didn't have time to correct anything.

Pretty much how mine happened as well. Got too far back on the blade somewhere around steps 5 or 6 of the 8 step mohawk and it was over before I had time to react.

[dbny]

I've heard a theory that wrist braces can be bad because they will transfer the shock further up your arm for a worse break.

I'm the one who spreads that idea around here. The link you provided later calls it "an old chessnut". My orthopedist told me that when I asked about wrist guards after getting my arm out of the cast. What he actually said was that there is no consensus among orthopedic surgeons about wrist guards being protective, for that reason, and that he himself does not recommend wrist guards. That was in the fall of 2001, so for all I know, his opinion has changed since then. I'm vain enough to not want to wear them, but I won't skate without my SkatingSafe gel knee pads, which really don't show anyway.

I went off the back of the blade - essentially airborn with no way to get the free foot in place and my right straight out the direction I was going. I went down so fast I didn't have time to correct anything.

That's why I'm scared now - I don't know how I could do that better another time. :giveup:

I know exactly what you mean. I was scared of the move I broke my wrist on, but understanding how it happened really helped, though it did take a long time before I recovered my confidence.

I told my coach about your accidents, and her first comment on the second fall, was that your FI three was executed towards the middle of the blade rather than up at the front, and combined with the cross check position and free leg in front, that's what took you off the back of the blade so fast. When you go back, work those RFI threes with a focus on your weight being at the front of the blade. Granted, it can't prevent your going off the back of the blade on other moves, but knowing how it happened and being able to deal with it should help your confidence.

[liz_on_ice]

I'm the one who spreads that idea around here. The link you provided later calls it "an old chessnut". My orthopedist told me that when I asked about wrist guards after getting my arm out of the cast. What he actually said was that there is no consensus among orthopedic surgeons about wrist guards being protective, for that reason, and that he himself does not recommend wrist guards.

That article quotes studies that say they have a protective effect, but other articles on the site, and browsing around, mention people who've had breaks above the guards. This largely snowboarding which is higher speed than skating, and done with the feet fixed to the board.

Someone is patenting gloves for skating that have grippy surfaces on the palms so your hands won't slide out falling forwards. I'd think this is likely to lead to more broken wrists, but the idea is to prevent the face from hitting the ice. I think I'd have done better if I'd have slid but the ice was not smooth and my gloves were texture too. Not sure that mattered, you don't slide when you just drop anyway.


I told my coach about your accidents, and her first comment on the second fall, was that your FI three was executed towards the middle of the blade rather than up at the front, and combined with the cross check position and free leg in front, that's what took you off the back of the blade so fast. When you go back, work those RFI threes with a focus on your weight being at the front of the blade. Granted, it can't prevent your going off the back of the blade on other moves, but knowing how it happened and being able to deal with it should help your confidence.

Um, I was working on the loop entrance which is why the free foot was to the front and I'd turned into crosscheck don't ask me why I thought I needed to be working on that just then. :roll:

[AgnesNitt]

I'd like to add something to the wrist guard discussion. I'm a proponent of wrist protection especially in recreational skaters like myself who started as adults. We simply don't know how to fall. We stick our hands out as if it's a fall at home. That works if you're not going too fast (say walking speed). But if you are going faster at skating speed, that same reflex can lead to a broken wrist. So wrist protection *can* be useful--but it has to be the right design. I use wrist guards that were designed for inline skating. They have a stiff metal bar with a curve in it that angles away from the wrist (no contact with the wrist). When you fall your wrist doesn't come into contact with the ice, instead the force is transferred to your much stronger arm bones. If you are wearing a wrist guard where the metal stiffener comes into contact with your wrist--that has no transfer capability at all to the arm, instead the full force of the fall goes directly to your wrist. So the type of wrist guard is important. There are worthless ones out there.

Force=mass * acceleration. Your wrist can tolerate just so much force before it breaks. If you are heavy and going fast--you can easily break your wrist. IF you are little and going the same speed-you may not. This explains why little kids can tolerate falls that would injure an adult--they don't have much mass and therefore are less likely to break something.

Let's look at the case of snowboarders--they're heavy and they're going very fast. No wrist protection is likely to help them except in minor falls. So now it becomes a risk mitigation issue: if they wear the wrist guard and the force is transferred to their arms, then they break their arm. Which is easier to fix an arm or a wrist? That's the risk mitigation decision the boarder needs to make.

From an adult perspective, I don't go fast, but I've got mass, properly designed wrist guards have saved me over and over.

[Query]

The second fall I took, I didn't have time to think or reposition at all. It was on a RBO edge with the free foot held in front, upper body in cross-check position, shoulders parallel to skating blade, facing outside the circle and right arm straight back. I went off the back of the blade - essentially airborn with no way to get the free foot in place and my right straight out the direction I was going. I went down so fast I didn't have time to correct anything.

Practice!

You don't have time to think - only to react. Most adult's initial reaction, which has been practiced to the point of becoming a reflex, is wrong. You have to change your automated reflex. You want to add the sequence of attempting a recovery, recognizing when that fails, then going into a safe fall, into your your "toolkit" of automated moves and reflexes that require no real thought to do. Like most skating moves. The only way I know to do that is through lots of practice

If you went stiff or straightened, then not only did you have to respond, but you did - in a suboptimal fashion.

The first few times you think there isn't time to react.

So let's do the math.

Assume it takes .6-.7 seconds for your body to reach the ice from a standing position (basic physics).

Assume it takes .2-.3 seconds to react, on a well practiced athletic move.

That is sufficient time, though you may have to do two reactions - one to attempt to recover balance, then a second, after that fails, to fall safely. Try to make the preparation for a safe fall a smooth continuation of the balancing motions, so it can happen faster.

(Note that the initial balancing phase can be very fast. It is so universally useful, the nerve loops for it don't have to travel all the way to the brain. I doubt you would be able to walk well over rough terrain if it took .2-.3 seconds to create balancing responses. But the choice to go into a safe fall requires a decision, though it doesn't have to be a concious one, which can occur during the balancing phase.)

It's not quite as easy to react fast enough if you are bent low and you are already close to the ice, as in a backwards shoot the duck - but then all you have to do is bend your neck - which is close to your brain, so has fast reaction times.

I just tested my reaction times for lifting my hand off a button after a light appears - a slightly awkwards motion - at a neat machine at the Ithaca, NY ScienceCenter. The best I could do is .217-.232 seconds. Various other people ranging from little children to the elderly managed about .17-.35 seconds. I'm sure more practice would have improved the results.

(Wierd. Shouldn't kids be fastest? They mostly weren't.)

I should perhaps increase the .1-.2 second reaction time estimate I posted at my falling site, though obviously different types of motion in different parts of the body have different speeds, and I only practiced the see light -> button lift a few minutes.

Shock and fear, from an unexpected fall can completely slow down to a crawl the way we think. For some people, it takes a lot of practice with easy high safety margin falls (e.g., from sitting position) to get over that.

Of course, for people who aren't alert to the possibilities, like people who don't pay close attention to the road while driving, reaction times are a great deal slower, which is why they tell you to leave 2-4 seconds between cars. But things go wrong while skating, so you probably pay attention. (In contrast, bicycle racers who "draft" a foot or so behind the bike in front - and have to react quickly to swerves and falls. Very fast reflexes - possibly below .1 second - are needed, if you do that math. There may be a selection factor, and they don't always succeed.)

BTW, on the wrist guard thing, it is self evident that imobilizing the wrist increases the stress on arm and shoulder, just like wearing high boots increases leg injuries, helmets increase neck injuries, and air bags increase lower body injuries. These are all well known trade-offs, with an established literature. But if you have a lot of bad falls or collisions where you feel you might break a wrist, it may be worth it to you. Let your experience be your guide.

[liz_on_ice]

Practice!
I just tested my reaction times for lifting my hand off a button after a light appears - a slightly awkwards motion - at a neat machine at the Ithaca, NY ScienceCenter. The best I could do is .217-.232 seconds. Various other people ranging from little children to the elderly managed about .17-.35 seconds. I'm sure more practice would have improved the results.




Interesting. I've read that 1/14th of a section is our minds 'frame rate' and it is different for other animals. Snails are like 4 seconds. So, at .07 seconds to perceive something, .07 to decide to move, and .07 to move .21 has got to be around theoretical minimum although if something is well practiced enough you may be able to drop out the decision time.



BTW, on the wrist guard thing, it is self evident that imobilizing the wrist increases the stress on arm and shoulder, just like wearing high boots increases leg injuries, helmets increase neck injuries, and air bags increase lower body injuries. These are all well known trade-offs, with an established literature. But if you have a lot of bad falls or collisions where you feel you might break a wrist, it may be worth it to you. Let your experience be your guide.

If it can distribute the shock far enough around that nothing breaks, that's to the good. Maybe what I want is the crash gel pads and a wrist guard.

What I'd like to know is the breaking strain of my wrist bone, and how close to it am I on a fall from a standing position with no other motion. That would let me know how much shock I need to absorb, to prevent a break. I'd also be able to tell how much losing 10 pounds would change the equation.

[Query]

Interesting. I've read that 1/14th of a section is our minds 'frame rate' and it is different for other animals... Snails are like 4 seconds.

Do you happen to remember where you read that?

How fast are cats?


What I'd like to know is the breaking strain of my wrist bone, and how close to it am I on a fall from a standing position with no other motion. That would let me know how much shock I need to absorb, to prevent a break. I'd also be able to tell how much losing 10 pounds would change the equation.

I was about to suggest an empirical approach to the breaking strain question. Try various things, see what breaks. But you've already taken it! You just need a little more data. :lol:

I wonder if body fat makes you more or less likely to break your wrists. Might depend where your fat is.

Here is a nice low-injury route to fixing the problem. :twisted: Take up parachute jumping. Those people have to learn to fall without using their hands and arms. Judo and aikido people do so too.

[Skate@Delaware]

Do you happen to remember where you read that?

How fast are cats?

Everone else's cats are fast...mine is too slow. He is always getting stepped on 8O!!!

I was about to suggest an empirical approach to the breaking strain question. Try various things, see what breaks. But you've already taken it! You just need a little more data. :lol:

I wonder if body fat makes you more or less likely to break your wrists. Might depend where your fat is.

Here is a nice low-injury route to fixing the problem. :twisted: Take up parachute jumping. Those people have to learn to fall without using their hands and arms. Judo and aikido people do so too.
My chiro has been working with me on "falling" and helping me to "let go" and it's a hard thing to do but like you said, practice, practice, practice! Easier said than done especially from someone that hates to fall....you can learn to roll into a fall and go soggy but some falls it just doesn't work (the surprise falls where you fall backwards 8O it's better just to tuck your chin and bear the brunt of the fall on your shoulders if you can rather than your head). I always seem to land where I have the least amount of fat.

[liz_on_ice]

Do you happen to remember where you read that?
How fast are cats?

The View from the Oak: The Private Worlds of Other Creatures

http://www.amazon.com/View-Oak-Creatures-Childrens-Literature/dp/1565846362/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1259607639&sr=1-1


I was about to suggest an empirical approach to the breaking strain question. Try various things, see what breaks. But you've already taken it! You just need a little more data. :lol:

I wonder if body fat makes you more or less likely to break your wrists. Might depend where your fat is.



Ptthhh. I've added 15 pounds of mass in the last couple of years, spread out fairly evenly. It's not that much since I'm 5'9" but that height means more acceleration

Here is a nice low-injury route to fixing the problem. :twisted: Take up parachute jumping. Those people have to learn to fall without using their hands and arms. Judo and aikido people do so too.

I had a net acquaintance with the rare distinction of being killed skydiving. Think I'll pass. Someone suggested aikido to me, sounds like a better plan. Besides, I don't need a hobby even *more* expensive than skating :roll:

[dbny]

Um, I was working on the loop entrance which is why the free foot was to the front and I'd turned into crosscheck don't ask me why I thought I needed to be working on that just then. :roll:

Exactly. That's why I'm drilling a student who is working on loops on getting that FI three up to the front of the blade, before she starts doing it with the free leg in front. Never having done loops on ice, I wasn't aware of the danger before your accident. You may well have saved others from the same fate. ...well, you do need to work on it sometime! I'm having my student do it at the boards - but then we are both chicken.

I'd like to add something to the wrist guard discussion. I'm a proponent of wrist protection especially in recreational skaters like myself who started as adults. We simply don't know how to fall. We stick our hands out as if it's a fall at home. That works if you're not going too fast (say walking speed). But if you are going faster at skating speed, that same reflex can lead to a broken wrist.

Actually, I think many adults do know how to fall from experience growing up and in other sports than ice skating. I also think falling response is instinctive and in that respect, most of it is probably the best thing to do. Think about it - if breaking your wrist has prevented a head injury, then you are better off with the broken wrist. That's why you fall that way - your distant ancestors who broke wrists survived to produce (and protect) more offspring than the ones who broke their skulls. Wrist fractures are common not just among skater and ski boarders. The instinctive response is to put those hands out to protect one's head. I know people who have sustained the same kinds of fractures while shoveling snow and while running for a bus. We focus on the skating injuries because that's what our interest is.

[miraclegro]

Well i basically had to re-learn at age 35, and had to travel to rinks until about three years ago. I have suffered numerous knee bruises, one BAD concussion, a broken fibula and most recently almost another broken foot on the other foot. And i think i chipped a bone in my elbow but never got it checked out. And, oh yeah, a "skater's chin" where i got a few stitches from dipping that arm down on the loop. That fixed my error darn quick!

Problem is, it seems that whatever you decide to pad, you fall on the part you didn't pad up!

Right now, i'm learning the axel, and i have NO idea what i'm gonna hit when i let loose to try it on my own. I can pad my butt, which is where the kids pad up but i'll betcha ill injure something else. I may wear a hat or helmet for this one. It would be fun to invent a foam suit one could move in! A gel one would be too expensive!

[liz_on_ice]

Right now, i'm learning the axel, and i have NO idea what i'm gonna hit when i let loose to try it on my own. I can pad my butt, which is where the kids pad up but i'll betcha ill injure something else. I may wear a hat or helmet for this one. It would be fun to invent a foam suit one could move in! A gel one would be too expensive!

Female pairs skaters pad pretty extensively for learning new lifts, don't they? Maybe there is such a thing :D

[aussieskater]

It would be fun to invent a foam suit one could move in! A gel one would be too expensive!

Not to mention sweaty and heavy! Imagine how wearing a full gel suit would improve the muscle-up into jumps - when you took the suit off, you'd probably jump so high you'd have enough time to comfortably rotate triples! (Landing them would be a whole other issue :D)

[dbny]

It would be fun to invent a foam suit one could move in! A gel one would be too expensive!

My favorite padding fantasy is a giant bubble a la "The Prisoner" :lol:

[liz_on_ice]

My favorite padding fantasy is a giant bubble a la "The Prisoner" :lol:

One of the nurses at the orthopedist when I went in the second time looked at me and said "we need to get you a bubble!" Started my bubble wrap fantasies right there. :D

[liz_on_ice]

Exactly. That's why I'm drilling a student who is working on loops on getting that FI three up to the front of the blade, before she starts doing it with the free leg in front. Never having done loops on ice, I wasn't aware of the danger before your accident. You may well have saved others from the same fate. ...well, you do need to work on it sometime! I'm having my student do it at the boards - but then we are both chicken.


Good plan. I had been too far forward on the blade on the takeoff, was working on fixing that based on corrections from coach. I may tell her I'm willing to live with too far forward from now on. :giveup:

[Query]

Some of you guys continue with amazing injury histories! How do you do it?

Someone should make and sell high fashion protective suits and dresses for skaters.

Fashion's the key, especially for girls. Figure skaters don't want to look like hockey or (american) football players.

Make the padding translucent or transparent so you don't look fat?

A padded dress that swirls around them with pretty patterns on spins?

Or the open fabric approach: hula skirt and pom pom material.

Strategically interleaved spots of black padding and skin, so you glimpse the trim body beneath. Make it sexy...

Then get some very pretty skaters to show it off. Sell or give away pictorial calendars. Contests to model the outfits!

[dbny]

Make the padding translucent or transparent so you don't look fat?


The SkatingSafe gel pads are the closest I've seen to invisible, but even then, most skaters don't want to wear them except in cases where they've had repeated injuries (mostly bruises) due to work on specific elements. I've seen padding worn most often for work on axels and doubles, but even then, as soon as the jump is "mastered", off goes the padding. For adults, I think there's more hope, but most coaches discourage protective padding because they grew up skating and did not use it themselves. I've seen quite a few injuries sustained because the coaches did not know how to teach adults.

[Skate@Delaware]

The SkatingSafe gel pads are the closest I've seen to invisible, but even then, most skaters don't want to wear them except in cases where they've had repeated injuries (mostly bruises) due to work on specific elements. I've seen padding worn most often for work on axels and doubles, but even then, as soon as the jump is "mastered", off goes the padding. For adults, I think there's more hope, but most coaches discourage protective padding because they grew up skating and did not use it themselves. I've seen quite a few injuries sustained because the coaches did not know how to teach adults.
The SkatingSafe pads are very popular at my rink as are the vollyball knee pads (which are pushed down to the ankle out of the way when not working on the axle. My coach doesn't care if I wear pads or not-whatever I want that makes me more at ease=more aggressive & comfortable on the ice instead of tentative.

I bought my husband a BMX pad undershort....it's pretty cool and all padded. He wore it under his skating pants (warm ups) and they are really nice have padding in all the important places and were only about $90 for his size (big guy).

[crash]

Did you have a chance to check out www.crash-pads.com style 1600 and 2700 are great for ice also style 2500 for extra tailbone coverage.

[Kat12]

^ Yes, we get the idea. You're advertising.

Anyway.

Someone is patenting gloves for skating that have grippy surfaces on the palms so your hands won't slide out falling forwards. I'd think this is likely to lead to more broken wrists, but the idea is to prevent the face from hitting the ice.
Hrm. I would think by the time my wrists are sliding forward, I'll have had time to realize what's going on and make sure I don't bash my face...it would be if I fell and nothing else hit the ice first that my face would be in trouble! That said, my gloves DO have grippy palms...which is great for catch-foot spirals!

My falling technique is probably entertaining, but from the sounds of things, relatively safe. It's not anything I've ever practiced or do consciously, lol. I don't just "go down" unless it happens too fast and I'm taken by surprise (which is rare). Instead it probably looks like some sort of flailing when brain goes into "OH SH*T!!" mode and body attempts to save itself. Sometimes this works and the only thing that falls is my ego, and sometimes it doesn't, but even when it doesn't the fall isn't so bad. The other day I did this great thing where I almost hopped on my toe pick on the way down. I still hit the ice but it didn't hurt. :)

Yeesh, all this is making me want to stay home on my safe couch, though! (Okay, this is sad, but while I'd like to go roller skating some time, the thought of falling on something harder than ice has me too freaked out to do so...)

I wear knee pads and elbow pads, just foam ones. I don't know if the elbow pads aren't too good, or if they slip out of the way, or if I just hit REALLY hard when I fall on my elbows and it would be even worse without the pads, but whenever I've fallen on my elbows I've still had lots of pain and bruising. I've only fallen on my knees once or twice but the knee pads were helpful.

I had considered in the past that I might wear my bike helmet when learning to jump, but have yet to come up against a situation in which I feel I need to, so I don't.

[Layne]

(Okay, this is sad, but while I'd like to go roller skating some time, the thought of falling on something harder than ice has me too freaked out to do so...)

Wood is actually significantly softer than ice, though I haven't compared to see if it actually feels any better. Not much is harder than ice except concrete.

I fell on my knees yesterday...not much fun. I definitely need some padding.

[Pandora]

Skatepark was concrete. Have to say, generally, falls are "worse" on concrete because the shock just jars right through you. On ice, you tend to slide which helps disapate the force a little bit, (if you're lucky.) Bubblewrap. Wear bubblewrap.:D Here is video.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFe1BR1EGr8 Don't look at me. Look at the skatepark. Nasty torn up concrete. Worms. Bottlecaps. (Believe me, you don't even want to know what else I found on there.)8O: I fell a lot. (Of course, cut that out of video except for 2:18). ;)Bubblewrap. Wear bubblewrap.

[dbny]

The problem with wood is that when you slide, it takes off a layer of whatever part you happen to be sliding on. We all had floor burns when I was a roller skater back in the day.

[Kat12]

I know wood is softer, but for some reason it SEEMS harder and I can't get past it! Looking at pictures of too many roller derby injuries, I guess, lol! We won't even talk about concrete. :)

[Query]

Wear bubblewrap.:D Here is video.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFe1BR1EGr8 Don't look at me. Look at the skatepark.

Why not look at you? You're nothing to be ashamed of, skating or otherwise!

If you are wearing bubble wrap, it's way too subtle to see. No gloves... I guess your personal experience must be your hands never touch?

Or are you like a very fashionable skater gal I knew who never used gloves, no matter how cold, because she did not like the look?

[Pandora]

(Pandora laughing).:lol:
Glove thing is funny because on ice I just can't skate without them. Hands get too wet/cold. Can't even do it in my prettiest dress. If I ever do get to skate in front of an audience, I will have to have some costumes made like the elite skaters (eg. Johnny Weir) who have gloves made into the costumes.

Wow!! Should start a thread on that.8O Which skaters always seem to have hands covered when competing. In my case it really DOES throw me off if I try to skate without them. (Mental thing.) Let's see.....Weir, Abbott (sometimes).......Know I have seen others, but cannot name them.

Oh! On the inline video. It was during the summer and hands sweated too much. Have hand pads from online skating store. (No fingers, just cut off thumb and a pad for the palm. Work great!) But was "brave" the day I took my video, (also extremely hot), and didn't have them on. :)

Yes, can't really see it. That is the cool thing about the bubblewrap. Only use one square. It is very thin and works great. Bends well. Hope to be at adult camp this summer (LP). Will bring my bubblewrap. Will show anyone who is there who wants to use it how it works. Maybe it will "get around." All the adults will be in bubblewrap. :)

dbny, Yes, know what you mean by wood burn. Still have the scars. ;)