Opinions about Skaters coming out of Retirement for Olympics [Archive]

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sk8ryellow

10-26-2009, 07:16 PM

Hi everyone! I was just wondering what your guys opinions were on other skaters coming out of retirement for the Olympics.

My opinion is: I think its wrong if the skater has already won any medal of any kind at the olympics because they have already retired and have been show skating gaining even more expierance and other such then the skaters skating competitivly. I think that what Plushanko is doing is wrong because he has already won a gold medal at the olympics. In my book I see it as cheating.

Its cool to view others opinions on both sides so please reply!

Pandora

10-26-2009, 07:41 PM

Have no problem with it. The medal should definitely go to the "best" skater in the world (on that night). Period. (Yes, subjective, I know. Even with the new scoring system.:roll:) But not a big fan of barring anyone...so yes, I do think it is ok for any of the skaters to come out of retirement and compete. (But they had better be careful because the new kids comming up are pretty good, too!;))

Nicki

10-27-2009, 01:03 AM

I have no problem with skaters returning to compete in the Olympics. Sometimes it can be helpful to take some time off. The only thing that bothers is skaters like Plushenko or Cohen who wait until the last possible second to return to competition. I would like to see them return at least one season prior to the Olympics to try for the World Championships and help to earn spots for their country on the Olympic team.

Schmeck

10-27-2009, 06:00 AM

Competing for an Olympic spot is one of the most difficult achievements - how in the world would it be considered "cheating"?????

As stated before, the person who skates the best for 6+ minutes combined is the one who will get the coveted gold medal - whether you already have one or not makes no difference.

Do you also consider it "cheating" for an athlete to enter (and win) multiple events at the same Olympics? What's the difference?

if anything, I admire those skaters that can come out of retirement and be competitive. It's not easy - wait until you are in your late twenties/early thirties, and do a quad... Then get out of bed the next morning...

RachelSk8er

10-27-2009, 07:51 AM

My opinion is: I think its wrong if the skater has already won any medal of any kind at the olympics because they have already retired and have been show skating gaining even more expierance and other such then the skaters skating competitivly. I think that what Plushanko is doing is wrong because he has already won a gold medal at the olympics. In my book I see it as cheating.

That's like giving trophies to all the kids in the t-ball league and not just the winning team so that the kids on the losing teams don't feel bad.

I think it's great, the Olympics are supposed to be for the best of the best to compete. Time off doing something different does any athlete good. And they still have to earn their trip there, it's not like they get to go automatically just because they've been there before.

I watched Plushenko's long program from the grand prix over the weekend and it was incredible for this early in the season. Technically he's still got the complete package, but the show skating experience he's gained allows him to actually entertain and stand out from all the cookie cutter IJS programs. I don't see anyone beating him in Vancouver if he skates clean.

I think Sasha will have to fight to even get to the Olympics. I don't think show skating really turned her into a good entertainer (I saw her at SOI last year and she was kind of boring and her skating wasn't even that great). But all the US ladies at the senior level are pretty inconsistent so really it's anyone's game right now. I'm impressed with what I've seen from Ashley Wagner so far.

jazzpants

10-27-2009, 09:33 AM

Plushy: Why not? Still got the goods to beat the young'ums. (Right, like he's REAL old right? :roll: )

Sasha: I'll believe it when I see it! I even doubt she will be at Nationals at this point. :(

dance2sk8

10-27-2009, 09:34 AM

I think its wonderful that Plushenko and Cohen are back! (Me being an ultimate Czisny, Cohen fan, I'm biased). I think technically, Plushenko is an amazing skater. His twizzles are mouth dropping! I also think this pushes everyone else to work harder and ups the competitions. Plus, no one's artistry touches Cohen's. Her spiral sequences and amazing flexibility is impeccable. I can't wait to see her compete and how she does against the other amazing skaters out there! The women's field is going to be tough. I just hope Mao can get herself together soon. My heart has been breaking for her since the last two GP events, she didn't fair so well.

To say that someone who won a gold medal, or a medal at all at the Olympics should not compete is not exactly fair nor logical in my book. Look at Micheal Phelps! Do you think he shouldn't continue to compete in swimming because of his achievements, or Nastia Lukin, multiple gold medals...

Its like telling someone who loves what they do to stop and not do it anymore just because they are better than everyone. How would that make you feel? Put yourself in their shoes. They love what they do, and they aren't getting any younger, so take advantage of the situation. I totally understand what they are doing. I know Cohen made a very late decision and I know training has been really hard on her.

Pardon me... but Go Sasha!!!!! Its nice to see a few skaters who aren't 16 competing.

http://www.jo-vancouver.fr/images/stories/sasha%20cohen.jpg

kayskate

10-27-2009, 10:09 AM

RachelSk8er

10-27-2009, 10:38 AM

Olys used to be all amateur. That is not true anymore, so different rules apply. Look at Oly hockey and basketball and tennis. If that is the case for those sports, it has to be true for skating as well or that would not be fair. Not saying I like it, but that's the way it is.

Kay

I do think that's taken away from some of the other sports. Part of what was so incredible about the '80 Olympic hockey team is that they were a bunch of college kids put up against teams from other countries who were born and bred to be Olympic hockey champions (mainly the Soviets). They were way out of their league, yet managed to win a game that was even more important because of the political climate.

The main difference between skating and other sports is that when you turn "pro" and sign the big contract, those athletes have not peaked yet, and therefore are still expected to improve in terms of ability and what their bodies are capable of. They're training just as much, if not more because now it's their job and the season is much longer. (Look at college basketball, hockey, baseball even though it's not an Olympic sport any more, etc and the length of their seasons versus professional teams, especially when you throw in playoffs).

When figure skaters turn pro, it's generally retiring. For those who do shows, the schedule is still rigorous because of all the travel and time spent learning choreography, but the phsyical demand that requires is very different from training long programs full of triples (and a few quads for the men). That kind of makes some of the comebacks we've seen in the past and will see this year so much more impressive.

Skittl1321

10-27-2009, 10:55 AM

Ah, but skaters CAN be professionals now- as long as they keep their eligibility (so they can't be show skaters, just occasional guests).

But not too long ago an eligible skater couldn't accept any money at all. They couldn't even coach tots. Now I many of the senior level skaters have students of their own.

As for comebacks- sure why not. If they are judged based on their skating and not their reputation. While I think Plushenko deserved every point he got for a jump, I think he was way overscored in total.

Cohen- I'll believe it when I see it. Though I'd love to see her skate again. :(

RachelSk8er

10-27-2009, 02:20 PM

But not too long ago an eligible skater couldn't accept any money at all. They couldn't even coach tots. Now I many of the senior level skaters have students of their own.

Before the rule change, I was working at the ice rink and I was not even allowed to skate guard at public sessions.

TreSk8sAZ

10-27-2009, 03:20 PM

I have no problem with skaters coming out of retirement to compete in the Olympics. The only way it would be cheating is if the skater broke the rules somehow in order to do it (i.e. bribing judges, falsifying eligibility, whatever). Simply coming out od retirement if they kept their status is not cheating because you aren't breaking any rule.

Now, I think it's stupid when they come back and aren't actually ready to compete with the best of the best. Plushenko is at least in good form and landing his jumps. We haven't seen Cohen yet so I can't say as to her. But if a skater who tries to come back isn't in top form and has no genuine shot to make the top of the Nationals podium through their skating skills (versus name/past accomplishments) then it's a waste for them to come back.

But no, there's no cheating involved by trying to make a comeback. Plus, there's no guarantee they'll even medal at the Olympics.

blackmanskating

10-28-2009, 04:26 PM

I think this is what skating needs!!! I'm so tired of these teenagers grabbing gold and then going pro!!! Back in the 80's skating was so popular because of conspiracies and because the veterans stayed in the game even after winning a medal in the olympics! So seeing a few more familiar faces back in the race is a wonderful thing!!! I'm excited to see who will make the olympic team!! Plushy Rox :bow: and he hasn't lost a thing, but Go Johnny! :mrgreen: And I'm glad Mr. Lambiel is coming back too!!! I'm interested to see if Sasha's jump technique has improved enough to compete with the likes of Mao and Yu-Na!!! Yu-Na kills all!!! I guess it's clear who I'm cheering for!!! Wow this is going to be an amazing event! Go veterans!!! Make these teenagers earn it!

BlackManSkating

dance2sk8

10-29-2009, 08:13 AM

RachelSk8er

10-29-2009, 08:32 AM

I have the biggest crush on Johnny Weir. He skates so beautifully.

He's a beautiful skater, but he annoys me. Too much of a drama queen. I guess he's toned down the attitude a bit now that he's struggling though (or he just doesn't have as much attention as he used to). And all his costumes look exactly the same.

blackmanskating

10-29-2009, 11:19 AM

He's a beautiful skater, but he annoys me. Too much of a drama queen. I guess he's toned down the attitude a bit now that he's struggling though (or he just doesn't have as much attention as he used to). And all his costumes look exactly the same.

LOL That was hilarious. I think his costumes are a little too much. Dude, skating is already considered a feminine sport, but do you have to have nude illusion shirts decked with rhinestones everywhere?? I thought his best costume was the king of chess short program back in 07 when he lost his title. It looked like something I would wear in a competition. None of the jewelry crap. He's just an incredibly smooth skater and it's a trait that I would like to emulate. Nobody skates like him. Nobu has always been my second fav skater. Takahashi is 3rd.

BlackManSkating

phoenix

10-29-2009, 11:34 AM

Plus, there's no guarantee they'll even medal at the Olympics.

There's even no guarantee that they'll even get to the Olympics--they have to qualify just like everyone else.

Personally I would have liked Sasha to have had to go through regionals, etc., start at the beginning again, rather than be given GP events so as to avoid that. But I suppose getting her in front of the international judges again is important if she's shooting for Olympics. But I hate that another skater who earned their spot last year got bumped because of her. Of course she hasn't actually done anything yet..... so we'll see.

LilJen

10-29-2009, 02:29 PM

A comeback is a great idea for the skaters I really like (Shen/Zhao, Lambiel). It's a terrible idea for the skaters I dislike (Plushenko). In some cases I'm indifferent (Sasha). :lol:

icedancer2

10-29-2009, 03:20 PM

Back in the 80's skating was so popular because of conspiracies and because the veterans stayed in the game even after winning a medal in the olympics!

I think you must mean the 90s - I can't think of anyone except maybe Brian Orser, who won a medal at the Olympics and came back (Silver in '84 and repeat Silver in '88) - plus he continued to skate competitively in the years in between.

It was about 1992 or 1993 when skaters who had skated professionally were allowed to come back and compete as amateurs - before that (except maybe in the Soviet Union where the lines had been blurred for decades because the skaters were supported by the government) once you had skated in a show or were coaching you could not compete as an amateur. (except for club shows and the Tour of Champions (now Champions on Ice)... I remember that time very well because skaters in our area who were competing could earn money as coaches whereas before that they had to just earn money with low-paying jobs, modelling, etc., whatever they could to cover their expenses.

in '94 a bunch of "pros" came back - Gordeeva and Grinkov, Brian Boitano, Katerina Witt, Torville and Dean - G/G were the only ones to re-capture the Gold medal and I remember Christopher Dean was not so happy with the Bronze that he and Jayne got - yes, that was fun, wasn't it?

And I'm glad Mr. Lambiel is coming back too!!!

I didn't know that - LOVE HIM! I thought he was permanently injured. So this is good to hear. He will give Plushenko a run for his money - and yes, I love Johnny Weir too, but I kind of doubt if he will qualify for the Olympics this year unless he really gets his jumps and speed in order. I look forward to his professional career.

blackmanskating

10-30-2009, 11:40 AM

I think you must mean the 90s - I can't think of anyone except maybe Brian Orser, who won a medal at the Olympics and came back (Silver in '84 and repeat Silver in '88) - plus he continued to skate competitively in the years in between.

It was about 1992 or 1993 when skaters who had skated professionally were allowed to come back and compete as amateurs - before that (except maybe in the Soviet Union where the lines had been blurred for decades because the skaters were supported by the government) once you had skated in a show or were coaching you could not compete as an amateur. (except for club shows and the Tour of Champions (now Champions on Ice)... I remember that time very well because skaters in our area who were competing could earn money as coaches whereas before that they had to just earn money with low-paying jobs, modelling, etc., whatever they could to cover their expenses.

in '94 a bunch of "pros" came back - Gordeeva and Grinkov, Brian Boitano, Katerina Witt, Torville and Dean - G/G were the only ones to re-capture the Gold medal and I remember Christopher Dean was not so happy with the Bronze that he and Jayne got - yes, that was fun, wasn't it?

Yeah I meant to say 80's-90's. :)

I didn't know that - LOVE HIM! I thought he was permanently injured. So this is good to hear. He will give Plushenko a run for his money - and yes, I love Johnny Weir too, but I kind of doubt if he will qualify for the Olympics this year unless he really gets his jumps and speed in order. I look forward to his professional career.

Yeah I read about Stephane Lambiel coming back and I was like, "Wow!!! This is gonna be one awesome Olympic Season!!!" Everybody wants a piece of the action and it has me glued to the screen every weekend even more than Sunday night football!!! I'm hoping that Johnny turns this thing around. I'm pretty sure Johnny will make the Olympic team. What I'm questioning is his medal contention especially with Plushenko skating like he is. It's funny because Brian Joubert completely crossed Plushenko off. I read some of his previous comments about Plushy. Then Plushy lost weight and gained Gold. That's just crazy. He might actually win his second Olympic Gold medal. Looking forward to this Grand Prix Final.

BlackManSkating

Isk8NYC

10-30-2009, 12:54 PM

A comeback is a great idea for the skaters I really like (Shen/Zhao, Lambiel). It's a terrible idea for the skaters I dislike (Plushenko). In some cases I'm indifferent (Sasha). :lol:
Bravo - you get a gold star for honesty. I feel the same way, just not about the same skaters. If there's an underdog with talent, I usually root for them. (See: Rohene Ward)

I also prefer clean programs that make the judges sweat to a splatfest where the skaters suffer.

MQSeries

10-30-2009, 08:09 PM

The most touching comeback was Elaine Zayak's :bow:

It doesn't matter to me who comes back but the skater must be in fighting shape when he/she comes back. It was so disappointing for me to see Midori Ito come back skating no where near the level she was capable off. That was one comeback I wish didn't occur.

techskater

10-31-2009, 05:16 AM

Midori Ito was supposedly "encouraged" by the JSF because the OOOOOs were being held in Nagano. There's more, most of it rumor, but she was much thinner upon her return and was hospitalized several times.

RachelSk8er

11-02-2009, 10:11 AM

I remember being very glad when Grinkov/Gordeeva came back, I always loved them, and the program they skated at the 94 Olympics was incredible. (Hard to believe Sergei's death was almost 14 years ago now...holy crap time flies.)

miraclegro

11-03-2009, 09:22 PM

You know, i think i agree that if someone decides to return, they shouldn't wait till the last possible moment. HOWEVER, i get So excited to see anyone OVER 20 to come back and give it their best. What used to be women's gymnastics and women's skating is now only for the pre-teens and teens it seems because of the crazy things their bodies have to do. So, i get real excited to see anyone who is "mature" come back, whether i dislike or like them! That makes a true athlete!