Double three turn

[luckykid]

I don't know if this is worth opening a new topic, but I'm having some trouble with my double three turn. I can turn alright, but I kinda scratch the toepick on the second turn and sometimes the first one too. And even if I don't scratch the toepick, I stop moving after I finished the second turn. Any possible ways of correcting it? In my last practice session, I was able to come to a very very slow glide after the second turn. I've noticed some things which I tend to do.

My coach asked me to put in more speed, but then I'll use the toepick because I'm going too fast, so I kinda drag the toepick to slow myself down.

My coach doesn't want me to bend my knees too much when doing any three turns. She said it's wrong. But I read somewhere in the forums that you need a down up down movement for a three turn? For me I enter with slightly bent knees, straightening the slightest bit when turning, since I don't even have much of a bend to begin with, and a deep bending after I completed the three turn.

About posture, I always feel like my upper body is being left behind. I was able to do a slow glide after my double threes in my previous practice, but it's funny. I have to control the edges, and I have to twist my ankle, so that the turning begins with foot, leg, hip, body, head being last. It sounds wrong? Should be upper body turning first?

What is the edge changes in a forward outside double three turn? Do the edge even change? My coach does not want me to get into the inside edge. So I'm either on flats or outside edge. For a three turn, I enter with outside edge, come out in slight inside edge, and I'll adjust it to be on flat.

[phoenix]

Firstly a FO double three will go: FO edge to BI edge to FO edge.

I have no idea why your coach wouldn't want you to be on an inside edge, or to not bend your knees for that matter.

It's the knee action that makes the turn happen; starting on the first FO edge on a bent knee you rise to do the first turn, rebend during the glide on the BI edge, and rise again for the second turn, and back down again on the exit FO edge.

You will probably turn your shoulders into each turn so the upper body leads the turn (different people teach this different ways).

You definitely shouldn't feel like you're using your foot to force any turn--if it's set up correctly the turn will turn itself.

[ferelu]

Are you doing double threes or twizzles? Twizzles are done on a straight leg, so maybe your coach wants you to practice double 3s without the rebent after the first turn to initiate you to twizzles.

Now, for actual double 3s, make sure that once you do the FO turn, you bring your free leg in front (make sure free hip is lifted and not dropped), then press on your heel to do the BI 3 turn. If you're scratching, then you're weight is not on your heel for the second turn.

[luckykid]

I know for a single FO3, whenever I get onto the inside edge I make a sharp arc which is wrong, so coach wants me on the flat to avoid that?

I start the turn with my foot first so that I can control the edges properly and not slip into BI. Whenever I get into a BI, I still can manage to turn but it feels forceful? Like the blade is cutting the ice. I scrape a lot of ice up when executing three turns. Sometimes it's the toepick, sometimes it's the heel of the blade that cuts through the ice. I hardly ever am able to stand on the center of the blade. I don't put the free leg in front for the second turn? I still put it at the side of my skating leg. I'll try that tomorrow.

I'm pretty sure it's a double three turn as I do check after the first turn, and it's not done in a continuous motion.

[icedancer2]

The reason you are making a sharp arc after the FO3 is that you are dropping your free hip and most likely your shoulder, too - keep those up and you should not have to think about making a flat to make the arc bigger.

[Mrs Redboots]

For the second half - the back 3-turn bit - you need your weight really far back on the blade. Which I find very difficult, but people do do it, so it must be possible....

[fsk8r]

For the second half - the back 3-turn bit - you need your weight really far back on the blade. Which I find very difficult, but people do do it, so it must be possible....

I think of lifting the toes when doing the turn. It's normally enough to put the weight back so you can do the back turn. Oh and you need to keep your weight over the skate. If you left it drift over to the free side it will pull you onto a deeper edge and makes it harder to switch edges on the turn.