Encouragement, for beginners... [Archive]

sk8joyful

02-07-2009, 03:15 AM

Hi again,

One of our friends at the rink practiced her mohawks
over a year, and she finally learned them! :)

me? Spiral: since 1st. one, have learned a few things.
Spin:
on my very 1st. try, I actually managed 2&1/2-rotations.
now, I'm trying to replicate that again, & add more.
Jump:
my 1st. bunny-hops, coach:"hey, some are really good".
(as a former mini ski-jumper, I like experience of flying).
Please, I'd like my back-outside-edges, for jumps :D
power-pulls: let's skip for a long :roll: while.
---
current-challenges:
1. Why do our legs switch?? sometimes,
from the Left, to the Right, being the stronger, like on F-edges.

2. Self-starting :roll: my F-crossovers. Once
I *trust* myself to get going, I get nice compliments!

3. backskating: past 1/2-swizzle, & free-foot forward,
I can't figger out how to Balance on the skating leg.
Please don't post that is dumb; we all learn these, I'm sure.

Thanks! for positive-encouragement, and suggestions!

.

sk8lady

02-07-2009, 07:23 AM

As a coach, I actually get more excited when my adult skaters reach goals because it's much harder work for them to get there than the kids. One of my adults did her first true crossovers yesterday and I was so thrilled I almost cried!! It's so hard for us adults to make the time to get to the rink and then go consistently, even if it's once a week, to keep practicing, to concentrate on something besides all the things you "should" be doing, that it's a major success just to actually continue skating! Three of my adult skaters quit at the beginning of this year because of various financial issues--not that this doesn't happen to kids, but I think when something has to go, it's more likely to be your own activities than your kids' activities.
As a skater, it took me something like four years to get a scratch spin I felt was acceptable. Then I got my sit spin almost right away. I got my camel before I got a backspin that didn't tip me over during the exit. And I'm still trying to get a consistent loop. Everyone goes at their own pace--as long as you're out there doing it, it's all good! :D

niupartyangel

02-08-2009, 09:02 PM

sk8lady, I agree...my coach was super thrilled when I finally got around two revolutions on my 1 foot spin...it took me almost a year just to get around from a T-entrance...lol. she was like, "yes, yes that's it!" and of course it took another half a year for it to get to where it is now...I get 4-5 revolutions on average, but I get super thrilled when I reach 6 which has only happened maybe 3x...but she knows how hard i've been trying and i could have gotten discouraged and quit but I didn't. :) some days i still don't spin well where I would only get 3-4 revolutions but she tells me to look at the overall picture of how far I've come and that makes me feel better.

sk8joyful, i am jealous that you actually enjoy bunny hops...my worst falls (including hitting my head) have come from those nasty guys :twisted: i still don't like them, and I only practice them when my coach makes me!

as for me, i am still working on the courage to actually take off for the loop...i have been practicing on the floor but on the ice i just freak out. Also my coach has got me working on waltz jump-toe-toe-waltz jump...my "toe-toes" are still really itty bitty, but I have graduated from doing them holding on to the rails...

sk8joyful

02-09-2009, 04:53 AM

As a coach,
I actually get more excited when my adult skaters reach goals
it's harder work for them to get there than the kids.

particularly when we are injured, plus household expenses fall on us. -
Often, I can't even get to the rink for 2 months.
Imagine a baby only getting walking-practice, every 2 months :roll: it might take years!!

One of my adults did her first true crossovers yesterday and I was so thrilled I almost cried!!

an untrue, from a true crossover, How do you differentiate?, please

it's a major success just to actually continue skating!
Everyone goes at their own pace-- as long as you're out there doing it, it's all good! :D

Fortunately (coming back from the dead 8O),
I developed this Skating-passion, that just keeps growing... :)

As a skater, it took me something like four years to get a scratch spin I felt was acceptable.
Then I got my sit spin almost right away. I got my camel before I got a backspin.
And I'm still trying to get a consistent loop.

Congratulations!!! on each of your achievements :D

Do you have any Encouraging-suggestions, for:
"backskating: past 1/2-swizzle, & free-foot forward,
I can't figger out how to Balance on the skating leg."
Please don't post that is dumb; we all learn these, I'm sure.

Thanks! :)

Sessy

02-09-2009, 06:26 AM

I'd say a true crossover actually crosses where as an untrue one has the crossing foot in front of the other skate, but never fully crossed. Also for a true crossover, the foot crossing over stays on the ice and an untrue one sort of steps

AgnesNitt

02-09-2009, 06:14 PM

Skate@Delaware

02-09-2009, 06:42 PM

I'm on the fence right now, between finances (full-time student) and health issues....I've been skating for 6 years and feel as though my skills are deteriorating, not improving.

I had skated a small bit as a teenager, maybe 20 times on a frozen cow pond (does that count for anything) but I didn't KNOW how to do anything...now I'm 47 and have trouble doing a decent crossover due to muscular/neuromuscular imbalances.

But, for the rest of you, keep it up and ENJOY it!!! It is a fun sport!!! I have enjoyed it immensely for what it's given me!

And yes, adults learn at a different pace....3 years for a decent (i.e. recognizable) scratch spin, 4+ for a loop (still struggling with that one) etc.

niupartyangel

02-09-2009, 06:47 PM

AgnesNitt, I have been there before...I got kicked out of my adults class because I "outgrew" it and the instructor told my privates coach (i was supplementing my group class with 15 min private lessons wtih her during the practice time) that I should really move to the Freestyle 1 class, never mind if i was with the kiddies. It was all well and good until I got to freestyle 2 and the dang spin was holding me back...one by one my classmates were passing me by and moving on to FS 3 (never mind that I was like 26 and they were like 8, the oldest being 14 years old)...it was very rough on the ego..

SkaterBird

02-09-2009, 08:19 PM

I was at Friday Coffee Club when I saw a woman my age doing respectable mohawks and 3 turns with the Adult LTS coach making suggestions. When I saw him later I asked if that was one of his students. "Oh, yes, "he said, "she has 3 turns and mohawks down after only 4 lessons. In another week or so I'm going to have to kick her out of LTS into private, she's so good."

I felt blackest skater despair. I've been skating for two years, slaved away at every element. Showed determination, stick-to-itiveness, etc. I know I don't have natural skating talent, but I realized I could have negative talent where you're so bad that no matter how much you practice everyone is passing you by and you're just pouring money down the drain. I was sitting there staring at my skates, thinking about Ebay, when one of the women ice-dancers came up. "So and so is so proud of how fast his student is learning. I just spoke to her, of course she skated as a child."

Hooray! If she skated as a child, I can't compare my skills to hers! She's got muscle memory from the sixties! I'm not giving up skating!

Well . . . I skated briefly as a middle schooler and again in college and could actually DO a few things, 29 years and around 50+ pounds ago. And now I am struggling mightily with three turns and mowhawks, and don't get me started on waltz jumps! Another skater at my rink - an adult in her early 40's who has skated on and off for years and is practicing silver moves but frustrated that she isn't farther along, swears that it is NOT like riding a bicycle - this stuff can be a lot mor challenging when one is older. Keep at it. If you love it then it's never money down the drain, it's money and time spent pursuing what you enjoy and investing in your own well-being. I've yet to meet an adult skater who is actually headed toward Olympic glory. On the other hand, I've met quite a few who struggle with their elements, feel a real sense of accomplishment when they do make gains, and get a little bit healthier and more fit with each practice session!

amyvw

02-09-2009, 09:22 PM

sk8joyful

02-10-2009, 03:58 AM

I've been skating for two years, slaved away at every element. Showed determination, stick-to-itiveness, etc.

"So and so is so proud, of how fast his student is learning.
I just spoke to her, of course she skated as a child."

Hooray! If she skated as a child, I can't compare my skills to hers!
She's got muscle memory from the sixties! I'm not giving up skating!

Hurrah! for you!! :D And you've been skating, only 2 years.
~
Well, I'm not giving up either, I don't care what some kids, & coaches, at our rink think.

I've overcome health challenges, the likes of which they (THANK God!) have no clue about.
Had they been saddled with them, I know 9/10 would never have laced-up in the 1st. place,
let alone continue tootling...-along. And besides, the few Skaters who do know, continue encouraging me.

Sure, I'd like to progress faster..., but I just remind myself how far I have already come, and I am well-pleased! :)
.

sk8joyful

02-10-2009, 04:18 AM

I'm on the fence right now, between finances (full-time student) and health issues....I've been skating for 6 years and feel as though my skills are deteriorating, not improving.

I'm 47, and have trouble doing a decent crossover due to muscular/neuromuscular imbalances.

But, for the rest of you, keep it up and ENJOY it!!! It is a fun sport!!! I have enjoyed it immensely for what it's given me!

Hi Skate-delaware,

You have (due to 'neuromuscular imbalances') trouble with your crossovers? -
I'm asking, because when I first started, nothing in my body worked, well maybe 10% 8O), and so I forced-myself into skates,
in the hope that I would regain my health, via a FUN-passion. - And somehow, with lots of fits & starts,
(mostly fits like a major STROKE for lack of a better word), I have started to FEEL... what I'm doing on top of my blades.

Can you share about how you are dealing with your challenges, to help you progress, & maybe this would help me/others too, yes? ;) Thanks!
.

sk8joyful

02-10-2009, 04:43 AM

I'd say
a true crossover actually crosses,
where as an untrue one has the crossing foot in front of the other skate, but never fully crossed.
Also
for a true crossover, the foot crossing over stays on the ice
and an untrue one sort of steps

Hi Sessy,
ok, thanks!! for these. - I only vaguely-recall, what it was like for me, to not "fully-cross, & stay there".
This part comes not only natural for me now, in addition I LIKE :D staying Crossed-over.

But I just recently discovered one reason why:
because I never got the fact that we are to TRANSFER weight, to the Crossed-over foot.
because I couldn't get the weight-Transfer...
that lack-of-skill was partly why I shy-away from 'Self-starting';

Funny-thing is: Once I get going... & STOP over-analyzing, and
allow my speed to advance (from the frozen-molasses stage) lol, ---- then,
it all seems to Come-together, like "what was :roll: my problem, THIS is almost :) EASY"

I'm sure other skaters have gone thru these Learning...stages.

Gee, when?? do I get to the point that my Crossovers are AUTOMATIC !!! :D
.

Bunny Hop

02-10-2009, 08:20 AM

I'm muddling along in my quest to regain the skills I had 13+ years ago. Things that were so easy back then just don't seem to want to come back for me now. :frus: I've been feeling pretty frustrated lately as I feel like I'm regressing rather than progressing.
Basically, what amyvw said.

It does depend what kind of skating people did when they were kids. I did group classes once a week for a couple of years in my early teens. Was learning basic jumps when the rink shut down. So it was low level and infrequent, meaning that coming back as an adult, I have a point of reference, but other than that it basically hasn't helped me at all, and I'm still struggling with the three turns and mohawks that I could do perfectly well at 15.

Unfortunately, the one thing I need is the one thing that nobody can teach me, which is confidence. So skating and me are probably a bad match, all things considered!

amyvw

02-10-2009, 09:04 AM

Basically, what amyvw said.

It does depend what kind of skating people did when they were kids. I did group classes once a week for a couple of years in my early teens. Was learning basic jumps when the rink shut down. So it was low level and infrequent, meaning that coming back as an adult, I have a point of reference, but other than that it basically hasn't helped me at all, and I'm still struggling with the three turns and mohawks that I could do perfectly well at 15.

Unfortunately, the one thing I need is the one thing that nobody can teach me, which is confidence. So skating and me are probably a bad match, all things considered!

I think you hit the nail on the head. For me, I think a huge part of this is confidence issues. I have moments where I seem to forget that I basically did not skate at all for more than 13 years and I catch myself doing something without thinking and then I startle myself back into reality. LOL. :frus:

I knew coming back after such a long hiatus would be hard, but I did not expect my progress back to where I was to be so slow. Everyone keeps insisting that "it will come back". I'm still waiting. ;)

And on another note...I'm still not 100 percent sure I have my left blade set correctly (which exacerbates my confidence issues). I had it moved further inside (big pronation issues with my left foot) in December and am still thinking it may need to move a little more (though not sure how much more it can move). I still feel like it takes such major effort to get/hold that left outside edge. I'm not sure how much of my problem with that is just in my head or if it's still a matter of further correcting the blade position to help offset the pronation. I'm determined to solve this if it kills me.

Thin-Ice

02-10-2009, 09:38 AM

Gee, when?? do I get to the point that my Crossovers are AUTOMATIC !!! :D.

Probably never... I take a perverse pleasure in hearing coaches telling their high-level (and very lovely, highly-skilled) competitive skaters (who have even passed all their Gold dances above the passing mark:lol::cry:) "You need to smooth out your crossovers".. and spending 10-15 minutes per lesson working on crossovers. It's the one thing the kids and I can commiserate on.. how crossovers are never automatic.. we ALWAYS have to work on them. :roll::cry:

sk8joyful

02-10-2009, 03:42 PM

Probably never...

I take a perverse pleasure in hearing coaches telling their high-level (and very lovely, highly-skilled) competitive skaters (who have even passed all their Gold dances above the passing mark :lol: :cry:)

"You need to smooth out your crossovers".. and
spending 10-15 minutes per lesson working on crossovers.

It's the one thing the kids and I can commiserate on..
how crossovers are never automatic.. we ALWAYS have to work on them. :roll::cry:

Well, I am aware - I have seen the difference, even in Olympic-skaters, that still need work...
But I didn't quite mean it like that, I'm NOT equating "automatic = perfection".

I just meant, Skating my crossovers... with less conscious-attention, & more Relaxed...
In the same way
that you tieing your shoes is NOW "automatic", because you have mastered this skill; understand now better ;)

Sessy

02-10-2009, 03:46 PM

haha once I was on the ice with our dutch champion and her coach was yelling at her "Bend your knees! Keep your back straight" and stuff like that. :twisted: I thought - they pay HIM money for that? Isn't it just easier to put a recording on the speakers? :twisted:

I came to like the crossovers at some point. That point was when I realised I could use both the inside and the outside edge of both skates to push off.

Wouldn't it be great if skates had little lift-off rockets that you could fire whenever you needed to start skating from a standstill? When I got my programme I, too, realised that yes my crossovers were pretty good (for my time skating) once I was finally doing them, but it took me forever to get started. I started practicing a couple of crossovers - then a backward stop - then another couple of crossovers - another stop. The same for forwards crossovers, except with a show stop. That way, both my stops and crossovers improved. But I think I could go on practicing just that for a few more years before I get any good at it. :twisted:

AgnesNitt

02-10-2009, 03:55 PM

sk8lady

02-10-2009, 04:10 PM

Well, as it took me almost a year (!) to get really comfortable with "true" crossovers, I'd like to post a couple of comments--cause I did so much wrong that I've learned just about every thing wrong to fix :lol:

1. You really need to be on your outside edge AND you need to lean in the circle--I spent 5 mos, on the outside edge but leaning out of the circle or not leaning at all. I've seen a lot of other adult learners be either straight up or leaning out, so how did I fix it? See step 2.

2. A coach told me to work on crossing the foot over then HOLDING it in the crossed over position. This was scary for a few days, but I kept at it and it worked. I really got confidence in my edges and I got the right position. When I was still uncomfortable with my crossovers I'd do a couple of cross and holds both ways--and voila! it would reset my body memory-- line up my edges, body position, and lean then I could do crossovers for the rest of the session perfectly.

I would add: leaning into the circle doesn't mean to actually lean OVER into the circle--you don't want to drop the inside shoulder as that will throw you off balance. I went to a power skating clinic once where the instructor suggested thinking about dropping the OUTSIDE shoulder without actually doing it. For a lot of us that keeps the shoulders level and makes for a balanced crossover. Physically leaning into the circle, like an airplane banking for a landing, drop the weight into the circle and onto the inside foot too early.
The same instructor had us do the exercise you mentioned, crossing over and holding the foot up, while holding the inside edge for so long that you spiral around in a circle. (It was a hockey clinic so a bunch of the kids fell on their heads.)
The other drill I have students do is to do crossovers without picking either foot up. Then when they do the crossover it's often a lot smoother and loses the clunky feeling.
With back crossovers, the most important thing to remember is that it's not done like a forward crossover--if you try to do it the same way only backwards you get a weird little hoppy thing. The outside foot actually doesn't ever need to come up off the ice.

sk8joyful

02-10-2009, 04:23 PM

2. A coach told me to work on crossing the foot over, then
HOLDING it in the crossed over position.

This was scary for a few days, but I kept at it and it worked. I really got confidence in my edges
and I got the right position. When I was still uncomfortable with my crossovers
I'd do a couple of cross and holds both ways--and voila! it would reset my body memory--
line up my edges, body position, and lean then I could do crossovers for the rest of the session perfectly.

My forward crossovers are crisp, nicely edged, and I can do them facing in or out of the circle.

Hi people,

Apparently my post above got lost in this shuffle; this one:
Hi Sessy,
ok, thanks!! for these. - I only vaguely-recall, what it was like for me, to not "fully-cross, & stay there".
This part comes not only natural for me now, in addition I LIKE :D staying Crossed-over.

But I just recently discovered one reason why:
because I never got the fact that we are to TRANSFER weight, to the Crossed-over foot.
because I couldn't get the weight-Transfer...
that lack-of-skill was partly why I shy-away from 'Self-starting';

Funny-thing is: Once I get going... & STOP over-analyzing, and
allow my speed to advance (from the frozen-molasses stage) lol, ---- then,
it all seems to Come-together, like "what was :roll: my problem, THIS is almost :) EASY"

Would you please speak to this part: "get the weight-Transfer...
that lack-of-skill was partly why I shy-away from 'Self-starting' " <-- SELF...start is my main hang-up :!: grrrrrrrrrrrrrr :D

Thanks! :)

doubletoe

02-10-2009, 04:28 PM

I would add: leaning into the circle doesn't mean to actually lean OVER into the circle--you don't want to drop the inside shoulder as that will throw you off balance. I went to a power skating clinic once where the instructor suggested thinking about dropping the OUTSIDE shoulder without actually doing it.

Absolutely true! When learning the power circles for the Intermediate/Adult Gold moves in the field, my coach helped me fix all the problems on my CW forward crossovers by telling me to press down on my outside shoulder. Basically, you are leaning into the circle from the hips down, so you have to counter-balance that by pressing your outside shoulder down and leaning your head and shoulder a bit to the outside of the circle. This holds true whether you're doing forward or backward crossovers.

Another thing that holds true in both forward and backward crossovers is that your chest should always be facing the inside of the circle. In other words, if you're doing left-over right crossovers, the right shoulder is pulled back and the left shoulder is in front so your chest is rotated to the right and your chest faces inside the circle. For right-over-left crossovers, the left shoulder stays pulled back and the right shoulder is in front so your chest is rotated to the left and once again faces the inside of the circle.

Hi people,

Apparently my post above got lost in this shuffle; this one:

Would you please speak to this part: "get the weight-Transfer...

Look at the front skater (a speed skater) in this picture doing a Crossover (http://images.google.com/url?source=imgres&ct=img&q=http://www.k-kiereta.webpark.pl/edu/wintersports/pictures/speed_skating_sml.jpg&usg=AFQjCNH9voE7e7ToKEJXsSWXbR40zZy0Rw). Ignore the upper body position, which is not right for figure skating, but look at the legs. Can you see how the leg that crossed over is now deeply bent and the other leg is extended behind and to the side? By bending that crossed-over leg, the skater transfers his weight and balance onto that leg. Once he feels that he is now balanced over the crossed over leg (the right leg), he can just keep the other leg in its current position and lift it a few inches off the ice. He will hold that position and glide, then bring it back into position next to the right leg and push off onto it, then do another crossover.

So the weight transfer process is:
(1) You have your weight on your left leg, which is bent
(2) You cross the right leg over it so that now your weight is on both feet., then
(3) you bend your right knee deeply and wait until you feel that you are now balanced on the right thigh
(4) Now you can just lift up the left foot, which should be extended behind you (still crossed under the right leg), with the outside of the foot facing the ice.

Try it on the floor in regular shoes first, bending both knees, crossing right over left with a wide step-over, then lifting the left foot off the floor a few inches once you have your weight on the right foot.

Skate@Delaware

02-10-2009, 10:25 PM

Hi Skate-delaware,

You have (due to 'neuromuscular imbalances') trouble with your crossovers? -
I'm asking, because when I first started, nothing in my body worked, well maybe 10% 8O), and so I forced-myself into skates,
in the hope that I would regain my health, via a FUN-passion. - And somehow, with lots of fits & starts,
(mostly fits like a major STROKE for lack of a better word), I have started to FEEL... what I'm doing on top of my blades.

Can you share about how you are dealing with your challenges, to help you progress, & maybe this would help me/others too, yes? ;) Thanks!
.
In late 2007 I injured my lower back (herniated a lumbar disc); had severe pain & numbness in my left leg after that. It was hard to stand or sit; I had to wear a leg brace because of foot-drop. In February of 2008 I had a surgical repair. I had to have intensive rehab before and after the surgery, which didn't really deal with imbalance. Fast forward to today, I'm back in rehab to deal with lingering lower back pain. I still have left leg weakness and imbalance from my right side overcompensating. I still have some residual numbness in my left foot which interferes with getting the "feel" of the ice at times.

So, through it all I still skated, but now I am dealing with this setback/relapse in my skills and tend to be more tentative when I do skate. I still jump and spin but have failed to progress any. I'm frustrated on many levels.

dbny

02-10-2009, 11:04 PM

Wouldn't it be great if skates had little lift-off rockets that you could fire whenever you needed to start skating from a standstill?

There is one! It's called "deeply bent knees" :twisted:

Hi people,

Apparently my post above got lost in this shuffle; this one:

Would you please speak to this part: "get the weight-Transfer...
that lack-of-skill was partly why I shy-away from 'Self-starting' " <-- SELF...start is my main hang-up :!: grrrrrrrrrrrrrr :D

Thanks! :)

In addition to what doubletoe said above, I have my students do crossovers while standing still. For example, stand with feet about shoulder distance apart. Bend L knee to get weight onto L foot. Raise R knee, crossing over the L and lower your body down onto the R foot without straightening out the R knee. This should result in a definitive shift of weight from L to R. Do four or five in a row, each time focussing on the shift of weight. Hold hands with someone and do it together if you need the security. Another weight shifting exercise that I bring in when a student sticks the crossing foot in front without lifting the knee, is to stand at the boards (hold on), and bend one knee deeply, letting the other foot slide back and straighten.

sk8lady

02-11-2009, 03:37 PM

Totally OT but I was reading a book I checked out from the library today and Agnes, did you know that you're a fictional character??
(I feel like Thursday Next!)

Sessy

02-12-2009, 02:08 AM

I used to have a friend called Agnes. Also there's a saint by that name - I think the name comes from the latin name for lamb.

sk8joyful

02-12-2009, 04:29 AM

I injured my lower back (herniated a lumbar disc), then
surgery.
I'm back in rehab to deal with lingering lower back pain.
I still have left leg weakness, and imbalance from my right side overcompensating.
I still have some residual numbness in my left foot which
interferes with getting the "feel" of the ice at times.

I wish I could make it all go away! for you :)
--
I don't have 'lingering'-pains, nor numbness; but my mind played other tricks,
like
Refusing, to let me pay-Attention, Concentrate, or Focus; just to teach :!: me a lesson 8O
& Refusing to Focus:
thru 1-eye the ice-surface seemed less than 2 feet beneath my nose;
while thru the other eye, I seemed to be suspended from the ceiling, or some other bizarre differences.
Initially, I got dizzy as I was totally dis-oriented. - BUT I stuck with it, and after YEARS, those health-challenges microscopically resolved themselves, THANK God! :D
so,
just last year (like I said), I started being able to concentrate... on what I am FEELing... as I skate. Imagine that! ;)

So, through it all I still skated, but now I am dealing with this setback/relapse in my skills
and tend to be more tentative when I do skate. I still jump and spin but have failed to progress any.
I'm frustrated on many levels.

You jump (& LAND) on numb?? feet; that's amazing!! :D
and
Maybe giving yourself some more resources/time to completely heal... what do you think? ;)

Like for Sessy, I will pray for, & send you healing... Intentions, too! :)
.

sk8joyful

02-12-2009, 05:02 AM

There is one! It's called "deeply bent knees" :twisted:

Hi, is it "Debby?"
Thanks! - as I am forever asking, "shouldn't I bend my knees more?" ;), and
skating friends at our rink respond "Actually you're doing well, with this :D"

In addition to what doubletoe said above, I have my students do crossovers while standing still.

Doing anything, while only standing-STILL on ice, ain't that a bit dangerous?
but yes, years ago I started-out that way

For example, stand with feet about shoulder distance apart.

ok, but if your feet are that far apart, and NO-speed, how will you Balance?? - just asking.
so
when we did it, we placed the foot right next to the other one, crossed over.

Bend L knee to get weight onto L foot. Raise R knee, crossing over the L and lower your body down onto the R foot without straightening out the R knee.
This should result in a definitive shift of weight from L to R.

Forgive me, I realize I forgot to mention at the outset:
that as a Natural-leftie, it's much easier for me to start... practicing CW; and
then ccw is like "we have left!! 8O the known... universe" lol

Do four or five in a row, each time focusing on the shift of weight.
Hold hands with someone and do it together if you need the security.
Another weight shifting exercise that I bring in, when a student sticks the crossing foot in front without lifting the knee,
is to stand at the boards (hold on), and bend one knee deeply, letting the other foot slide back and straighten.

ok, I don't get this: how can a skater cross-over, without?? BENDING BOTH knees -
It seems to me, that the Crossing-foot would bang-into the Skating-foot, no? - and cause the skater to fall, no?

Forgive me, if I mis-understood. And THANKS so much for graciously giving of your time!

Annie

AgnesNitt

02-12-2009, 05:21 PM

Totally OT but I was reading a book I checked out from the library today and Agnes, did you know that you're a fictional character??
(I feel like Thursday Next!)

Agnes Nitt--"the fat girl with the thin one inside--named Perdita" Although I have lost 13.2 lbs and am down to a size 12 skirt (and not one of those fluffybutt skirts, but a real pencil skirt).

Skate@Delaware

02-12-2009, 07:09 PM

There is one! It's called "deeply bent knees" :twisted:

In addition to what doubletoe said above, I have my students do crossovers while standing still. For example, stand with feet about shoulder distance apart. Bend L knee to get weight onto L foot. Raise R knee, crossing over the L and lower your body down onto the R foot without straightening out the R knee. This should result in a definitive shift of weight from L to R. Do four or five in a row, each time focussing on the shift of weight. Hold hands with someone and do it together if you need the security. Another weight shifting exercise that I bring in when a student sticks the crossing foot in front without lifting the knee, is to stand at the boards (hold on), and bend one knee deeply, letting the other foot slide back and straighten.
These are VERY GOOD exercises, and I still do them to GET MY WEIGHT JUST RIGHT and to help me "recover"
I wish I could make it all go away! for you :)
--
I don't have 'lingering'-pains, nor numbness; but my mind played other tricks,
like
Refusing, to let me pay-Attention, Concentrate, or Focus; just to teach :!: me a lesson 8O
& Refusing to Focus:
thru 1-eye the ice-surface seemed less than 2 feet beneath my nose;
while thru the other eye, I seemed to be suspended from the ceiling, or some other bizarre differences.
Initially, I got dizzy as I was totally dis-oriented. - BUT I stuck with it, and after YEARS, those health-challenges microscopically resolved themselves, THANK God! :D
so,
just last year (like I said), I started being able to concentrate... on what I am FEELing... as I skate. Imagine that! ;)

You jump (& LAND) on numb?? feet; that's amazing!! :D
and
Maybe giving yourself some more resources/time to completely heal... what do you think? ;)

Like for Sessy, I will pray for, & send you healing... Intentions, too! :)
.

Thank you so much! It has been my left leg which was numb (now my foot is only numb occasionally) and that is my propelling foot. My landing foot/leg is ok. Had it been the other way around, no way would I have been jumping!

OTOH, it has been my spinning leg and it severely impacted my spins BUT the silver lining has been it has FORCED me to (thru no choice) work on backspins (yes, there is an evil dark force in the universe and when I find it I will toe-pick it in the shins) :twisted:
Agnes Nitt--"the fat girl with the thin one inside--named Perdita" Although I have lost 13.2 lbs and am down to a size 12 skirt (and not one of those fluffybutt skirts, but a real pencil skirt).

YOU GO GIRL!!!! Pencil skirts are so much sexier anyway.....

sk8joyful

02-13-2009, 01:02 AM

my coach helped me fix all the problems on my CW forward crossovers, by telling me to press down on my outside shoulder. Basically, you are leaning into the circle from the hips down, so you have to counter-balance that by pressing your outside shoulder down and leaning your head and shoulder a bit to the outside of the circle. This holds true whether you're doing forward or backward crossovers.

Hi Doubletoe,
ok, I tried to practice this in this morning's practice, and
I guess I'm either doing that already, or I'm not ready yet, I'm not sure which.

Another thing that holds true in both forward and backward crossovers is that your chest should always be facing the inside of the circle. In other words, if you're doing left-over right crossovers, the right shoulder is pulled back and the left shoulder is in front so your chest is rotated to the right and your chest faces inside the circle.
For right-over-left crossovers, the left shoulder stays pulled back and the right shoulder is in front so your chest is rotated to the left and once again faces the inside of the circle.

This I am beginning to do more... guess it's the same ole *confidence*-issue, Thanks!

Look at the front skater (a speed skater) in this picture doing a Crossover (http://images.google.com/url?source=imgres&ct=img&q=http://www.k-kiereta.webpark.pl/edu/wintersports/pictures/speed_skating_sml.jpg&usg=AFQjCNH9voE7e7ToKEJXsSWXbR40zZy0Rw). Ignore the upper body position, which is not right for figure skating, but look at the legs.

Yes, I had a copy of this picture already; &ha-ha, he-he, this is a hoot :!:, as I'm about 1/2-way down there, like a SPEED-skater normally <-- I know what I'm supposed to be doing posture-wise, but not until I get comfy, do I actually manage to STRAIGHTEN-UP :D especially by LOOKing-UP!!! LOL

Can you see how the leg that crossed over is now deeply bent and the other leg is extended behind and to the side? By bending that crossed-over leg, the skater transfers his weight and balance onto that leg.

ok, so today (only practicing my favorite-side=CW) I paid closer-attention, to 'weight-TRANSFER'; and the good thing that did, was (instead of being anxious about crossing-over), I was just Focused on the weight-TRANSFER <-- isn't it a hoot how we manage to fool ourselves, & get right past some (perceived) challenge. - I'm laughing as I type this, lol

Once he feels that he is now balanced over the crossed over leg (the right leg), he can just keep the other leg in its current position and lift it a few inches off the ice.

ok, I haven't quite gotten to the point, where I can keep my under-foot laying sideways like that; nor do I really get it off the ice, until the last minute before I bring it back into position next to the right leg and push off onto it, then do another crossover.

So the weight transfer process is:
(1) You have your weight on your left leg, which is bent
(2) You cross the right leg over it so that now your weight is on both feet.,

I'm good to there :)
then

(3) you bend your right knee deeply and wait until you feel that you are now balanced on the right thigh
(4) Now you can just lift up the left foot, which should be extended behind you (still crossed under the right leg), with the outside of the foot facing the ice.

Try it on the floor in regular shoes first, bending both knees, crossing right over left with a wide step-over, then lifting the left foot off the floor a few inches once you have your weight on the right foot.

OK, will do...
And THANKS alot! too for your kind attention! :) I appreciate it!! - Annie

AgnesNitt

02-13-2009, 09:46 PM

dbny

02-13-2009, 10:26 PM

ok, but if your feet are that far apart, and NO-speed, how will you Balance?? - just asking.

It's actually a really stable position, and if you watch beginners who've had no instruction, that's how they stand on the ice (and usually shuffle along that way too.)

ok, I don't get this: how can a skater cross-over, without?? BENDING BOTH knees -
It seems to me, that the Crossing-foot would bang-into the Skating-foot, no? - and cause the skater to fall, no?

Yes, and that is called "the click of death". :lol: I don't know how they do it, but I've seen this a lot. It produces a motion that I call the chicken walk because there is a kind of rocking forward and back to put that crossing foot on the ice by sticking the foot out instead of raising the knee up to cross. I just fixed this problem in a new student this week. I had him skate on a circle, put feet together, lift the crossing knee, and lower his body onto the bent knee. Sometimes just saying "lower your body" instead of "don't straighten your knee" works.

dbny

02-13-2009, 10:30 PM

Well, it's interesting about crossovers and people having trouble with them. The Big Guy, who can do his spins and jumps both ways, cannot (well, will not) do crossovers. Apparently, he fell once doing one and go a scar on his bald spot, and he's panicked like an Alpha ever since when a crossover's required. .

6'3", 230 pounds. When the Big Guy goes out on the rink it's like watching an aircraft carrier entering New York harbor. When he jumps, all activity in the rink stops to watch in awe.

But he can't do crossovers in the corner.

So when we're on the ice, I like to skate in front of him and do alternating crossovers on the straight just to taunt him.

:lol::lol::lol: That must be fun! :lol::lol::lol:

He really should take the time to get those FXO's. Most of the falls learning FXO's that I've seen are due to catching the toe pick of the under foot. I took my first FXO fall that way, and watched my coach after my lesson to see what happened. Too bad she didn't teach me what I saw her doing! I put my students on the wall and have them lift the toe so they can feel it. Then I have them do a one foot glide with what would be the under foot lifted with the ankle flexed so the toe is up.

sk8joyful

06-19-2009, 04:43 AM

Kat12

06-19-2009, 06:36 AM

^Yes! First the lovely rink I like to go to during the week, which is attached to a school, stopped having their after-school open skate (because, y'know, there's no more school to be after). The rink closest to me doesn't have Saturday night skate right now. The other rink I go to is eliminating weekend open skate for most of the summer (can't figure out why...I would think that would be busier than weekday sessions). And we almost always visit my partner's parents on Sundays, which is the day there IS public skate on my near rink. And as I'm NOT going to drive to his parents' house (which is 12 miles away) separately from him, then drive back here in the middle of the day to skate, then back to his parents' house, I'm going to have to spend some Sundays saying "yeah, I'm not coming over all day so I can spend an hour and a half skating instead" and looking like a jerk (and I know they're not going to understand WHY I don't do all that driving so I can still come over AND skate). But I'm sorry, I drive 30 miles to work ONE way every day, in my poor elderly car. I don't want to put on any more miles than I have to, for the sake of my car, my wallet, and the environment--hell, I skip work socialization functions because they would always require me to drive at least 15 miles. I feel bad that I'm going to drive 12 miles to my skating class rather than going to a closer one, even.

I'm not far enough along in skating yet to get discouraged, but I know I will. I'm an artsy person and not inclined to athletic/physical endeavors. I mean, I've been dancing for four years and this is my second year competing, and I'm still regularly getting my @ss kicked by 12-year-olds at competitions...a girl on a dance forum I go to was recently saying "I've been dancing since January and just went to my first competition and won the trophy!" Meanwhile, I still sometimes don't even place in dances, and know that in one or two more levels I'm going to have to quit so I don't make a fool of myself up there with people who actually know what they're doing (in Highland dance, you get "stamps" if you get a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd in a competition, and once you have six stamps you move up, and the same for the next level, then for the next level you spend a year regardless of how you do at competitions, and then you're in the highest level. So conceivably you could move up through the levels without being very good--all you have to do is get a fluke 3rd place in one dance at a competition and not place in anything else, or place well at a competition where the other dancers aren't very good, and then WHAM you're stuck in the highest level without really being up to that skill level).

This is another reason I'm taking adult classes, though. I don't want a bunch of little kids passing me by. I'd feel like a dolt, and I certainly don't want a bunch of 10-year-olds saying amongst themselves, "gosh, she isn't very good, is she?" I'd feel far better if adults were surpassing me (unless they were 70, I guess...).

Skate@Delaware

06-19-2009, 09:29 AM

sigh,
un-able to practice consistently... is another reason, not to progress as possible.

since I started this thread 4 months ago, I've only been able to practice less than 6x. Anybody else have such challenges?

When I was first learning to skate, I only skated once a week. I then added a second session and that made a huge difference. Later on, I added more but had specific plans/goals for each session. Adding off-ice training helps.

I'm not on the ice now (rink closed for summer hiatus) so I'm doing off-ice training (and my body hates me right now). My schedule looks like this:
Sunday/Tuesday/Thursday-bodyweight training (like weightlifting but without weights; stretching; dance
Monday/Wednesday/Saturday-high level cardio intervals using the elliptical
Tuesday/Saturday-yoga; stretching; dance
Tuesday/Saturday-plyometrics/jump training using light weights, cords & my trampoline (not all at once); stretching; dance

And I mix it up depending on how sore/tired I am and also do some hula hooping with my weight hula hoop.....;)

londonicechamp

06-19-2009, 01:17 PM

Hi

Nice to read everyone's skating progress on here. :lol:

Well, for me, after lesson, yesterday I was doing a bunny hop after the ice resurface, and a lady ice marshall gestured to me that she really admired my bunny jump. Woo hoo. :lol: The lady ice marshall also amazed that at my age (33), I can still do backward shoot the duck. :bow:

Well, yes, I skated from 1997 to 2004, then due to study of professional exams, gave up my ice skating. Only came back in January of this year. When I stopped 4 years ago, I could do jumps, up to toe loop, and scratch spin (but not very good one). Strangely when I go back in January this year, and when I finally finished my Bar exams in end of May, I go ice skating 3 times a week (wed and thur. evening for adult lessons) and I could do the scratch spin (well not holding the leg in front yet) at least 10 revolutions. However, that pair of ice skates, I shipped them back from London to Singapore, won't receive it until the end of July or early August. :roll: I got a spare pair of skates in Singapore, just having to get used to, well can do scratch spin with leg holding in front 3 revolutions max. and with legs crossed max 4 to 5 revolutions. My skating friend was clapping at me after I managed one scratch spin (4 to 5 rev) after holding the leg in front for about 2 revolutions. :lol:

I am also working on mohawk sequence, and cross rolls (backwards). The coach tried to get me not to start from a pushing position first, just a stand still position. Private coach trying to correct my right leg forward crossover, as she said that should be 1 push, and I always have 2 pushes. :frus: However, my left leg crossover is alright. My coach said that it may be due to bad habits I formed when I first learnt ice skating, and my coach did not pay attention to that. :giveup:

Can do sit spin occasionally, but only about 3 revolutions (half sit really). 8O

Toe loop seems to be getting better. Also working on loop sequence, and half loop. Waltz jump, well, sometimes the jump is not that distinct. Argggghhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!! :x Keep working on it. Hopefully some day the jump will be big and distinctive.

londonicechamp

kayskate

06-19-2009, 01:48 PM

I've been working w beginner who could not do anything when she started. NO coordination. But the girl loves it! She has worked hard all season. We started w grps then I gave her a private. The kid has made progress to B3. Her mother and the child are thrilled. As her teacher, so am I. Hard work pays off!

Kay

Skate@Delaware

06-19-2009, 06:54 PM

Can do sit spin occasionally, but only about 3 revolutions (half sit really). 8O

Toe loop seems to be getting better. Also working on loop sequence, and half loop. Waltz jump, well, sometimes the jump is not that distinct. Argggghhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!! :x Keep working on it. Hopefully some day the jump will be big and distinctive.

londonicechamp

I would be soooo happy with even a quarter sit spin! Glad I'm not the only one feeling the frustration with waltz jumps :frus: even tho I can do more advanced jumps, my coach still had me go back to the waltz jump and work on it...

I went shopping today and bought more "equipment" for my home gym:
-10 & 15lb kettlebells
-balance disk
-exercise/therapy ball (my son popped my last one, this one is "anti-burst")
-Tosca Reno's book "Eat Clean Diet" (yeah I need all the help I can get, but I stopped by my mother's to drop off her groceries and she gave me a box of See's Candies to take home-that woman is pure evil -kidding-man that candy is sooo good! So, I'm saving it for my cheat meal day).

sk8joyful

06-19-2009, 11:52 PM

When I was first learning to skate, I only skated once a week.

but prolly you were 'consistent', yes?

Not: 'ok, 1-4x this week; then nothing for 5wks., to 2-3 months' <- mostly useless.
No babe ever learned to walk..., on that schedule; yikes!
and i also
1. endured major family-complications; &
currently: 2 major health-issues, so I can't just skate whenever I fancy.
&
2. need to work, (preferably 1600-0200), as currently i get too tired, to ice-play after 1400.

I then added a second session and that made a huge difference.
Later on, I added more but had specific plans/goals for each session.

Rest assured, there's no lack of "specific... dreams, :lol: goals, or plans" :D <- this dept. is well-rehearsed, on a daily basis, lol

Adding off-ice training helps. My schedule looks like
this:
Sunday/Tues/Thurs: bodyweight training (like weightlifting but without weights; stretching; dance
Mon/Wed/Sat: high level cardio intervals using the elliptical
Tues/Sat: yoga; stretching; dance
plyometrics/jump training using light weights, cords & my trampoline (not all at once); stretching; dance

ok; so do you do all these "off-ice trainings", also by yourself? - or
do you practice with :) family & friends...
i ask
'cause after playing-around on the ice by my lonesome,
I'm too extroverted, to do more of the same 'off-ice'.

I just gotta have some company... :), for Ballet, Pilates, Stretching, & especially Trampoline, etc.

(one of these days, I also wanna learn to Swim)

And I mix it up depending on how sore/tired I am and
also do some hula hooping with my weight hula hoop.....;)

ooh, I used to play with a 'hula hoop' in gradeschool. Where did you buy yours?

Thanks! so much for your sharing... :)
.

sk8joyful

06-20-2009, 12:34 AM

Hi
Nice to read everyone's skating progress on here. :lol:
Well,
for me, after lesson, yesterday -
* admired bunny hop
* lady ice marshall also amazed that at my age (33), I can still do 'backward shoot the duck'. :bow:
* scratch spin (well not holding the leg in front yet) at least 10 revolutions.
* I am also working on mohawk sequence, and cross rolls (backwards).
* Toe loop seems to be getting better.
* Also working on loop sequence, and half loop.
* Waltz jump, well, sometimes the jump is not that distinct.
Hopefully some day the jump will be big and distinctive.

londonicechamp

I C (says she), this "Encouraging beginners..." ;) thread
has jumped... :bow: tracks again. um, about a light-year... away, lol
Congratulations!!!
well,
for me (with my last formal-lesson in Feb., no current classes, & no coach),
I continue Discovering... what I am feeling where, as I skate..., iow, the KINESTHETICS
Hm,
maybe start a new thread ;)
.

Kat12

06-20-2009, 09:09 AM

^ LOL, it's always awkward when everyone else is like "I'm about to learn my triple Lutz!" and you're like, "I finally let go of the wall today!"

I felt that way at first too. Then decided, "hell, I have as much of a right to post that I am learning crossovers as everyone else has to post about axels and sit spins," so I do. It IS still difficult to find folks who are just starting out, though. Maybe we need a "Beginners Club" here for those of us who've been skating less than six months/are in Basic 8s or below Basic 5 or 6 or something... :)

Skate@Delaware

06-20-2009, 11:06 AM

but prolly you were 'consistent', yes?
~~snipped
Rest assured, there's no lack of "specific... dreams, :lol: goals, or plans" :D <- this dept. is well-rehearsed, on a daily basis, lol
~~snipped
ok; so do you do all these "off-ice trainings", also by yourself? - or
do you practice with :) family & friends...
i ask 'cause after playing-around on the ice by my lonesome,
I'm too extroverted, to do more of the same 'off-ice'.

I just gotta have some company... :), for Ballet, Pilates, Stretching, & especially Trampoline, etc.

(one of these days, I also wanna learn to Swim)

ooh, I used to play with a 'hula hoop' in gradeschool. Where did you buy yours?

Thanks! so much for your sharing... :)
.
To answer your questions: Um, no at the beginning I was NOT consistent (unless you count how terrified I was to move away from the security of the wall), I used to just get on the ice and muck around without any specific idea of what to do on practice ice. After a while I decided (it was my coach's idea) I needed a plan & goals so that's what I came up with for each month, year, and practice session.

I practice my off-ice stuff by myself (all alone), although sometimes my son (age 13) jumps on the trampoline with me. I don't have a problem doing ANYTHING by myself, I'm a 47-year-old female skater, the only adult at my rink that competes, and I'm usually in a "class by myself" sort of category. That being said, I've gotten used to doing many things by myself from skating to archery, kayaking, etc. So, no it doesn't bother me as most of my girlfriends don't do ANY of my same activities. I zone out and hit it. I don't mind company but I don't need it LOL!

And last, I bought my hula hoop at my rink (one of the girls sells them there) but you can buy them online. Check out www.sports-hoop.com (http://www.sports-hoop.com) or www.hooping.org (http://www.hooping.org) for more info about them (these are links I googled).
^ LOL, it's always awkward when everyone else is like "I'm about to learn my triple Lutz!" and you're like, "I finally let go of the wall today!"

I felt that way at first too. Then decided, "hell, I have as much of a right to post that I am learning crossovers as everyone else has to post about axels and sit spins," so I do. It IS still difficult to find folks who are just starting out, though. Maybe we need a "Beginners Club" here for those of us who've been skating less than six months/are in Basic 8s or below Basic 5 or 6 or something... :)

By the way, I may be doing some (haha not all) jumps and spins but I am STILL working on edges & crossovers, even more since my injury!!!! And even if I did not have to work harder because of the injury & resulting muscular imbalances, my coach would MAKE me do it anyway because you ALWAYS need to work on & fine-tune the basics! Even before I hurt my back, we would go back and work on edges, knee bend, pointing toes, arms, crossovers, stroking, etc. because you CAN'T do ANY of the advanced stuff if you don't have the basics down!!! So yes, I jump back into the beginners club all the time!

It is hilarious to have the little kids (even ones working on doubles) ask me "why are you doing edges????" and "is your coach mad at you?" hahaha!!! I say "it makes me a BETTER SKATER!" They can DO their jumps & spins but where is the finesse?

dbny

06-20-2009, 02:10 PM

sigh,
un-able to practice consistently... is another reason, not to progress as possible.

since I started this thread 4 months ago, I've only been able to practice less than 6x. Anybody else have such challenges?

I coach, so I'm on the ice almost every day (and that does help), BUT, there are many weeks when I don't have the time, or am too tired to actually practice. It shows.

I've been working w beginner who could not do anything when she started. NO coordination. But the girl loves it! She has worked hard all season. We started w grps then I gave her a private. The kid has made progress to B3. Her mother and the child are thrilled. As her teacher, so am I. Hard work pays off!

Very true. I also have a student who is a beginner and could not do a one foot glide or F swizzles when he started. He was skating once a week and making progress slowly. Then, all of a sudden, I saw a huge change in him, and found out he was getting to the rink three times a week.

"hell, I have as much of a right to post that I am learning crossovers as everyone else has to post about axels and sit spins," so I do. It IS still difficult to find folks who are just starting out, though. Maybe we need a "Beginners Club" here for those of us who've been skating less than six months/are in Basic 8s or below Basic 5 or 6 or something... :)

Keep in mind that many of us may be relatively "advanced" in some areas, but beginners in others. I've been told I look really good, smooth, etc on the ice, but I've been struggling with FO and FI three turns for many years. BO threes are hesitant and I have not really tackled BI threes yet. I am a truly crummy spinner. I teach all of those things, and jumps too, but I don't do them, so I'm a beginner in that respect. The only reason I can teach is that I was a gold roller dancer when young, so I have the eye and the technical understanding. There are some relatively simple things that I know I will never master because I'm too scared of the potential for injury to really work at them.

londonicechamp

06-21-2009, 01:00 PM

Skate@Delaware

06-21-2009, 05:01 PM

Hi Skate@Delaware

Yes, should perhaps be happy about my half sit really. Can sometimes do only 2.5 revolutions. That is coz I am still getting used to the pair of ice skates I have in Singapore, where I am living now.

Hi sk8joyful

Thanks for your encouragement. I shall keep up my ice skating, as long as I am healthy and not yet started a family. 2 2o light years away, like your sense of humour. :lol: Body energy level is not as good as when I first learnt ice skating in my early 20s. When I first learnt, I can skate for 2 to 3 hours non stop, without feeling tired. Now, after about 2 hours, will feel slightly tired. :roll: Must be to do with my age. 8O

londonicechamp

Before I hurt my back, I had a very lovely hunched-over semi-squat spin that in no way shape or form remotely resembled a sit-spin!!! LOl! My coach INSISTED that I keep working on it....8O I got a brief reprieve after my injury but she revisited it when I was somewhat recovered. It had NOT improved at all. I had become weaker in my legs though and was not able to get as low as before (or as high?)

I'm 47 and have to manage my energy levels...I can't skate for HOURS on end; I do take frequent breaks and make sure I eat better.

dbny

06-21-2009, 05:55 PM

Body energy level is not as good as when I first learnt ice skating in my early 20s. When I first learnt, I can skate for 2 to 3 hours non stop, without feeling tired. Now, after about 2 hours, will feel slightly tired. :roll: Must be to do with my age. 8O

Age can make a huge difference. When I was a kid, doing roller dance, I skated 5 and 6 hours a day almost every day (with some breaks, of course). Now, at 62, not only is 2 hours just about my limit, but if I'm on the ice working (teaching, not my own skating, so a lot of standing around) for 4 to 5 hours Sat & Sun, then I have to take Mon off. Ice dance has helped build my endurance a lot, but I know there are limits imposed by age.

Skate@Delaware

06-21-2009, 07:47 PM

Age can make a huge difference. When I was a kid, doing roller dance, I skated 5 and 6 hours a day almost every day (with some breaks, of course). Now, at 62, not only is 2 hours just about my limit, but if I'm on the ice working (teaching, not my own skating, so a lot of standing around) for 4 to 5 hours Sat & Sun, then I have to take Mon off. Ice dance has helped build my endurance a lot, but I know there are limits imposed by age.

Yes but with age comes wisdom (hopefully!) to recognize that energy needs to be rationed out! And to work smarter and not quite as hard (altho working hard tends to be a relative term).

niupartyangel

06-21-2009, 08:33 PM

Been working on pre-bronze MITF...my coach says she's amazed at my progress on the different test elements...she said the crossovers no longer give her gray hair :P because i'm no longer toe pushing and even if I wear, usually it's only one or two times she could see that I did so. And the fact that my crossovers are nice and even, plus keeping the same beat/rhythm rather than before would drive her crazy. Ditto for forward stroking and backward edges...even my waltz 8 is really great. My only problem now is the left side of the waltz 8. My coach drew me a way bigger circle to follow, and I cannot hold the first LFO 3 turn that long :x. The right side is okay though. And the last "weirdo pattern" as we call it...i'm still shaky but she said at least I know what I'm doing now and we just gotta polish it up.

Also been working on my scratch spin...can't quite get the free foot totally in the front to cross....i think it's a mental thing. Salchows and toe loops are great. Been working on the loop but haven't landed it yet. My coach said she'll put me on the harness so I can get the feeling of the loop...can adults use the harness? I only see kids being put on it. My husband was like, "oh really? THIS i gotta see!" lol.

Clarice

06-21-2009, 09:37 PM

Yeah, I've used the harness. We have the kind suspended from the ceiling - I don't think the "fishing pole" kind would generally work well for adults. I don't especially like it, though - I find the straps really annoying. It doesn't prevent you from falling, but allows your coach to soften the blow. The coach can also buy you a little time in the air, so you can get the feeling of fully rotating a jump. I only used it for axels (which I've since given up on). For the other single jumps, I mostly worked on off-ice rotations.

niupartyangel

06-24-2009, 07:29 PM

Skate@Delaware

06-25-2009, 07:25 AM

Thanks...we will be using the kind that hangs from the ceiling. I have been practicing it off ice but I still can't get the full 1 foot rotation on ice. The most I can do is a half rotation and land it two footed :P Guess we'll see how it is this weekend.

Can you get a full rotation off-ice? How about 3/4 rotation? An exercise out of the Poe book has a skater stand on 2 feet hip or shoulder-width apart and rotate 1/4 turn, then rotate back to start; rotate 1/2 turn, then rotate back to start; rotate 3/4 turn, then rotate back to start; and last rotate 1 full turn, then rotate back to start. So each time, you rotate one way, then back to start. This can also be done on one foot but I'd recommend getting it down on 2 feet first. This is a speed drill-you are going for several things when you do this:
-quickness in obtaining the turn
-stability in landing and holding the same position

This drill is effective for many of the jumps. When you can do these well and can land from a full rotation without falling over then try it on one foot. Snap into that landing position each time.

sk8joyful

06-25-2009, 04:52 PM

^ LOL,
it's always awkward when everyone else is like "I'm about to learn my triple Lutz!"
and
you're like, "I finally let go of the wall today!"

Not quite that exaggerated, but one of 3 reasons I haven't posted here much.

Another reason: most skaters, thankfully, have no clue what 'health-challenges' - some of us started with, & lingering,
can get soo frustrating. - BUT the point is I have, by sheer persistance :), just found 3 important resources I need, to help me
move forward more safely... and naturally I'm thinking this will give me more confidence...
however, unfortunately I don't think it's going to be Success-overnight (not that it ever is anyway) -

I felt that way at first too. Then decided, "hell, I have as much of a right to post that I am learning crossovers,
as everyone else has to post about axels and sit spins," so I do.

Well, and then (unless Board-members "practice, or compete" together), no one else can OBSERVE us skate...,
so people are limited in how much help they can give. - Being embarassed :( to say much of anything, mostly I just read,
often wondering what I am even doing here.

It IS still difficult to find folks who are just starting out, though. Maybe we need a "Beginners Club" here
for those of us who've been skating less than six months/are in Basic 8s or below Basic 5 or 6 or something... :)

I already asked about a "Beginners Club" at one time, thought that would be kewl. -
However, noticing how many adult-beginners have
passed (those of us majorly physically-challenged) at the rink,
such a group would be just one more downer, so no, I don't think that's beneficial either.

When I had a coach, one day I told her "something similar to 'Special-olympics',
we should have a class for skaters like me, to help each other our goals achieve..." - and
she even had no clue what I was talking about, sigh.
--- that said,

I enjoyed a nice (albeit short) practice this morning, including
asking 'grandpa' (our skate-Sharpener :D extra-ordinaire!!) "so, aside adding-back my extensions on my stroking,
how will I get from stepping..., to feeling & looking, like I know what I'm doing, lol" and
he said
"ah, did you forget ;) to push-OFF with your Stationary-foot, so your other foot can glide...";
and I said "apparently so :lol:"; so we rehearsed that on the floor, & then he watched me skate it, with
"YEAH, now you're doing it right, again. See how much more natural that feels!" -
and
Another thing I am noticing, or maybe better said, I appreciate more about my skating:
I no longer throw... myself forward, hoping for the best. No, I can actually Focus, & Concentrate, & set my Intent, &
then whatever results, I praise myself for it (instead of being dis-appointed, when I don't get it on 1st. attempt.)
Instead, I have returned to "ok, let's try this again, & again, & again...and as I notice incremental progress, I PRAISE myself :D again.
Which, when you think of it, is exactly how I parented :) too.

Anyway, hopefully another (un-usually challenged) skater can from this take some encouragement, & also think of themself well... :)
.

Skate@Delaware

06-25-2009, 07:54 PM

Not quite that exaggerated, but one of 3 reasons I haven't posted here much.

Another reason: most skaters, thankfully, have no clue what 'health-challenges' - some of us started with, & lingering,
can get soo frustrating. - BUT the point is I have, by sheer persistance :), just this week found 3 important resources I need, to help me move forward more safely... and naturally I'm thinking this will give me more confidence...
however, unfortunately I don't think it's going to be Success-overnight (not that it ever is anyway) -

Well, and then (unless Board-members "practice, or compete" together), no one else can OBSERVE us skate...,
so people are limited in how much help they can give. - Being embarassed :( to say much of anything, mostly I just read,
often wondering what I am even doing here.

Here is a video of my first competition, done a few years ago. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzVeMwvgXlM

Cruise around and you will see a few more skating videos. I did another competition (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhbLeDO28LY) when I was still suffering from my herniated disc (I could not feel my left leg below the knee and was forbidden by my doctor to jump or do full-out spins). I just finished one on April 4th but haven't put up the video. Yeah, I'm not even close to "smooth and accomplished" but hey, I'm out there having fun! I'm the only adult at my rink (out of 5) that competes and have been skating for a little over 6 years now (not overnight success, right? ;) Sometimes I wonder what I'm doing out there!!!)

So keep on doing EXACTLY what you are doing! Not for anyone else but for yourself!

sk8joyful

06-25-2009, 10:51 PM

Here is a video of my first competition, done a few years ago. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzVeMwvgXlM

Cruise around and you will see a few more skating videos. I did another competition (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhbLeDO28LY) when I was still suffering from my herniated disc (I could not feel my left leg below the knee and was forbidden by my doctor to jump or do full-out spins).
I'm out there having fun!
I'm the only adult at my rink (out of 5) that competes...

So keep on doing EXACTLY what you are doing! Not for anyone else but for yourself!

THANK you so much for sharing!

Tho o/o necessity, in the 2nd. video you scaled back your skating, yet it was very nice!
and
Your 1st. competition: what a wonderful Spiral :D, and nicely-centered Spin :) you showed.
And then, your two Waltz-jumps :bow: lovely!! - You skated really well.

Today during practice, a teenager skated no less than 52 consecutive Waltz-jumps, lol - and she was still upright at the end.

As soon as I get my BOE, I'll be skating waltz-jumps too, I can hardly wait ;)

londonicechamp

06-26-2009, 03:32 AM

Hi Skate@Delaware

I agree with sk8joyful's comments on your first competition. The first video is better than the second one. Yet, I understand that you had setbacks from your injuries on the second one. Given that, the second skating is not too bad either.

When I used to skate in the UK, my coach used to make me do 10 waltz jumps, and I was still upright after that. :D

Keep up the good work.

londonicechamp

niupartyangel

06-27-2009, 10:03 AM

Can you get a full rotation off-ice? How about 3/4 rotation? An exercise out of the Poe book has a skater stand on 2 feet hip or shoulder-width apart and rotate 1/4 turn, then rotate back to start; rotate 1/2 turn, then rotate back to start; rotate 3/4 turn, then rotate back to start; and last rotate 1 full turn, then rotate back to start. So each time, you rotate one way, then back to start. This can also be done on one foot but I'd recommend getting it down on 2 feet first. This is a speed drill-you are going for several things when you do this:
-quickness in obtaining the turn
-stability in landing and holding the same position

This drill is effective for many of the jumps. When you can do these well and can land from a full rotation without falling over then try it on one foot. Snap into that landing position each time.

I can do 3/4 rotation off ice on one foot, sometimes 1 full rotation but not consistently. I haven't heard of the exercise above but i will definitely try it! anything will help me at this point. my coach put me on the harness today just so I can have the feeling of taking off the right backoutside edge and doing the 1 full rotation. it was awkward because i never used the harness before but i guess it helped. she said it'll be better next week.

I also don't have my back spin yet so I know that's another issue too, we're working on that as well. I can only manage 1 rotation on the backspin, sometimes 1 1/2 and i wobble around. :giveup:

Pre-Bronze MIF are going great though!

Skate@Delaware

06-29-2009, 02:04 PM

I can do 3/4 rotation off ice on one foot, sometimes 1 full rotation but not consistently. I haven't heard of the exercise above but i will definitely try it! anything will help me at this point. my coach put me on the harness today just so I can have the feeling of taking off the right backoutside edge and doing the 1 full rotation. it was awkward because i never used the harness before but i guess it helped. she said it'll be better next week.

I also don't have my back spin yet so I know that's another issue too, we're working on that as well. I can only manage 1 rotation on the backspin, sometimes 1 1/2 and i wobble around. :giveup:

Pre-Bronze MIF are going great though!
I just finished up adult skating camp at Hackensack NJ this past weekend and for the first time actually managed a better backspin than I've had all year....from a 2-foot spin! It took a few tries to get the weight shift just right but when I did wow it was great fun! You might want to give it a try and see if that works for you. Be sure to stay lower in the knee at first when you shift your weight and rapidly cross the free foot over instead of leaving it out.