A few stoning questions...

[badaxel]

Okay, I've asked for a new dress for Christmas, in the hopes that it will motivate me to get my Novice MIF together so that I can wear the dress. Anyway, I'd like to stone the dress, but I have some questions for all of you master stoners out there!!

1. Which is better- the BeJeweler, the Kandi Kane? And what about the Professional Touch- made by Kandi Kane, but prettier?

2. What if you want to use non- standard shapes, like a tear drop? Do you have to resort to E6000 or GemTac? Or is there a way to do it with hotfix?

3. Does it look bad if you mix colored and crystal AB stones?

4. What about non-Swarovski stones, are they any good? WOuld it make sense for me to use cheaper stones, since this is my first attempt, or will I be unhappy with the results?

Thanks in advance for your help!!!

[sk8tmum]

I use the Bejeweler; it works great for me. Also I can buy individual tips easily from my retailer if I need spare ones. I also use 2 at the same time, so that I have 2 different tip sizes hot for doing different sizes of stones ...

Non-standard stones: I use the hot spot tip (it's solid) and melt the stones on bit by bit. After they set for about 24 hours, I check them and remelt if needed. I find that I have more hassles with the non-standard ones, but, they are still very easy with hotfix.

I mix coloured, crystal AB and coloured AB regularly; it depends on the dress and the style. The crystal AB complement many coloured stones well. Check out a dress or two that you like for ideas on how to creatively stone. I always plan before I stone ... it's hard to undo placed stones.

I've used Preciosa hotfix, and they work for me reasonably well especially in the smaller stones (under 20SS). Other than the Preciosa (Czech) types, I don't know: it's not just the crystal quality, it's the quality of the glue. I'm able to wash my Swarovski hotfix dresses (handwash) - and that's something that I value ... where I have seen random rhinestones on the floor at the arena, they're usually NOT Swarovskis. And, if I'm going 30SS or higher, I want Swarovskis, because that's when I'm going for major flash and I like the Swarovski effect.

[phoenix]

I've also used the Preciosa & I think they're very good--and much less expensive overall than Swarovski.

I don't know about the hot fix--I always glue on all my stones. I use the E6000 glue & if the dress itself is washable, I can put it right in the washer/dryer, & I've never lost a stone.

[katz in boots]

I haven't been able to get Preciosa crystals in Oz, but have tried some cheaper hotfix and have to say they really do not compare with Swarovski in the amount of sparkle. I would definitely agree it is worth paying for Swarovski for larger sizes, and perhaps a mixture of Swarovski & a cheaper type for smaller sizes.

My hotfix applicator is a L'Orna decorative touch wand, but I am considering buying a Bejeweler. I haven't had much success with the applicator tips, the 'hot-spot' tip or the special glue. My crystals are usually falling off before I get on the ice, let alone surviving hand-washing, whichever method I use. I wonder whether it is because I have to use an adapter for American electrical products, so plan to get a Bejeweler especially designed for my country.

I've also bought some of the special Mylar paper you can buy, so that I can place the design on the paper then iron the design on. I suffer from shaky hands, so the transfer design might eliminate some of my stress.

[vesperholly]

I like the look of mixed colors and AB stones.

You probably don't need Swarovski. Lots of money for not much more bling.

[Isk8NYC]

For skating dresses, I've always sewn or glued on the stones. I wanted to try something new, so I picked up the supplies for the heat-fix stoning last month.

I bought a "Fire and Ice" applicator and stones at Michael's. (It's a Kandi Kane tool - the tips of the iron actually had that brand name on them) I also bought some Swarovski gemstones, which were far more expensive.

First, I tried the Teflon sheet iron-on-in-bulk approach, but the stones just wouldn't adhere, so I went over them one-by-one with the tool. (Heat the tool, pick up the stone, turn it upside down, wait for the glue to melt, put it back down in the same spot, hold it, then move on.) It's tedious, but once you get a rhythm, it's not too bad.

I like the look of mixed colors and AB stones.

You probably don't need Swarovski. Lots of money for not much more bling.I was very disappointed with the Swarovski stones - they just wouldn't get hot enough to melt the glue. Maybe it was because of the tool?

I ended up glueing some of them onto the dress, but mostly using non-Swarovski stones for the bulk of the work. A few of the knockoffs also popped off, so I replaced them using glue. (I had already burned myself three times with the tool. Enough was enough.)

Frankly, the regular stones were fine for the girls' skating dresses. The Swarovski stones were more sparkly up close, but from a distance they weren't any more impressive than the knockoff brand. I ended up returning 3/4 of the Swarovski's I purchased for the project.

I would give the hotfix applicator another try, but I think glueing them on with jewel glue is easier and has better results.

There are a bunch of threads that I checked out before using the hotfix tool. Try searching the tags for "rhinestones."


TIP: Buy or make a cardboard "form" to slip inside the dress while you're working with either glue or hotfix. I covered it with foil to use the soldering iron. You wouldn't believe how many "spots" either method produces on the inside of the dress - you don't want the back of the dress to get pock-marked. It also makes it easier to work with the stretch fabrics.

[Isk8NYC]

I use the E6000 glue & if the dress itself is washable, I can put it right in the washer/dryer, & I've never lost a stone.I've had good luck with glued stones too. I use the jewel glue from some craft store or another.

Someone at the rink said that the E6000 glue isn't available anymore because it contained cancer-causing ingredients. Maybe people were gluing them onto their skin, lol. Not sure if that's true or not, but if you really like that glue, you might want to check out the rumor.

[patatty]

I have the Bejeweler, and it works great. I have only used round stones, so I can't advise you regarding the non-standard shapes, but with with the round Swarovski stones, it is perfect. I never have a problem with them falling off, even after washing. I have mixed colored and AB in my last two dresses and they came out really nice - especially if the colored ones are dark, the AB ones give the dress a little more flash. I had one dress that was navy blue, and I used light blue and AB stones on it and it was beautiful. My other dress was red and I mixed red and AB and that worked well too, especially since red stones on red fabric don't stand out very well by themselves.

[Sessy]

3. Does it look bad if you mix colored and crystal AB stones?

4. What about non-Swarovski stones, are they any good? WOuld it make sense for me to use cheaper stones, since this is my first attempt, or will I be unhappy with the results?

AB and Color mixes look great.

Non-swarovski stones can look good, depends really. The dark coloured ones such as dark red tend to be very bland by cheap brands, but the lighter colors tend to still have a lot of sparkle left. I stoned a dress with some brandless hotfix acryllic crystals even, and they didn't come off in the laundry, and the white and pink and salad and light blue ones sparkled okay (the darker colors didn't). Even just comparing it to mom's swarovski dresses, yeah there's a noticeable difference in sparkle. The sparkle factor is probably like thrice lower on the cheap acryl crystals. But then 10 euro for 1000 hotfix stones in size 20... Y'know.
If you're still a beginner, nobody's really expecting a lot of sparkle off your dresses anyway - in fact, it might even look a little pretentuous to wear a dress stoned shut.

[Sessy]

I've had good luck with glued stones too. I use the jewel glue from some craft store or another.

Someone at the rink said that the E6000 glue isn't available anymore because it contained cancer-causing ingredients. Maybe people were gluing them onto their skin, lol. Not sure if that's true or not, but if you really like that glue, you might want to check out the rumor.

Mom uses it. I don't think it's the glueing onto the skin that's the problem - it's inhaling the vapors. Man, even with the windows open, working with that glue smelled the whole house up!

On the other hand. Dresses stoned with E6000 could be washed in the washing mashine on a short, cautious, cold cycle.

I did a little googling and found out that E6000 is apparently going to be produced with toluene instead of the p-something chemical they produce it with now, in the USA anyway. In Canada they're sticking with the old formula for now because the chemical is still legal, apparently. I don't know where they'll import the E6000 in Europe from in the future, but I can imagine changing the formula might affect its effectiveness adversely (or not).

After reading the effects of the E6000 I'm starting to wonder whether mom's sinus infections before competitions weren't E6000-related btw.

[LWalsh]

I stone all of my dresses using swarovski crystals and the bejeweler with no problems. I do find that the AB stones have the most sparkle. The colored stones (even swarovski) just don't seem to have the same sparkle. Some of the colors like black are significantly less sparkly than others. I tend to think that the darker the color, the less sparkle.

Here's a tip. Do not buy hotfix crystals from a craft store. Buy them in bulk on eBay and you will pay MUCH less $$$. You a gross of the 20ss size for around $20-25. The craft stores don't sell the quantity you'll need either. I normally use a minimum of 2 gross, and I've been know to use up to 5 gross on a competition dress.

Lara

[badaxel]

WOW!! Thanks, guys! I think I'm going to go with the BeJeweler and the Swaovskis. I jsut don't want to do all of this work, on the dress and the Novice Moves, and not have the dress live up to my expectations!

I think I'm going to mix the crystal AB and the colored stones. My dress is a lavender/ lilac color. Would you all recommend using a darker or lighter purple stone? Should I use the purple AB stones or just the regular purples?
THANKS!!! I'm so excited!!!

[Clarice]

I think I'm going to mix the crystal AB and the colored stones. My dress is a lavender/ lilac color. Would you all recommend using a darker or lighter purple stone? Should I use the purple AB stones or just the regular purples?


It depends what kind of design you're doing, and what kind of effect you're after. AB stones will pick up the color of your dress a little, and will tend to blend better. If you're going to scatter stones over a particular area, colors darker than your dress, particularly if they're not ABs, will tend to look a little spotty. If you're using the stone to trace a solid line, though, the darker color might look nice. I just did a lavender dress for my daughter, and we used all crystal ABs.

If you want to try matching the color, rather than contrasting, you might consider tanzanite, light vitrail, or light amethyst - you'll have to see what looks best on your fabric. I see that the site I order my stones from has listed some new Swarovski colors that don't appear on the color chart I bought years ago - violet and lilac might work for you.

I highly recommend getting a color chart if you can't actually go to a shop with your dress to lay stones out on it to see what works. I go to a shop when I can, and sometimes find that the most unlikely colors look really good when laid out on the dress.

[Isk8NYC]

I stone all of my dresses using swarovski crystals and the bejeweler with no problems. It's probably the tool I used that kept the more expensive jewels from working. Maybe it doesn't get hot enough, although my burnt fingers would disagree with that assessment, lol. I was tempted to pull out my stained glass soldering iron, but I figured that was over-the-top.

I wanted a vine-like pattern for one of the dresses, so I used a set of french curve tools. (You can buy them at craft or office supply stores) It felt rather unimaginative, though it turned out pretty. (but simple)

How do others come up with the designs and layouts for the stones?

[jskater49]

It's probably the tool I used that kept the more expensive jewels from working. Maybe it doesn't get hot enough, although my burnt fingers would disagree with that assessment, lol. I was tempted to pull out my stained glass soldering iron, but I figured that was over-the-top.

I wanted a vine-like pattern for one of the dresses, so I used a set of french curve tools. (You can buy them at craft or office supply stores) It felt rather unimaginative, though it turned out pretty. (but simple)

How do others come up with the designs and layouts for the stones?

I just spread them around on my dress until I come up with something I like. I really wanted to do a candy cane stripe thing with my last dress but that required straight lines and I'm just not that precise. I just did some around the neck and back - but that way I can use my dress for a freestyle and not just one program!

I don't use any fancy tools - just the glue with the fumes that cause cancer and a tooth pick.

j

[Sessy]

I don't use any fancy tools - just the glue with the fumes that cause cancer and a tooth pick.

j

You should really consider upgrading to tweezers. Also pays off to dish out on a more expensive pair rather than the $0.50 tweezers from a thrift store. My favourite tweezers by far for stoning are the ones that came with my overlock with a really flat, wide end - kinda like a miniature barbeque grip... lol.

So, badaxel, you stoned yet? ;)

[jenlyon60]

I hand-glue (and am pretty fast at it....)

I have used a couple tricks to help with straight lines.

Since I tend to use a pillow as a "body form" and put the dress on that, straight pins and a ruler help to make a nice straight line. I then pull out the straight pins as I work my way down the line. Or sometimes (depending on the color of the dress and the material), I'll use a water-soluable very fine point pen to mark where I want stones to go. Then glue the stone on top of the pen marking.

[jskater49]

[QUOTE=Sessy;380904]You should really consider upgrading to tweezers. Also pays off to dish out on a more expensive pair rather than the $0.50 tweezers from a thrift store. My favourite tweezers by far for stoning are the ones that came with my overlock with a really flat, wide end - kinda like a miniature barbeque grip... lol.

[QUOTE]

Nope. Tried tweezers. They get all mucked up with the glue. When the tooth pick gets mucked up, throw it away and get a new one. I like my system. Pour out the stones in a dish, try to get them upside down. Dip the tooth pick in the glue...pick up the stone with the toothpick and glue, place it on the dress. Works pretty good.

Joelle

[jskater49]

I hand-glue (and am pretty fast at it....)

I have used a couple tricks to help with straight lines.

Since I tend to use a pillow as a "body form" and put the dress on that, straight pins and a ruler help to make a nice straight line. I then pull out the straight pins as I work my way down the line. Or sometimes (depending on the color of the dress and the material), I'll use a water-soluable very fine point pen to mark where I want stones to go. Then glue the stone on top of the pen marking.

Ack...where was this advice when I was trying to make a candy cane? But don't the pins put a lot of holes in the dress?

j

[jenlyon60]

Nope. I don't do continuous almost touching pins, for one thing. I space them out about 1/2 inch apart (which is enough for me to keep the line straight).

And I've used this technique on spandex and stretch velvet. Mesh has little holes, so no "piercing the fabric"

You want to use very fine straight pins if possible (they come in a couple of grades... the best are "fine" and "Super fine". JoAnns and other fabric stores generally carry them (just checked Joann's website, and the super-fine pins are carried there).

[Isk8NYC]

There's a "pickup" tool they sell at the craft stores for beading and stoning. It is a small stick - a bit longer than a cotton swab - that has beeswax at the ends instead of cotton. It is AWESOME for picking up stones once they're facing the right side up.

Whenever you work with knits like spandex, you should use ball point pins. They are sold in the sewing sections of craft/fabric stores. (You should use ball point needles in your machines as well, if you're sewing spandex.)
Ball point pins don't leave holes because they slip between the threads instead of puncturing the fabric.

[slusher]

I have a kandi kane, I think ! pink and purple. I use a medium flat tip almost all the time. I put the stones on the dress and then just heat them up by holding the flat tip on top, after a while you know when the glue has bubbled and it will set. It works for all shapes doing this way. I found the shaped tips for diamonds to be a pain as the glue would get stuck on the side and then the stone go stuck. I'm also impatient as hell with the one by one method.

I put a teflon sheet under the dress so nothing sticks in case the glue goes through. Going through is a good thing, the stones are definitely set! I have had good success with laying out stones and using a teflon sheet on top and setting them with the household iron. I do have an ancient iron, without steam holes and it's super hot, maybe that's the difference.

[stacyf419]

I got the Bejeweler and did the other half of my stretch velvet dress using Swarovski hotfix - at least 10 of them fell off when I tried it on 2 days later, whereas none of the stones I had done with the E6000 have come off yet. Also, it took me a lot longer - it was so irritating! I'm sure it's just personal preference and skill (or lack thereof in my case), but I find the glue quick and easy, so I stick with that. I also ordered a few of those pickup sticks from Rhinestone Guy with my last order, so am looking forward to using them when I stone my new dress.

PS - my new dress is a Sharene and I'm in love with it - I take it out of the closet about 5 times a day! It's this (http://www.shareneskatewear.com/shoppe/product_info.php?cPath=21&products_id=42) in purple and I added the short sleeves in lace.

[Sessy]

Nope. Tried tweezers. They get all mucked up with the glue. When the tooth pick gets mucked up, throw it away and get a new one. I like my system. Pour out the stones in a dish, try to get them upside down. Dip the tooth pick in the glue...pick up the stone with the toothpick and glue, place it on the dress. Works pretty good.

Joelle

Well I use hotfix myself so there. But mom uses tweezers but she does it the other way around. She applies the glue to the fabric first, then puts the stones on top. I stoned my laptop and stuff that way as well.

[jenlyon60]

When I've done stoning directly on single layer mesh (aka dance skirts), I've used E-6000 (since the gumminess works better for me for setting stones on mesh vice the Gem-Tac).

And I've used a technique similar to jskater49... I put stones upside down on a breadplate or such. I put a bit of E-6000 on a piece of shiny-side up freezer paper. I put some shiny-side up freezer paper underneath the part of the skirt on which I'm working. I take a toothpick, stick it in the spot of glue and put a dab of E-6000 on the end of it, pick up a stone. Put the stone where I want it, press lightly with finger and pull out toothpick. Every so often (after every 10-20 stones) I have to squeeze some more glue out of the tube.

But still quite fast, and sets up quicker than Gem-Tac. And when I'm space-limited (dance skirts having a much larger circumference than freestyle skirts), it helps a lot.

[RachelSk8er]

I buy Swarovskis from a local fabric shop (Carmen, an elderly gentleman, he's at a lot of midwest comps selling fabric/stones). I like that I can take a dress in there, play around with stone colors and layout a bit, and if I don't buy enough it's just 5 min from my house and I can get more easily. I glue them all on by hand with E6000. Those of you who know me know I don't hold back when it comes to stoning dresses (thanks to spending most of my skating career doing synchro and not being allowed to wear stones), so that's A LOT of time/glue/stones/money.

I have a small ceramic plate from my old dish set that I will put a dollop of E6000 on and I use a toothpic to apply a little to the back of the stone, then I plop the stone onto the dress. Works just fine!