Ankle/foot injuries/overuse - your experiences

[The Ice Demon]

Hi All

I thought I'd start a foot/ankle injury/problem thread to see what experiences, injuries etc skaters have in common and possible remedies etc.

Here are my experiences:

1. Just so you know my history I have very flat feet ie. I pronate so I wear orthotics in all my shoes and have a permanent set in my skates.

2. I have been having ankle pain when skating, it seems to be caused by my backspin and the technique I use. I enter it from a RFI 3 and it twinges on the turn of the 3 turn as I flick into an open spinning position. This is when it hurts the most and it has been a gradual thing, it was not caused by one specific incident. Once it has started hurting during a skating session it continues to hurt and then affects my landings (it is my right, landing foot). When I am not skating I can walk/run on it fine and it does not give me any problems.

3. I have a large bump on the back of my heel at the bottom of the achilles. I have been told that all skaters get this and it is called retrocalcaneal bursitis or a bursa and is a build up of scar tissue or something. I always need a good bandage on it when I skate or it blisters. Any one else experience this? I think it will keep getting bigger as long as I skate.

I just thought this could be an interesting topic to discuss and maybe share our ideas. Especially as our feet and how they fit into our skates is vital to our skating!!!!

Happy skating

8)

[JDC1]

I am relatively flat footed and don't have orthodics, can't afford them. I have developed bumps on the bone on the inside of my foot and my feet cramp up on a regular basis. Weirdly enough it's the outside of my feet that really hurt not the arch area. My left akle is often sore when I skate and feels a tad swollen. Like you when I am not skating I don't have the same problems. I do generally have problems with shoes and fit and comfort but I just almost exclusively wear flats and it helps, heels past 2 inches are excrutiatingly painful and cannot be worn.

[KJD]

Ice Demon,
Can't relate on a lot of the feet thing but I did get the retrocalcaneal bursitis during an injury bout I had in the Spring. I actually tore a calf muscle, my right one, two weeks before adult nationals. At the same time, the impact that tore that muscle also gave me the retrocalcaneal bursitis on my left foot (landed hard doing something dumb on a concrete floor). The calf muscle healed, sort of, after 3 weeks or so off the ice, but the bursitis took a long time. Ice and Aleve helped a lot but I basically was off the ice for 4 weeks and then 2 weeks of not jumping until it healed. It doesn' heal if you don't lay off it and it does get worse if you don't!

[manleywoman]

Ahhhh, I subject I know well....

I have extremely flat feet and wear orthotics in everything. I make very little money too, but I have three different pairs of orthotics for skates (custom built skates for my problem feet) and shoes, and would be in almost constant pain without them. I HIGHLY recommend that if you have any foot pain that would be releived with orthotics that you find the money to get them, because the pain will start to travel upwards and affect your knees, hips and once you start hunching over a bit to releive the pain in your legs, your lower back will be affected as well.

Ever since I got orthotics, I've never had a problem.

JDC1, If you're in pain frequently enough and getting cramping, please find the money to get thee to a physical therapist! It's not worth it to be in pain if it can be avoided. Orthotics will prevent other more expensive problems later. And if it hasn't shown up yet off the ice, very likely it will soon.

Trust me. Been there.

Otherwise, I had a ganglion cyst for a whiole on my ankle, but it eventually went away.

[mikawendy]

Yes, I have mutant feet, too. They're flat as pancakes, wider at the toes, and my 2nd toe is longer than the first. I wear orthotics in my street shoes but they aren't dress orthotics so I can't wear them in heels. For my next set of boots, I plan to get orthotics in them. I've heard that if you can't get them through health insurance, you can sometimes get a good ski shop to make some that will do the trick.

If your health plan covers orthotics, you may be able to get them at low cost. Be careful that all your paperwork (preapproval or referrals as needed) is lined up. Mine wasn't, so the only reason I didn't have to pay through the nose for them was that I was volunteering for a physical therapist at the time.

If anyone needs the name of a good foot/ankle physical therapist in the Baltimore area, PM me. I know a great one who has been working with dancers for 10 years (she's a dancer herself and has been a PT for 14 years, is also a certified athletic trainer, and knows all the really good orthopedists in the Baltimore area). She's great because she doesn't just tell you to work through the pain, and she has a mean set of hands for doing deep tissue massage on the affected areas. If you're in DC or another area, she might be able to recommend someone (she knows a really good PT in New York City who works with dancers).

I had tendinitis of the posterior tibialis muscle for about 6 months because of my flat feet and she got me back to no pain. Then she gave me exercises to strengthen the area and to make the muscles of my feet stronger so that I would pronate less. My injury was an overuse injury and I really had to do what she said to not make it worse--icing after exercise and using ibuprofen in the initial stages of healing from the injury. She also made me REST because even when I thought I was resting it, I wasn't! :oops:

Good luck!

edited to say that one way to get free (or nearly free) physical therapy is to volunteer for a physical therapist. I did that because I was planning at one point to go to PT school. Lucky for me that my injury happened then so I got really great PT care. I'm not saying to do this just to get free care, but if you're interested in learning about PT it can be a good experience...

[pattern99]

wow, a subject that has stopped me in my tracks several times. :( Get's kinda old after a while. Let's see...where to start...

Instead of having flat feet, I'm the opposite...I have very high arches, so my feet are very vulnerable to stress injuries. I didn't start wearing orthodics until this year... after having 2 years of straight ankle pain...which doctors said they can do nothing bout. Cronic tendonitis...achilles...u name it...I got it.

Now on to the spurs!! I have bone spurs on both ankle bones on both feet. Bad enough so, that I had to get custom Harlicks because they contributed to a nasty case of tendonitis to flare up at Norths 2 years ago. But the show goes on, right?

Now on to the major frustration. I land quite flat on my blade on double axels. I have special gel shock absorbing soles in my skates, but it doesn't do anything for me. Even when I land on the toe pick, there's this excruciating pain that goes up the back of my heel to my achillies tendon. Very painful. This has been a cronic problem for me since right before 2001 norths. Dr's are mystified and have no clue what's really wrong. Go figure.

My wonderful and fun summer last year ended early due to this gradual twinge of pain in the metatarsal region of my right foot. I figured it was the usual ache and pain...so I pressed on. It started right after the 2002 LP summer freestyle comp. and by the time Hershey came around, I was gritting my teeth and crying with every landing. Never felt anything that hurt so damn bad. I didn't tell my coaches, cuz I wouldn't want to be accused of being a wouse :roll: so for a month, I skated with this pain and got yelled at for my sub-par effort (or so it appeared. :oops: ) Finally at Hershey (landed double axel there...2 of them.:cry: ) and ended up having to withdraw from the freeskate due to the fact that I couldn't even walk in my skates off the ice, let alone attempt to jump. Now, had it been Norths..you bet your Harlicks I would have sucked it up and skated. Went home to Florida and for three months, went to sports dr. and ankle/foot specialists... no dice. Finally in the fourth month... (oh it was prolly a stress fracture.) How convieniet right?

So after that wonderful 4 1/2 month sabatical :twisted: I was pain free after getting my custom Harlicks in March... about 4 months of no pain..at all... and well, here I am again. Frustration wouldn't even be a word to surmise how I feel about my feet. That's it, I protest, I'm trading them in for a newer model cuz these are defective. :lol:

And that's the reader digest version. Urgh... I swear people thought I was nuts at JN's when I had to tape my feet before I skated. Only like half a roll of tape every time. Sigh...maybe this is sum higher power telling me it's time to turn in the skates. Only one problem, I feel like I've only begun skating (been skating 6 1/2 years)

Any suggestions??

*patt99*

BTW. I hope no one has terrible feet like mine.. it sux.

[dooobedooo]

I read recently that if you get the bump on the back of your heel this is a sign that your boots are too big. Perhaps you could have an informal discussion with a good boot fitter.

[melanieuk]

My feet are 34 years old and have been subject to skates for 5 years, and ill-fitting shoes for 2 decades. Now I only wear trainers! :)

I have a Bunga pad permanently in place over my left sesamoid bone - foot specialist calls it metatarsalgia.
It won't go away.
It'll only get worse if I continue to land on it.

I have numerous other callouses and patches of hardened skin / tissue all over both feet.

I'm in the Broken Foot club! :?

[jenlyon60]

I am lucky... mostly just nasty callouses on both feet on the inside edge of the ball of my foot. From wearing combat boots and poorly made hikers for many years. Some rough skin on my ankle also where the tongue of my boots sits.

[wannask8]

I don’t get much ice time, but I also wear anti-lace bite Bungas in my new skates to avoid a recurrence of nerve compression (tingling) contributed to by over-tightening my old, over-sized skates, hiking boots, etc. I ice the top of my left foot a bit after practice, too. Even so, a little tingling does sometimes come back if I skate more than once a week (which I don’t get to do much anyway because of my knees – different subject!).

I also had a bit of heel strike pain and arch pain (before I started skating – a podiatrist diagnosed it as plantar fasciitis) that eventually improved with over-the-counter gel heel pads and supports in certain shoes (my new skates feel plenty supportive without orthotics). Fingers crossed here, but I haven’t had a problem with heel or arch pain for months now . . ..

-- wannask8

[Suzanne]

wannask8 -- I have plantar fasciitis too! I've had it since early May. Unfortunately nothing that I bought OTC helped for the long-term so I ended up going to get orthotics. (Just went for the first session two nights ago actually!) The price isn't as prohibitive as I had thought it would be -- $400 Canadian for a set. My feet are worth it!

I can't wait to get them. By the end of the day (I'm a teacher and on my feet a lot), I'm hobbling right now.

[wannask8]

Susanne, my podiatrist had me try some simple stretches that didn’t do much for me, but might help you – see my 8/02 post in the “foot pain” thread – so you might ask yours about that. I hope you get some relief from your orthotics!

-- wannask8

[manleywoman]

Mikawendy...you and I have identical feet and therefore identical problems! I have the same tendonitis, longer second toe, etc.

I live in Wash DC, and have a great physical therapist up Route 29 at Randolf Road, if anyone needs one.

[JDC1]

I called my insurance company and they cover some foot problems but not flat footedness. I am going to try and get an appt. with my internist and see if he can begin helping me diagnose what's going on. Part of the problem is my boots are a tad big, I end up scrunching up my foot and my toes to get a good feel for the boot and the insole has lost it's uselfullness, I can totally feel the screws in my boot, it feels like there is no insole. I am going to get new boots for my birthday, Nov 17, so I am just trying to skate smart, stretch and keep the jumps to a minimum, jumping has REALLY made a difference in the foot and ankle pain. It's actually just my left ankle that really gets sore, part of that is because the left leg is weaker (bursitis and 2 times on crutches as a kid) and since I've started spinning I am really working the left leg. I just started working with a personal trainer who is goign to help me build up my left leg.

[mikawendy]

Originally posted by JDC1
I called my insurance company and they cover some foot problems but not flat footedness. I am going to try and get an appt. with my internist and see if he can begin helping me diagnose what's going on.

I think when I got my orthotics, my orthopedist prescribed them because my flatfootedness was contributing to my raging case of tendinitis in the posterior tib. muscle. So I think the orthotics were considered "medically necessary" because of my leg problems rather than my foot problems. But again, there was a paperwork foulup anyhow that could have been very expensive for me had I not been volunteering for my PT at the time.

Good luck!

[Elsy2]

Although many skaters do get the heel bumps...I agree with dooobeedoo that skates that are too big in the heel can cause them. My daughter developed them in her SP-teri's that were too big in the heel. We switched to custom Harlick's with those nice heel huggers, and her bumps have regressed to near normal.

My SP-teri's are 3 years old, and I need new boots. The left boot still fits perfectly, but the right feels too big lately. My left foot has no heel bump at all, but the right has a slight one developing.

[mikawendy]

Originally posted by manleywoman
Mikawendy...you and I have identical feet and therefore identical problems! I have the same tendonitis, longer second toe, etc.

manleywoman, do you get a callus under the ball of your second toe from it being longer? Mine has gotten bigger since I've been skating more. I'm going to keep an eye on it because I don't want it to split open! (sorry to gross anyone out, I have some modern dancer friends who dance barefoot and have had that problem. Talk about painful!!!!8O )

p.s. Debbie S said she got to meet you at the Todd Eldredge clinic. (I work with her)

[NickiT]

I still suffer as a result of the ankle injury I had nearly three years ago. I broke my right ankle and tore the ligaments. I have a metal plate and screws in my ankle now and this is what causes anything from mild discomfort to bad pain when I skate. I always protect the area where the screws are with a bunga pad and this helps a lot, but I've come to accept that this is as good as it's going to get now. After having a month off skating this summer my ankle improved, and when I resumed I was able to skate without painkillers and so far I still am, so I am pleased about that.

Nicki

[RoaringSkates]

I have a bunion on my left foot and a wide front-foot in general. This makes skates painful at best, and I believe my skates have worsened my bunion.

My skates are a US women's 4Wide, also punched out (a lot) at left forefoot. When I buy new ones, I plan to buy some that have a wider forefoot. Also thinking about custom orthotics.

[tazsk8s]

Foot and ankle injuries...hmmm, where to start. Right now it's tendonitis in the right achilles. Particularly painful on flip and loop landings. Some days are better than others - on my worst days I hobble like my 80+ yo grandmother. I have a history of sprains on the same ankle anyway...silly stuff, mis-steps off the sidewalk, falling off my bike, being stepped on by the person next to me in college marching band.

Interesting about the bumps on the back of the feet. I've always had them. Taz Jr. has them too (I think that's the only feature of my feet she inherited, though - hers are narrow, mine are ultra-wide). Her bumps seemed to get worse as she got closer to outgrowing her skates, not sure if they just got irritated and inflamed from the rubbing or what.

[Yazmeen]

Here's a great site for plantar fasciitis:

www.heelspurs.com

It was a godsend for me two years ago when I had this problem--I learned how to tape my foot here.

One HUGE suggestion to help with PF and other foot conditions: WHEN YOUR SHOES ARE WORN OUT, GET RID OF THEM!!! After all, we change to new skating boots when the old ones get shot, don't we?

Dr Beth

[wannask8]

Wow, Beth, that is a fabulous site! And of course, you are totally correct about replacing shoes. My feet are very narrow, especially in the heels, which has always made it difficult to find the “girl shoes” I needed for work (primarily pumps) that would stay on my feet. I’d usually end up trying to live with something too big, or if I found a pair that fit well, I’d keep them way too long, which may have contributed to my PF problem. We’ve switched to biz casual now, though, so the choices have expanded.

-- wannask8

[manleywoman]

Originally posted by mikawendy
manleywoman, do you get a callus under the ball of your second toe from it being longer? Mine has gotten bigger since I've been skating more.

No, although my second pairs of custom Harlicks (I'm on my 3rd now) for some reason rubbed the top of my second toe on my left foot, so I have a little bunion there! But this 3rd pair for some reason have caused calluses on the outsides of both big toes! Strange....even customs are always a little different, since my first pair never gave me any problems at all, and the 2nd and 3rd pairs have caused random calluses here and there.

p.s. Debbie S said she got to meet you at the Todd Eldredge clinic. (I work with her)

Yes I did! I hope she had a good time, since i had to bolt out of there as soon as I was done. Say hello to her for me.

[singerskates]

singerskates, adult competitive skater in waiting here. LOL

I have flat feet that pronate, hammar toes, long second toes, bonions and tendonitis in my right Achellis tendon.

I wear orthotics in all my shoes. I've adjusted my skate's footbeds to be shaped the same as my orthotics. This has helped but when I get the cash, I will buy orthotics that will be made specifically for my skates. I wear Graf Edmonton Specials because I have wide balled feet and narrow heels but the inside of the boots didn't allow me to insert my orthotics because it has an arch before you put it the foot bed that comes with the boots. And the foot bed that came with it before I adjusted it didn't support my arch properly. It took me a while to get the feeling right by trail and error.

I was thinking about developping something that would go in between the big toe (hammar toe) and the second toe to train the big toe to go in the correct position and releave the pain but what I tried did't work. I'm now thinking some sort of foot brace that goes over the whole foot and that could pull the top of the hammar toe outward would be best.

Dr. Beth (Beth) a.k.a. Yazmeen, since you're a doc, do you think you could develop this thing? I could draw up the plans but I have no way of marketing such a thing to the medical comunity. This idea of mine comes out of the frustration of having pain in my right foot's bonion and hammar toe which had been holding back my loop and flip jumps until now.

[SusanaO]

Singerskates

I actually wore a device like the one you described on both feet for about a year. The doctor made this sort of brace that went over the whole foot and would pull the toe to the correct position. I would only wear it at night, and let me tell you, it was very uncomfortable and painful. This was a long time ago, when I was about 12 or 13, and it didn't help at all. I still have pretty bad bunions and my skates seems to be aggravating the problem.

By the way, I also have mutant feet, my second toe is also longer than the big toe.

[manleywoman]

Originally posted by SusanaO
By the way, I also have mutant feet, my second toe is also longer than the big toe.

WOO-HOO!! Let's hear it for all of us with mutant feet and longer second toes!! :D

i never realised there were so many of us.8O We should get our own boot named after us...any name suggestions?;)