Flip

[hanca]

Hi,

I wonder if anyone can advise me. I am an adult skater and I have been trying to land flip for more than six months and I am not much succesfull. I have tried both entry, from three turn and from Mohawk, but neither of them works for me. If I have one of my 'better' attempts, I manage to do a full rotation and land backwards on both feet; when it is not so good, I am missing a quarter of rotation (and land on both feet). But even when I have the full rotation, my weight is not completely on the right landing leg, so even if I somehow managed to not to land on both legs, it would be inside edge of right leg. My legs are not quite together and the weight is somewhere between them. :frus:

Looks like flip is not my jump. :roll:

Thank you

[patatty]

When you pick your toe in, make sure that you are not picking out to the side. This can prevent your weight from staying over the landing leg. Whenever my flip starts to flounder, I concentrate on picking back, almost in line with my skating leg. This helps to cross the free leg and speed up the rotation.

[RachelSk8er]

Also, stay down in your nees. If you come up too soon (before you pick), that may be keeping you from getting the height that you need for the rotation.

[fsk8r]

Try thinking about lifting the non-picking foot up as you jump. I find if I forget about it I can two foot the jump very easily.

But I thoroughly agree with the staying down in the knee. I was trying to do mine today at slightly faster than snails pace and discovered that my trick of digging my toe in on my skating foot ain't really helping my jump because my weight isn't far enough back when I pick. If I go down in the knee and keep the weight back on the skating foot to transfer to pick, then it actually works (and lifting the skating foot so it hasn't got time to hit the ice as I land).

[Pgh.Coach]

How is your loop jump? Being that the in-air position (and body alignment) for the flip is quite similar to the loop, perhaps your issues are stemming from a weak loop jump technique.

Try working on "h position" while gliding backwards: where your belly button is pulled into your spine, you are standing on a straight skating leg (your right leg, if you're a CCW skater), and your free [left] leg is slightly bent in front of you. You arms will be slightly open to your right side. This position mimicks the letter h and forces correct body alignment (over the right hip). Check out to a landing position and hold.

You can also practice this h position from standing in the door of the penalty boxes already in position (which will require you to hold onto the sides of the door with each hand on for balance). You begin facing forward (looking at the ice) and using your hands on each side of the door, quickly spin yourself out of the door (still in h position) as you hit a landing position and hold for approximately three seconds.

[froggy]

I like to practice doing loops and backspins before i work on my flip, just to get the feel of being on my right side (ccw). Also when you turn the 3 on the flip try doing it on a line and make sure after the turn you came all the way back to the line, also, you may be not fully rotating b/c you tried preroating on the jump, on the takeoff, jump UP not around and try keeping your left arm checked in front-that should also help you not pre-rotate.

you'll get it! keep practicing! good luck!!

[Vicki]

I would also suggest using the three turn entry on one of the hockey lines. Make sure you complete the three turn before the jump take off. This helped me get over my right hip and ended the two-foot landing problem.

Once I could land a flip, backspin became much easier.

[Mrs Redboots]

Make sure you're looking over your left shoulder (right if you're a clockwise jumper). Husband's flip is extremely iffy, and his coach realised it was because he was looking over the wrong shoulder.

[Sessy]

Do you have the loop solid? If not, you might wanna practice more backspins to learn to have the weight over your rotating foot. That's the main trick for both the flip and the loop.
Also, check the takeoff strongly, else underrotation might be one of the results.

What I liked to do on a flip (counterclockwise) was first do a steep left forward inside edge, then turn that into a left forward outside edge, pushing off with the toepick of the right foot as I turned, then doing the 3-turn as normal and taking off for the flip.

[hanca]

Hi everyone,
Thank you very much for your help. I really appreciate it. Today I had a really good day. I landed my first ever flip with correct landing on one foot!!! :D Though I have to say that I am not sure whether it was 'the skill' or just an accident. I don't really know how I did it, or what I did differently than the attempts before or after. I am still trying to figure out how to make it happen (as opposed to waiting for another accidental happening).


"Sessy: Do you have the loop solid? If not, you might wanna practice more backspins to learn to have the weight over your rotating foot. That's the main trick for both the flip and the loop."
- My loop is pretty consistent, and so is my back spin.

"Mrs Redboots: Make sure you're looking over your left shoulder"
- Quite honestly, I haven't got a clue where I am looking, but I will try this.

"RachelSk8er: Also, stay down in your nees. If you come up too soon (before you pick), that may be keeping you from getting the height that you need for the rotation. "
- I tried this, and it did make a lot of difference. I think first time ever I managed something that felt like a draw.

"fsk8r: Try thinking about lifting the non-picking foot up as you jump. I find if I forget about it I can two foot the jump very easily. "
- That's exactly what my coach tells me to do. Easier said than done though! I went through a phase of not lifting it at all, then somehow I moved to a phase when I was lifting both legs :lol::lol: and now 'sometimes' I do manage to lift the correct leg. Not always though.

"patatty: When you pick your toe in, make sure that you are not picking out to the side. This can prevent your weight from staying over the landing leg. Whenever my flip starts to flounder, I concentrate on picking back, almost in line with my skating leg. This helps to cross the free leg and speed up the rotation. "
- The crossing of legs is also what my coach tells me to do. I have never managed to do it though! I can do it on loop, but not on flip. Weird.


Anyway, one more thank you for your help. :bow:

[fsk8r]

Hi everyone,
Thank you very much for your help. I really appreciate it. Today I had a really good day. I landed my first ever flip with correct landing on one foot!!! :D Though I have to say that I am not sure whether it was 'the skill' or just an accident. I don't really know how I did it, or what I did differently than the attempts before or after. I am still trying to figure out how to make it happen (as opposed to waiting for another accidental happening).


"Sessy: Do you have the loop solid? If not, you might wanna practice more backspins to learn to have the weight over your rotating foot. That's the main trick for both the flip and the loop."
- My loop is pretty consistent, and so is my back spin.

"Mrs Redboots: Make sure you're looking over your left shoulder"
- Quite honestly, I haven't got a clue where I am looking, but I will try this.

"RachelSk8er: Also, stay down in your nees. If you come up too soon (before you pick), that may be keeping you from getting the height that you need for the rotation. "
- I tried this, and it did make a lot of difference. I think first time ever I managed something that felt like a draw.

"fsk8r: Try thinking about lifting the non-picking foot up as you jump. I find if I forget about it I can two foot the jump very easily. "
- That's exactly what my coach tells me to do. Easier said than done though! I went through a phase of not lifting it at all, then somehow I moved to a phase when I was lifting both legs :lol::lol: and now 'sometimes' I do manage to lift the correct leg. Not always though.

"patatty: When you pick your toe in, make sure that you are not picking out to the side. This can prevent your weight from staying over the landing leg. Whenever my flip starts to flounder, I concentrate on picking back, almost in line with my skating leg. This helps to cross the free leg and speed up the rotation. "
- The crossing of legs is also what my coach tells me to do. I have never managed to do it though! I can do it on loop, but not on flip. Weird.


Anyway, one more thank you for your help. :bow:

Congratulations on landing it. Now you know you can do it, so it's just a matter of working out what you need to do to make it work on a regular basis. We all have different tricks to make the jump / spin / whatever happen. Some will work for you, some won't. Once you've landed a few more and messed up a few more you'll get a feel for what you do differently when you land it. I still don't know why I sometimes bale out mid-flip, sometimes it's the skating knee not being bent enough, sometimes I forget to lift my free leg knee (quite often that one), sometimes I freak out because I think i'm going to fast and sometimes it's just one of those random things that "something" wasn't quite right. The more I work at it, the more in control of some of the known issues I am and the more likely I am to land it.
and if you work out how to cross you leg whilst doing the jump, let me know. I've never crossed my legs on a flip. If I keep it in front of my picking leg I figure I'm doing well. I'm hoping the leg crossing will come when I work out how to do a back spin.