Late Students

[dbny]

My Sundays have become so busy that the only spare time I have are the ice cuts. Previously, I've always been able to deal with late arriving students by just starting the next lesson later, but now that won't work. Suggestions please. Also - there are several students for whom I lace skates - guess I'm going to have to stop that or include it in the lesson time.

[Pgh.Coach]

I used to have an issue with late students as well, so I updated my private lesson policies, which go out to all my new students, and included a revised copy in my monthly newsletter that I send out.

Here's what it says regarding the issue of late arrivals:

- "Please be on time and ready to skate for your lesson. If you are late, you will lose out on your full lesson time and I will not be able to teach you longer to make up for the time you lost as I often have back-to-back lessons. I do not have time to come off the ice and find you. Your regular lesson rate will be charged."

I haven't had as much of a problem since then, especially after I charged one of my students, who repeatedly showed up as late as twenty minutes for her half hour lesson, her full lesson rate. Her mother assumed I'd have time to make up her daughter's lost time, but I explained to them that I have other skaters [arriving on time] right after her lesson therefore did not have the time. I also told them that when my skaters arrive late, they are still expected to pay their full lesson rate. Sure, they weren't happy, but they've been on time since.

As I've also had some past issues with last minute cancellations and a skater booking an hour of my time weekly then deciding she only wanted to do a half hour at the last minute, so I made certain to include the following two statements in my policies:

- "At least 24 hours notice is required for lesson cancellations. While I understand that emergencies arise, you will be charged your regular lesson rate for lessons canceled without sufficient notice (24 hours prior to your lesson), no-shows, or for repeat 'emergencies'."

- "Due to the number of skaters desiring additional lessons and the fact that I must allocate lessons in blocks in accordance with the skating sessions, you will be charged your regular lesson rate if you do not skate your regularly booked weekly lesson time unless I know in advance (not the day of your lesson) that you are taking a shorter lesson."

Lay down your rules and enforce them tactfully. Better yet, put 'em in print. Doing so prevents confusion and both you and your skaters will be able to refer back to your policies if a discrepancy arrives.

[jskater49]

My lessons are from say, 6 am to 6:30 am. If I get there at 6:15 am, my lesson is still over at 6:30 and I pay for the whole half hour. Except for last winter when I went in the ditch and coach gave me a break. And yes, if you are tying skates, that's lesson time!

[Virtualsk8r]

I'm too much of a nice guy most of the time - and end up losing money as a result when skaters get on the ice late while I (literally) cool my heels waiting for a student to show up.

There are a couple of ways to smarten up skaters while keeping your sanity.
1) If all skaters are five minutes late getting on after the flood - and you have 3-15 minute lessons - then subtract 2 minutes from eack skater's lesson time. So their lessons are now 12 minutes instead of 15 minutes. Sure some parents will be annoyed but at least one of them will make sure their skater is on the ice on time, which benefits everyone!

2) Give the first skater a full lesson and the last skater gets the leftovers, but pays for the full lesson time. That should get them on the ice next time BEFORE skater number 1.

3) Assign lesson slots to the skaters in advance. I tend to do that when I have 10 minute lessons to give. Rotate the first lesson among the skaters each week, so that each skater just has to be on time when it is their week.

4) Bill for the full lesson for the first two skaters ( 30 minutes) and just 10 minutes for the last skater. Lots of parents will be mad that their skater got only 10 minutes, while everyone else got 15!!

Sometimes I just bill for the full lesson fee anyhow, because I usually give extra time to everyone when I can rather than sit around in the coaches room. I figure it all balances out in the end.

[Pgh.Coach]

There are a couple of ways to smarten up skaters while keeping your sanity.
1) If all skaters are five minutes late getting on after the flood - and you have 3-15 minute lessons - then subtract 2 minutes from eack skater's lesson time. So their lessons are now 12 minutes instead of 15 minutes. Sure some parents will be annoyed but at least one of them will make sure their skater is on the ice on time, which benefits everyone!

2) Give the first skater a full lesson and the last skater gets the leftovers, but pays for the full lesson time. That should get them on the ice next time BEFORE skater number 1.

3) Assign lesson slots to the skaters in advance. I tend to do that when I have 10 minute lessons to give. Rotate the first lesson among the skaters each week, so that each skater just has to be on time when it is their week.

4) Bill for the full lesson for the first two skaters ( 30 minutes) and just 10 minutes for the last skater. Lots of parents will be mad that their skater got only 10 minutes, while everyone else got 15!!

I don't think the best way to handle a few late students is by punishing all of your students. It's not exactly beneficial to you as a coach, who is essentially employed by your skaters' parents, to purposefully try to annoy or anger parents.

Those who are late pay the consequences, not those parents and skaters who make every effort to arrive on time for their lesson.

[Virtualsk8r]

I don't think the best way to handle a few late students is by punishing all of your students. It's not exactly beneficial to you as a coach, who is essentially employed by your skaters' parents, to purposefully try to annoy or anger parents.

Those who are late pay the consequences, not those parents and skaters who make every effort to arrive on time for their lesson.

I don`t know how your sessions work, but at my rink skaters pay for a 50 minute session and get 15 or 30 minute lessons on that session but not at any specific time. If just one skater gets on the ice at the beginning of the session, then I don`t lose any lesson time because the other 3or 4 will wander in before the first lesson is over. However, if all three of them wander on the ice 10 minutes after the flood - they all will be docked that time during their lesson as they could have been on the ice rather than sitting in the dressing room socializing.

BTW - while I may be employed`` by my skaters`parents , I run a business just like the doctors, lawyers, bankers, accountants whose children I teach. If a parent does not respect the contract they have made for my services, which means showing up on time for lessons, then I have no obligation to provide them with my services. Certainly there are extenuating circumstances from time to time, but the parent-skater who abuses that will find themselves without a coach after a time.

[Pgh.Coach]

I don`t know how your sessions work, but at my rink skaters pay for a 50 minute session and get 15 or 30 minute lessons on that session but not at any specific time. If just one skater gets on the ice at the beginning of the session, then I don`t lose any lesson time because the other 3or 4 will wander in before the first lesson is over. However, if all three of them wander on the ice 10 minutes after the flood - they all will be docked that time during their lesson as they could have been on the ice rather than sitting in the dressing room socializing.

Understandable. Quite different than the way my rink sets up the ice time, but I see how you wouldn't necessarily be as affected by straglers as someone like myself who must adhere to blocks of ice time (60 or 50 minute sessions) and who assigns lesson slots based on these blocks.

BTW - while I may be employed`` by my skaters`parents , I run a business just like the doctors, lawyers, bankers, accountants whose children I teach. If a parent does not respect the contract they have made for my services, which means showing up on time for lessons, then I have no obligation to provide them with my services.

Very true. That's just the point I'm making in saying that those who do not respect a coach's contract are the ones who suffer--and rightly so. I understand now that you're not necessarily punishing all your skaters when one comes late, but rather those who do not show a concern for your services.

[dbny]

Thank you for your responses. I book all of my lessons myself and each student has a specific time, but because it is the beginning of the season, and both public session and freestyle times have been changing weekly :frus:, I have had to schedule anew each week. Most of my students are beginners and skate on the public sessions. If I were teaching on freestyle ice, I would have no problem cutting the late student's lesson short if necessary. I would never penalize anyone for someone else's mistake - although it did happen accidentally once. Last week I had a parent call for a lesson at the last minute and I was able to move a couple of students from the first slot to the last. I gave them extra time as a thank you for helping me out. I'm nervous about sounding heavy to my students because they are not committed skaters. Handing out a written policy comes under that heading. I think I will have to discuss it with certain parents though, and hopefully they will understand.

[Skittl1321]

It sounds like you have a very casual coaching relationship, due to the fact that your students are beginners.

Now that you have the change in the session set up, you have no choice but to no longer let students have more than a 30 minute block of time (whether they are there for it or not) like it sounds like you used to do. So, you need to make the decision as to whether you want to bill for the entire block of time, or just the part you are teaching.

So if a student is 10 minutes late, they get a 20 minute lesson. If you have beginners, who you are trying to be "soft" on, you can charge them just 20 minutes. If you don't want to charge for skate tying (and you should) and that eats up 5 minutes of the lesson, don't give them 5 more minutes, just charge for 25.

However, I think this really does a disservice to you, as a professional. I think if the student books 30 minutes with you, you should charge for the 30 minutes they booked regardless of what occurs in that 30 minutes (unless of course, YOU are late) So when the student is 5 minutes late to the rink, requires 5 minutes of your time to tie skates, and then gets a 20 minute lesson, I would think you should charge for the 30 minutes they booked with you.

I think even for informal, beginner students, a written explanation is the best way to go. I think a "contract" would scare some people of, but not knowing what is going on is even worse. Outlining your policies, and then having a way of notifying parents/students when they change is convenient, not scary or heavy handed.

I had a coach who would routinely run over with his first 3 lessons in a 2 hour block, and I was the 4th lesson. My lesson would get cut short week after week, as mine could never run over- the Zamboni cut us off. I finally spoke up and got a free lesson, and it occured less often, but still happened. Cutting into your later lessons is not a good idea- and its smart of you to outline a policy to make sure it doesn't happen, otherwise other skaters/parents are going to be upset.

(I also agree with those who say that you should require 24 hr cancellation. I know that if I miss a lesson I have booked, I have to pay for it. It especially stinks when you wake up sick that morning and the lesson is at 4:00 so there aren't 24 hours to notify, but if the coach can't rebook, I reserved the spot. Now if the coach CAN rebook, and still charges- for sick, not for "uh, I don't wanna skate"- that's a big problem)

[Virtualsk8r]

EVen the most committed skaters have parents who aren't so respectful of your scheduling needs. I have one competitive skater who calls my cell 10 minutes before the scheduled session to say a) lhis dad is late picking him up b) locked out c) working late d)just got home from school etc... So when he eventually shows up for his second hour - I give him just one lesson unless someone else was able to take his earlier lesson slot. I've given up billing for missed lessons from this one -- the punishment is in giving just one or no lesson at all that day. AT least now he calls me when he will be late!!!

BTW: What happens to the same skater when they show up late for a ballet class (they get kicked out if more than 5 minutes late) or a piano lesson (get billed for the total time no matter what) or judo class? (have to do pushups, etc. or have to pay for class but kicked out).

Why is skating so much softer than the other activites the kids are involved in? Reminds me of the parent who expected a badge for their learn-to-skate child who showed up a total of three times in a 12 week course!!!!

[Kay]

If you want to try easing into it, before laying out your specific instructions, could you try a more flexible approach? At my home centre, we schedule lessons on a session basis - you book a lesson during a session and the coaches take whomever is there. ie if Susie and Sally both have lessons on a session, and Susie shows up on time while Sally is late, Susie gets first lesson and Sally gets a lesson later.
Coaches take whichever of their students is available on the session. If students have more than one lesson per practice, sometimes the coach will just come over and mention to the coach that is teaching the student currently that they want the student next - it's very casually said so it doesn't interrupt the lesson, and then you just go to that coach next.

[dbny]

That wouldn't work for me. I have students with some very specific time requirements and they are not the ones who are late. I have others where there are 3 or 4 kids in the family taking lessons with me, so the parent books an hour or an hour and a half and switches the kids in and out of the lesson. I just really need people to be on time! I wish I could switch some of the Sunday students to Saturday because that would give me more leeway, but most of the Sundays can't come on Sat for religious reasons.

[Mrs Redboots]

I am just gobsmacked at our coaches' willingness to get to the rink at 6:30 am, over 30 minutes earlier than usual and after a drive of over an hour, to accommodate a small girl whose father can't (temporarily) bring her in at any other time. Granted they don't wish to lose the skater, but it makes a very long day for them when they are not leaving the rink until 8:00 pm or later. I think that is totally above and beyond the call of duty, and so I've told them!

They do have a cancellation policy in place; in practice, however, they only enforce it if someone is constantly messing them around. We're lucky as it's rare that both of us are unable to skate with no notice, so whoever is able to go takes the whole lesson. And they will always shuffle our lessons round to suit us, if necessary - as, indeed, we are willing to accommodate them if they want us to have our lessons on another day for any good reason.

[Pgh.Coach]

I just really need people to be on time!

Then kindly let your skaters and their parents know that. And, stand your ground! There's nothing wrong with asking that your skaters have the courtesy to arrive to their scheduled lesson on time even if they are beginners. Remember, eventually these beginners aren't going to be beginners anymore, and then what? I doubt these parents would appreciate it if you arrived late to their child's scheduled lesson. Why should you feel the need to create repeat exceptions for late students.

Don't let these few straglers take advantage of your time. As a coaching professional, I agree with what Skittl1321 said, that you are doing a diservice to yourself. You know what your time and expertise is worth. Don't sell yourself short for those few who have shown little respect for that.

[Virtualsk8r]

Mrs. Redboots - Most skaters and coaches on this forum will probably agree with me here....I think that all true professionals would go out of their way under extenuating circumstances for a long-standing student, especially one that is hard working and competitive. I've had my coach drive a hour sick as a dog - to a practice at a new rink in preparation for sectionals . Now as a coach, I think of the ways he showed respect for me as a skater, and I try to do the same for my clients. I've had a temperature of 104 and pnuemonia - but showed up for a skater going to nationals because he needed me...and I've driven skaters home/to school 40 minutes out of my way or yes, even showed up at 6am for a skater who couldn't make it to the rink at any other time and was facing a major competition.

The issue is never the skater/parent who appreciates the coach who cares enough to go beyond the call of duty - but rather the skater/parent who doesn't show respect for the coach (or themselves) by expecting everything be handed to them on a silver platter without earning anything - especially respect.

Since there is no "Miss Manners" for parents/skaters as to the proper etiquette for the skating world, I agree that beginners should be eased in. By speaking with a parent ande skater at the beginning of the year and gently highlighting your expectations - and at the same time handing the parent an information sheet with your name, contact number, professional rate and billing cycle, late-payment penalties, 24 hour notice for cancelled lessons and highlighting the time, dates, sessions that the skater will receive their lesson plus in larger letters the fact that lateness will result in a reduced lesson time and full payment of fees. You can also include possible test dates, competitions or goals for the session on that same sheet. Put a note on it to Keep This On Your 'Frig.

Parents will be verbally informed (which may go in one ear and out the other) but then they will have the written notice to read later!

[Pgh.Coach]

Mrs. Redboots - Most skaters and coaches on this forum will probably agree with me here....I think that all true professionals would go out of their way under extenuating circumstances for a long-standing student, especially one that is hard working and competitive. I've had my coach drive a hour sick as a dog - to a practice at a new rink in preparation for sectionals . Now as a coach, I think of the ways he showed respect for me as a skater, and I try to do the same for my clients. I've had a temperature of 104 and pnuemonia - but showed up for a skater going to nationals because he needed me...and I've driven skaters home/to school 40 minutes out of my way or yes, even showed up at 6am for a skater who couldn't make it to the rink at any other time and was facing a major competition.

The issue is never the skater/parent who appreciates the coach who cares enough to go beyond the call of duty - but rather the skater/parent who doesn't show respect for the coach (or themselves) by expecting everything be handed to them on a silver platter without earning anything - especially respect.

I'm with ya on this one! As a coach, I try to be as accomodating to my skaters as possible, particuarly to those who, like you said, appreciate the coach who goes beyond his/her call of duty.

On the other hand, I sometimes encounter skaters who will not make even the slighest effort to arrive on time, so when they regularly cancel their scheduled lesson at the last minute and subsequently request a different lesson time/day to make up their missed lesson, I won't necessarily go out of my way to accomodate them. If I can easily accomodate them, for instance, if another student has cancelled, then I will.

Like most relationships, that of a skater and his/her coach must be 100/100%, not 50/50%. If I'm giving 100% of myself to coaching a skater, I expect that my skater put forth 100% of his/her effort as well, not 25% or 50%. I can't care more about my student's skating than he/she is willing to care.

[dbny]

I really don't have any students/parents that I would call disrespectful. The problem seems to be mostly with those with more than one kid to wrangle, and I understand that all too well. There are also occasions where traffic backs people up. That happened two weeks ago, and I was lucky to have some slack in the schedule and more than one student caught in the same mess. I think I'm going to begin with "my schedule is now so full that there isn't any slack, so if a student is late, I will have to stop the lesson when the next one should start. I will be happy to make up missed time the following week if at all possible, but it will likely not be possible." I'll see how that goes. I never anticipated being this busy. I love it, but it's sooo exhausting!

[Pgh.Coach]

I really don't have any students/parents that I would call disrespectful. The problem seems to be mostly with those with more than one kid to wrangle, and I understand that all too well. There are also occasions where traffic backs people up. That happened two weeks ago, and I was lucky to have some slack in the schedule and more than one student caught in the same mess. I think I'm going to begin with "my schedule is now so full that there isn't any slack, so if a student is late, I will have to stop the lesson when the next one should start. I will be happy to make up missed time the following week if at all possible, but it will likely not be possible." I'll see how that goes. I never anticipated being this busy. I love it, but it's sooo exhausting!

Ahhhh, the joys of coaching. 8-)

Also, I think what you're planning to say sounds good.

[sk8tegirl06]

I'll add my 2 cents as a student. I am a returning young adult skater. I was lucky enough to reconnect with former coaches at home. (My coach at school is different.) Except now they are based out of a rink that is a good 45 minutes to an hour away. They come down my direction because my rink has freestyle every day year round, which is quite a bit more than their home base.

I tend to be the first lesson of the afternoon because I can drive myself and get there when the kids are still getting out of school. But if the smallest little thing goes amiss in my coach's schedule, she will be late for my lesson. I really don't mind because she only charges me for the number of minutes I actually had, not what was booked. If at all possible she will go over into what would be the next lesson slot. (Not always possible with Zam cuts) I'm grateful that she even comes to my rink, so whatever time I can get is great. From the coach's side, I would concur with the opinion of laying down the rules ahead of time. If the coach is at the rink waiting, they are on the clock so to speak and deserve to be compensated. If the student is at the rink waiting, then they should be compensated in some way.

[Mrs Redboots]

And then, of course, sometime's it's nobody's fault - I arrived this morning to be told my coach was running five minutes late; this was because the skater for whom she came in at 6:30 was waiting outside the door for the coach ("and only had one boot on!") when she arrived. With the best will in the world, the skater can't be on time when the rink is locked!

Not that it mattered, as the coach had a good gap after us, so the 15-minute gap she'd planned between our couple's lesson and my husband's solo lesson disappeared.

[momof3chicks]

I love my dds coach, but he is always stuck in traffic or forgot something and had to go back home etc. He usually makes up the time for her, but it does at times put a kink in the works for me.

With 3 kids and a FT job, I need him to be on time all the time. WWYD?

[Skittl1321]

I love my dds coach, but he is always stuck in traffic or forgot something and had to go back home etc. He usually makes up the time for her, but it does at times put a kink in the works for me.

With 3 kids and a FT job, I need him to be on time all the time. WWYD?

Chronically late? Get a new coach. Occasionally late- just make sure you aren't being billed for the time missed, and try to get make ups in whenever possible.

[Pgh.Coach]

I love my dds coach, but he is always stuck in traffic or forgot something and had to go back home etc. He usually makes up the time for her, but it does at times put a kink in the works for me.

With 3 kids and a FT job, I need him to be on time all the time. WWYD?

Since you don't sound as though you're planning a coaching switch over your coach's poor time management issues, I'd start by addressing his lack of responsibility with your coach. Just tell him what you told us: that you have three kids and a full-time job, therefore you need him to be on time! If you have to buy blocks of ice time according to a session schedule (say, from 3:30-4:30 p.m. or something), I'd explain that to him as well emphasizing that having to purchase extra sessions is not only financially inefficient but time inefficient as well. I don't know; if you've never mentioned anything to him in the past, perhaps he's not aware of how his lateness is affecting you.

I'd also make certain that you are not paying for his lateness. If you're getting a half hour lesson and he's arriving ten minutes late, then you should only be billed for 20 minutes. Afterall, it's not your fault that he ran into traffic or forgot something in his car. While getting stuck in traffic, for instance, may not necessarily be your coach's fault either, if he is habitually late due to that reason, I have to wonder why your coach doesn't anticipate that he may get stuck in traffic and simply leave a few minutes earlier. Responsibility anyone? :??

[dbny]

ITA with above posters about late coaches. I hate being late and usually leave the house with time to spare.

Just found out that the rink is cutting Sunday public sessions to 4.5 hours starting week after this. Great - now I know I can't fit everyone in. They are also not restoring the 3 to 6 PM public session on Thurs, which is also going to be a problem for me. We all know that Hockey pays the bills, but it still hurts!

[twokidsskatemom]

Chronically late? Get a new coach. Occasionally late- just make sure you aren't being billed for the time missed, and try to get make ups in whenever possible.

Sometimes easier said than done!!