Zero Tolerance

[melanieuk]

What's your opinion?

If a skater assaults another skater (or a skating partner), on or off ice, should they be allowed to continue skating either as representative of their country or as a coach?

And should this be universal, throughout all nations in skating?

Take in to account the treatment of Tonya Harding.

Please see poll.
You can choose more than one option in poll. ;)

[dani]

If there is an actual assault then the police should be involved as in any other assault. However, I think the organization should take appropriate action including banning the skater. I also think severity must be taken into account.

There is a big difference in, for example, one skater consistently getting in the way of another skater who starts yelling and it escalates and the Tonya incident. Neither is excusable but I can understand the first one better.

This seems like a curious poll, may I ask what made you think of it?

Non-assaulting hugs for everyone!
Danielle

[melanieuk]

(((Dani)))It is a curious poll, yes. :)

I suppose an alleged incident which might have happened in the UK has provoked me to ask these questions.
I asked it because I wondered if anyone had strong feelings on the subject.
In the UK or at least in Scotland, there is a Zero Tolerance policy - that is towards men who abuse women.
However:
A well known football player got lots of publicity when he assaulted his wife, but was allowed to continue to play for his country - indeed he was a front page figure, much idolised by impressionable kids.
Questions were raised about this; what sort of a message does this give to kids - that's it's fashionable/ok/acceptable to beat up your wife?
So much for Zero Tolerance, huh?

In the US Tonya Harding gets banned for life because her husband bashed Kerrigan's knee.
Of course this was high profile stuff and the USA Skating feds had to be seen to be doing something. Maybe they would've swept it under the carpet if skaters hadn't been so much in the limelight at the time?
Does anyone think Tonya's punishment was too severe?

[dani]

Oh wow!! That is a different matter. I think that Tonya was dealt what she deserved, if in fact, she was involved. In retrospect, I think she has validated that with her subsequent behavior.

However, I do think it gets stickier when the crime has nothing to do with skating! Are there any rules in any the national organizations relating to moral/criminal activity? Should there be?

;-)

[melanieuk]

The assault to which I'm referring is documented here:


http://www.bladesonice.com/mag/blaweb1.htm

Scroll down to
Pair Skater In Neck Brace
by Alexandra Stevenson

[Mrs Redboots]

Goodness, that's terrible. I do hope the police were notified, whether or not any further action is taken - but the skater in question should be banned for life, no question. That sounds harsh, but skaters, like anybody else in the public eye, need to be seen to be above reproach.

[TashaKat]

Most, if not all, skating couples have fallings out ... I guess it depends on what actually happened. To take assault literally as a physical assault (especially if there have been prior incidents) then I would say DEFINITELY say that they should not be skating for their country, perhaps get the police involved, again it depends on the circumstances. The same with our footballers, why on earth are they allowed to be role models when they've beaten up their partners, beaten up the public, taken drugs and drink on a regular basis and are STILL paid thousands of pounds!! Most of us would be out of a job!

Specifically to skating in the UK I would personally say that our association needs to smarten up it's act! There are coaches dating their underage pupils, there are skaters known for violence, there are skaters who just shouldn't be allowed out in public! Of course the majority are good, nice people but the bad apples MUST be got rid of.

L x

[dooobedooo]

This is a terrible and very sad story - I was shocked.

Everybody in the UK was hoping and expecting great things of this new pairs partnership; Tiffany had finished in the top ten with her previous British partner and Mike had been five times British pairs champion and is a very fine skater. Both of them have worked so hard for success.

However, I think the police were right to classify this as a domestic dispute. The incident happened in the home and not at the ice rink. This couple were so close that they were living together and on the point of marriage. Nobody outside a couple's relationship can ever really see inside it. We do not know what lead up to this event, how much responsibility for the escalation lay with each partner, and what actually happened at the time. Pairs and dance partners fight all the time. There is absolutely no proof and no witnesses. Tiffany has been trying to slander Mike's character, and I don't know either of them personally, but I have never previously heard anything bad about him, and they have already been skating together for several months.

This is a very different episode from the Tonya Harding episode, where she was directly or indirectly involved with an unprovoked and vicious attack on a non-related fellow competitor. In the latter case, I think the US federation was right to take action, although possibly a life-time ban was over the top.

I am so sad at your news about Tiffany and Mike - I do hope they both come out of this OK.

[melanieuk]

I think that it is time the word "domestic" was removed in regards to assault.
Assault is assault, no matter where it happens or who it's between.

It is said that there were 2 other skaters present at the time of the assault - witnesses, I believe.

I don't think Tiffany Sfikas is slandering Mike Aldred's name. She states that she hopes he finds help for his issues.
She's describing her life as she finds it now, and if in so doing, Mike's character doesn't shine, it's not because she is calling him names.

After all, she could have (and should have) had him charged.

Just my opinion.....

[dooobedooo]

Originally posted by melanieuk
... After all, she could have (and should have) had him charged.

Just my opinion.....

So what stopped her ... ?!

[dani]

Originally posted by melanieuk
I think that it is time the word "domestic" was removed in regards to assault.
Assault is assault, no matter where it happens or who it's between.


THANK YOU!!! We have a term over here called "date rape" that is a similar way to try to water down or explain unforgivable behavior!

In this particular example (or even the Tonya example) what do people think should happen if the national organization doesn't do anything about it? For example, should/could the USFSA ban him from competitions hosted by them? Should the ISU step in?

I actually think that the rules either allow the punishment or they don't. If they do, great! Give it to him. If they don't, should they?

I also agree with a point made by Dooobe - this didn't necessarily have anything to do with skating (other than the participants were skaters). Should that make a difference with the skating worlds reaction? (I think probably it should). But I also disagree on another point, I don't care how frustrating or angry someone gets, it should not justify violence!

[melanieuk]

The term "date rape" is also used here in the UK.
It almost trivialises the crime, doesn't it?

After TS was (allegedly) thrown across the room, I imagine the first thing on her mind would be to go home and be with her family and loved ones, and also to see her own doctors back home, where she'd be more than likely to remain for some time to come, given that her British partnership is no longer viable.
One of the main things about charging someone is that you may have to appear in court and give evidence.
In court, you may have to endure more prolonged unpleasantries.
You may also not want to burn your bridges with the politics that surrounds figure skating in this country, especially if you are hoping, one day, to skate for that country (again).
Especially if you hoping to possess a British Passport.

It doesn't matter that the (alleged) assault happened off-ice, or what caused the incident.
No person has the right to assault another - it's against the law.

People in the public eye have a responsibility to the youngsters who are out there watching them.
Other professionals also have to "behave" themselves otherwise they find themselves out of a job.
If I eat a slice of bread that belongs to a hospital ward, for example, I could (in theory) lose my job as a nurse.

What message does it send out to youngsters when they see their role models getting away with breaking the law??

:!:

[TashaKat]

Mel/Dani - I totally agree with you about the phrase 'domestic' and 'date rape' .... it totally waters down what they really are ASSAULT and RAPE ... and somehow manages to deflect the blame partially onto the girl.

Regarding Tiffany, I haven't been a fan of hers but for goodness sake the girl has got proven injuries! The police were called, I hardly think that she would be 'slandering' 'poor old Mike' for no apparent reason!!!

If you hear any more please let us know, it would be interesting to see how NISA deals with this one.