Figure vs dance

[cazzie]

At what level do you think children should decide?

What are the disadvantages of choosing one of the ther early vs choosing them later?

Are their problems with doing both (but perhaps less of both compared to more of one?)

Beginner daughter at skating school is doing both and loves both. Has all singles except axel and able to combine different jumps. (Trying double loops on her own as she reckons this is the easiest double). Looks more like ice-dancer (apparantly) and enjoys this but struggles with idea of dropping free.

We don't ever expect her to be a serious competitive skater - more about having fun, doing low level competitions, feeling good about herself.

[Skittl1321]

We don't ever expect her to be a serious competitive skater - more about having fun, doing low level competitions, feeling good about herself.

Based on this sentence alone I would say there is no reason not to do both if she enjoys them.

I've been routinely told that dance lessons will help freeskating ability, as well as ability to relate to music and that dance lessons should be considered for even the serious freeskater. Freeskate ability (at least not jumps, but spins are definetly integrated into OD and FD) doesn't do the same for dance. As long as you can handle both disciplines, I'd keep at it.

[icedancer2]

My parents always used to say that doing both was good because (and I know I'm going to get ripped for this)- even if you don't like doing dance as a kid, you may like it when you are an adult - and I have found that to be true. I kind of liked dance when I was a kid but of course also liked to freestyle. Now as an adult skater I don't do any freestyle but LOVE dance!)
Lisa

[Mrs Redboots]

Both is best! She will need the dance to help her edges, her poise, her presentation, her ability to skate to any type of music and her footwork; she will need free skating for speed and confidence!

[sk8tmum]

First - all of the original posters are right on re: the benefits of doing dance; if it's taught properly (edges, flow, carriage) etc, it's a huge benefit for freeskate - but if it's done on the rush-them-thru-the-test to pass it, then the benefits drop.

However: a few thoughts:

Overload: for some kids, doing freeskate (and I think in the US they're called MITF?) - is a lot to take in and learn. Adding in dance patterns can cause information overload. I remember when DS and DD were learning dance, skills (we're Canadian) plus freeskate programs at age 8/9, their attention was divided, he-more-than-she was having problems keeping all of the different steps in his brain ... and it was a bit of a struggle. As we've hit older years with more attention and maturity, it's got better.

Budget: Can you afford multiple lessons for the different disciplines? Or are you best to focus on one discipline and pay for one so that one can be mastered? A good freeskate coach teaches footwork and edges and turns along with jumps ... so you're not losing that aspect of it. I've seen a number of well-schooled Freeskaters who go back and master the dances quickly and easily, because they have the edges, turns, footwork from quality and focussed freeskate instruction.

Ice Time: if you're limited in ice time, having to practice multiple disciplines means that you might have to short change each one for practice time.

Boredom Option: for kids who get bored easily and may quit, then, having that option of "say, let's do dance/freeskate for a bit" i.e. the other discpline may help them re-engage when they hit that wall by giving them a new challenge.

Injuries: my freeskater has been able to stay on the ice practicing dance when he's injured something that has knocked him off jumping for a bit ... which is great.

and ... ummm ... how is the boy situation? Up here, the ratio is 1 boy to 200 girls. 8O There are a LOT of girls who want to ice-dance, but can't because there are no partners. So, if your DD wants to actually dance with a guy, check to see the availability !

[sk8tmum]

At what level do you think children should decide?
We don't ever expect her to be a serious competitive skater - more about having fun, doing low level competitions, feeling good about herself.

:bow::bow: I so like your statement here, esp. the thing about HAVING FUN, 'cause that's what it should be about.

[smelltheice]

:bow::bow: I so like your statement here, esp. the thing about HAVING FUN, 'cause that's what it should be about.

This is true. You can still be competitive and enjoy yourself at the same time. The two aren't mutually exclusive but if you enjoy what you do, you will be much better at it and get much more from it.

[cazzie]

I think the dance is quite well taught and probably more successful ice dancers emerge than free skaters . I'm told local rink has reputation on free side for learning ++ elements but not doing as well at basic skating. From what I can gather dance coach happy for her to do free - but - free coach seemed VERY annoyed with me yesterday about daughter doing the dance...and made this obvious to my daughter.

The skating school (at her level -she's just moved up a group) suggests 5 on ice and 4 off ice group classes. We've asked for 3 dance (on ice), 3 free (on ice) and 4 off ice (one would be jump rotation and the other three ballet/flexibility). We've only ever done very occasional one to one lessons and at her level she doesn't seem to need them.

SHe puts enormous focus into what she does and seems to learn sequences of steps quite quickly and I have no idea how she keeps them seperate in her head.

She has done a lot of (non-ice) ballet and modern and performed quite a lot with these but wants to make skating her focus now.

She hasn't been skating long (only been full time skate school since January) and started ice dancing (once a week although increased a month ago) in April. Has had a program for beginner free competitions only recently.
She doesn't want to think about quitting free until she lands her axel and some double jumps and has some ideas of other things she wants to achieve. She also loves the ice dancing. Seems happy to work really hard at this as well.

Yes she will compete - she likes to perform and loves the idea of being the only skater on the ice - but - I'm under no illusions about her abilities. She's not a potential olympic athlete or national champion or anything like that. And yes - there is quite a boy shortage!

[GordonSk8erBoi]

At what level do you think children should decide?

What are the disadvantages of choosing one of the ther early vs choosing them later?

Are their problems with doing both (but perhaps less of both compared to more of one?)

Beginner daughter at skating school is doing both and loves both. Has all singles except axel and able to combine different jumps. (Trying double loops on her own as she reckons this is the easiest double). Looks more like ice-dancer (apparantly) and enjoys this but struggles with idea of dropping free.

We don't ever expect her to be a serious competitive skater - more about having fun, doing low level competitions, feeling good about herself.

My curmudgeonly side has to point out that I think you mean "freestyle vs. dance" -- unless you genuinely mean working on figures, which I doubt :-).

[jskater49]

My curmudgeonly side has to point out that I think you mean "freestyle vs. dance" -- unless you genuinely mean working on figures, which I doubt :-).

WHen I saw the title I thought someone was trying to decide between taking dance or figures! ;)

[Rob Dean]

Boredom Option: for kids who get bored easily and may quit, then, having that option of "say, let's do dance/freeskate for a bit" i.e. the other discpline may help them re-engage when they hit that wall by giving them a new challenge.

and ... ummm ... how is the boy situation? Up here, the ratio is 1 boy to 200 girls. 8O There are a LOT of girls who want to ice-dance, but can't because there are no partners.

For my son working on both disciplines has helped with the boredom during practice sessions issue, since as sk8mum says, having something else to switch to when the work (on either side) get frustrating is usually good.

As for the imbalance situation, yes :), he's been getting inquiries regarding his availability regularly since he started. I don't think the ration is quite as bad as that around here, but it is at least 10 to 1 (and more likely 15 to 1). And that's just of the girls actually testing, not counting those that aren't even trying on account of the partnering situation.

Rob

[cazzie]

Yes - I meant free. Get all the terminology mixed up!

(Sadly not a proper skating mother as I still can't work out differences between different jumps or what a rocker, bracket or choctow or hydroplane or inner bauer is....or all the other things my daughter chats about:??)

[Tennisany1]

...
(Sadly not a proper skating mother as I still can't work out differences between different jumps or what a rocker, bracket or choctow or hydroplane or inner bauer is....or all the other things my daughter chats about:??)

You're not the only one! I get regular eye rolls because I try to use the correct term only to fail miserably. I do find it amazing that my 8 year old can talk me through an entire dance telling what edge she is on, the count, where she is facing, etc., but she can't remember to bring a notice home from school!

[sk8tmum]

Yes - I meant free. Get all the terminology mixed up!

(Sadly not a proper skating mother as I still can't work out differences between different jumps or what a rocker, bracket or choctow or hydroplane or inner bauer is....or all the other things my daughter chats about:??)

I know the feeling ... I'm still waiting for the Figure Skating for Dummies book to come out, because my learning curve from hockey brat to skating mum was brutally fast and intense. In the interim: here's a link to a website I found helpful for figuring out what stuff looks like.

http://www.sk8stuff.com/

The navigation bar on the left: look for Recognizing Elements and there are handy-dandy little videos on all of the moves including Ina Bauers and Choctaws and all that.

For dance: I use Youtube and search on the dance name, you get a whole bunch of videos of dances being done (there are other good resources, it's just easy to get pre-teens to look at YouTube stuff!)

Similarly, a Youtube search on skating programs ... you can get decades of stuff to watch.

[Clarice]

I know the feeling ... I'm still waiting for the Figure Skating for Dummies book to come out, because my learning curve from hockey brat to skating mum was brutally fast and intense.

Actually, Figure Skating for Dummies HAS come out, quite some time ago. Kristi Yamaguchi authored it. You can get it on amazon.com, among other places.

[smelltheice]

First - all of the original posters are right on re: the benefits of doing dance; if it's taught properly (edges, flow, carriage) etc, it's a huge benefit for freeskate - but if it's done on the rush-them-thru-the-test to pass it, then the benefits drop.

However: a few thoughts:

Overload: for some kids, doing freeskate (and I think in the US they're called MITF?) - is a lot to take in and learn. Adding in dance patterns can cause information overload. I remember when DS and DD were learning dance, skills (we're Canadian) plus freeskate programs at age 8/9, their attention was divided, he-more-than-she was having problems keeping all of the different steps in his brain ... and it was a bit of a struggle. As we've hit older years with more attention and maturity, it's got better.

Budget: Can you afford multiple lessons for the different disciplines? Or are you best to focus on one discipline and pay for one so that one can be mastered? A good freeskate coach teaches footwork and edges and turns along with jumps ... so you're not losing that aspect of it. I've seen a number of well-schooled Freeskaters who go back and master the dances quickly and easily, because they have the edges, turns, footwork from quality and focussed freeskate instruction.

Ice Time: if you're limited in ice time, having to practice multiple disciplines means that you might have to short change each one for practice time.

Boredom Option: for kids who get bored easily and may quit, then, having that option of "say, let's do dance/freeskate for a bit" i.e. the other discpline may help them re-engage when they hit that wall by giving them a new challenge.

Injuries: my freeskater has been able to stay on the ice practicing dance when he's injured something that has knocked him off jumping for a bit ... which is great.

and ... ummm ... how is the boy situation? Up here, the ratio is 1 boy to 200 girls. 8O There are a LOT of girls who want to ice-dance, but can't because there are no partners. So, if your DD wants to actually dance with a guy, check to see the availability !

I really do wish that I was skating in the US or Canada. In the UK, there are plenty of dance girls and a few guys so a similar situation in that respect but as for pairs, they are like unicorns. In fact, rarer than. We have one senior pair and the top pair girl in the country skates at my rink and has had to look outside the UK for a partner. So if it has been so hard for her, I am finding it impossible. I'm an adult skater (33) and trained in pairs but cannot find a partner to go to UK adult competitions, let alone nationals. The guys you have over there are lucky in the choice they have. I am seriously considering immigrating!! (there are other reasons for it too like the UK being soooo expensive now "equivalent of $12 a gallon for gas!!")