Loop Jump Entries?

[singerskates]

Recently in the last two weeks, I've changed the way I've been entering my loop jumps because I was finding that I couldn't keep my free leg crossed in front of my skating leg throughout the jump which caused me to either not get a full rotation or to land on two feet with sometimes landing on what was suppose to be my free foot first.

3 Turn:The first method I tried when I first learned the loop and got it back in the 2004-2005 season was the 3 turn method. I haven't been able to do a strong clean loop since the 2004-2005 season.

3 Turn & Back Crosscut: Then during the 2006-2007 season I was trying to regain my loop (missed skating in 2005 after Adult Canadians because of injuries and illness and the first half of 2006), so I tried again with the 3 turn method but never really got the loop to work away from the boards. I also tried the back crosscut method to enter the loop. For some reason, I just couldn't get myself to stay checked and to keep my free leg crossed to start the jump, and I'd not always get around on the jump.

Mohawk: Then 2 weeks ago, I started playing with using a Mohawk to enter my loop jump. Immediately I was able to get my free leg to cross my skating leg and was able to get down to be able to spring up into the air. The only thing I had to do was to work on the timing of my arms. A few days after trying the Mohawk method on the ice, I was at home when I finally realized that I needed to check the Mohawk harder after the turn so that I'd have more momentum with my arms to get the full rotation. Now I'm doing the full rotation and sometimes a quarter to a half more than I need and am able to land the loop most of the time on 1 foot. Now I have to work on getting my free leg up and out after I land so that I don't do a one rotation backspin on the landing.

What has been your experience with your loop enteries and your loop jump? Are there any other ways of entering a loop jump? Have you tried them? Were they successful?

By the way, it doesn't matter if your loop is a single like mine, a double or a triple because we're taking mostly about the entery affecting the jump.

[Skating Jessica]

I'm working on getting my double loop clean. Currently, I do back crossovers followed by a RBO 3-turn and then jump, which seems to work pretty well for me.

I've seen skaters enter the jump with a series of back 3-turns in which the free foot is kept off the ice the entire time preceeding the jump. (This is mainly used for double and triple loops, however, at least that I've seen.)

For instance, a CCW skater would do consecutive back 3-turns on their right foot in a CCW direction keeping their left foot off the ice (in front, slightly bent knee)--not similar to back power 3s, but rather quick double 3s. After getting a good momentum going, the skater uses a bit more knee action than required for the 3s, jumps up and does the double--or whatever--loop. The back 3s are used to mimick the in-air loop position. And, its all about control.

Are you sure you're taking off forward, like, all the way off the toepick? Some skaters have the misconception that a loop (or salchow, for instance) takes off backwards when in actuality they need to turn forward for the actual take-off. Sometimes that can cause issues with [completing] rotation.

[CaraSkates]

I can do a loop from any of the above entries but my favorite is to do a RBO3 into RFI mohawk into loop. I like to do two or more back power 3s before the jump (loop loop is fun too!). My RBO3s are very strong and I love doing them. (loved Juv MIF Back Power 3s!)

EDIT - I'm doing singles out of these RBO3s but a friend does the same entry and doubles.

Other entries I've used in the past -
Forward stroking to RFI mohawk, jump
CW BXOs, step forward on a left foot, RFI mohawk
CCW BXOs, jump
RFI3 (when I first learned the jump)
2 RBO3s, RBO twizzle, extend the free leg, step forward to LFO3, set RBOedge, loop jump. (hard to describe. this was a show program)

[Ellyn]

I originally learned the loop from outside three and change feet. That's how I usually try to do it if I'm trying to get enough power for a loop-loop combo without slowing so much I cheat the second one, and it was also how I was preliminarily working on double loops (never rotated) for a while 8-10 years ago.

The back crossover or (back three-)mohawk methods just feel awkward to me and I'm lucky if I can pull off one single from those entries at all.

Usually I do at least one loop from an inside three before I work on the other entry, to get the feel of my weight over the landing side from the beginning. But it's harder to do it that way at speed.

My favorite way of getting into a loop is from the landing of another jump, preferably a salchow.

[FlyAndCrash]

Most of the time for singles, I just do it out of backcrossovers. Lately, its been revolving 3 (RBO 3-turn mohawk) into a loop.

Since I started doubles, its on a line. I start going backwards on a clockwise circle, left foot forward and both feet on the ice, shift to a counterclockwise circle and then jump. It makes a very shallow backward "S" shape, and I'm a counterclockwise jumpter.

[singerskates]

Are you sure you're taking off forward, like, all the way off the toepick? Some skaters have the misconception that a loop (or salchow, for instance) takes off backwards when in actuality they need to turn forward for the actual take-off. Sometimes that can cause issues with [completing] rotation.

When I first starting jumping and until recently when I saw some video about the loop jump, I didn't know that the loop took off foward from the last tip of the toe pick even though I could do the loop during the 2004-2005 season before the injuries and illness. It wasn't until after Adult Canadians this year that I saw the video online about the loop take off. It was a real eye opener to me.

The reason I still have troubles with the 3 turn and back crosscut method now is because of 2 things; what's between my ears ROTFLOL and my bodies lack of timing since the injuries. I began to play with the Mohawk method two weeks ago because it forces me to do the right thing in the loop. And yes, I'm taking off forward with the Mohawk method and getting that nice rip of the ice and the little check on the ice on take off. I just find that sometimes I get a little too much power and over rotate because sometimes I don't check out fast enough with my arms. Although, how do you get even more power so that you can get the last rotation of a double? OK, I'm ahead of myself. If I do a 2 loop, it will be the first 2 jump since I was doing 2 salchows back at the very end of the 2004 - 2005 season.

[looplover]

I first learned it from a 3-turn as well but now I always either do it from a mohawk or back crossovers. It kind of depends on how comfortable I am with the speed at that moment...

[jazzpants]

I have been doing them from back crosscuts... but I am trying to enter now from a back power 3 entry... just b/c I think it looks KEWL!!! 8-) (But unfortunately, I currently lack the control to do back power 3's at higher speeds.) :frus:

[ElinorD]

I do back crosscuts - loop is a problem for me, it's either 2 footed or badly cheated. The 3 turn method, while great in theory, doesn't work for me. I just don't feel as secure on the edge. I overdo the 3 turn a bit and try to throw myself back on the heel.
I may have to print out some of these descriptions & take them with me to the rink. Some really great ideas! And I need help!

[RachelSk8er]

I do it either from crossovers or a power 3. A few power 3s before are my preferred method, but it depends on how much time I have in my program, layout, etc.

[doubletoe]

I like it equally well from any of the standard entrances, but the last time I did it in my program as a solo jump, I did it from a RFI Ina Bauer. It's basically a RFI 3-turn entrance where the left foot stays on the ice on a LBI edge. As soon as I do the RFI 3-turn, I'm in perfect loop takeoff position, with my weight over the right hip and the left foot resting lightly on the ice in front of me.

When we work on the double loop, my coach has me do one or two CCW forward crossovers at low speed, do a LFO 3-turn, then step down onto a RBO edge for the jump.

[Thin-Ice]

My favorite way to do a loop is from a RFI-3. My least favorite is from a LFO-3turn and set down my right foot. My coach says when I do it that way it looks like a bad flip attempt. I have also done flips from mohawks and from back crossovers/crosscuts... but I like the relative ease and there's no telegraphing the jump.. just turn-bend-jump. (BTW Loop is not my favorite jump.. so I'm sticking with the easiest way I can do it!)

[katz in boots]

I usually do a couple from a RFI3 before doing them from back crossovers (I guess that's what you call cross cuts?). I struggle a little with timing from crossovers and will quite often 2 foot the landing because it doesn't feel right in the air, but when I'm getting it right, it is heaps better than from the 3 turn.

When neither method is working for me, I can usually count on doing them in combo with other jumps, unless I'm really tired.

[Sessy]

I can do it from both the crossovers and the 3-turn. I tend to vary my preference for the entry on other circumstances (like crowdedness of rink, cw/ccw jumping, ice quality, part of programme/no, etc).
I can't do it from a mohawk at all (but I can do mohawk/flip, strangely)

Overall I'd have to say the crossover method gives me more height and air time, but the 3-turn method allows for more pre- and underrotation, making it a good entry when I'm just learning it, or taking it slow. Strangely enough, with my cw loop it was the other way around, I started from crossovers, then as I got better I took it from a 3-turn, then I went back to crossovers again. However, doing loop-loop is a lot harder from a 3-turn for me, as I land it at a steeper angle to the ice.