Seeking advice on music for program

[Jim Watkinson]

My daughter has competed in two basic skate competitions and done well (Basic 5 and 6), but her skills at this age lack a sense of showmanship and presentation, so we're looking for ideas that can help move her free skate program up a bit in a way that allows here to build this type of skill. She is 7 years old and like most youngsters, is very fond of the type of music she and her friends listen to (Hannah Montana, etc.), not necessarily the type of music you would hear at a competition. We have heard contemporary music like this used in recent Basic and Freestyle level programs, but her coach really prefers standard classical pieces. Picking music then can be a real battle, with her coach on one end of the spectrum and she on another. Her coach is very young herself, and this, in fact, is her first student. So the experience level is limited and I'm looking for advice.

I'm guessing that finding music that can connect with both a young skater and a judging panel is something that every coach and parent faces regularly. She'll be skating in a basic 8 competition in a couple of months and we're pulling together her program now. I was hoping to hear some suggestions from parents and coaches for music that has connected well with other skaters of this age and worked well in competitions. As a refresher, a Basic 8 skater will be including the following in a program: Mazurka, Waltz Jump, and Scratch Spin to mention a few. We'll probably also be adding a couple of spirals to her piece because she is very strong with that.

Thank you for any thoughts you may have.

JW

[luckeylasvegas]

Maybe you can compromise with a nice Disney instrumental. When my DD was that age she skated to a nice Colors of the Wind version from the Princess Lullabies CD. I know they have it on itunes if you want to have a listen. She also skated to instrumental scores from Return to Neverland and (of course:roll:) Harry potter. We always have a herd time finding a piece that all 3 (me, DD and coach) agree on.

[dbny]

I think you may have to have a gentle word with her coach. Skaters need to feel their music to skate their best. Being young and inexperienced, the coach may not realize that many 7 year olds will not relate to the type of music she herself prefers. The coach may also be getting her music from someone else, or it may be the music she herself has used in the past. You could suggest finding the music yourselves and doing a trial program that way to see if it helps your daughter develop her interpretive skills. My daughter's coach never provided music, which I thought was a real drag, but since my daughter always chose her own music, she always loved it. Now that I am coaching, I let my students choose their own music and that has worked well.

[Skating Jessica]

Had the same problem with many young skaters I coach. They all love Hannah Montana, High School Musical, Cheetah Girls--definitely not the style of music I encourage or that most judges want to hear.

Your daughter's coach is going to need to be a bit more firm. Have her coach select a few pieces of music, say 3-4 choices, that she would be comfortable having your daughter skate to, and then have her and your daughter sit down and listen to them together. Make sure your daughter knows that she has only these pieces to pick from. Usually skaters will decide that there's at least one song that they like.

If after that, your daughter and coach still cannot reach an agreement, have your coach go back and find a few more selections. Have her and your daughter sit down and figure out the kind of music she may like (fast, slow, upbeat, Latin, etc. rather than Hannah Montana, Spice Girls, etc.). Your coach should go back and try and find something that will please your daughter that way (tempo, style, etc.).

It may eventually just end up coming down to your daughter's coach putting her foot down when it comes to music. While this may not please your daughter, perhaps she can work on a fun piece for a showcase or artistic number to a more kid-friendly song that will satisfy her and the coach. Remember, you're paying this coach for a reason. Although she may be inexperienced at coaching, she likely isn't with skating. In that respect, she may have enough experience with being able to know what the judges are looking for.

BTW, has your coach looked for any kid-friendly songs that are instrumentals only? There are a lot of good karaoke versions of pop songs that don't sound nearly as annoying as their originals. Think "Reflection" from Mulan, for instance.

Good luck! Let us know what they pick!

[twokidsskatemom]

It may eventually just end up coming down to your daughter's coach putting her foot down when it comes to music. While this may not please your daughter, perhaps she can work on a fun piece for a showcase or artistic number to a more kid-friendly song that will satisfy her and the coach. Remember, you're paying this coach for a reason. Although she may be inexperienced at coaching, she likely isn't with skating. In that respect, she may have enough experience with being able to know what the judges are looking for.


I dont agree.
It would be different if the skater was at a higher level.I think at basic 8 with I think a 1 min program the skater should be able to pick it herself.Or at least have a major say in the matter.At basic 8 she should have FUN!!
Our coaches have always let both kids pick their own music.The coaches can guide them ie this is too old, too slow ect but the skaters have to enjoy the music.
I wouldnt want a coach to tell my skaters what they had to use for the year.Its a team effort not just the coachs choice.
imo
Ps we are leaving for the rink now but when we come back will list what my daughter used at that stage.

[sk8tmum]

Suggestion: Have her cruise YouTube (under supervision of course) and look at good skating programs. Help her to recognize what makes "good" skating music and what doesn't. This can help her gain a new perspective on the sport.

Then,have her make a list of the 10 programs she likes best, and why she likes them. From this, you'll be able to help her identify that, say, she likes Latin but hates twinkly-sparkly music. Then, you'll know a direction to go in. Armed with that, you can sit down with her and her coach and work together ...

it worked for us. Once the coach got a better sense of what the skater liked, and the skater got a better idea of why some music works and some doesn't, music became far more collaborative and more enjoyed by both.

[Skating Jessica]

I dont agree.
It would be different if the skater was at a higher level.I think at basic 8 with I think a 1 min program the skater should be able to pick it herself.Or at least have a major say in the matter.At basic 8 she should have FUN!!
Our coaches have always let both kids pick their own music.The coaches can guide them ie this is too old, too slow ect but the skaters have to enjoy the music.
I wouldnt want a coach to tell my skaters what they had to use for the year.Its a team effort not just the coachs choice.
imo

Of course, I feel that skater, especially at that age, should have a say. I guess what I'm trying to say is that a coach should be able to guide them toward a specific style that is appropriate for their age, ability, and level. I've had skaters use fun songs at that age and level like a vocal version of "I Wanna Be Like You" from The Jungle Book and an instrumental version of "Under the Sea" and have had no problem with it because like you said, skating and competing should be fun!

If that's what it's going to take to have a kid get out there and perform well, then a coach needs to acknowledge and work with that. I'm just saying that there comes a certain point when a skater's maturity, age, and ability warrant a more sophisticated, yet enjoyable routine, much like you mentioned. Cutesy routines can only get a skater so far; they're not nearly as do-able at thirteen as at 7-8 years old.

But I agree with you that at the younger ages, this can be difficult and the coach must emphasize fun and choose something as a group effort with the child when selecting music.

[ElinorD]

If you feel comfortable with it, please also try iTunes - you can search through lots of compilations and listen to 30 second introductions before you purchase. There is a section in "music" called "iMix" for people to make their own mixes of their favorite songs. I've found some great music that way. (there may even be a few skating imixes...)
Also, a little more low-tech 8-) try the public library. Some larger cities have good CD collections that your daughter can listen to. I highly recommend some compilations, (My favorite are the "Mad About" series) for a general idea of classical or movie music. It will help her get an idea of what she likes.
Another little hint: a lot of book & music stores have good compilation CDs for reasonable prices. I have found some fun ones for less than $10.
What kind of movies does she like? I think someone suggested disney movies, that's a great idea. Cartoon music is another thought.
Good luck! As a classical music dork, I hope she enjoys it!

[Kim to the Max]

I second the movie/Disney music...be aware though, that the judges will have heard the Disney music a lot...

There are also some fun classical pieces like "flight of the bumble bee" or "rodeo" (the..."beef, it's what's for dinner song :)) which you might consider...

[Virtualsk8r]

A really good piece of music for a program - whether a one-minute beginner or a 4 minute senior lady - requires thoughtful editing and choreography that uses the music rather than just a bunch of linking moves. Many coaches don't take the time to edit music properly for younger skaters, and the effect is pretty awful (cut off phrasing, endings - no balance etc.)

That said - I have used the following for one or one 1/2 minute solos with great success. I try to use pieces that aren't heard in the rink or at competitions -- so no Pirates of the Carribbean!!! lol

Try: Mary Poppins
Bugs Life (requires combining 2-3 pieces but sounds great)
The Producers (jazzy, Hollywood)
Pink Panther (techno, normal and jazz versions combined)
Lizzy Maguire movie suite
Parent Trap suite
Monsters Inc. (must edit for effect)
In the Mood
anything Big Bad Voodoo Daddy
Chocolate (the movie has lots of great tracks)
Wizard of Oz
The Emperor's New Groove
Puttin on the Ritz and other big Hollywood movie type themes
Little Women
Fur Elise
Down with Love

Lots of others if these aren't to your liking. I try not to recycle my programs so that skaters get a fresh take every year and don't have to answer the question "Isn't that ____ solo from last year?)

[momof3chicks]

[karaoke versions of pop songs that don't sound nearly as annoying as their originals. Think "Reflection" from Mulan, for instance.

Good luck! Let us know what they pick![/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

My 7 yo skated to a fun version of this song this weekend.

[Mainemom]

Thankfully my DD's coach has never tried to foist classical music on her as she knows it just wouldn't suit her style. Two of her other students do and are fine with it but it is so NOT my DD that she wouldn't be able to make anything out of the program no matter how well choreographed it was!
The weird thing is that now whenever we are watching a movie together, we end up really hearing the music and often will say - "oh that piece would be great for so-and-so but I couldn't carry it off" or "I wish I were a guy, that would be perfect!" or "right there, can you hear the spiral?? oh, footwork section..." For her last season's music, we checked out a bunch of CD's from the library and listened to tons and tons of stuff before offering some things up to her coach for final approval and cutting. This year, her coach chose and it was absolutely perfect, my DD to a T!
My biggest beef with other people's music is a piece that has been done to death or music that is too fast for the skater's ability. There is nothing more painful than watching a skater try to keep up with a piece that is zooming along when they are barely able to do decent back crossovers.

[Skating Jessica]

For her last season's music, we checked out a bunch of CD's from the library and listened to tons and tons of stuff before offering some things up to her coach for final approval and cutting. This year, her coach chose and it was absolutely perfect, my DD to a T!

That's a wonderful example of the compromise, creativity, and thoughtfulness that goes into music selection for skaters. And, the success that can come from it! :D

Like Mainemom pointed out, not every skater is a classical style skater; some are jazzy, others have that Latin flair while some are dramatic and real show-stoppers. Searching through various genres is a great way to find what style your child appreciates and feels most comfortable skating to.

[Mrs Redboots]

There is nothing more painful than watching a skater try to keep up with a piece that is zooming along when they are barely able to do decent back crossovers.Except watching a very slow skater skate to very slow music... zzzzz......

[JazzySkate]

Wonderful ideas! May I also suggest that before you take whatever CD's you'd like to pick your program from to the rink, play them at home first and ask your daughter to improvise. See how she moves and if she feels the music. If nothing else, you can even set up your opening pose in front of a door-length mirror. You can actually do a walk-through off-ice just to get ideas for movement, where to place jumps, etc. then play that particular music track at the rink and watch how she moves on ice.

When I competed I walked-through some of my programs first off-ice, then did it at the rink, added or deleated ideas and movements with my coach, plus saved tons of time.

[Jim Watkinson]

I must tell you all how pleased and impressed I am with the quality and depth of the many insights offered to my question about music for my daughter’s new program. Some of the suggestions offered confirmed things I’ve been thinking, but since we are new to competitive skating, it’s easy to feel uncertain about your own ideas.

Before writing, my daughter and I looked at some of the historical skating performances available on youtube, to see which skating styles and performances themes she seemed drawn to. These skaters are of course well beyond her ability, but she can connect to some of it by seeing some of her own
moves like Mazurkas and Mohawks. After this, I used my iPod’s preview capability to draw up a list of music that I thought would please her from her comments about the performances and our prior conversations about what we liked for future performances.

Here’s what we came up with:

1. The Lizzie Maguire Movie –What dreams are made of. This was also a piece someone mentioned on this list.
2. Mulan – True to your heart
3. Barcelona Nights – Ottmar Liebert; a Spanish instrumental. This something she and I have liked to listen to in the past, but we never considered doing a Spanish piece before.
4. Someday – Yanni: instrumental. Very light and upbeat.
5. Singing in the rain. You all know this one.
6. Rodeo – Aaron Copeland; instrumental. Another one you’ll recognize. This one was recommended here and was also used recently by another young girl at our rink.
7. True Friend – Hannah Montana.

My seven year old very quickly narrowed this list to three options: Lizzie Maguire, Barcelona Nights and True Friend, with True Friend being a very strong favorite because of the Hannah Montana connection. After we both listened to it together we tried to create a picture in our mind of what sections of the song she could use and where she might put her specific moves she agreed it would be difficult to make this work. In a flash she then picked the Spanish piece: Barcelona Nights with a real conviction in her words. I was very surprised as I had viewed this as a long shot to win her approval.

I reviewed the options we had availabe with our Coach and she immediately liked the selection of Barcelona Nights. Her only change was to blend in a closing 15 seconds from a related piece to give us a more dramatic closing.

My daughter will definitely be challenged to perform to this piece, with its very upbeat and typical Spanish passion, but that is actually our goal here. She is an incredible technical skater for her age, but we want her to be able to put some of her emotions into her show. Whether she wins isn’t as important as being able to move from technical skating toward being able to convey a story and feeling that connects with the audience.

We’ve begun mapping out the performance itself and will also have to begin working hard to find a jazzy Spanish dancer costume. We’ll be performing this routine in August at the Lighthouse competition on Cape Cod and I’ll try to keep you all posted on how things are going.

Many thanks to all.

JW

[sk8lady]

Looks like you found appropriate music...but here's what I do, as a coach, to select music for programs:
For adults, they can select their own music, unless it's something I really can't stand (since I'm choreographing the program, I have veto power!).

For kids, I meet with the parents and the kid and ask if there's anything they particularly like or don't like, or if they have something in mind. If what they want to use is not appropriate (read "tacky pop music with unsuitable lyrics the judges will hate"), I look for something with a similar feel.

I stay away from overused pieces (I love "Rodeo" but it's used a lot and reminds EVERYONE of "beef...it's for dinner" and do you REALLY want someone thinking that while you perform your program???) and overly fast pieces. I want to use pieces suitable for the age of the skater--nothing sexy for 7 year olds.

I troll around a lot online (Napster and itunes) listening to different kinds of music and storing them so they're around when I need music for a program. Last year I choreographed programs to Bach's Minuet in G Major from the Anna Magdelena Notebook; "Raisins and Almonds" (Yiddish folk song); music from Riverdance; Loreena McKennitt's "Marco Polo"; and intercut an instrumental version of "Hernando's Hideaway" and McKennitt's "Tango to Evora."

As your coach becomes more experienced, she'll probably start listening to more and more different kinds of music.

[AshBugg44]

I too am a young coach, and I do not let my students skate to music with words above the pre-alpha level. However, my students and I sit down with their parents to choose music. Most of my skaters also do spotlight programs so that they can skate to fun music as well.