I just need to know...

[AW1]

Ok without being judgemental and giving me the that's the way of the world lecture (cause really I don't need that kind of thing right now!)

I want to ask other parents/coaches this...

My daughter has been entering competitions and is consistently coming last (2nd last on a good day) usually to kids up to twice her size/age, which is really taking a toll on her confidence and self-esteem on the ice.

I have asked and asked and asked for feedback on what she's doing/not doing that's causing this, but I never get any answers. Her coach doesn't know what to focus on, as all the comps are closed scoring. I've tried contacting one of the judges politely to ask via email but had no answers.

All I'm trying to work out is how you find this out. I mean, how can she learn/improve on what is holding her back if no one will tell her what it is she needs to work on.

Someone suggested to me that maybe it's just because she's so little, which is fine - if someone would tell us that I'd stop wasting my money on entering her in competitions until she was bigger and actually had a chance.

Can anyone at all shed some light on this for me??

[littlekateskate]

How old is she, what level is she skating?

[Clarice]

This kind of thing is almost impossible to evaluate without having seen the competition, but I'll go at it from my own experience. At one of my daughter's first competitions, at age 6, she was in a group with girls who were 12 - literally twice her age and size. She came last, and with good reason. All other things being equal, the older girls had much more power. The thing is, all other things weren't equal. I wasn't able to recognize it at the time, but now when we watch her old videos, we just laugh. Her stroking was choppy, her jumps were cheated, her sit spin wasn't low enough. She was cute as a button, but her skating technique had a long way to go. You and your daughter's coach need to honestly evaluate your daughter's skating and identify the weaknesses. Her size/age may well have something to do with it, but there may be other factors as well. Does she enjoy competing? Do placements matter to her, or is she happy enough just to get the chance to perform? There can be reason to compete even if the skater doesn't place well - gaining experience in front of audiences/judges, meeting personal goals (like to skate a clean program, or land this jump for the first time in competition, or get this many revolutions on a spin, etc.) If you all focus on the progress she is making, skating can continue to be a positive experience for her, whether or not she competes.

[SynchroSk8r114]

This is exactly what has been happening with one of my students, so I can sympathize with you!

This skater is 12 years-old, very small for her age. She has a younger sister who's 10 years-old and people are always saying that the younger sister is older, which only adds insult to injury. This girl is very hardworking and a total perfectionist, but has consistenly taken last place at every competition she participates in for the very same reason you state: she's up against girls twice her size and who look about sixteen! She only competes ISI competitions (because she'd definitely get creamed at USFSA competitions), so the girls she competes against are obviously around her age and at her level; however, this skater has that disadvantage is size and therefore power. Add to that the nerves of competiton and by the time she hits the ice, she's barely moving.

Based on what judges I've spoken with at test sessions have said about this skater, as well as what judges I've talked with at the competitions have added, much of the problem that is that this skater lacks power. It's kind of unfair too because 1.) she's small and tiny, and 2.) she's up against bigger, stronger girls.

Aside from competiting, this girl and her younger sister both test Preliminary MIF a while back. Sister passed, this skater didn't. She broke under nerves, and after seeing all her friends and her younger sister pass, and much like your daughter, her self-esteem and confidence was shot by this point. And what did the judges complain about? Speed and power. Yeah, ouch...

There is hope though. First of all, if nerves play any part into her skating at compeitions/test sessions, you've got to try and get that under control. I try to keep parents away from my skaters once the kids are ready to get on the ice, especially for this skater because her mom only hypes her up and makes her nervous. Her daughter already does all that 'What if...' situations, many of which have never happened to her in her life (such as, 'What if I fall in my scratch spin?'), so mom's nerves don't help. I'm not sure how to tell you to calm your daughter, if this applies to her, as every kid's different.

For the speed/power thing, my skater has been working intensively with me and we've brought in another coach who focuses on power as well. We've been doing several different stroking, power, edge exercises and I've seen a dramatic improvement! She passed her Preliminary MIF with flying colors - waaaay over what she needed to pass and is now working on her Pre-Juvenile MIF and keeping up to the standards of the other girls at the rink (although I do not like to compare skaters and would never say this to her parents, other coaches, or this skater). Passing those MIF and working on things all her friends and her sister is has improved her self-esteem and made her feel like she really deserves to be skating at that level. She went from a kid who used to say 'Gee, do you think I really deserved to pass?' and 'Was that okay? Would that have passed?' to a skater who now states when she notices she's improved and who has a renewed motivation and love of the sport.

She's also joined the rink's synchronized skating team, which has done wonders in pushing her to keep up with some of those bigger, stronger girls. She's learned how to generate speed and power from edges and stroke correctly, and synchro has also improved her presentation. This skater used to be (well, still is a bit) very shy, but skating on a team and making friends has been overwhelmingly helpful.

One thing I wouldn't do is baby your daughter, which is tough to hear because she's your daughter. I know, but if you continue to reinforce her belief that she's only capable of so much, that's what she'll learn to settle for and that won't help with her actual skating or her self-esteem. Yeah, skating's fun and you want your daughter to skate well, but deep down, what's more valuable: having a kid who finishes first or having one who may have had to struggle to skate well but who ultimately learned more important life lessons: determination, overcoming challenges, self-confidence, sportsmanship, etc.?

This isn't easy, but hang in there! With the help of her coach, you guys can get through this!

[AW1]

How old is she, what level is she skating?

She's 6 and competing in Level 2 Aussie Skate, which is the level below preliminary here.

I know someone is going to say "who cares that's not a real competition" somewhere in this thread.... save it cause I don't want to hear it.

ALL I am trying to find out is how one is supposed to improve if they are given no feedback from those judging. I think her coach evaluates her honestly and doesn't expect anything more than she is capable of, yet still pushes the boundaries.

In technical comps, I've pretty much concluded she's got none & buckley's of placing because the kids are bigger/stronger than her. However in things like Artistic Comps, I don't see why they would place a bigger kid with a less artistic program ahead of her. This is what I mean..... without knowing what we need to change/work on - how is she going to improve?

[jskater49]

Artistic is always going to be a crapshoot...but I have noticed that even though that is not supposed to be the way it is, the better skater wins artistic. So if they are bigger and more powerful in a regular freestyle, that's going to give them the advantage in artistic. Unless she has a really really really cool costume.

I'd tell you that's the way it is...but ya don't want to hear that ;-)

J

[dooobedooo]

If you would like feedback from the judges, the best thing is to talk to them in an informal situation. Unfortunately, I can't see anybody in skating actually putting something down in writing, especially in an email that might be forwarded on for laughs - that's just not how it works! Try to have a word with them in person at the competition rink, or maybe find out which rink they are associated with and approach them there.

I've also found that sometimes you can get useful feedback at the competition from a very experienced and secure fellow coach, or fellow skater.

Six is very young - I know of one young skater who always used to place very low at this age (competing against older and more experienced skaters), but several years later did eventually win a national title.

[sk8guy]

It is not appropriate for a parent to be contacting judges. This should be done through your coach.

In my area there are competitions which have age, and or jump restrictions which are great for the little ones. The larger competitions have no restrictions and people know to expect skaters from age 6 to 16 and the range in ability. It is not realistic to enter a 6 year old in a competition like this for anything other than some fun, a special day with the family and experience, even though she's too young to appreciate how "experience" will help her down the road.

[Logan3]

Hi,
It might be that the reason that you are not getting a lot of feedback is that there is NO feedback to get. Your dd most probably is doing the best she can for a 6 year old. Unless you have access to a competition that group the girls according to age then you are pretty much stack. I can see only 2 ways to go:
1) Be patient. Eventually she will catch up !
2) Hold her back. Replace some of the freestyle sessions with strocking and power classes. This way she stays in the same freestlyle level but she becomes a stronger skater.

[dbny]

In addition to what others have said, you could also stop entering her in so many competitions. Start picking the ones she does enter more carefully. You could keep her in the basic skills or participation competitions where the groups are by both skill level and age, are no larger than three or four skaters, and every skater gets a medal.

[Rusty Blades]

One thing I have seen done here is for the coach to arrange to hire a judge for one session to evaluate the skater. Since it is not a competition and you are paying the bill, YOU get a detailed evaluation through the judge's eyes.

[slusher]

There's a development program in our area, to discover talent I guess, and one coach I know puts all her kids into this program, and it costs for the extra competition fees but they get written feedback from the judges. None of them have much of a chance of being picked for the special team or whatever it is, but it is a fabulous way of seeing what the judges think.

I also know another coach that puts their kids in that same program and does not let the skaters or parents see the written feedback. The coach manages the interaction.

Skating can be a soul wrenching sport, but the job of the COACH is to prepare the skater for the competition, with personal performance goals and expectations. It's very difficult to find a 6 year old mature enough to handle this. It does suck to be last for every competition, been there done that.

Edited to add: It is also extremely helpful to watch back videos with the coach and count the number of revolutions in spins from the established position, look at jump take offs and landing for rotation and cheats and watch for good usage of the ice. I wouldn't do this with a six year old other than maybe as a reminder to make sure they do enough spin rotations.

[twokidsskatemom]

Im not sure if she is upset or you are more upset for her.
There are two ways to look at this. Do you talk to her about the fact she is the youngest and might place last ? How does she handle that ?Does she gets upset at herself or upset as she knows you are upset ?
Since we live in a small state, both my kids have ALWAYS been with kids twice their age.We did start out saying thing like... you will be with older kids, more muscles, bigger ect. In the begining, they did place last alot.Maybe due to no presure from us, they didnt care. Its not that they didnt want to win, its just they knew it was the experience they wanted, not the medal.We talked alot about the bigger picture. And yes, some 5 and 6 year olds can handle the talk and do understand.
But after awhile, they did started placing higher than older kids.The both love to compete and step up when they do compete.Its not like she will always place last with older skaters IF her skills are the same.My son age 6 just did a non test show case with a 14 year old girl and placed first.He had more skills than she did.The 14 year old girl was good, and we told him, you might not come in first, she is much older than you .The past two years for my daughter its been the same.placing well with older skaters.They skate both ISI and USFSA.
The second is maybe she is not ready to compete or maybe she just isnt a competive skater. Its hard to handle it and she is young. I would just take a break and focus on skill building, recitials ect.
As far as the judges, both our skaters have had critques of programs from judges. Does your club offer anything like that ?
Im sure you are doing the best you can for your skater and that is all that counts !Maybe our way isnt for everyone,ymmv

[AW1]

dooobedooo & sk8guy - this was how I was told to ask for feedback, hence why I did it that way.

dbny, there aren't many comps out here. They have an in-rink one every term (4 per year) plus club championships, plus usually another 2 maybe over the course of 12 months. I don't enter her in all of them because financially it's not doing anything for her and she doesn't need to be exposed to that many comps in my opinion.

twokidsskatemom, I am upset for her naturally (however I am pregnant and hormonal and this shows in my post)... BUT I only get upset/annoyed because she's taking it to heart and keeps asking what it was she did wrong. When neither me or her coach can tell her this, she thinks in her own little mind she didn't do anything wrong (which I know isn't the case) but how can she be expected to learn/grow and improve without that feedback?

We always explained to her she might not place because she's up against much bigger kids (she's been doing this since she was 4) but after 2 years of consistently coming last, she's starting to be very much affected by it. The day after this last comp, she didn't want to skate at all, which is NOT like her... :(

I wouldn't care if someone just outright said to me, don't enter her in any comps until she's 8 - she's got no chance of placing until then... however this is the problem. No-one, including her coach, can tell me why she places so bad against these other kids. In her FS program the other night there were 6 kids ... at least 3 of these kids had falls and still placed ahead of her.

[twokidsskatemom]

dooobedooo & sk8guy - this was how I was told to ask for feedback, hence why I did it that way.

dbny, there aren't many comps out here. They have an in-rink one every term (4 per year) plus club championships, plus usually another 2 maybe over the course of 12 months. I don't enter her in all of them because financially it's not doing anything for her and she doesn't need to be exposed to that many comps in my opinion.

twokidsskatemom, I am upset for her naturally (however I am pregnant and hormonal and this shows in my post)... BUT I only get upset/annoyed because she's taking it to heart and keeps asking what it was she did wrong. When neither me or her coach can tell her this, she thinks in her own little mind she didn't do anything wrong (which I know isn't the case) but how can she be expected to learn/grow and improve without that feedback?
WWe always explained to her she might not place because she's up against much bigger kids (she's been doing this since she was 4) but after 2 years of consistently coming last, she's starting to be very much affected by it. The day after this last comp, she didn't want to skate at all, which is NOT like her... :(

I wouldn't care if someone just outright said to me, don't enter her in any comps until she's 8 - she's got no chance of placing until then... however this is the problem. No-one, including her coach, can tell me why she places so bad against these other kids. In her FS program the other night there were 6 kids ... at least 3 of these kids had falls and still placed ahead of her.

Why is she upset IF you tell her she might not place well with older kids ?If she knows that going in, she should just skate to have fun !If it still bothers her that much, I would just wait till she is older.
I would guess its her basic skills that are holding her back.When I got upset the first time Grace didnt place well, looking back, it was her basic stroking crossovers ect.
I would say that at that level, its very hard to judge. You might have one that stands out, but the rest of the pack is close.Until they get jumps combos, spins combos or things that are different, its just hard to call.
Good luck !!

[AW1]

Why is she upset IF you tell her she might not place well with older kids ?If she knows that going in, she should just skate to have fun !If it still bothers her that much, I would just wait till she is older.

I think she gets upset because she's a stubborn kid and very competitive by nature... it's just the way she is. :giveup:

[Skittl1321]

I think she gets upset because she's a stubborn kid and very competitive by nature... it's just the way she is. :giveup:

I understand that as much as you prepare your child for the very real possibility that it will happen again, she might get upset. You prepare your child, not control her. And it's okay for her to get bummed about it, but if it's taking the enjoyment out of skating, then maybe you should pull her from competitions for awhile. Or do 2 a year instead of 4.

I think with a lot of the little kids, they do fantastic tricks, but they just don't have the basics to back them up. And strong basic skills win it for skaters. You said she skated a clean program while other kids fell, and still finished last. But if those older kids fell on jumps, and had a stronger performance on footwork and transitions, it's still possible for them to place higher. You even see that at high level competions, where a gold medalist will have had a fall and a silver will have a clean, but lower scoring program.

Are there any exhibition opportunities in your area? I think the chance to perform without being ranked might be better for your daughter, at least until her basic skills mature. If there aren't any, could you talk with your rink about setting something like this up? Our LTS program just did an exhibition that was 30 minutes long and had skaters from Snowplow 3 to Intermediate pairs perform routines, so the learn to skate kids could see what "figure skaters" at different levels look like. Most of the kids in the LTS program have never had the opportunity to see a figure skating routine. It required very little planning, and no extra ice was purchased- the LTS director just chopped 5 minutes off of each class, and then an ice make was canceled before the next session to provide the time.

I also think you should talk to your coach about not passing her up to the next level based on the ability to get through tricks. It's easy to say "spiral- check, half flip- check, one foot spin- check." And go to the next level. But often these levels are passed with a low level of profiency of the skills because the skater is just happy they can do it, and the coach judged programs don't really have a standard other than "can do it". But you can also not test a level until you have a higher level of mastery. I don't think it's "sandbagging" to stay at a level until your basics catch up with your tricks. It's sandbagging if you are winning every single competition at your level, and can do the requirements of the next level, but don't want to move up so you can keep your gold medals. Clearly, this wouldn't be the case. Lessons focusing on edges and crossovers aren't always as fun as spins and jumps, but they need to be done too.

I hope that even with this frustration skating remains fun for your daughter. Just remind her there is a lot more to skating then competiting, and that she has years of competitions ahead of her, and then cut the comps from 4 a year to 2. You might also remind her how many competitions the famous skaters have lost before they were able to win them. (I believe the US ladies junior national champion this year didn't even make it to novice sectionals last year and she's amazing.)

[sk8tegirl06]

I don't know what to say in terms of competition as I have yet to compete. But I do sympathize with the not getting answers. I'm the type of person as well, who needs to know what went wrong in the judges' eyes and how to correct. To place a child last tells them they are not good enough yet, but how are they supposed to know what "good enough" is in terms of judging if there is no feedback from an outside source. I have been judged in auditions for band/orchestra since the 4th grade. Even if it just a score in each musical category, I know to work a little more on this or that. When the circumstances arise, I have been able to talk in detail about certain auditions. Most times they are very open and willing to talk, from other messages I am getting the sense that the skating world is not as open. Everybody has good days and bad days, but at the very least the musician/skater should be entitled to constructive criticism. She is young still and I hope despite her stubborness she skates for the joy of skating and not placement.

[Skittl1321]

To place a child last tells them they are not good enough yet, but how are they supposed to know what "good enough" is in terms of judging if there is no feedback from an outside source.

I have to disagree with this statement, at least as how I am reading it.

A skater who places last is being told "the skaters who placed ahead of you were better than you were on this particular day". It has nothing to do with being "good enough" as there is no set standard that they must be better than. They merely have to be better than anyone else who is there, on that paticular day.

In a test- you know if you are 'good enough'. There is a set standard. You meet it, or you don't. In competition, there is not that luxury. If you weren't "good enough" for the level, you would not be in that level, you would be in the one below it. BUT many people in each level are FAR beyond good enough, they are exceptional- and they are the ones who win the level. There comes a time when they need to leave a level, but it doesn't seem like the OP is saying the girls her daughter is competiting against are in a level too low for them (sandbagging) merely that she is unsure why her daughter is not placing higher.

[phoenix]

I am getting the sense that the skating world is not as open.

You have to remember that a competition is not an evaluation session. Some competitions do offer critiques, but typically not at this low level.

Here's the scenario: you are a judge. You are sitting, in a cold rink, for 6 hours. During that time you watch 129 children, of varying degrees of ability (or, let's be honest, non-ability), skate their program. You've never seen any of these children before in your life. Half of them are wearing pink dresses. The other half skate to "Little Mermaid" or some other Disney music.

At the end of the day you drive home, spend 45 minutes in a hot bath trying to get warm again, and drop off into bed.

Three days later you get an email or voicemail message from one of the parents whose child skated that day, asking for more details as to why you placed her where you did—"She was the one in the pink dress, & skated to the Little Mermaid." You, of course, have no idea who that child is, what place you gave them, or for that matter who the parent is. Clearly they're unhappy with you & want answers.

Do you return the call/email? I wouldn't.

That's why parents aren't encouraged (in the States, anyway) to contact judges. If you want a critique, as someone mentioned, you have the coach contact a judge & arrange a private session. Or, perhaps, in a very small competition & with a *very* accomodating judge, you have the coach set it up before the competition ever starts, that they will take extra notes on that one skater & review them with the coach later.

I think your answer is in your question: she's skating against girls who are older/bigger than her. That means they're stronger, jump higher (even if the technique may not be as good), spin faster, skate faster, etc etc. It's just the way it is. At a higher level, things change, being small is an advantage, & they can get much better results if their skating is up to par. If it's discouraging to her for now, pull her from competition. 6 is very, very, very young. It really is, even in skating. In the long run, it won't hurt her one bit to wait to compete until she's 8 or 9.

[SynchroSk8r114]

You have to remember that a competition is not an evaluation session. Some competitions do offer critiques, but typically not at this low level.

Here's the scenario: you are a judge. You are sitting, in a cold rink, for 6 hours. During that time you watch 129 children, of varying degrees of ability (or, let's be honest, non-ability), skate their program. You've never seen any of these children before in your life. Half of them are wearing pink dresses. The other half skate to "Little Mermaid" or some other Disney music.

At the end of the day you drive home, spend 45 minutes in a hot bath trying to get warm again, and drop off into bed.

Three days later you get an email or voicemail message from one of the parents whose child skated that day, asking for more details as to why you placed her where you did—"She was the one in the pink dress, & skated to the Little Mermaid." You, of course, have no idea who that child is, what place you gave them, or for that matter who the parent is. Clearly they're unhappy with you & want answers.

Do you return the call/email? I wouldn't.

That's why parents aren't encouraged (in the States, anyway) to contact judges. If you want a critique, as someone mentioned, you have the coach contact a judge & arrange a private session. Or, perhaps, in a very small competition & with a *very* accomodating judge, you have the coach set it up before the competition ever starts, that they will take extra notes on that one skater & review them with the coach later.

I think your answer is in your question: she's skating against girls who are older/bigger than her. That means they're stronger, jump higher (even if the technique may not be as good), spin faster, skate faster, etc etc. It's just the way it is. At a higher level, things change, being small is an advantage, & they can get much better results if their skating is up to par. If it's discouraging to her for now, pull her from competition. 6 is very, very, very young. It really is, even in skating. In the long run, it won't hurt her one bit to wait to compete until she's 8 or 9.

Well put, Phoenix! As a coach and an ISI competition judge, I totally agree with your assessment of the situation. You get my "Best Answer to the Thread" award! :bow:

[sk8tegirl06]

Like I prefaced my last post, I have yet to participate in a competition. :giveup:

However, the OP said the competition was closed scoring. Is that normal practice? My only competitive experience has been in marching band, and yes after 5-6 hours of competition the judges were required to give critiques to the band directors who then relayed the information to the band members. The compeition site/judges also provide score breakdowns for each category and each level of competition. I see your point in having 100+ parents wanting to know why their kid placed where they did, but I don't see parents pouring money into a sport where their child is placing poorly and nobody can tell them why.

Overall, I think the skater in question is probably out of her league size wise, maturity wise, etc.

[techskater]

Yes, closed or partially closed scoring is the norm. Under IJS, you will see the total scores posted (TES and PCS) on the wall once the competition is over. For qualifying competitions, the scores may be read between skaters. For non qualifying in the US, a coach can request a critique (we've gotten them at several club comps from different judges).

I would recommend that the COACH request a judge come to the rink and provide a critique. It's not uncommon here at all that before a test (when it's marginal) or when preparing a new program, that the coach request a critique of the program/moves/etc. The judge will suggest areas of improvement.

[3skatekiddos]

Sorry, neither here nor there but I have just made a mental note NOT to have my DD wear pink or skate to Disney in her first "competition" ( it's a club one ) :giveup: LOL.

[Lmarletto]

I have asked and asked and asked for feedback on what she's doing/not doing that's causing this, but I never get any answers. Her coach doesn't know what to focus on, as all the comps are closed scoring. I've tried contacting one of the judges politely to ask via email but had no answers.
I don't understand this. At your daughter's level, her coach should be able to give you all the feedback you need. Going to a judge for explanations at this level is just 8O .

You haven't been really specific about what the program content at Aussie Skate level 2 is, so I'm just going to assume it's close to USFS FS2 (half jumps, sal and toe, forward and sometimes back scratch, no sit or camel, spirals, shoot the ducks, bunny hops, mohawks to dress up the program). Any coach qualified to teach at that level should be able to watch a group of skaters at a competition and give you an evaluation, element for element, of how your daughter compares. There's usually a big, ole, messy bunch of skaters in the middle, so placements are a bit of a crap shoot, but a guesstimate of top, middle or bottom third should be pretty close. Repeatedly placing last indicates two things, IMO, 1) the skater is competing at too high a level and/or 2) the competitions are too close together and there hasn't been an opportunity for improvement in skills. While it's true that older, larger skaters often have an advantage in terms of speed and power, I think it's just as likely that they have gotten stuck at a particular level because they are stiff, cautious and have poor technique. At the basic skills/single jump levels a smaller, younger skater with decent athletic ability and a good coach may start out at the bottom, but should steadily move up to middle of the pack and then medaling.

My daughter's coach actually plans for this and spaces competitions out so that when we look look back at competition videos we can clearly see the progression in program content and quality of elements relative to the other competitors. And everything her coach has said about what was necessary to improve placement has always been true. At 10, my daughter still is very unhappy about not medalling, but she has at least superficially bought into her coaches strategy. At 8 she would burst into tears as soon as we left the rink and at 6 she probably would have refused to compete ever again - but she didn't start competing until she was 7 so we were spared that drama. Some kids just need a little more time to develop a mature approach to competition than others.

[AW1]

thank you all for your feedback.

Re: getting a judge in to evaluate - I've never seen it happen here and don't even know if it does because the judges are volunteers, they usually give up their time for the comps only from what I gather.

Anyway it seems life may have sorted it out for my daughter anyway, since I found out today I'm unemployed and simply can't afford to have her continue skating and gymnastics. She'll have to pick out of the 2, and skating is more expensive, so that looks as though it might get the cut.

[kayskate]

Anyway it seems life may have sorted it out for my daughter anyway, since I found out today I'm unemployed and simply can't afford to have her continue skating and gymnastics. She'll have to pick out of the 2, and skating is more expensive, so that looks as though it might get the cut.

I'm sorry to hear this bad news. Best wishes for finding a new job. I am also sorry to hear your DD may have to give up skating for a while. My suggestion: get her a pair of roller skates and take her to the park. I started as a rec roller skater as a child, your daughter's age. Roller builds strength. You really have to push to get moving. This may help your child develop the muscle and strength she needs to ice skate w more power.

You may also consider other off ice activities. In the US, schools offer lots of after school sports that would contribute to your DD's overall athleticism and help her build confidence. Look into this at your school. I know you are not in the US and I have no idea what is common in Australia. Being on the ice alone is very intimidating. She may benefit from participating on a team. In the US soccer is very popular w girls. It also emphasizes running, quickness, agility, leg/lower body coordination, etc. These skills are related to skating.

Kay

[sk8tmum]

I would recommend that the COACH request a judge come to the rink and provide a critique. It's not uncommon here at all that before a test (when it's marginal) or when preparing a new program, that the coach request a critique of the program/moves/etc. The judge will suggest areas of improvement.

We also have fairly collegial coaches who will critique other skater's programs and tests (on request!) in order to give it a second/third/fourth eye.

[Mrs Redboots]

Yes, closed or partially closed scoring is the norm. Not in the UK and Europe it's not - open scoring almost all the time for us, except occasionally for closed club competitions.

Anyway it seems life may have sorted it out for my daughter anyway, since I found out today I'm unemployed and simply can't afford to have her continue skating and gymnastics. She'll have to pick out of the 2, and skating is more expensive, so that looks as though it might get the cut.
It would make more sense - skating will wait, whereas gymnastics might not, and the gymnastics will feed into her skating should she take it up again a couple of years down the line.

*Hugs* - I do hope you find something else soon.