Short Program?

[coolsk8ingirl]

I am an intermediate ladies skater...If I do a half flip double flip after a transition in my short program, will that count in as a combination?

[jskater49]

I am an intermediate ladies skater...If I do a half flip double flip after a transition in my short program, will that count in as a combination?

I'm pretty sure half jumps don't count.

j

[doubletoe]

It will not count as a combination because a combination must consist of either two or three listed jumps done immediately after each other and you are only doing one listed jump. The "listed" jumps are: toeloop, salchow, loop, flip, lutz and axel (toe walley counts as a toeloop). They can each be done as a single, double, triple or quad but will not count as a jump if only done as a half jump. However, a half jump can serve as a difficult entry for any of the listed jumps, so the half flip might raise the GOE points of the double flip you do right after it.

[vesperholly]

It would be a sequence. Combinations are listed jumps with no steps between the landing and takeoff edge, and sequences are any other jump combination that do not.

[doubletoe]

It would be a sequence. Combinations are listed jumps with no steps between the landing and takeoff edge, and sequences are any other jump combination that do not.

Not really, because a sequence must begin and end with a listed jump, and this one consists of only one unlisted half jump and one listed jump.

[techskater]

It's a "difficult" entry OR it's a preceeding step on the jump proceeded by steps in the SP

[daisies]

It would be a sequence. Combinations are listed jumps with no steps between the landing and takeoff edge, and sequences are any other jump combination that do not.

As doubletoe stated, a sequence has to include at least two listed jumps. But new this year is the additional rule that you can't have turns or steps between jumps in a sequence, you can only do small hops, like half-loops or mazurkas. (But even with mazurkas, you'd half to follow it with an axel, because you can turn after it!)

[chowskates]

Not really, because a sequence must begin and end with a listed jump, and this one consists of only one unlisted half jump and one listed jump.

What I heard from a judge last year was that,
one unlisted 1/2 jump + one listed jump is not a sequence.
BUT
one unlisted 1/2 jump + 2 listed jumps (in combination) will be counted as a sequence, not a combination

Not sure if this has been clarified in this years' rules... but if a sequence doesn't allow turns, then having a turn in between the 1/2 jump & the first listed jump would rule out a sequence.

Haha, I was going to ask if anyone knew for sure, but I suppose I just answered my own question... :mrgreen:

[daisies]

What I heard from a judge last year was that,
one unlisted 1/2 jump + one listed jump is not a sequence.
BUT
one unlisted 1/2 jump + 2 listed jumps (in combination) will be counted as a sequence, not a combination

That is not correct.

If you do single axel-half loop-double salchow, that's a jump sequence -- it's a listed jump, followed by an unlisted jump, followed by a listed jump, and there are no turns or steps in between.

But, if you do a walley-double toe-double toe -- which is one unlisted jump + two listed jumps in combination -- that's still a combination. The unlisted jump isn't between the listed jumps, it simply serves as a transition into the listed jumps.

Now, if you do double toe-mazurka-double flip ... that's two separate jumps, because you will need to do a three-turn or other such turns/steps to get backward to take off for the flip.

Clear as mud!

[wasabi]

Not really, because a sequence must begin and end with a listed jump, and this one consists of only one unlisted half jump and one listed jump.

That's correct in IJS. But for short program especially, some local competitions are still using 6.0 for levels like intermediate. You probably wouldn't get a deduction for it (since most judges pretty much go by IJS rules anyway), but technically, under 6.0, any half-jump + a full jump IS a sequence and thus illegal in short program.

Just pay attention to what judging system you're skating under and change the footwork accordingly, if you can.