double toe help

[*JennaD*]

Hey everyone!

So lately I have been having a lot of trouble with my double toe...

I feel like it's taking me too long to get into a backspin in the air...does anyone have any tips on how to snap into the position faster?

And also, I know some people do double toe like a "toe axel"...like they pick and then do an axel. My coach told me this is wrong because you end up taking off forwards, and you ahve to take off off your backward edge.

So I have my right pick in the ice ( I skate CW), and am on a left outside edge...how do I get into a backspin from that position without doing a toe axel and kicking my left leg through so I end up taking off forwards?? I really don't understand this jump...lol

thanks!

[doubletoe]

Boy, if we could buy clean toeloop takeoffs, whoever was selling them would be a billionaire! :lol:

I've just recently managed to clean up my single toe takeoff (have not yet gotten up the courage to try it on the double, which used to be a nice, consistent toe-axel :frus:) There are two things that helped me get this:

1) Stand on your right foot, reach back and put your left toepick in, then pull yourself back, staying backwards and keeping your entire body as one unit. As the right foot approaches the left, let it start to cross in front of the left and then sort of pivot on the right blade, like a RBO 3-turn, which will turn you forward as you pass the picking foot. Do this a gazillion times.

2) When you pick and pull back to take off, think of opening a door with your left arm (picking side arm). It will be extended in front of you as you pick, then once the pick goes into the ice, pull it back from the elbow, just like you are opening a door towards you. This will unblock the left side of your body without making you pivot on the toe. Nikolai Morozoff taught this little trick at the Hackensack camp this year and it's one of the best tips I've ever gotten!

[techskater]

I think about picking like doing a back outside pivot and then pushing to my picking side and kicking though with the (new) free foot and then up and over like an Axel. I had a World level skater who was visiting comment on my very nice double toes this weekend, (8O) so I would say this works really well as a method, at least for me.

[wasabi]

Your issue actually sounds like it's mostly with timing. Double toe was always my hardest double (I learned double lutz-double loop before it!), but what helped me most was doing a lot of doing split singles. Do a single toe, but in the air, split your legs (leg a split jump) and then quickly bring them together ("click your heels"), and land on two feet. It may seem counterintuitive, but practicing lots and lots of singles will be far more productive than practicing losts and lots of doubles.

[flikkitty11]

I skate CW and im having problems with my double toe too. I had it clean but i was doing a really bad technique. It wasnt a toe axel, i used to stop as i put my toe in and almost go around in a circle.
Now that nationals are over (from australia) my coach has decided to make me re-learn it. sigh.
She told me to do lots of singles with really good technique. Then, in my lesson, she was trying to get me to do a double with the same technique but i just couldnt do it, i was too scared to change technique. So, to get over the fear, she had me do 1.5 rotations and land forward (making sure i didnt fall on my face). Doing 1.5 rotations meant that i dont have to be in a tight position and dont have to snap. Now, all i have to do is try to pull in slightly tighter and snap a tiny bit quicker each time i practice it.
The point:
Practice single with perfect technique.
Try to snap a tiny bit quicker each time.

[doubletoe]

Your issue actually sounds like it's mostly with timing. Double toe was always my hardest double (I learned double lutz-double loop before it!), but what helped me most was doing a lot of doing split singles. Do a single toe, but in the air, split your legs (leg a split jump) and then quickly bring them together ("click your heels"), and land on two feet. It may seem counterintuitive, but practicing lots and lots of singles will be far more productive than practicing losts and lots of doubles.

When you say split double toe, I assume you mean with the right leg in front, not the left? So you're doing a bell jump (or "click waltz jump") but from a proper backwards toeloop takeoff?

[vesperholly]

I like the advice about thinking of a back pivot. That would explain a lot, since my back pivot with the left toe pick is very poor. :giveup:

[wasabi]

When you say split double toe, I assume you mean with the right leg in front, not the left? So you're doing a bell jump (or "click waltz jump") but from a proper backwards toeloop takeoff?

I guess? I'm not really sure what a click waltz is.

[jskater49]

My daughter's coach's students all have good uncheated toe loops and she does the back pivot thing. She's trying that with me but I can't even do a back pivot so we really had to go back to square one.

j

[vesperholly]

I guess? I'm not really sure what a click waltz is.
A bell jump is different than a click waltz. A click waltz is when you do a waltz jump, but bring your feet together mid-air and then land normally. A bell jump is basically an axel with only 360 degrees rotation - you take off forward and land forward.

I think I get your split double toe, but which leg goes in front on a CCW jump? For a regular CCW split jump with a flip take off, you pick with the right foot and the left leg is in front.