BlackManSkating's Pre-Bronze Test Experience [Archive]

View Full Version : BlackManSkating's Pre-Bronze Test Experience

blackmanskating

08-27-2007, 05:05 PM

*Disclaimer* This is going to be a long post so prepare yourself. But I am going to try and make it as informative as possible. :)

Saturday, I took my first moves and freestyle test and I am pleased to report that I passed them both!!! It's been a long time since I've been that stressed out and nervous. I can sing and perform in front of thousands of people but when it comes to skating, I couldn't even feel the lower half of my body. I have no idea how I pulled that together. I am glad that it is over. 8-) Here is how everything went down:

I woke up at 7:30 in the morning unable to go back to sleep. I decided to just get up put on some music and try to eat breakfast. I could feel the tension in my arms and legs accompanied by butterflies in my stomach. :oops: I decided that trying to digest food in this condition, was probably not a good idea. So I just had reduced sodium chicken broth for breakfast and water to drink. Breakfast of Champions right?? LOL I decide to call my girlfriend, then listen to music and take a hot bath to relax myself for the task ahead.

I was scheduled to test at 1:13PM and I had to be there an hour early in case of contingent test failures and cancellations. I show up in all black with a pair of shades so that I could at least look like I'm cool and collected. It didn't work. When I showed up to meet my coach, I took off my shades and my coach noticed that my hands were shaking. Never in my life have I ever seen that rink so quiet. The nervousness was so thick that you could practically see it in the air. Everybody was nervous especially the coaches. At least I know that I am not alone. My coach had a few other students testing before me, so this gives me time alone to gather my thoughts.

It's time for the warm-up. Me and 4 other people step out on the ice to warm up. I start skating alternating forward crossovers as fast as I can to warm up my body. I can't feel my knees or my ankles but they are shaking like crazy because I am stumbling on something I consider routine. I am trying to calm down but it is way too quiet in there. Finally I hear my coach say, "get down in your ankles and push!!!" At first it startled me, but it was exactly what I needed to get through.

After the warm-up I am up first. Here's what the judges said about each element I performed. I'll start with postive comments followed by the negative ones.

Perimeter Stroking: Good Flow and nice knees; maintains flow and speed; solid lines good extensions. Good upper body control and presentation. Did more crossovers going clockwise so they looked weaker than counterclockwise.

My legs were shaking so much in the beginning that I could hear my edge wobble. I quickly got a grip on myself and corrected the problem. I did struggle on my clockwise crossovers out of sheer nervousness. I let my body lean into the circle I was creating. Stupid mistake.

Basic Consecutive Edges: Good control and clean, nice presentation throughout. Good starting pushes on the back outside and inside edges. Significant tendency to 2-foot transitions. Transitions were wide at times.

I thought I did quite well on this exercise. All my edges were clean and I didn't lose control at all. I was holding my breath the whole time though. I totally forgot to breathe. I almost passed out at the end of it. I don't know what they meant by "2-footing my transitions" because I thought you had to put your foot down to push on the other edge. I'm not river dancing. Maybe I kept my free foot down for too long.

Forward/Backward Crossovers: Good speed and continuous flow; Good power nicely placed back outside edges on the crossovers. Nice transitions when changing circles. Posture too far forward on back crossovers; some forced edges.

I started off pretty good but I started to build speed very quickly on both the forward and the back crossovers. Pretty soon it felt like I was going too fast for the circles I was creating and I had no more room to make them bigger. I felt like I was too close to the wall and I scratched my toepicks a little and it made me slow down enough to dodge the wall. They were right about me leaning too far forward. I was way more forward than normal and leaning too far inside on my circles.

Waltz Eight: Good control of 3-turn and back outside edge; Pattern could be bigger. Circles are small.

I thought I did well on this one too but this is the one test where all of the judges said the same thing. They said that my pattern was too small. I agree because I did not get a good push coming off the line and instead of having one smaller circle followed by 3 huge ones, I decided to make them all even with the first one.

Forward 3-turn pattern: Lots of speed and Power, control of turns with a clear checking off the upper body. Could use more control; whipped 3-turns and scratches.

I did not do well on this pattern. One of the judges wanted to fail me because of it. This was the pattern where the judges were contradicting each other too. 2 of them said I had good control while the other one said that I had poor control because of whipped 3 turns. I skated this one really fast and my speed increased with each crossover. Maybe if I had slowed down a little bit, my 3's wouldn't have looked so whipped around but hey, it is what it is. Let's move on to the freestyle test.

I was very nervous on this test too but I did far better. I only received one negative comment. Here we go:

Jumps: I chose to do a loop and a flip. All three judges loved the speed and height of the jumps. I slightly scratched my free foot on the ice during my loop because I was too far inside the circle when I took off. I couldn't believe I did that. I got focused and went up for my flip and did it well.

Spins: Nice, fast, and Centered 13 revs good control

They liked my scratch spin too. It felt very centered and controlled. I didn't know they were going to count how many revs I did though. I wasn't expecting that.

Forward/Backward Crossovers: good start; nice extension of free foot; well done with flow and control; cadence was unequal.

I learned my lesson from the Moves test and showed them that I can do crossovers well in both directions directions and going forwards and backwards. It was easier because I was not inhibited by staying on a hockey circle. I could open it up with more speed and a bigger circle.

Spiral: Hip Height with nice turnout; very nice; good position

They liked the fact that a guy chose to do a spiral instead of a lunge. I did an outside spiral from one corner of the rink to the other. By then, I was in control of my shaking so the edge didn't wobble and I was able to hold a steady position.

After I found out I passed, I went out to celebrate!!! Yay!!!!!! It's over!!!!8-) Now I'm testing bronze level next month!

BlackManSkating

SynchroSk8r114

08-27-2007, 05:07 PM

:bow: :bow: :bow: Congratulations!!! :bow: :bow: :bow:

blackmanskating

08-27-2007, 05:10 PM

:bow: :bow: :bow: Congratulations!!! :bow: :bow: :bow:

Thanks Synchro Skater!!!! I really appreciate it!!!

BlackManSkating

Skittl1321

08-27-2007, 05:12 PM

TreSk8sAZ

08-27-2007, 05:17 PM

Congrats!

It sounds like you learned some important lessons for you to do your best on the next tests! All of your hard work is paying off!!

LilJen

08-27-2007, 05:30 PM

I show up in all black with a pair of shades so that I could at least look like I'm cool and collected. It didn't work.

This is a hoot!!!

I'm really glad you shared your detailed comments. I was a week from taking my pre-bronze moves when I broke my ankle in April, so I still have done no formal tests, but for the one competition I did back in March I was *totally* jittery, just like I was back in school doing various competitions and performances (and even though all the moves I had to do were quite easy for me).

I was puzzled by the "two-foot transition" comment on the edges, too. You kind of have to have both feet down temporarily to push, right?

This spring my coach was pushing me to do the pre-bronze freestyle test, but I was so shaky on the one-foot spin--though perfectly confident on everything else--I told her nope. No way can *I* get 13 revs, on either 1 or 2feet (I think the test specifies at least 3 revs for each)!

For the waltz eight, my coach always had me do them inside the hockey circles (or the center hockey circle), filling the entire diameter of the circle with the 2 circles--is that how you did them?

Sounds like bronze moves will be a piece of cake for you! Congrats!

looplover

08-27-2007, 05:32 PM

kimberley801

08-27-2007, 05:32 PM

Congratulations! It takes a lot of hard work and skill to skate even at a pre-bronze level. I hope to get there someday. good luck on the next tests!

doubletoe

08-27-2007, 05:36 PM

Congratulations on passing your first USFSA tests!!!! :bow: :D

blackmanskating

08-27-2007, 05:50 PM

Congratulations!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :bow: :bow:

I was wondering how it went!!!! You transferred over from ISI like I did, right? OMG as nervous as I was with ISI tests I'm triply nervous with USFSA ones. Sounds like you really did great! I can't wait to hear your scores for bronze because I bet they'll be high.

I know what you mean. ISI didn't seem as formal as USFSA is. The fact that I did 2 tests in one day only compounded my nervousness. I'm just glad I got through it. I gotta get ready for Bronze. I am determined to get my moves on the same level as my jumps.

BlackManSkating

blackmanskating

08-27-2007, 05:51 PM

Congratulations!

I had a similiar moves test- I was shaking like crazy it was amazing I could skate. I got the "two foot transitions" comment on my back insides- a few skaters looked at the tape, and they said the transition was just too slow making it "two footed" I was trying to get a deep push, but apparently I needed to do it quicker!

I looked at the video you posted on youtube before I tested to see what it was really like. I wanted to thank you because your video helped me know what to expect and now I feel more prepared for my next one.

BlackManSkating

blackmanskating

08-27-2007, 05:53 PM

Congratulations on passing your first USFSA tests!!!! :bow: :D

Thanks doubletoe!!!!! Thanks everybody!!!!! I'm going to continue to do my best.

BlackManSkating

SkaterBird

08-27-2007, 06:41 PM

What a wonderfully informative (and entertaining!) post. Congratulations on a job very well done - you've obviously done a lot of hard work, and it's paid off! I hope I'll do as well if I ever manage to take any of the tests! Treat yourself to something special as a reward - you've earned it!

Mimi

herniated

08-27-2007, 06:57 PM

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!! I loved the detail also in your post. I wore sunglasses once into a competition to look cool too. Noone seemed to care or think I looked cool. :oops: I also get very nervous testing. Once I almost threw up. Aren't you glad I shared that? :lol:

Anyway, congrats again!!!!:bow:

jazzpants

08-27-2007, 07:02 PM

Morgail

08-27-2007, 07:04 PM

Congratulations!! The first tests are the scariest. I'm sure you'll do fine with Bronze:)

mdvask8r

08-27-2007, 07:13 PM

Forward/Backward Crossovers: . . . . Pretty soon it felt like I was going too fast for the circles I was creating and I had no more room to make them bigger. I felt like I was too close to the wall and I scratched my toepicks a little and it made me slow down enough to dodge the wall.

I had the same problem several years ago when I tested Preliminary MIF. The rulebook actually states that you may lay the move out on the long axis and skate larger circles. I tried to convince my former coach to let me do that, but she insisted that I had to keep it on the hockey circles "because everyone does it that way." Well, guess what -- the judges asked me to reskate the element specifying that I turn it on the long axis. I passed with flying colors!! The coach was speechless. :roll:

CONGRATS to you for a good, strong test!!

phoenix

08-27-2007, 08:12 PM

.....I tried to convince my former coach to let me do that, but she insisted that I had to keep it on the hockey circles "because everyone does it that way."

I didn't. I did mine on the long axis & skated the circles almost wall to wall. The judge didn't mind. If I have an adult skater who is a strong/powerful skater, I always have them lay it out that way. The width for the hockey circles is just way too small for a stong, adult-sized skater.

CONGRATS to you, blackmanskating!! Next time, do a very extensive off-ice warmup (enough to get you sweating) just before getting dressed & into your skates--helps greatly w/ nerves, & helps get your legs going much better than those measly 4 minutes of on-ice warmup.

Stormy

08-27-2007, 08:26 PM

I'm going to continue to do my best.

BlackManSkating

That's all you can do! I'm so happy for you. Passing is a great feeling. Congrats!! :)

dbny

08-27-2007, 08:45 PM

Congratulations, and thanks for the report!

FallDownGoBoom

08-27-2007, 09:14 PM

Hey, thank you for the narrative and congratulations on A) testing and B) passing.

I hope others post their own testing experiences, particularly at the pre-bronze and bronze levels. I promise to do so whether I pass or not!

blackmanskating

08-27-2007, 09:25 PM

CONGRATS to you on surviving one of the first of many skating tests that you'll be doing!!! ENJOY the relief that you have now for getting thru these tests... you know that there's MORE coming soon!!! LOL!!! :P :twisted: :lol: (Just raggin' on 'ya!!! But seriously, I think you'll do fine on those tests too!!! I have confidence in you on that. Also, given the comment on the spirals, I think you should have no problem on that element when you do take the Silver Moves tests too!)

GO BLACKMANSKATING!!! GO!!! :bow: :bow: :bow:

Gee, Thanks Jazzpants :P !!!! LOL Hahaha!!! Seriously, thanks for the vote of confidence on my future tests. I am finding that this experience was stressful but it was worth it. I better get used to it if I plan on competing at Nats this year. Let's see how my finances look in a few months.

BlackManSkating

TimDavidSkate

08-27-2007, 09:28 PM

http://www.funmunch.com/graphics/congratulations/graphics/congratulations2.gif

Very nice description of your fantastic day ;)
Good job - first step to Nationals all done now 8-)

CaraSkates

08-27-2007, 09:48 PM

Before I forget - CONGRATULATIONS ON PASSING BOTH TESTS!!!!!!!!!!

[QUOTE=phoenix;335333]I didn't. I did mine on the long axis & skated the circles almost wall to wall. The judge didn't mind. If I have an adult skater who is a strong/powerful skater, I always have them lay it out that way. The width for the hockey circles is just way too small for a stong, adult-sized skater.....QUOTE]

Speaking as a 17year old, strong, teen skater (so yes I am adult sized....) here. I tested Preliminary MIF back in March with a friend/another student of my coach (13yo, very strong skater). While preparing for the test our coach had us practice the crossovers on the hockey circles and on the long axis. We tested them on the hockey circles because the rinks around here always single panel Pre-Pre and Prelim MIF tests so we were on the ice at the same time - if one of us had been in the center on the long axis we would have collided during the pattern. Another friend tested PM last year and she was on the ice with another skater also testing PM. The other skater, a young girl, insisted on skating her pattern on the long axis - my friend came close to hitting her during the test. It is easier to do more crossovers on the long axis but my coach just makes sure we all do four (the min) and when I tested the judges called my friend and me over after the test to tell us it was a pleasure to judge our test.

Someone said something about placement of the waltz eight above? I am a fairly strong MIF skater (at least so far, about to test Pre-Juv, working on Juv), when I tested PPM, I skated my waltz 8 starting in one of the two spots on the ice with no markings - think inbetween the hockey circles at one end, then move towardsthe center circle. Right in the middle of all those is a nice big empty white spot. My coach likes to have all her skaters test this way, but not all are capable - some of the younger ones start on a "dot" or a line. In size - I am 5'6", say I start on the very center dot. My circles extend about 6" past the center circle on each side.

tidesong

08-27-2007, 09:52 PM

Congratulations! We don't have moves test here but I hope to be able to do something like that in the future... and thats my weak point too!

chowskates

08-27-2007, 10:17 PM

Congratulations!!! :D

Below are just a few opinions...

Basic Consecutive Edges: Good control and clean, nice presentation throughout. Good starting pushes on the back outside and inside edges. Significant tendency to 2-foot transitions. Transitions were wide at times.

I thought I did quite well on this exercise. All my edges were clean and I didn't lose control at all. I was holding my breath the whole time though. I totally forgot to breathe. I almost passed out at the end of it. I don't know what they meant by "2-footing my transitions" because I thought you had to put your foot down to push on the other edge. I'm not river dancing. Maybe I kept my free foot down for too long.

Maybe it is that you keep your weight on 2 feet for too long. The way I look at edges is that at any moment in time, your weight should be on 1 foot - i.e. the weight transition should happen quickly. This is usually no problem for forward edges, but the transition for back edges is more tricky! ;)

Forward 3-turn pattern: Lots of speed and Power, control of turns with a clear checking off the upper body. Could use more control; whipped 3-turns and scratches.

I did not do well on this pattern. One of the judges wanted failed me because of it. This was the pattern where the judges were contradicting each other too. 2 of them said I had good control while the other one said that I had poor control because of whipped 3 turns. I skated this one really fast and my speed increased with each crossover. Maybe if I had slowed down a little bit, my 3's wouldn't have looked so whipped around but hey, it is what it is. Let's move on to the freestyle test.

IMHO, whipped 3s come from a forced turn, i.e. you are using your free hip (or even free leg) to make yourself turn rather than the skating hip. It is a matter of technique, not speed, but yes, I think it becomes way more obvious if you're going fast.

montanarose

08-27-2007, 10:22 PM

Many, many congratulations :bow: :bow: :bow: -- and this comes from someone who is still a member (one of the very few :oops: ) of the "Pre-Bronze For Life" Club. I'm sure that from now on the tests will come easier for you -- even if the elements themselves don't :roll: -- but now you know what the testing thing is all about so you can go into it with that experience and that knowledge.

A big "huzzah!" to you, blackmanskating! (and would that there were many more of you, so you would no longer have to be "one of the few"*).

montanarose

*You should steal this line from the USMC: "the few, the proud, the black men skating" :lol:

Scarlett

08-27-2007, 10:29 PM

Congrats BlackManSkating!

Thin-Ice

08-28-2007, 02:31 AM

CONGRATULATIONS!!! The first time testing can be nerve-wracking.. but it sounds like you coped well and now you are halfway to qualifying to go to AN!

Rob Dean

08-28-2007, 06:37 AM

The rulebook actually states that you may lay the move out on the long axis and skate larger circles.

With respect to those circles of back crossovers, I routinely skate on three different rinks (in two facilities), all of somewhat different dimensions. I usually have been doing the crossover circles around the hockey circles across the short dimension of the ice. I was glad to take the test in the widest of the three, as it's not too hard to develop enough speed that crashing into the walls is a real possibility on the narrowest rink. I've practiced them on the long axis, but I never like doing them when it's too crowded (and for that maneuver, it doesn't take many people before *I* think it's too crowded) and finding space in the center is even harder than space around the hockey circles.

My coach did check me out last week to ensure that I could do the moves anywhere on the ice, though, and it turned out that I was triple-paneled with two pre-pre tests, so both ends and the center were needed at some points.

On Waltz-8s, my coach has had me doing them where *each* lobe was about the size of a hockey circle, rather than trying to fit both within one. So, at the end, one lobe is pretty much on or just within a circle and the other ends up topping out about in the middle of the other.

And, congratulations on passing the test! It's amazing how nervous you can get about something that's supposed to be fun, isn't it?

Rob

Mrs Redboots

08-28-2007, 09:42 AM

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/LukeMahdiyah/Congratulations.jpg

Ellyn

08-28-2007, 10:34 AM

With respect to those circles of back crossovers, I routinely skate on three different rinks (in two facilities), all of somewhat different dimensions. I usually have been doing the crossover circles around the hockey circles across the short dimension of the ice. I was glad to take the test in the widest of the three, as it's not too hard to develop enough speed that crashing into the walls is a real possibility on the narrowest rink. I've practiced them on the long axis, but I never like doing them when it's too crowded (and for that maneuver, it doesn't take many people before *I* think it's too crowded) and finding space in the center is even harder than space around the hockey circles.

The first time I tested preliminary I put them on the hockey circles, but because I'm big with decent power and I usually skate on the Olympic size rink but the tests are usually in the NHL rink, that meant I couldn't make the move about getting maximum power because I had to make my primary focus not running into the wall, so I've rotated them.

Just in case I have to do it with another skater doing the same move on the other end of the ice, I have to make it about not crossing the red line, but unless the other skater is doing exactly the same thing in mirror image at the same time it wouldn't be dangerous if I did.

Of course with three skaters on the ice it would be a problem.

Actually, it's the forward crossovers that I worry about running into the wall, because I don't feel quite as much in control of the clockwise ones. On the back crossovers I can control them well enough to avoid the wall if I skate the pattern crosswise, but I just don't get the opportunity to show as much power as I'm capable of.

Skittl1321

08-28-2007, 10:51 AM

Just in case I have to do it with another skater doing the same move on the other end of the ice, I have to make it about not crossing the red line, but unless the other skater is doing exactly the same thing in mirror image at the same time it wouldn't be dangerous if I did.

Of course with three skaters on the ice it would be a problem.

For those who haven't tested prebronze yet- the judges want you to pass. They aren't going to TRY to make it difficult for you.

I found the judges at my test to be EXTREMELY accomodating. There were two of us on the ice at a time, and for the perimeter moves they asked us if we wanted to start on opposite sides- or just follow each other. For perimeter stroking we did opposite sides, for 3-turns I followed him, as my coach wanted me starting on that side. The judges were fine with it.

Before the test started they asked us where we put all of our moves- and told us if we always practiced the waltz 8 and edges at a certain place (hockey circle, end lines) we should do them there. We both said we could do them wherever, so the judges asked us to place ourselves directly in front of them. We both did crossovers at opposite hockey circles, but I was pretty impressed the judges were willing to let us do the moves where WE felt most comfortable, rather than where they wanted them. (Though we ended up doing them where they wanted them, because we were okay with it)

jazzpants

08-28-2007, 11:12 AM

Don't know if this make sense for Pre-Bronze, but many many moons ago, I took the pre-prelim moves test with two other little kids on the same rink (and it was a NHL size rink.) For the perimeter stroking, I just did them with the kids. For the consective edges and waltz 8, we all got different lines towards the middle of the rink (which was scary b/c I was afraid of running into one of the kids on the waltz 8...) The spiral that is on the Silver Moves test was easy to deal with though.

I would imagine that for the new Pre-Bronze 3turn pattern down the length of the rink that they would have to have two at a time, yes? :??

Lucky for me, I'm not physically that big of a skater and all three of us managed to pass our respective pre-prelim moves that day.

SK8RX

08-28-2007, 12:40 PM

Congratulations! Onward and upward. Hope to see you skate in Lake Placid next April.

blackmanskating

08-28-2007, 01:46 PM

For those who haven't tested prebronze yet- the judges want you to pass. They aren't going to TRY to make it difficult for you.

I found the judges at my test to be EXTREMELY accomodating. There were two of us on the ice at a time, and for the perimeter moves they asked us if we wanted to start on opposite sides- or just follow each other. For perimeter stroking we did opposite sides, for 3-turns I followed him, as my coach wanted me starting on that side. The judges were fine with it.

Before the test started they asked us where we put all of our moves- and told us if we always practiced the waltz 8 and edges at a certain place (hockey circle, end lines) we should do them there. We both said we could do them wherever, so the judges asked us to place ourselves directly in front of them. We both did crossovers at opposite hockey circles, but I was pretty impressed the judges were willing to let us do the moves where WE felt most comfortable, rather than where they wanted them. (Though we ended up doing them where they wanted them, because we were okay with it)

Skittl you are right. Generally, the judges want you to pass but it doesn't make you immune to failing. Nervousness will cause you to fail and fail miserably. And be prepared for positive as well as negative comments. My coach wanted to rip up the test results without me reading them because he didn't want me to focus on the negative. Only after assuring him that I wouldn't dwell on the negative stuff would he allow me to see it. The only reason I bothered to look at it was to post my results on this forum. I was just happy that I passed. I'll let my coach worry about the comments and to instruct me on where I need to improve. I mean that's what I pay him for right??

BlackManSkating

garusha

08-28-2007, 04:27 PM

CONGRATULATIONS, BlackManSkating and good luck on your Bronze Tests!

jcookie1982

08-28-2007, 06:18 PM

Congrats!!

Thin-Ice

08-29-2007, 02:19 AM

(snip) ...be prepared for positive as well as negative comments. My coach wanted to rip up the test results without me reading them because he didn't want me to focus on the negative. Only after assuring him that I wouldn't dwell on the negative stuff would he allow me to see it. The only reason I bothered to look at it was to post my results on this forum. I was just happy that I passed. I'll let my coach worry about the comments and to instruct me on where I need to improve. I mean that's what I pay him for right?? BlackManSkating

And that's why the judges put both positive and negative comments on all test sheets, whether you are taking a Pre-Pre or Pre-Bronze or a Senior test of any kind. The comments are there to let you know what you did well (some skaters have no idea they have good power or nice edges and extension!) as well as what that particular judge thinks you will need to work on to succeed at the next level (either testing or competing). You're smart to let your coach focus on the negative comments.. but not everyone is that attentive after hearing the coach say "Bend your knees more" for the 200th time. So sometimes it helps the skater remember if a judge also comments on stiff knees (and sometimes the skater knows it, but still can't get the knees bent enough for judges or coaches... guess how I know that?).

jskater49

08-29-2007, 04:57 AM

And that's why the judges put both positive and negative comments on all test sheets, whether you are taking a Pre-Pre or Pre-Bronze or a Senior test of any kind. The comments are there to let you know what you did well.

That's why judges are SUPPOSED to put both positive and negative comments. Many times they will write nothing. I find that more aggravating than the negative comments. At least you can do something with those.

j

lovepairs

08-29-2007, 05:28 AM

A Huge Congrats, and welcome to the world of testing! Here's the good news:

The more you test, the more your nerves will go away. My first test was the same as yours (couldn't feel my legs.) However, about 30 tests latter, nerves are under control and not only can I feel my legs, I've perfected the art of staying in the moment, too! It definitely gets better the more you test...same goes for competition, too! :P

Thin-Ice

08-29-2007, 08:03 AM

That's why judges are SUPPOSED to put both positive and negative comments. Many times they will write nothing. I find that more aggravating than the negative comments. At least you can do something with those.j

EXCELLENT point jskater49! You're right... better to have comments than be left clueless. We have one local judge who is notorious for putting a check mark on an element when you complete it -- or if he's feeling magnaimous.. a "+" or "-"... not that you'd ever know what he liked or didn't. He does that even on freestyle and dance tests. A few months ago, he judged my friend's Gold Moves test. She was "invited to retry" but he wrote a TON of comments.. and she said THAT was worth framing his test sheet for. No one we talked to had ever seen him write ANY comments ever!

GordonSk8erBoi

08-29-2007, 05:12 PM

Congrats on passing!

You wrote:
Waltz Eight: Good control of 3-turn and back outside edge; Pattern could be bigger. Circles are small.

I thought I did well on this one too but this is the one test where all of the judges said the same thing. They said that my pattern was too small. I agree because I did not get a good push coming off the line and instead of having one smaller circle followed by 3 huge ones, I decided to make them all even with the first one.

I've been thinking about this as I'm planning on testing in December. I've always started W-8 as you probably did (push off from a T into the first lobe), but it occurs to me that you are allowed introductory steps on all the Moves, aren't you? so you could have (or I could) have a couple of strokes into the Waltz-8, which would fix the problem you experienced (not a good push off the line).

Skittl1321

08-29-2007, 05:29 PM

I've been thinking about this as I'm planning on testing in December. I've always started W-8 as you probably did (push off from a T into the first lobe), but it occurs to me that you are allowed introductory steps on all the Moves, aren't you? so you could have (or I could) have a couple of strokes into the Waltz-8, which would fix the problem you experienced (not a good push off the line).

The judging form does say "introductory steps are optional" I've never seen it done with steps though- I wonder if even though it's "allowed" judges might think it was odd. (You know, since you hear stories about judges failing skaters in OTB tights or whatever :roll: )

Not all the moves allow steps, though the edges have to be done from a standstill.

CaraSkates

08-29-2007, 06:38 PM

.....
I've been thinking about this as I'm planning on testing in December. I've always started W-8 as you probably did (push off from a T into the first lobe), but it occurs to me that you are allowed introductory steps on all the Moves, aren't you? so you could have (or I could) have a couple of strokes into the Waltz-8, which would fix the problem you experienced (not a good push off the line).

This came up at my rink (very small, everyone discusses and crititques eachother all the time, maybe 10 competitive skaters?) the past June when one of my coaches young students was testing PPM. She wanted to skate into her waltz 8 - stroking and then the RFO3. The main problem was that she couldn't control the 3 with the beginning strokes. Our coach had myself and another skater (PreJuv) try it and we were capable of controlling it now but back when we took PPM we wouldn;t have been. The girl tested it starting from a standstill Tposition. She passed, got excellent comments on edge quality. I have never seen anyone test the W8 NOT from a standstill. I believe you CAN, I've just never seen it done.

looplover

08-29-2007, 07:27 PM

Yeah my coach was pretty firm on starting that from a standstill. I thought that was better, because it helped me really evaluate exactly where to place that beginning three and control it.

This came up at my rink (very small, everyone discusses and crititques eachother all the time, maybe 10 competitive skaters?) the past June when one of my coaches young students was testing PPM. She wanted to skate into her waltz 8 - stroking and then the RFO3. The main problem was that she couldn't control the 3 with the beginning strokes. Our coach had myself and another skater (PreJuv) try it and we were capable of controlling it now but back when we took PPM we wouldn;t have been. The girl tested it starting from a standstill Tposition. She passed, got excellent comments on edge quality. I have never seen anyone test the W8 NOT from a standstill. I believe you CAN, I've just never seen it done.

blackmanskating

08-29-2007, 08:41 PM

SynchroSk8r114

08-29-2007, 09:02 PM

Well like some of the other skaters have mentioned, I have never seen it done with intro steps.

BlackManSkating

As a coach, I've never seen it done that way either. I make my students start from the T-position at a standstill because 1.) this move's more about control and edge quality, not speed, so you wouldn't really need to fly into it; 2.) pushing too hard into your waltz eight could cause you to lose control, two-foot/step out of, or be unable to turn your first three-turn successfully, unless you're quite strong at rotating and checking your turns; and 3.) I think most judges would appreciate a more traditional start to a move. I wouldn't throw them off by taking introductory steps on this move.

jazzpants

08-30-2007, 12:35 AM

I was made to do waltz-8 from a standstill as well. I definitely wasn't allowed to skate into it. The point was to be able to get the most bang for the one push to an edge. The other point is that... if you are on an edge, you don't need that much of a push to get thru the first three turn -- you should be moving. It's part of the whole "edge control" thing.

And as other said, you don't need that much speed to pass this test. You just have to be at the right part of the lobe and the right edge consistent to the count of the beat.

Rob Dean

08-30-2007, 06:28 AM

3.) I think most judges would appreciate a more traditional start to a move.

"Traditional" in this case being that the move was originally a school figure pattern--and those are always started from a stand.

Rob

mdvask8r

08-30-2007, 12:09 PM

Interesting -- everyone I've seen starts the waltz 8 from 1 or 2 short intro strokes. Guess it depends on what is customary in your area and with your coach.

GordonSk8erBoi

08-30-2007, 06:10 PM

This came up at my rink (very small, everyone discusses and crititques eachother all the time, maybe 10 competitive skaters?) the past June when one of my coaches young students was testing PPM. She wanted to skate into her waltz 8 - stroking and then the RFO3. The main problem was that she couldn't control the 3 with the beginning strokes. Our coach had myself and another skater (PreJuv) try it and we were capable of controlling it now but back when we took PPM we wouldn;t have been. The girl tested it starting from a standstill Tposition. She passed, got excellent comments on edge quality. I have never seen anyone test the W8 NOT from a standstill. I believe you CAN, I've just never seen it done.

I don't understand this. After the first push you are going to come into all the other circles with some speed, so I don't understand why it would be different.

I asked my coach about this this morning and she said I could do it that way if I wanted to, but that yes it's pretty rare.

For me, the advantage would be that I would probably place the first 3 better if I had some speed going into it. I'll have to try it both ways and see.

Skittl1321

08-30-2007, 06:11 PM

My coach had me doing the waltz-8 pretty slow (to the point where he had me SLOW DOWN what I was doing) so the push I got from a standstill at the beginning was about the same as the push I got when I changed circles.

I think if I skated into it my first lobe would be much bigger than my others.

(I practiced mine so that if I stood on a hockey circle dot it would extend to the edges of the circle. I'm 5'0" though)

double3s

08-30-2007, 08:48 PM

Congrats on passing! Doesn't it feel great?!!

Regarding waltz 8 - I did (and passed) mine with 2 short entry strokes. My coaches had me doing fairly large circles. My axis was between two hockey circles, and each circle came out past the center of the hockey circles - so even though they weren't done *on* the hockey circles, each circles was about the size of a hockey circle. According to my coaches (and my own experience) larger circles are more difficult and show better control, at least when it comes to 3 turns.

Regarding XOs on the axis - again I did these starting between the hockey circles and used each hockey circle as a guide. I tried to convince my coaches to let me do them along the long axis because I had a hard time fitting in enough XOs, but they refused, even though the rules say you can do it that way. According to them, doing XOs on a smaller circle shows better control and strength, which is especially important for a larger skater - due to the larger momentum we carry into our moves, we *must* deveop the strength to control it and fight centrifugal forces.

Scarlett

08-30-2007, 09:17 PM

I did my waltz 8 from a stand still in between the 2 hockey circles. My lobes were big extending far outside the circles. Basically, I did the waltz 8 like a compulsory figure because that is how my coach was taught it. The size of the circle has something to do with your height.