Question on Backward Edges and other basic moves

[laybackspinster]

Hi everyone, I've just begun skating lessons this June in an ISI-based rink and am needing help on my backward outside and inside edges. What is the appropriate position of the free leg during each edge, and is the head supposed to face a certain direction? As a CCW skater, is it normal to have more trouble on the RBO edge? I would greatly appreciate any pointers.

On a miscellaneous note, and anyone please explain to me what is a "reverse mohawk" and "spread eagle turn?"

[doubletoe]

Wow, never heard of a reverse mohawk or a spread eagle turn in my 10 years of skating lessons, so please feel free to give your coach a perplexed look, LOL!

As for your edges, imagine you are skating on the face of a clock, starting at 12:00, and the "circle" refers to the clock face (where the center of the clock is "inside the circle"). If you are doing edges on a straight line, the straight line is the vertical line between 12:00 and 6:00. Okay, ready?

Back outside edges:
Right foot: Start at 12:00, looking inside the circle with free foot in front and chest facing inside the circle. That means your right arm must be back and left arm must be forward. At 11:00 start gently turning your head to look outside the circle, then start gradually scissoring your arms (not swinging, but scissoring straight forward and back, hands close to the hips) so that when you hit 9:00--the midpoint of the half circle--your left hand is starting to pass behind the left hip and the right hand is starting to pass to the front of the right hip. Now pass your left leg gradually to the back, also keeping it close rather than swinging it. Hold the edge until you pass 6:00, still looking outside the circle.
For the Left back outside edge, do the exact same thing in a mirror image, starting to turn your head to look outside the circle at 1:00, passing the arms at 3:00 and holding the edge until 6:00

Back inside edges:
Left Back Inside - Exactly same head, upper body, arm and free leg movements as Right Back Outside (because they are both going in the counter-clockwise direction). Start looking inside the circle, gradually look to the outside of the circle and pass the arms, then pass the free leg, etc. so your face and chest face outside the circle after the midpoint of the half circle.

Right Back Inside - Exact same head, upper body, arm and free leg movements as Left Back Outside (because they are both going in the clockwise direction). Start looking inside the circle, gradually look to the outside of the circle and pass the arms, then pass the free leg, etc. so your face and chest face outside the circle after the midpoint of the half circle.

[TreSk8sAZ]

Well, I had an inside spread eagle turn in one of my programs (though it wasn't called that, exactly). Basically, I push into an inside spread eagle, and let the curve take me around in a circle (almost like a two foot spin) for a couple of turns, then go out into my next move. Not sure if that's what your coach was talking about, though.

[Sessy]

For the back edges, keep your knees together and your arms under tension, not like spaghetti. Makes all the difference.

I'm ccw, my most difficult is the left back inside edge. Outside edges come easily to me, inside edges not so. It's a personal thing, nothing to do with cw or ccw.

[Skate@Delaware]

Doubletoe, where were you when I was learning these??????? What a great explanation!

[laybackspinster]

Thanks for all the help everyone. I guess the part I have the most trouble with is the last third or so of the edge. It just feels weird for me to be looking outside of the circle with my free leg slightly behind me, but I guess it will get better with practice.

[laybackspinster]

Do all back edges (outside and inside) start with the free arm forward? Likewise, do all forward edges start with the skating arm forward? This is what my teacher told me today, but my former teacher told me that the front arm changes for the outside and inside edge in the same direction on a certain foot (i.e. that the front arm for LBO is the free arm and for LBI is the skating arm). So I am confused. By the way, do arm positions even matter in the more advanced way to do edges?

[Mrs Redboots]

No. For an outside edge you will most probably start with your skating shoulder (it's the shoulder that matters, not the arm) forward, but for an inside edge, you'll lead with the opposite shoulder. But you should eventually be able to do edges and, especially, swing rolls and crossovers/runs either way - "with body" (i.e. starting with the skating shoulder forward and finishing with the opposite shoulder) or "contra body" (i.e. the opposite shoulder forwards).

[icedancer2]

Back inside edges:
Left Back Inside - Exactly same head, upper body, arm and free leg movements as Right Back Outside (because they are both going in the counter-clockwise direction). Start looking inside the circle, gradually look to the outside of the circle and pass the arms, then pass the free leg, etc. so your face and chest face outside the circle after the midpoint of the half circle.

Right Back Inside - Exact same head, upper body, arm and free leg movements as Left Back Outside (because they are both going in the clockwise direction). Start looking inside the circle, gradually look to the outside of the circle and pass the arms, then pass the free leg, etc. so your face and chest face outside the circle after the midpoint of the half circle.

I keep thinking about this - when I do BI edges, my head is always facing the middle of the circle (more or less) - I have never seen it done this way I don't think - you can see how it is more commonly done on these Adult Moves videos that the US Figure Skating put on the web last year - scroll down to Pre-Bronze Move #2 - basic edges:

http://www.usfigureskating.org/

It is true that if you're setting up for a BI 3-turn, bracket, or counter you might want to look outside the circle on your BI edge, but for basic edges I think it is easier to look inside the circle as you go through the lobe.

Just my 2 cents - great description though!