Question for skaters in "non-traditional" ice skating locales?

[Laura H]

Sorry, don't know how else to phrase it . . . to explain, I live in South Carolina, and we don't have a whole lot of ice skating facilities here, and of course not a lot of people know how to ice skate. After having our local rink close abruptly at the end of April, I am EXTREMELY motivated to make sure that any future endeavours are as successful as possible. OK, yeah, I'll concede that there isn't the "history" of figure skating here, but it was packed on Saturdays, active hockey programs, active figure skating programs, lots of kids in the LTS programs and I know there are plenty of successful rinks in adjoining states . . . I'm just not buying the argument that you can't successfully run a skating rink here.

On the flip side though, I know there are lots of areas where rinks have been closed and that was IT for ice skating . . so what's the secret? If you are a skater who skates at a rink in an area that is not known for ice rinks/skating . . . what makes such a rink successful? How do you get people interested in skating and keep them hooked? (I know I certainly fell into the "trap" - surely others exist in our community!!).

[psnave]

This is a great question...and one I've pondered lately as well. We also recently lost one of our rinks here, and are now down just 2 full time rinks serving a pretty large metro area. I would say we are predominantly a soccer town, with other TEAM sports such as softball, football and basketball not far behind.

I've been looking at some Colorado rinks as I plan an upcoming vacation, which has an abundance of rinks and figure skating opportunities. Perhaps the interest comes with the geography, such as those who love snow and winter activities enjoy living in that area, and ice skating fits well into the scheme. This does NOT account for the multitude of ice rinks in areas like California though.

I think that affordable public skating times are essential to draw people into the sport. I think there needs to be more marketing from the rinks as well, I rarely see much done here locally.

A good strong Learn to Skate program is essential too, in my humble opinion. This is what drew us to our rink, which meant driving many miles out of our way. I felt it was worth it for good instruction. Our rink required all private coaches to work at LTS in exchange for their coaching privileges (i.e. free ice and no sharing of revenue).

I noticed some of the rink websites I looked at gave out a "buddy" pass for a student to bring along a friend to one of their LTS classes for free. This is a great idea, especially if the dates for use are varied (so entire class doesn't show up with buddy on same day). Kids are much more likely to stay involved if they know someone in the class.

Corporate sponsorship (via advertisements on the hockey boards, etc), is another way for rinks to generate revenue as well. This type of fixed income would possibly allow rinks to run more of the less profitable public sessions to attract newbies.

I'm sure I will think of more later. Hope others chime in too.

Patricia

[Skate@Delaware]

In my area, the only thing that pays the bills is hockey ice! It's sad but so true! They get second choice for booking ice after the Learn-To-Skate programs. Then, it's the figure skating club (but we sometimes get bumped).

Our skating director is trying to get the public's attention...hence the fake ice shows (in addition to our normal regular-ice shows). This is our 2nd summer in a row of doing them. They are held at the State Fair and get some people who are at the building trying to stay cool (during the fair, the building "belongs" to 4H). She put me in, trying to draw in the adult crowd-I'm 45 years old and learned to skate (mostly) as an adult. I also talk to the crowd after the show-good PR work (a necessity!)

The rink has been open for 5 years and there are still people IN THE TOWN WHERE IT'S LOCATED who don't know it is there!!! 8O I blame no advertising for that.

People will go to a rink if it's clean, well-run, affordable, friendly, and has good features (snack bar, game room, heated lobby or bleachers). They also want excellent instruction and that can be shown by higher placement at competitions.

my 2 cents worth. But, yeah, hockey pays the bills.

[littlerain]

The rink that I'm currently skating at is located in a large mall (actually one of the largest in the country) where shoppers can watch what's going on(haha wasn't there a thread about mall rinks recently?). I feel like that does help, at least a little, bc I often see people watching and then deciding to come to the public session.

The rink seems to do well w/ drawing people to public skating - or at least they try. Residents of the town get public skating for $1, and they also promote free public sessions when it is forecasted to be 90 degrees or above on a certain day. You can also join the "club" (separate from the figure skating club) and get a debit card to use at the rink & then pretty much everything is cheaper. They also do lots of family friendly activities such as themed nights, a "Snow Day" (something about having a huge pile of snow in the middle of the ice lol - this is next week), and a family day type thing with a dj, raffles, etc. They also do cosmic skating on saturday nights.

They do have quite a bit of hockey there, with a local county team as well as a high school team using the ice. I don't really know much about where the figure skating club falls in the list of priorities, but it seems to me like there's plenty of freestyle time + at least 3 hrs of public skating everyday (6 hrs on some days). There's also lots of advertisement on the boards, a cafe, and a large arcade (with tickets and prizes like Chuck E. Cheese's) that includes some spinny ride and lazer tag. I have seen park district summer camps attend public sessions as well, so I assume that helps their profits some.

There are lots of LTS classes... They also teach freestyle in group sessions, and they do the "bring a friend to class week" (it's actually this week!). They also have an Off Ice studio with dance classes run by one of the better local dance studios, as well as jumping and conditioning classes. This rink seems to have quite a lot going on in comparison to others I've skated at nearby... But all the rinks nearby that I'm aware of have been around for ages and definitely at least the 10 years that I've lived here. One rink did cancel public skating bc of some lawsuit but yeah, they all seem to be doing fine?

I'm not exactly located in an area where skating is unpopular, but maybe this will help anyways?

[dooobedooo]

In the UK, several rinks have been lost to property development. They are often built in industrial areas where land is cheap, and then over the years the land rises in value. Eventually even a really successful rink can fall victim to the developers, as Richmond did in the 1990's. Recently Docklands lost its ice rink, too.

I think the only answer is to set up a tight and irreversible legal framework (with trusts, covenants etc) to protect the rink as an entity.

Regarding bringing in the public - something for everyone - the Friday and Saturday night discos are a great place for young people to socialise and also a good fundraiser for the rink. In general, ice rinks are a fun place for the whole family. Sport is a healthy activity and there should be funding available from sports organisations (in the UK the government body is Sport England, and they have part-funded new rinks). You need a strong coaching director who will organise an in-depth learn-to-skate program, clubs, and recruit a good team. Management need to be reminded that each serious hobby figure skater is worth about GBP 2000.00 to GBP 3000.00 per annum to the rink in lesson fees and ice time.

[TreSk8sAZ]

I live in Arizona (hence the user name) which may be the most unlikely place to skate. I actually have seen both sides of this discussion.

In Tucson, there was only one rink for over 1 million people. The rink closed down due to major mismanagement, financial and health problems. This rink had a large population of hockey players (including a college team and a semi-pro team), and a decent sized figure skating club/LTS program.

Phoenix, on the other hand, has 7 ice rinks. These are always packed, and there are over 400 members in one of the two clubs in the city. There are tons of freestyles, as well as hockey and LTS and public skate.

What's the difference? There are a few.

Location. The Tucson rink was in the far east side of the city, tucked back in an out-of-sight area. If you knew how to get there, you could. But for people on the West/Northwest side it took 45 minutes to an hour to get there. In Phoenix, the rinks are spread out and each burb has an easily accessible rink.

Advertising. The Tucson rink hardly ever advertised, except in the summer. In the winter, people forgot about it. Most public sessions were during school times, except the weekend night sessions, and if people didn't hear about the rink, they just didn't care. The LTS classes were NEVER advertised, except within the rink (until the end when they were trying to rally support so it didn't close down. Too late!) Phoenix, there are commercials, free coupons for public sessions, etc., found all over the city. Having the professional hockey team here helps advertising, too.

Ice time. As stated above, the rink that closed down had most of its ice time when the public couldn't go. Figure skaters got at most 3 hours per day (4 was a REALLY good day). Hockey got the rest of the ice. There were two sheets, and one was often left empty. In Phoenix, there are a variety of times for public sessions, afternoons, evenings, etc. Rinks generally have both sheets running constantly, and having a hockey game or freestyle opposite the public skating is a good way to get people interested. Most rinks have between 6 and 8 hours of freestyle per day (I think there's only 1 exception). This way, people can practice and don't get frustrated into quitting since they can't find ice time.

Exposure. Tucson had very few National coaches, and in recent years only one kid made it to Jr. Nationals, and there were two Adult Medalists at ANs. Phoenix has multiple Olympian Coaches, as well as a strong program where the kids are getting recognized for their achievements on tv, in newspapers, etc. People are more willing to shell out the bucks if there's a prestige to the program.

Those are just a few that I've noticed. I'm sure there are plenty more!

[tidesong]

There is one ice skating rink in Singapore and alot of people (even people that regularly commute to the train station near it) are completely surprised when I tell them that I figure skate there (surprised because they were not aware that there is a rink right under their noses). There is hardly any publicity by the rink, they get mentioned in the newspaper sometimes or the news on tv but its like maybe 3 or 4 times a year??, but it still gets really packed in the weekends, I guess its generally the teens and word of mouth that keeps them going. Ice hockey here doesn't seem to be as big as elsewhere... I don't understand how ice hockey pay the bills, unless they charge more per hockey player than per recreational skater on public ice. Maybe Chow has a better idea than me.... haha

[chowskates]

I don't understand how ice hockey pay the bills, unless they charge more per hockey player than per recreational skater on public ice. Maybe Chow has a better idea than me.... haha

LOL, does it look like I play hockey? :roll:
but anyway, there are several reasons...

FIRST, hockey here is mostly organised by the "expats" - mainly the Canadians who are working & living here. And some of them are in high positions in large companies that *sponsor* the teams and their training.

SECOND, hockey players are able to tolerate training with 20 others on the same teeny piece of ice, whereas figure skaters can't!

THIRD, it is easier for hockey to buy ice and organise group training, since that doesn't directly conflict with the rink's figure skating school.

[Laura H]

In Tucson, there was only one rink for over 1 million people. The rink closed down due to major mismanagement, financial and health problems.

actually, Tuscon is (was) somewhat of a "sister" rink to ours, and I had read with interest the articles that I could find online . . . because it seemed like the rinks had experienced similar problems. Very interesting to hear perspective from someone who was actually there!!

[Laura H]

and thanks, everyone, for sharing some of the things your rinks have done to build interest in the community.

Oh yeah, there are plenty of people around who had no clue that we HAD an ice skating rink!! :frus: A little marketing could sure go a long way!

[TreSk8sAZ]

actually, Tuscon is (was) somewhat of a "sister" rink to ours, and I had read with interest the articles that I could find online . . . because it seemed like the rinks had experienced similar problems. Very interesting to hear perspective from someone who was actually there!!

If you want the full story, feel free to PM me. There's quite a bit I couldn't say on a public forum.

[Isk8NYC]

I don't understand how ice hockey pay the bills, unless they charge more per hockey player than per recreational skater on public ice. Most hockey ice is rented from the rink, although there are "Open Hockey" sessions where the rink collects an admission fee. The rink's only expense is cutting the ice, placing the goals on ice, turning on the scoring/sound system, and cleaning the rink/lockerrooms and in exchange they have a guaranteed income. All other expenses, such as officials, etc. else is taken care of by the hockey association.

To be successful, the rink has to build awareness through advertising and community events. Hosting fundraisers, offering group discounts, and getting the rink's name in front of the audience is critical. One of the rinks near me advertises twice a week and the local paper includes their public sessions in the weekly "Events Calendar." It's very effective, although very expensive.

Think of public sessions as a way to build interest in skating. Always have someone from the skating school there for inquiries, and offer private lessons on that ice. That invites discussion and builds interest in the skating school. The skating school is a "feeder program" for the rink's hockey and figure skating programs. Offering new and interesting programs each session keeps skaters coming back.

Here's a link to back issues of the ISI EDGE (http://www.skateisi.org/HTML/pubs_backissues/edge.cfm) trade magazine. It's an industry trade magazine that provides all different articles about running and promoting rinks.

You mentioned packed weekend sessions. Rearranging their ice schedule during the week was probably needed to attract more people during the week. They needed to distribute their skaters so that they were profitable every day, not just Saturdays. Unfortunately, hockey contracts are so tempting that rink managers sign away prime group lesson time during the week. That's an opportunity cost because, while the weekends were crowded, some people probably didn't sign up for anything due to crowds or scheduling conflicts.

[Laura H]

I've always thought it would be smart to have a designated "someone" available on public sessions (especially the busy ones!) who can help struggling beginners . . . make sure the skates are fitting right, etc. and hopefully make someone's first skating attempt a positive experience. Particularly in an area like ours where lots of people ARE skating for the first time. Occasionally there would be a big "event" designed to attract people to the rink and they would give free group lessons down at the end of the rink . . . which was nice for people just venturing into ice skating. Unfortunately, I think most of the time people were just left on their own.

Coupons/reduced admission rate deals were nice too, but those got scarcer and scarcer as time went by . . . which made sense in retrospect, but seemed kind of odd at the time.

[psnave]

Good information here!

Our rinks utilize a lot of hockey activities too, and I've heard comments that it is pretty profitable. In fact, our pro shop recently converted to 90% hockey equipment, with ONE figure skate model on display (Riedell Blue Ribbon) and a couple blade guards/soakers/tights. Yikes. Mom's on the public sessions have stopped and asked me where to buy skates because our pro shops have no figure skating inventory.

Makes me wonder if a rink could stay afloat if it was primarily figure skating only.

I agree with the prior poster mentioning public skate hours. During the school year, our rink usually runs public from 1-3pm M-F. I always found this frustrating when my girls were first beginning to skate. This approach probably increases their revenue from freestyle sessions (scheduled before and after school), but really limits the number of new kids that will fall in love with skating.

[Skate@Delaware]

Most hockey ice is rented from the rink, although there are "Open Hockey" sessions where the rink collects an admission fee. The rink's only expense is cutting the ice, placing the goals on ice, turning on the scoring/sound system, and cleaning the rink/lockerrooms and in exchange they have a guaranteed income. All other expenses, such as officials, etc. else is taken care of by the hockey association.

To be successful, the rink has to build awareness through advertising and community events. Hosting fundraisers, offering group discounts, and getting the rink's name in front of the audience is critical. One of the rinks near me advertises twice a week and the local paper includes their public sessions in the weekly "Events Calendar." It's very effective, although very expensive.

Right. The hockey teams also get money through their team sponsorship: each team is sponsored by a corporation or business-hence the name on their jersey (advertising!!!) which figure skating doesn't have. Unless you want to GET a sponsor and wear a jersey with their name on it each time you skate & compete :lol:
I've always thought it would be smart to have a designated "someone" available on public sessions (especially the busy ones!) who can help struggling beginners . . . make sure the skates are fitting right, etc. and hopefully make someone's first skating attempt a positive experience. Particularly in an area like ours where lots of people ARE skating for the first time. Occasionally there would be a big "event" designed to attract people to the rink and they would give free group lessons down at the end of the rink . . . which was nice for people just venturing into ice skating. Unfortunately, I think most of the time people were just left on their own.
Well, as long as there are no liability issues, YOU can be the one!!! If i'm just plunking around I don't mind if people ask me. If people see you as approachable, they will do so. If I see something wrong with their skate-tying I offer suggestions (always phrased: "would you like a suggestion?")

You have to be careful not to make it bossy-sounding (been there, done that) We have to be good skating ambassadors.

I always mention about the Learn-To-Skate programs :lol:

[kander]

I've heard that even successful rinks are marginally profitable. That means when something better comes along the business changes. I can think of several examples in my area where the rink exists because either the owner is into skating or there is some kind of direct community connection. There aren't too many that exist mainly as a business entity.

BTW I heard, several years ago, that the electric bill for one of the rinks around here is 50-100 thousand a month 8O

[Skate@Delaware]

I know ours is about $5,000 a month...and we are in a temperate climate!!!! Holy Cow!!!

[Isk8NYC]

Makes me wonder if a rink could stay afloat if it was primarily figure skating only. Fritz Dietl's rink in New Jersey has figure skating and LTSkate/LTPlay only. The single-surface rink looks like a converted garage and it is too small for hockey. The ceiling is very low, and Mr. Dietl set it up more for figure skating. I think they used to have mirrors and barre's. That's where I landed my first axel, after several sessions on the harness.

Anytime I teach on a public session, I have interested parents/skaters ask me about lessons, assistance, etc. I now tuck a few group lesson brochures into my rink jacket so I can hand them out when asked. I don't like taking "pick up lessons" at those sessions; they never call back to schedule another lesson (or they call but go "no show"), but they then expect me to have time for them if they come across me later on. I give them a bit of a lecture now that "this is just for today; if you want to continue, you must let me know."

Still, if the rink were to pay me a set fee to "work the session" on the ice, I'd take the job.

[chowskates]

Right. The hockey teams also get money through their team sponsorship: each team is sponsored by a corporation or business-hence the name on their jersey (advertising!!!) which figure skating doesn't have. Unless you want to GET a sponsor and wear a jersey with their name on it each time you skate & compete :lol:

Haha, yes, why not... but, doesn't ISU have some regulation against putting "advertising" on what skaters wear??

[TreSk8sAZ]

Haha, yes, why not... but, doesn't ISU have some regulation against putting "advertising" on what skaters wear??

I don't know about ISU, but USFSA rules say you may wear a warm-up with a sponsor logo, but during competition there is to be no logo or name of a corporate or individual sponsor on the costume.

[rlichtefeld]

Sorry, don't know how else to phrase it . . . to explain, I live in South Carolina, and we don't have a whole lot of ice skating facilities here, and of course not a lot of people know how to ice skate. After having our local rink close abruptly at the end of April, I am EXTREMELY motivated to make sure that any future endeavours are as successful as possible.

Which rink closed? Greenville? Irmo? Charleston?


Rob

[Laura H]

It's Irmo. Charleston and G'ville still doing well as far as I know!!

[Morgail]

I live in Kentucky, which isn't exactly figure skating central. However, my city is managing to keep two private rinks afloat right now. One has been open since the early 60s. I think it's managed to keep chugging along because people who grew up here have fond memories of skating there sometimes as children, and now take their children skating. The rink is seasonal, but they have ample public skating hours when open (perfect for kids looking for something to do after school).

The other rink is newer, and they have been aggressive with promoting their hockey teams. The figure skating club has been equally aggressive with promotion, and as a result, has done very well. I've seen both hockey and figure skating featured in the paper more than once, which is miracle considering that most people around here think that basketball is the only sport that exists. The skating club does an annual production of the Nutcracker, advertises it well, and I think that draws a lot of people in who would never have thought of trying skating. They've also managed to get Regionals here in October, and I think (if they advertise well) that might draw in more people.

I skate a lot at public sessions, and if a kid comes up to me and is even remotely interested in learning to skate, I nearly always mention the learn-to-skate programs. Getting the rink into the newspaper or on TV news helps also - I think people see that and think, "oh, that would be fun!" And just having the rink be open to the public - for skating, for shows, competitions, hockey games, etc.

[AW1]

I live in Brisbane Australia, which is as far from an ice skating town as you'll ever get. We are a sub-tropical climate where the temperature rarely falls below 15 degrees celcius in the winter, and peaks at around 40 degrees celcius in summer.

However, somehow they manage to attract enough patrons to public sessions etc to keep 2 rinks going profitably in this city.

I would think given our population of approximately 1.8m people, we would be small in comparison to lots of places in the US.

[Isk8NYC]

However, somehow they manage to attract enough patrons to public sessions etc to keep 2 rinks going profitably in this city.What do they do right? Do you have a lot of public sessions, or are the FS/Hockey Clubs really well-organized? Publicity, community relations, what????

My rink allows the drop offs and Friday nights are horrible sessions with pre-teen to teenagers going crazy, graffiti all over the bathrooms, toilets plugged, and outside littered with cigarette butts and other (eeek) stuff. Several of the rinks around here offer a Friday Night Family Skating session. Kids can't be dropped off to run wild. Crowd is smaller, but better behaved for the most part. I prefer the latter.

A few rinks have a DJ in the scorer's box playing songs and organizing dances like the macarena and hokey-pokey on ice. It's only one session each week, and it's not as organized as the old roller rinks where they'd clear the rink to announce "Couples Only" skates for one song. Still, it's fun!