Flexibility Question

[blackmanskating]

I am trying hard to improve my flexibility but I've seem to come to a brick wall. :frus: Quite frankly, it hurts and I've seen little results from it. My coach says that I need to stretch more, but how much more? Am I supposed to be dedicating an hour a day to stretching or what? I'm confused. :??

Recently, I purchased a flexibility training book and DVD by Pavel Tsatouline (sorry for bad spelling) and I tried one stretching routine that was suggested. I didn't tell my coach about the purchase. The very next day he said that he noticed an improvement in my camel spin. He said that my leg was getting a little higher than hip level and that he could tell I was stretching. Of course this made me feel great but man it is painful for me to stretch like that. I can't see me doing those routines for more than 20 minutes. I would like to be able to do full splits one day. I feel like my flexibility (or lack thereof) is holding back my skating. Is there anyone who can give me suggestions on how to improve this? My spirals look like hot garbage. Help Please!!!!

BlackManSkating

[Isk8NYC]

I warm up and stretch off-ice, then get on and skate around a bit to warm up more. Then, I use the rink boards as a ballet barre' to stretch out my spiral positions before I practice spirals.

AFTER I skate, I take the time to stretch out again and I get much more reach and stretch in my positions.

At home I use a sturdy chair or dresser as a barre' to stretch and hold various leg positions while wearing ankle weights. That's really strengthening the muscles, which allows me to lift higher. sigh. I really want a higher spiral, but I know from experience that it doesn't happen overnight.

One note: make sure you turn out your free leg so the position is clean - otherwise, even a high free leg looks "off."

[Maineskate]

Hi there,
Most people don't stretch properly. They get bored, don't see results and give up. Here are some tips that might help you.

1) *Always* warm up your muscles before you stretch. Warm muscles stretch like taffy, cold muscles break like old shoe leather.

2) You have to hold a stretch for a full 60 seconds or it does no good. 60 seconds is longer than you think--time it! There's a scientific study about this somewhere. Try googling "effective stretching"

3) Stretch until it is slightly uncomfortable, not painful. Hold there for a bit and concentrate on relaxing the stretched muscle. Then take a deep breath and go further into the stretch on your exhale.

4) Stretch both sides of your body and all major muscle groups to maintain balance. (You don't want one leg loose and one leg tight)

Flexibility takes a long time to develop. Don't push it too hard right away or you will hurt yourself. Be patient with your body, and try taking a yoga class. They really help with your alignment and proper stretching.

Good luck!
Julie

[herniated]

I love the 'hot garbage' reference! :lol: That was great! Improving flexibilty does take time but it works. Just a tip if you are in pain, don't stetch so far. It shouldn't hurt. And don't bounce the stretch. I'm not familiar with the DVD program you purchased, sorry.

Before you skate do dynamic stretches. These are movements that mimic the activity you are about to do. After your skate that is when you want to do the 'deep' stretches. Where you hold the stretch for about 30 seconds then slowly release from the position to prevent tearing or putting the muscle in spasm. I think an hour is a long time to work on flexibility especially if it hurts you.

I'm a certified personal trainer, if you want more info you can PM me!!:)

[jskater49]

Before you skate do dynamic stretches. These are movements that mimic the activity you are about to do. After your skate that is when you want to do the 'deep' stretches. Where you hold the stretch for about 30 seconds then slowly release from the position to prevent tearing or putting the muscle in spasm. I think an hour is a long time to work on flexibility especially if it hurts you.

I'm a certified personal trainer, if you want more info you can PM me!!:)


My coach is a big propenent of dynamic stretching. I'm not so good at stretching (and have the crappy spiral to prove it) but I do the dynamic stretching before I compete and honestly those have been my best spirals.

j

[blackmanskating]

I just remembered what the DVD was called. Well actually, I looked it up. It's called "relax into stretch". Yeah maybe you're right about stretching too far. I can just see this taking forever so it kinda motivates me to push harder. But I never bounce. I know that's bad. I'm not trying to rip tendons and ligaments; I just want to be able to do somewhat of a spiral for this moves test. At least I can touch my toes. I usually do the dynamic stretches, jump rope, practice rotations (singles first, then axels, then doubles) then I get on the ice. It usually takes about a half hour. I'm on the ice from an hour and a half to two hours and then I get off and stretch. I do this 5 days a week. Dynamic stretching doesn't bother me at all, it's that dreaded deep stretching that makes me wanna pass out. Then I see all of these kids and teenagers doing splits with no warm-up. I keep thinking, "if only I would've done this when I was a kid. . ." :frus: ohh well. :roll: Maybe I need to talk to some of these contortionists I keep hearing about.

BlackManSkating

[liz_on_ice]

Good times for stretching are right after a hot shower, or after exercise - not just skating, but if you run or bike ride. It's a good idea to stretch after exercise anyway, helps prevent soreness, but while everything is warm and loose is a good time to work on flexibility too.

-Liz

[Skate@Delaware]

I really like Pavel's stuff! Stretching requires a lot of dedication, and almost daily dedication. I haven't tried his stuff but have alternated between regular stretching, pilates poses and lately yoga (which seems to be helping me the most).

You don't say how old you are, but I am 45 and have been working on it for years (trying to get to the splits) after not stretching for many years. Not stretching had taken a toll and I'm paying for it now.

And it takes a while to see results! So, patience is a virtue, hang in there!

[blackmanskating]

I really like Pavel's stuff! Stretching requires a lot of dedication, and almost daily dedication. I haven't tried his stuff but have alternated between regular stretching, pilates poses and lately yoga (which seems to be helping me the most).

You don't say how old you are, but I am 45 and have been working on it for years (trying to get to the splits) after not stretching for many years. Not stretching had taken a toll and I'm paying for it now.

And it takes a while to see results! So, patience is a virtue, hang in there!

I am 24. I am going to try my best to get flexible. I guess I will have to do what I can do for now. Well at least I know I got a good DVD for training. And it did help me since my coach took noticed the first day. It seems that he sees the increased flexibility before I do. I'll keep trying. What other Pavel stuff do you have?

[Skate@Delaware]

I am 24. I am going to try my best to get flexible. I guess I will have to do what I can do for now. Well at least I know I got a good DVD for training. And it did help me since my coach took noticed the first day. It seems that he sees the increased flexibility before I do. I'll keep trying. What other Pavel stuff do you have?
I have his "Naked Warrier" book because I was IMPRESSED!!! (to say the least). I got it after seeing the video my boss brought in. (My boss works out with kettlebells and is a behemoth of a man but has no flexibilty).

I thought about getting his stretching one, but since doing the yoga, have put it on the back-burner.

Lucky for you, you are young enough to catch up and surpass any lack of flexibility. Us older hoots have to work a bit harder at it!

[jazzpants]

Us older hoots have to work a bit harder at it!But you have LOVELY SPIRALS to show for it!!! :bow: (This older hoot has FINALLY gotten her spirals to hip level again. But it sure took a LOT of consistent work on my part.)

Okay, my $0.02 worth for blackmanskating (Welcome to skatingforums.com and I like your music on your myspace page, BTW...)

Try to do GENTLE stretches before you work out or skate. Save the big stretches for when you are warmed up (like after you work out or skate.)
Gradually build up on your stretching. When you start stretching, go comfortable and then gradually go up on the flexibility.
Be consistent about it. Can't do it once a week... I do mine 3 times a week and it's still not enough.
BE PATIENT!!! Takes a LOT of time... and time is on your side since you're 24!
BREATHE while your stretching. It helps you to relax, which allows your muscles to relax and makes you slightly more flexible. What my trainer does with me when he stretches me is that he pulls a little more each time I breathe out (and I'm supposed to breathe deeply in and out.)

[Skate@Delaware]

That's right, and thank you for the compliment, jazz!

I also want to add (forgot about this part, must be getting old-timers what-ya-callit): the countering force to the relaxation/stretch is strength/force! If the opposing muscles are WEAK then you will have a harder time...especially when it comes to controlling your body parts (as in a spiral).

So, if you are doing a move, think about that; although most of your muscles are in a state of tension, some are more relaxed while some ore more tense.

blackmanskating, whatever workout do you normally do-be sure it encompasses your whole body (i.e. don't neglect a body part). For example, some people neglect their arms/upper body because "I won't use them skating" but you really do because they counter your lower body during jumps!

It's all a science and it makes my head hurt-I'd rather just SKATE!!!! :lol:

[kayskate]

Flexibility takes a long time. I have been stretching since I was a teen. I am 40 now. Before I broke my ankle last summer, I was working on getting my splits back on both legs. I agree w/ the advice you have already rec'd about warming up, etc. I would also like to recommend the Anne Margreth Frei video, Magic of Style 2. She has a great flex routine at the end of the vid which also includes valuable advice for spirals, butterflies, etc. It's a great investment. I used her routine to get my splits back. Took a few months.

Kay

[AlexeiLover]

My only suggestion is to try pilaties (I don't think I spelled that right...) and yoga.

[je]

I would also like to recommend the Anne Margreth Frei video, Magic of Style 2.

Kay

Thanks for mentioning this, Kay. I picked up a used copy of this tape on Amazon a while ago, but hadn't watched the whole thing. The stretching/strengthening at the end is just what I need at the moment--I'm hoping to take Silver moves soonish, and my spirals are not as strong as I'd like them.

Johanna

[doubletoe]

I had also reached a wall in my flexibility when I pulled a hamstring and ended up going to a great physical therapist for help with it. She taught me a slightly different hamstring stretch that eventually worked so well that I can now do the splits on that side! So it does matter *how* you stretch, not just how much you stretch.

I recommend going to a physical therapist for help with stretches that will help you work your way to the splits. It will be well worth the cost!

But here are the ones that have helped me (in order of progression):
- Calf stretch: always stretch calves before stretching hamstrings. You can stand on stairs and press your heels down below the stairs, or many other calf stretches (you can find some online).
- standing stretch with one leg extended on raised surface: Stand on one leg with one leg extended in front of you and resting on a raised surface (a padded chair, etc.). Keeping both legs locked straight, arch your back and stick your butt out. Hold for 20 seconds, then do a "negative", pressing the heel down into the raised surface for 10 seconds. Repeat 2 more times. Switch legs.
- Lying hamstring stretch with belt - Lie on your back and raise one leg, putting a belt under the foot of the raised leg and holding the ends of the belt with your hands. Use the belt to pull the straightened leg toward you so you feel a stretch in the hamstring. Guide the leg to the left, middle and right so you stretch the inside, middle and outside of the hamstring. Hold each position for at least 20 seconds and try to gradually bring it closer and closer to your chest.
- Seated hamstring stretch - This one was the breakthrough that ended up enabling me to do the splits. Sit on the floor with one leg extended straight in front of you and the other bent and lying on its side, so that the bottom of the foot of the bent leg is touching the knee/thigh of the straight leg. Now try to arch your lower back and push your belly button down toward your extended thigh. At first you will probably need to use something to pull yourself down and forward (a belt, a doorway, etc), or you can sit with your back against a wall and push your lower back away from the wall with your hands to help yourself arch your back and get over your hips better. Arch the back and press your belly button towards your extended thigh while keeping that leg locked out, and hold each position for 30 seconds before pushing yourself a little further. When you can get your chest flat to your thigh all the way and hold it for 30 seconds, then your hamstring is flexible enough for the splits with that leg in front. Now you just need to make sure your hip flexor on the other leg is flexible enough.
- Hip flexor stretch - Do a lunge position on the floor and lock the back knee out straight. Press the back hip down and arch your back to feel a stretch in the hip flexor. Hold for 20 seconds. There are also other hip flexor stretches on line if you search. This is an important stretch for the back leg in the splits, or the raised leg in a spiral position. If your raised leg is bent on your spiral, you probably have a tight hip flexor.

[blackmanskating]

But you have LOVELY SPIRALS to show for it!!! :bow: (This older hoot has FINALLY gotten her spirals to hip level again. But it sure took a LOT of consistent work on my part.)

Okay, my $0.02 worth for blackmanskating (Welcome to skatingforums.com and I like your music on your myspace page, BTW...)

Try to do GENTLE stretches before you work out or skate. Save the big stretches for when you are warmed up (like after you work out or skate.)
Gradually build up on your stretching. When you start stretching, go comfortable and then gradually go up on the flexibility.
Be consistent about it. Can't do it once a week... I do mine 3 times a week and it's still not enough.
BE PATIENT!!! Takes a LOT of time... and time is on your side since you're 24!
BREATHE while your stretching. It helps you to relax, which allows your muscles to relax and makes you slightly more flexible. What my trainer does with me when he stretches me is that he pulls a little more each time I breathe out (and I'm supposed to breathe deeply in and out.)

Thanks alot Jazzpants!!! Thanks for welcoming me and I'm really glad you like my music. I guess because I'm young, I suffer from the I-want-results-right-now syndrome. I will try to be more patient with the process. It would be easier if I could find some type of enjoyment in it. I just do it because I have to and I just visualize what my long term goal is and that keeps me motivated. I will give some of those stretches a shot. Some of them are what Pavel Recommends. He does the breathing thing a little different though. He makes you tense up the muscle at the beginning of the stretch as you hold a deep breath. You then exhale and relax the muscle at the same time and you deepen the stretch. You repeat the process until you won't go any lower/farther.

[jazzpants]

Some of them are what Pavel Recommends. He does the breathing thing a little different though. He makes you tense up the muscle at the beginning of the stretch as you hold a deep breath. You then exhale and relax the muscle at the same time and you deepen the stretch. You repeat the process until you won't go any lower/farther.Yeah, that's how my trainer wants me to do them... well, it's kinda hard NOT to be able to tense up the muscles as you're inhaling... Each time I exhale, he pulls a bit more... and actually I got a bit further than he expected, which is a good sign for me. We'll see if he gets me a bit more flexible for me to get better spirals though.

[quarkiki2]

Part of achieving a stretched look on the ice is in the use of the full extension of your limbs -- regardless of flexibility. Think of that old firehose full of water analogy -- you must always extend energy through the complete end of your limbs -- fingertips to toenails. A spiral will always look more stretched if you think aobut getting energy all the way through both legs, both arms, and the top of your head. That's why bent knees and "scary zombie fingers" ruin the look of all spirals, even the ones in a full split. Every part works in conjunction to make the picture.

Now, it's easy for me to say this -- I have 15 years of ballet and a physical abnormality in that my tendons are all a little longer than they should be -- but my sister, who wasn't born with naturaly flexibility, was able to get a lovely arabesque position by stretching and keeping energey flowing through her limbs.

When I teach kids, I try to get them visualizing a color of paint and that every "end" of their body is capable of painting that color if they send energy to it. The goal is that they should paint with their entire body and NOT just their free leg.