Salchows: which way

[beachbabe]

well, this week my coach changed my double sal entrance to just a plain mohawk because she says apparently it looks very good when i do it.

I myself am not sure about it at all- it feels awkward and scary, but apparently looks better than my good ol' LFO3 entrance.


so this got me wondering- how do you all do your salchows?

[TreSk8sAZ]

I've been doing sals from a mohawk for quite awhile. I couldn't do LFO3s with a strong enough check, meaning I couldn't hold the entrance edge long enough to get good height. My double sals are the same way. I've done them from a BO3 into a mohawk, but I sometimes have trouble getting the kneebend I need. It takes awhile to get used to it, just make sure you hold the entrance edge a bit longer than you feel you did on the LFO3 entrance.

[cecealias]

My coach only makes me do it from a mohawk on days when my moves are sucking and he's complaining about the 3 turn. The stronger the moves are the easier to check the 3 turn hard. Usually on days when i'm tired, im not going to check hard enough. That's the thing about doubles... i discovered i have to have a LOT of sleep, energy, tension, control, and confidence to work on them... they are not meant for the lazy or scared.

[coskater64]

I have done it from both and landed it, just depends on the day. The mohawk works better when I am having wild free leg days, the 3 turn on calm free leg days. Currently...who knows?!

[icedancer2]

I haven't done a true salchow in at least 10 years but I learned it from a LFO3. I like the mahwk entrance also.

[techskater]

You didn't give any options for us CW skaters! :??

I actually am currently doing 2 Sal from LBO power three-mohawk entry, but I can also do it from a LFI Bauer where I press my weight onto my back foot and up.

[Skate@Delaware]

I usually do the LFO3 entrance, but have just started learning the mohawk way (my daughter is teaching me-how's that for funny? 8O the teacher has become the student). It feels weird.... She does it from mohawks because she hates 3-turns.

[Team Arthritis]

my coach has me drill (now we are talking singles here, I'm just trying to get it bigger but she's doing the same thing with 2 kids working triples) from the MO over and over until I can get and keep the weight over the skating leg. Then She has me drilling this from the 3, working on matching the feeling.
Lyle

[doubletoe]

I've been doing sals from a mohawk for quite awhile. I couldn't do LFO3s with a strong enough check, meaning I couldn't hold the entrance edge long enough to get good height. My double sals are the same way. I've done them from a BO3 into a mohawk, but I sometimes have trouble getting the kneebend I need. It takes awhile to get used to it, just make sure you hold the entrance edge a bit longer than you feel you did on the LFO3 entrance.

It's so strange that you (and my coach) are saying to hold the BI edge longer on the mohawk entrance than the 3-turn entrance. I can't do it from the mohawk when I try to hold the BI edge, only when I make it shorter, immediately doing a deep bend and springing up. It isn't a checking issue, since I am fine on the 3-turn entrance (even for doubles). Any thoughts?

[doubletoe]

You didn't give any options for us CW skaters! :??

I actually am currently doing 2 Sal from LBO power three-mohawk entry, but I can also do it from a LFI Bauer where I press my weight onto my back foot and up.


Oh, that's cool! I like to do the single salchow from a RFI spread eagle (same concept) but there's no way I could get a double out of it from that entrance.

[Team Arthritis]

It's so strange that you (and my coach) are saying to hold the BI edge longer on the mohawk entrance than the 3-turn entrance. I can't do it from the mohawk when I try to hold the BI edge, only when I make it shorter, immediately doing a deep bend and springing up. It isn't a checking issue, since I am fine on the 3-turn entrance (even for doubles). Any thoughts?

I hesitate to give advice over my head but this is exactly what my coach was working with multiple students - if you are having trouble from the MO entrance then, she says, you aren't getting enough of your weight over the skating leg. Instead your weight is in between your legs and you are using the hook of the three to whip you around which takes a lot of the oomph out of the jump. So start off with the MO and bend at the waist and way superrotate over the skating leg and glide that way for a bit and then swing the free leg. Working the free leg swing this way lets the leg swing independent of the rest of the body. Next, and this is where I'm stuck, do this with more speed and lean but feeling most of the pressure right down on the skating foot, again over rotate and then swing the free leg to jump. When you get this, match the feeling off the 3 turn exit (I find the main difference is my skate is now further back/ less forewards).
Lyle (parroting my coach)

[jazzpants]

I usually do the LFO3 (well, RFO3 for me) entry, but my secondary coach recently had me try the mohawk entry and she claims I have better control on the torso doing the mohawk entry than the FO3 entry!!! So I'm still doing the FO3, but playing around with the mohawk entry now! Go figure!!! LOL!!!! :lol:

[doubletoe]

bend at the waist and way superrotate over the skating leg

???? Totally confused on this part. Can you explain a little?

[Team Arthritis]

???? Totally confused on this part. Can you explain a little?

Sorry for the confusion - CCW jumping, in order to get the feel of just how much of your weight should be over the L skate, coach has us plant our body and lean over it by: doing the RFI MO and then twisting to the left with the free leg at about 1:00 then bend forewards at the waist at about 45 degrees. (kind of like a bent BI3 entrance) Then you go straight up on the L knee and toe as you kick the R leg straight across with a straight knee trying to get as far "left" as possible (at right angle to back glide) rather than kicking around or swooping or up. This feels very ackward and is only used as a tactile feedback exercise for where your weight should be, the swing of the free leg across rather than around and the weight transfer from L to R hand side.
Sorry if this is still confusing
Lyle

[doubletoe]

Okay, still can't follow that, but that's okay, LOL! But the point was to make sure the weight is over the skating side on the LBI takeoff edge? (BTW, I can't do the straight right knee because I'm going for the double)

[TreSk8sAZ]

It's so strange that you (and my coach) are saying to hold the BI edge longer on the mohawk entrance than the 3-turn entrance. I can't do it from the mohawk when I try to hold the BI edge, only when I make it shorter, immediately doing a deep bend and springing up. It isn't a checking issue, since I am fine on the 3-turn entrance (even for doubles). Any thoughts?

My coach and I actually worked on double sals this morning since something weird was going on with mine. Basically, it's all a timing issue. With the 3-turn, it can be easy to trick yourself into swinging your free-leg through and making the jump happen with the free leg. With the mohawk, your body somewhat blocks this motion, so you have to wait a bit longer. What my coach keeps telling me (as she's yelling "wait" for what seems like an eternity) is that the jump should happen on its own. I hold the edge, with my knee bent, until the free leg comes through and I feel a "hook" (I can't explain, the jump really does go up on its own). I CAN pull the jump off with a shorter BI edge, but it's not nearly as high and it's much more forced than when I wait.

Don't know if that makes sense. It's completely a feeling of timing for each person.

[cecealias]

Yes the weight between the legs is a common problem that takes away lift - it's like trying to jump up when you have nothing to push off of. Max height comes from all the body weight lined up exactly over the skating foot *toe* on the moment of takeoff, and that's a combination of alignment, timing and especially good MITF control

[doubletoe]

TreSk8sAz, I know what you mean about waiting for the edge to finish before taking off. I used to have a problem with not checking and holding the edge long enough on the 3-turn entry, but then we worked through it awhile ago and now that part is fine. My coach has been telling me lately to put more tension in my landing side (not takeoff side) as I bring the free leg through and take off, so that my weight gets over to the landing side better in the air. Since all of the skaters who land triple sals seem to actually touch--or almost touch--the free foot on the ice as they bring it to the front, I figure it must work. . . So now I'm more confused about the conflicting messages about keeping the weight over the takeoff side. :roll:

[cecealias]

I don't think tension in the free leg immediately after the 3 turn conflicts with keeping the weight on the skating side. it actually helps get the jump in the right place a lot.