Strange question about backspins

[icenut84]

Ok, this is something I've been wondering about and figured someone here must know. Although I'm not at this level yet, I was wondering about the positions that can be achieved in a backspin. Skaters do camels, sits, scratch spins, Y spins, even Biellmann spins if you're Irina Slutskaya. But why does nobody ever do a layback backspin? The only person I've ever seen do one was Oksana Baiul in her 94 exhibition program "Swan". In all the combination spins people do on TV, they never ever do a backward layback. Even Irina, when she does her Biellmanns, goes into a sort of layback before she takes hold of her foot on the forwards one, but not on the backwards one. Is it a balance thing? (If so, how come Oksana managed it? It was only about 4 or 5 revs, but even so). Can anyone shed any light?

[MissIndigo]

Well, I have seen skaters do layback camel spins, and often these are backspins. I myself am working on a change-foot attitude spin, and let me tell you, that back attitude is hard. I get little help from the free leg to sustain rotation. Balance issues, maybe? :? Most often, if I see a skater doing any sort of backspin with a side lean or lean to the back, they do what I've heard called a "spaghetti spin", where the skater assumes the normal backspin position and instead of crossing the feet in front, brings the free leg behind the spinning leg. The legs are some distance apart, and the effect is corkscrew-like. In order to accomplish this, you have to have some sort of lean in the back. It's a neat spin to watch.

[Imo]

I've been working on a back layback spin for about 6 months now - on and off... It's a variation my coach wanted me to try because she used to do it, and I'm always up for a new spin to work on. I've had some success with it - but it's been one of the more difficult variations for me to learn. I find it hard to stay centered and I haven't really become comfortable in the position yet... The forward layback, on the other hand, is by far my favourite spin!

[rinsk]

I've played with back laybacks for a little bit off and on and they're tricky to learn. I'd wonder if why I haven't done more work on back layback would be another reason you don't see them that often:

1-)It's tricky to relearn your layback balance over the other leg.
2-)It's scary to do a spin that you haven't mastered the proper balance for yet.
3-)It's not required for anything and even if you do it as a little extra embellishment in a competition or on a test, I really don't know how much credit it would get.
4-)I've got so many little and not so little things I want to play with and master and not nearly enough ice time. I may eventually work with it seriously, but for now it's just got to wait in line.

[Alexeiskate]

It seems like a back layback spin would be very difficult to maintain balance and that's probably why not too many skaters perform them. If you have a tape of the 84 Olympic, you'll see Kay Thompson of Canada performed one in her 84 Olympic's long program.

[melanieuk]

Obviously it must be one of the hardest spins to perfect....and getting the aesthetics right would be difficult.
I've also wondered about the lack of back laybacks.
I've asked all the senior skaters I know if they can do them, but none can - at least not in a traditional layback position.


I bet Lucinda Ruh has done them! :D

[kayskate]

I have seen Kwan do one in a program maybe a couple of years ago. It was not an isolated spin but at the end of a combo. Sarah Hughes does a gorgeous back attitude.

I can do a back attitude. There is a photo of it in my web site photo gallery. I have tried the back layback a little but w/ o much commitment. I have to improve the back attitude first. A younger skater I know has worked on them intermittently and says they are very hard.

Kay

[icenut84]

Just a question - what exactly is an attitude spin?

[Alexeiskate]

Originally posted by icenut84
Just a question - what exactly is an attitude spin?


Picture a spin where your free leg is raised high in the classic layback position, like Sarah Hughes', but your upper body is upright, slightly arched, not bent backward or sideway. One arm is usually raised above the shoulder and the other arm is extended to the side. It can be either a forward spin or a backward spin.

[icenut84]

Thanks alexeiskate :) I think I know the one you mean. Michelle Kwan does/did a combination of forward camel/sit/Y, backward sit/attitude? (She did it in SOTBS). Also in Sarah Hughes's Olympic LP, am I right in thinking she did an attitude spin after her layback? :)

[CzarinaAnnie]

I loove back layback spins. I was just watching an old ice show and saw Oksana do one, and was wondering why no one does that in comps or shows anymore. Maybe someone like Sasha Cohen or somebody else will come up with one this season.