Fruuuuuustrating Camel!

[miraclegro]

I have a schizophrenic camel! Help! I can do them amazingly well one day, and then the next, it's like i'm a total idiot!

My coach recently told me to not move my left hand until i make about 1 revolution - to keep it in front of me. I think it helps some, but i still think the main problem is sometimes i rush into it, and am not sure how to get it into the right "balance" and edge at the same time. I am Adult Silver level, and have been frustrated with this because of how totally good it is one minute and how stupid it is the next!

Any tips would totally help me! Everytime it think it is "fixed" it is comes back to haunt me!

[doubletoe]

Yep, the camel spin and the axel are the most finicky things ever, and on the camel spin, rushing the edge and dropping the leading shoulder seem to be the biggest culprits. Here are a few things that have always fixed my camel:

1. Count how many seconds you are on your windup edge, then count out the exact same number of seconds on your entrance edge so that they are held for the same length of time. It's a great guideline.

2. Bend your knee more deeply on the entrance edge; that will force you to stay down longer.

3. On the entrance edge, keep your chest parallel to the ice (I think of sweeping a coffee table with it, since it's lower than a regular table and that reminds me to stay low on my skating knee)

4. On the entrance edge, keep your chin and eyes facing up, and keep your leading shoulder high. Use the edge to curl you into the spin, not your leading arm. That's where the deep knee bend and waiting longer are going to help you.

5. Once you go into the spin, keep your knee bent for the first revolution; don't pop up onto a straight knee.

5. If you go into the spin from back crossovers, think of planting your foot into the ice, getting your weight on it and then pushing off onto it. It seems to help. If you go into it from a fwd inside 3-turn (RFI3 if you spin on your left foot), make the 3-turn exit nice and round and look over your shoulder (left shoulder if your on a RBO edge) before the end of the edge. Both of these things always help me get a better entrance edge, although I do a lot better with the 3-turn setup. I hate the back crossover setup for camel spins.

[techskater]

Sounds like you've got the same problem I had with mine. Most likely you are dropping your left shoulder on the way in. One way to fix it is to have your left arm sweep early in the spin so once you rise up, your upper body is in the correct position so you don't bail onto your toepick.

[NickiT]

Thanks for those tips, Doubletoe. Some days I can pull off nice camel spins every time and others, I just can't get it right. The worst thing is that when I do a good one it always feels so easy! I'm glad it's not just me then. Thankfully mine are more good than bad now but it helps to have a few tips from someone other than my coach for the times when it's not as good as it can be!

Nicki

[doubletoe]

Yeah, me, too. My coach finally just stopped caring if I mess up my camel spin in practice, because whenever I skate my program to the music, I always do it just fine. I now realize that the timing of the music tells me how long to hold my edge, and that's what makes the difference! It's the exact same story with my double salchow takeoff, LOL!

[TimDavidSkate]

The camel took me 3 yrs to get the feel of this damn spin. Even till today, I dont have it consistent, but I know its there when I have to compete. Plus if I practice it too much, I get dizzy, then lose the feel of the spin8O

[miraclegro]

Thanks for all the tips. Will put them into practice. I am working on it from both types of entrances, the 3-turn and the back crossovers, and even then they work great sometimes,and not at other times. Hopefully i will get it better soon. THanks ya'll!

[vesperholly]

I drop my left shoulder on the entrance, too. Here's a simple tip: Turn your left hand out so that it is palm-down to the ice the entire time (entrance to camel position). What this does is rotate the shoulder open a little bit so it's easier to pull it back instead of dropping it. This really, really helped my disappearing/reappearing camel to reappear.

[NickiT]

Yeah, me, too. My coach finally just stopped caring if I mess up my camel spin in practice, because whenever I skate my program to the music, I always do it just fine. I now realize that the timing of the music tells me how long to hold my edge, and that's what makes the difference! It's the exact same story with my double salchow takeoff, LOL!

That's weird you should say that because generally it's true of me too. I used to struggle a lot with doing elements to music, but now I mostly find the timing of the music helps. Same for my loop-loop combination. The timing of the music really helps!

Nicki

[lovepairs]

My coach recently told me to not move my left hand until i make about 1 revolution - to keep it in front of me. I think it helps some, but i still think the main problem is sometimes i rush into it, and am not sure how to get it into the right "balance" and edge at the same time. I am Adult Silver level, and have been frustrated with this because of how totally good it is one minute and how stupid it is the next!

Here's the thing. Your coach is actually telling you to keep your left hand in front of you as a "rouse" so that you don't loose your left shoulder. It's really your left shoulder that has to stay "in front of you" so to speak, and your right shoulder back. This way your chest is parallel with the arch of the circle. Hips have to do the same thing: do not loose your left hip when going in--keep it just as you keep (and directly under) your left shoulder. Free leg stays back (as you enter the spin) also, underneath your right shoulder. This way you can do whatever you want with your hand--doesn't matter.

Next, wait, wait, wait, wait and then a little extra wait to really get inside of the circle before coming up. As you are taking your time getting to the inside of the circle remember to 1) keep your upper body "up" the same way that you don't want to drop your upper body when going into a lutz, 2) do not look down at the ice, 3) do not look over your left shoulder, which will cause you to loose this shoulder--just look straight ahead.

Now, when it is time to rise up into the spin, don't give it a fast jerk up--don't quickly pop up into the spin--this is the tendency. Rather, rise up softly in a spiraling up corkscrewing type of fashion. Try to visualize a Carvel Soft Serve ice cream cone. The ice cream softly spirals up to the top.

The only way I finally got the camel was to "visualize" this soft serve icecream cone. In fact, visualising this, believe it, or not, fixed all of my spins.

Next, when you are finally centered in the spin and have reached the top, really stretch your body out in the camel position from head to "free toe" as if you were a rubberband being stretched. Helps to turn the free foot out and point the toe. If your free toe points down to the ice, the tendancy is to drop your right hip, then you fall into the circle, then it's all over.

Hope this helps :P

[miraclegro]

You all have been so helpful - thanks! But, now i am wondering,are theback camel and the flying camel also this difficult to evenly maintain? If so, i'll be an old lady when i start getting them! (i haven't started on those yet!)

[NickiT]

You all have been so helpful - thanks! But, now i am wondering,are theback camel and the flying camel also this difficult to evenly maintain? If so, i'll be an old lady when i start getting them! (i haven't started on those yet!)

Personally I think the back camel is even more difficult. I'm currently working on my change-foot camel and while I can spin in the back camel position, I find my position is not very good at all. The crazy thing is that this is my back spiral position which I find easier than the forward spiral on my left foot.

Nicki

[techskater]

In that respect, each person is different. While I initially found it hard to do a back camel, now I find it to be more automatic than my forward camel.

[Sonic]

Some great tips here from lovepairs and doubletoe.:bow:

In my (admitedly very limited!) experience, I've found that practising spirals helps - do it from the low down position as if you're entering a spin rather than throwing your leg up.

IMHO sometimes it's just down to natural abilities. I.E. just like the 'jumper or spinner?' discussion, I guess some people are better at sit spins, some better at camels; for example there's a girl at our rink who does a great sit spin but very dodgy camel, I'm getting to grips with camel but am nowhere near (and I mean nowhere near!) a sit spin!

S xx

[doubletoe]

Some great tips here from lovepairs and doubletoe.:bow:

In my (admitedly very limited!) experience, I've found that practising spirals helps - do it from the low down position as if you're entering a spin rather than throwing your leg up.

IMHO sometimes it's just down to natural abilities. I.E. just like the 'jumper or spinner?' discussion, I guess some people are better at sit spins, some better at camels; for example there's a girl at our rink who does a great sit spin but very dodgy camel, I'm getting to grips with camel but am nowhere near (and I mean nowhere near!) a sit spin!

S xx

I didn't used to have a sitspin to speak of until my coach gave me a few tricks. Now it's my standout spin, low and pretty fast. Here are the main pointers that helped me:
1. Go in low on the skating knee, with an arched, rigid back
2. The farther your free leg is extended behind you, the more momentum you'll get when you bring it around to the front.
3. When you swing the free leg, keep it extended and keep your back arched and tight.
4. When the free leg reaches 2:00 (or 10:00 if you rotate CW), turn the foot out quickly and all the way and let it collide with the skating leg without slowing it down.
5. Once the free leg hits the skating leg, lower your rear end and push the free leg forward until you feel the top of your skating calf pressing against the inside of the thigh of your free leg. When you feel this, it means your skating thigh is parallel to the ice.