Observed a testing session today

[sunshinepointe]

I'm aiming to take pre-bronze in July so I wanted to know what a testing session was like - there was one tonight at our rink so I popped in to make some mental notes for my own testing.

At first I was nervous just WATCHING the girls (no guys tonight) do their thing. There was one pre-pre tester, a girl doing a FS for what level I'm not sure but she did up to a double loop and double sow - double toe, and then 2 girls doing Int. MIF and 2 girls doing Novice MIF.

I know the process now so I feel a lot better about going to my own session. I'm sure I'll still be a nervous wreck, but at least on observation I noted some things.

1) The judges really aren't that bad - they seem friendly and interested, although I did note they spent a lot more time writing notes than watching the actual skating. Guess after a couple of seconds they can figure out whether or not the skater has the move or not.
2) The rink is unbearably cold and quiet during testing - must find a way to stay warm in between warm up and actual skate if I don't skate first
3) Nervousness and tentativeness definitely shows out there on the ice. Must find a way to not LOOK so nervous even if I am.
4) Finish EVERYTHING. Almost all of the girls would finish their moves but never come to a complete stop, or actually finish. To me, this looked sloppy. I asked the test chair about this later and she said while there's not a written rule about it, it just looks so much nicer. I agree.
5) Don't overtrain on the warm up - a girl went out and did her double-double combo once and it was perfect - she tried doing it again and it went downhill followed by at least 3-4 botched attempts. She never recovered, couldn't do it in her program. Couldn't do it on the reskate.

Only one girl passed out of the 6. I wasn't surprised. 4 girls, including the double-double girl fell doing elements. The pre-pre skater showed up in shorts and a t-shirt and had pretty awful edges, the poor thing. The last one was just so nervous that her elements were slow and shaky with poor speed and flow - and I've seen her skate the elements before well so I know she can do them. Just goes to show that the judges don't mess around and they hold a high standard for passing skaters. Good to know you can't get away with sloppiness.

Overall it was a good experience and I feel a lot more prepared for my testing whenever it happens. The test chair, who is also a coach, told me that I should have no problems passing (she's seen my moves I guess?). We'll see.

Anywho, if you've never tested before and you want to feel better about the whole thing observe a test session - it'll answer a lot of questions and make the experience a little less...daunting 8O



I hope!

[dbny]

Only six skaters makes it a very small test session. I'm really surprised that only one passed. I've been to quite a few test sessions, most with many skaters, and several of them taking more than one test, and I've always seen more passes than fails. I love your observation of the importance of finishing each move with a complete stop, and I agree that it's important. It's also important, IMO, to go out there looking confident and well put together. If you make a mistake, keep going as if nothing happened. As you noticed, judges do have to take notes, and a small mistake could be missed. My former coach always said that the judges pretty much make up their minds about each move right away, so it's important to start off strong. I was also told to always look at the judges after each move, and wait for them to indicate that they are ready for the next move before beginning to skate again. I know of a kid who failed pre-pre moves because he didn't do that! Good luck with your test in July.

[Csk8er]

DBNY is definintely correct about looking at the judges before starting the next move. Sometimes skaters start the move without realizing that the judges are still writing comments from the previous move skated. When I speak to the skaters before they start the moves test, I always make sure the skaters are aware of this.

SUNSHINEPOINTE, your comments about the test session were very insightful. In fact, I was one of the judges at the test session. For having only limited skating experience, you really aware with what you are seeing out there. Have you ever considered becoming a judge? We could always use more people like you in the judging ranks, especially in Florida. I skate at Pines also (usually on Sat. and Sun. morning freestyle sessions). When I was in high school, I actually used to skate on the same sessions at Sunrise with Beth (your coach).

As a masters level skater and judge, I would definitely recommend to you pursue taking both the standard track & adult tests. They will enhance your skating in the long run.

[phoenix]

The pre-pre skater showed up in shorts and a t-shirt and had pretty awful edges, the poor thing.


I was just having a discussion w/ a non-skating friend that was relevant to this....I found a tango dress I really like, & I said I was sending a photo to my coach so he'd have a chance to veto it if he wanted. My friend thought it was ridiculous that I would do that, but I said I always want to know what my skaters are going to wear for a test/competition too--just to be on the safe side. My coach really doesn't care, I don't think, but I do it out of courtesy I guess.....and my thought is, especially with a new skater you just never know what you're going to see, as in this case. Poor little skater--the coach should have gone over what was expected.

I agree, your observations are very astute! Thanks for the report; I always like hearing about other test sessions. I've seen some bad ones where very few people pass, it happens.

[coskater64]

Having tested for the first time in almost 9 months, I knew what to expect but I forgot how nervous I get. Testing is different from competition in my mind, while both are performances, one you compete against others, in a test you compete against a standard. I find the testing much more difficult, I got very nervous but didn't fall or make any horrible mistakes, I just didn't skate as well as I usually do. I took my JR moves, my choctaws were .2 down across the board and I failed by .3 overall so it was a close test, I didn't gain points in my usual strong areas because I was so nervous, even though I knew the judges and I knew they wanted nothing but the best for me.

Your first test is an "encouragement" test, but never count on that, know how to do you moves well, stop between each move, check to make sure the judges are watching before you start the move.

One of the judges commented on how pretty my test was, even though it didn't pass you still can show quality skating, did I skate like a Jr lady?-- no, but I'll try again because in the end I will be a better skater when I pass.

;)

[Csk8er]

There was one pre-pre tester, a girl doing a FS for what level I'm not sure but she did up to a double loop and double sow - double toe, and then 2 girls doing Int. MIF and 2 girls doing Novice MIF.

Only one girl passed out of the 6.

There were 6 tests taken (1 Pre-Prelim MIF, 2 Intermediate MIF, 1 Novice MIF, 1 Junior MIF, and 1 Novice FS) and only 2 tests passed (not one).

[sunshinepointe]

There were 6 tests taken (1 Pre-Prelim MIF, 2 Intermediate MIF, 1 Novice MIF, 1 Junior MIF, and 1 Novice FS) and only 2 tests passed (not one).

Oops, I got confused with who was doing what MITF test, I'm still not 100% sure of the levels. I thought only one girl passed (the young lady in the blue, the last skater) but I'm glad there was another passing student as well - which was it, if you don't mind me asking?

Thank you for your comments about my insight! I'd love to train to become a judge but I have no idea where to get started. If you have any time I'd love to meet up with you and get more information. I had a great time watching the testing session - and I'm a stickler for little details in case you didn't notice ;) But I'd definitely like to find out more whenever you have a minute :mrgreen:

[Csk8er]

I thought only one girl passed (the young lady in the blue, the last skater) but I'm glad there was another passing student as well - which was it, if you don't mind me asking?



The Pre-Preliminary Moves and the last Intermediate Moves test passed.

I would be more than happy to talk to you about judging and adult skating in general if you'd like.

[Debbie S]

I love your observation of the importance of finishing each move with a complete stop, and I agree that it's important. It's also important, IMO, to go out there looking confident and well put together. If you make a mistake, keep going as if nothing happened. As you noticed, judges do have to take notes, and a small mistake could be missed.As far as the stop thing, well, I guess there are several schools of thought. I observed a Wash FSC test session where every skater finished their pattern with a T-stop. I guess that was what was expected at that club. But when my coach was prepping me for my (Bronze MIF) test, she recommended that I not stop at the end of each pattern, b/c the judges look for power, and stopping, as opposed to gliding out of the pattern, breaks things up, plus takes up time. Based on what I've seen at test sessions in my area, either way seems acceptable to judges - I've never gotten comments about stopping or lack thereof - I guess it depends on your coach's preference and the culture among clubs and judges in your area.

Yep, I agree about acting as if nothing happened when you make a mistake. At my most recent Bronze MIF test, I got off-balance a bit during the back perimeter stroking and wobbled a bit on the BI edge - no foot touching down, but not very attractive, I'm sure. I figured I'd definitely failed the move, but I ended up passing it with 2 of the 3 judges (and the judge who failed me didn't comment on the wobbles). I happened to be chatting with one of the judges at the rink the next day (she is an adult skater) as her dance coach was chiding (in jest) her about not noticing a small error one of his students made on a dance at the test, so I brought up my wobble and asked her if she noticed (since she passed me on the move and didn't write anything about it) and she nodded her head - obviously, in her eyes, it wasn't enough to fail the move - so if you do make a mistake, don't lose hope!

This sort of set my alarm off:
The test chair, who is also a coach,Do you mean the test chair is a coach at your rink/club, with students who test at said rink/club? If so, that's a violation of USFSA (and potentially PSA) rules. Coaches are not allowed to be club officers or even have votes at board meetings - a club can have 1 coach on the board to be a non-voting coaches' rep/liaison, but that's it. It's a blatant conflict of interest to have a coach choosing the judges, setting up the test schedule, etc. PSA rules are clear that coaches need to avoid all situations where they could use their influence to give their students an advantage, or perceived advantage, over other coaches' students.

This happens to be one of my hot buttons b/c I was the beneficiary (or victim, however you'd like to put it) of an unscrupulous coach's unprofessional behavior involving a test schedule. This coach was not the test chair, but was a voting board member, and about a week before the test session when I tested Pre-Bronze MIF, forced out the test chair in a personality conflict/dispute, then took over the process of re-working the schedule that had already been posted. Aside from shortening the length of the session, which needed to be done, she made some changes to the order of my test within my group. Yep, as you probably guessed, the other 2 skaters (also testing Pre-Bronze MIF) were her students. I won't go into all the details, but obviously this coach thought the test order mattered as one skater was somewhat weaker than the other 2, and I guess she decided that anyone going after this skater would have an advantage. I thought the whole thing was ridiculous - and I don't think the test order, ultimately, mattered in the least. But changing the schedule was just plain wrong. My coach at the time complained about it, but with this coach running the test session, there wasn't anything that was going to be done. This is an extreme example, and most clubs probably won't run into this, but USFSA and PSA rules are in place for a reason. The less power a coach has over club functions, I think the better off everyone is.

[Joan]

This sort of set my alarm off:
Do you mean the test chair is a coach at your rink/club, with students who test at said rink/club? If so, that's a violation of USFSA (and potentially PSA) rules. Coaches are not allowed to be club officers or even have votes at board meetings - a club can have 1 coach on the board to be a non-voting coaches' rep/liaison, but that's it. /QUOTE]

I think this is a matter of how your club's bylaws are written, rather than a USFSA-wide rule - at least with regard to having Coach directors who vote. I'm not sure about the officer thing.

[Debbie S]

I think this is a matter of how your club's bylaws are written, rather than a USFSA-wide ruleWell, several months after that test session, one of our club's officers called the USFSA to ask about their position on coach involvement in clubs (the coach I mentioned was no longer on the board by then) and that's what the USFSA person (I think it was one of the membership people but not sure) said. There's a long document on their website that addresses club management and I think there's something in there somewhere about this.

[Csk8er]

This sort of set my alarm off:
Do you mean the test chair is a coach at your rink/club, with students who test at said rink/club? If so, that's a violation of USFSA (and potentially PSA) rules. Coaches are not allowed to be club officers or even have votes at board meetings - a club can have 1 coach on the board to be a non-voting coaches' rep/liaison, but that's it. It's a blatant conflict of interest to have a coach choosing the judges, setting up the test schedule, etc.

This is an extreme example, and most clubs probably won't run into this, but USFSA and PSA rules are in place for a reason. The less power a coach has over club functions, I think the better off everyone is.

I have judged here in Florida as well all over the New England region. Although it is not ideal, there are some situations (where I have judged test sessions) where a coach has been the test chair or competition coordinator. Many times there aren't enough volunteers in a club to handle all the things that need to be done (i.e. testing)

I used to serve on the board of a larger club in the New England area where there is a professional on the board with voting privileges. Some may see it as a conflict of interest, but everyone in their own way may have a conflict.

In terms of the test session that SUNSHINEPOINTE was referring to, I used to be a member of this club and still help out (in terms of the test sessions). The test chair has asked me in the past to help with creating the test schedule since I've been involved in judging for over 10 years. I know the past 3 test sessions that this club had the President and Treasurer also in attendance to help out (collecting papers and making sure skaters know when to go out on the warmups).

Just my 2 cents on the issue.

Happy skating!

[cecealias]

As far as the stop thing, well, I guess there are several schools of thought. I observed a Wash FSC test session where every skater finished their pattern with a T-stop.

I would strongly agree with Debbie on the stop thing. Especially when you get to the pre-juv/juv mitf and higher tests, you really want to show the judges how much power is generated from each move and stopping the move right after it is completed destroys that effect. Some coaches have their students stop, but it really doesn't let the judges see how much power was really generated and if the skater can sustain the flow out of the move. Sustaining and extending out of the end of a pattern is good practice for higher level moves that eventually require these skills, i.e. Junior power circles.

[skaternum]

Do you mean the test chair is a coach at your rink/club, with students who test at said rink/club? If so, that's a violation of USFSA (and potentially PSA) rules. Coaches are not allowed to be club officers or even have votes at board meetings - a club can have 1 coach on the board to be a non-voting coaches' rep/liaison, but that's it.This is NOT a USFSA rule. It's up to each club to stipulate, via its bylaws. My club decided about 5 years ago that we don't want coaches on the Board of Directors.