Hinged boots

[Tinkerbell]

I was just curious about something.
I was looking for some figure skate images to accessorize my skating journal and one of the images I came up with was this: http://www.udel.edu/PR/UDaily/2004/skate042904.html

Has anyone here ever heard of/seen/used these new boots? If so, what's the concensus? Wave of the future or flash in the pan?

I suppose everything gets redesigned but these are hard to get used to the idea of. And also kind of ugly.

Thoughts?

[tidesong]

Well, the most famous example would be Alissa Czisny of which I've heard using this boots. She seemed to be very happy with them, but still had boot problems sometime later in this last season. I've also seen them in the catalogues but dont know any skaters personally that use them.

[jenlyon60]

There are a bunch of low-level skaters at my rink using them. Can't say one way or the other if it's helped their jumping and other elements.

I've heard miscellaneous rumbling about maintenance problems with the boots, though. Broken cables or other broken parts.

[VegasGirl]

As far as I know it's not supposed to help with jumping etc but rather reduce the risk of injury and strain on the skater's joints. Here's another article:

http://www.udel.edu/PR/UDaily/2006/apr/proflex041306.html

And the official Jackson site:

http://www.jacksonskates.com/html/frames/frameset-Proflex.htm

I seriously doubt that these are in use by beginning or low-level skaters...

[oroetlaboro]

My daughter has been wearing them for over a month now and loves them. (Novice) It took a few hours on the ice to adjust to being able to bend and point her feet, but she landed all her doubles the first day in them. Her jumps are higher because she can push off with the ball of her foot. She said she can feel the difference in landing - it's not as jarring as with her old boots. These are the re-worked version of the boots. They did have a lot of little things going wrong with the ones that first came out - as is to be expected in a new product - but she hasn't had any problems with this pair yet. I think they're here to stay. This type of innovation is absolutely necessary to minimize the pounding our skaters' bodies are taking in this sport these days.

[oroetlaboro]

I seriously doubt that these are in use by beginning or low-level skaters...

I don't see why not. They are available for sale to anyone at this point. Well - probably not absolute beginners as I would hope they wouldn't spend that much money on a boot.... However, I've heard of several high-level coaches saying they are trying to get all of their skaters to wear them.

[VegasGirl]

But the cost factor is exactly what I'm talking about... at just short of $600 just for the boot it's not exactly a beginner modell!

[gt20001]

I have personally got a pair on order which should be in in a couple of weeks. I have tried them on and i like them. There is a girl at our rink that is at least doing doubles in them and she loves them she was having knee problems and they have helped her. I was also talking to someone else at the rink who knew someone who had them and they said they were happy too and that they had helped with previous pain. I can post what i think of them personally after i get to try them out on the ice, which should be in the next two weeks. I am looking forward to getting them in my opinion when i tried them on they were more comfortable to me the the ones i got i only got the others because i needed skates then and didnt want to wait 4 weeks. yes they did go through a recall but they have supposedly fixed those problems with the new model.

[racytracy]

A few girls at one of the rinks I skate with use them. Currently they are having problems with the hinges actually slipping out because they are made of plastic. Personally, I would wait a while before buying them and let them work out some more of the kinks. I don't know about you buy if I spent $600 on a boot that kept breaking or having issues like that I'd be beyond upset.

[TashaKat]

I've never actually tried them and never plan to. I've looked into them for purely academic purposes but I think that they're ugly and that there's more to 'break' on them. Give me good old fashioned custom Harlicks any day of the week.

If you've got them and like them then fair play to you but they're not something that I would ever consider.

[saras]

My daughter has been wearing them for over a month now and loves them. (Novice) It took a few hours on the ice to adjust to being able to bend and point her feet, but she landed all her doubles the first day in them. Her jumps are higher because she can push off with the ball of her foot. She said she can feel the difference in landing - it's not as jarring as with her old boots. These are the re-worked version of the boots. They did have a lot of little things going wrong with the ones that first came out - as is to be expected in a new product - but she hasn't had any problems with this pair yet. I think they're here to stay. This type of innovation is absolutely necessary to minimize the pounding our skaters' bodies are taking in this sport these days.

A friend of mine tried a loaner pair on for a few sessions- and said that while she liked the "spring" you'd get for edge jumps, and she liked the knee bend/toe point for a lot of things - she didn't like NOT having the boot tongue to press against while going up into spirals (for example). Can you tell me what your daughter's experience is for stuff like that? AND, what was her experience like in being able to *point* the toe so much - eg., for take-offs of toe jumps?

thanks! Sara

[beachbabe]

well, I'd really love to try them...b/c i would assume they would have a very short break in period. Although i really don't know if i would want that much of a toe point. i like stiff botts and the stiffer the better because they amke me feel secure on landings. If I was able to bend my ankle that much I think I would have to rely more on the ankle absorb the shock of jumps and I have weak ankles as it is.

In addition they are way out of my price range, I mean $600 is about how much i would pay for boots+blades. It seems cool, but not that practical

[SkatingOnClouds]

I've considered these because my old knees don't like to bend much, thought every little bit would help. :lol:

I hadn't thought about those things where you need resistance, like spirals, or potential instability on toe-assisted jumps. I wonder....

[oroetlaboro]

A friend of mine tried a loaner pair on for a few sessions- and said that while she liked the "spring" you'd get for edge jumps, and she liked the knee bend/toe point for a lot of things - she didn't like NOT having the boot tongue to press against while going up into spirals (for example). Can you tell me what your daughter's experience is for stuff like that? AND, what was her experience like in being able to *point* the toe so much - eg., for take-offs of toe jumps?

thanks! Sara

Sara, My daughter said she's never had a problem with the boot tongue in spirals. You can adjust the tightness, so maybe your friend had it a little too tight? Not sure on that one. As for the toe, she said the only jump it took longer to adjust to was the triple-toe. However, she was only just beginning to land that one fairly frequently, so it wasn't a solid jump anyway. Her coach said it wasn't the boot's fault; it was whatever my daughter was doing or not doing. Now, she says she loves being able to point her toe because it gives her more spring in the take-off.

[Mrs Redboots]

If you've got them and like them then fair play to you but they're not something that I would ever consider.I certainly don't see myself trying them - at least, not yet. Maybe in ten years' time or so, when they have been most thoroughly tested and used and people know what can go wrong and the worst bugs have been fixed - and the price has come down a bit!

Like Tivos - we plan to wait at least another year before getting one!

[Lenny2]

Just wanted to add that my skater is now in the Graf hinged boot and she really doesn't see much difference between the Graf hinged boot and the Graf Edmonton. In other words, it doesn't really "hinge" much. The one good thing is that the hinged model is made in Switzerland whereas many of the other Graf models are now being made in Canada and the quality seems to be better on the boots made in Switzerland. She did not have much trouble breaking in the boots, but I understand that that is true of all Grafs. Also, she wears a relatively small sized boot, and we were told that the smaller the boot, the less the boot would hinge (which makes sense). It's a nice looking boot--not bulky like the Jackson--but it does not have the same hinge properties of the Jackson.

[skate1965]

I got the new hinged boots in December and I can't say enough good things about them. I will never go back to normal boots. If you have questions about them, I would be happy to answer.

[SkatingOnClouds]

I got the new hinged boots in December and I can't say enough good things about them. I will never go back to normal boots. If you have questions about them, I would be happy to answer.


I have just a few questions:

Do you have the Graf hinged boots, or the Jacksons?
What jumps and spins are you doing?
How hard was it to get used to doing toe assisted jumps in them?
Was there anything else that took some getting used to?
Did you get stock or custom, how much were they?
Who did you get them through?

[skate1965]

Mine are the Jackson Proflex. And I'm doing doubles in them. You're used to them in about three days and you don't have to break them in like normal boots. I bought mine at the Ice House in Hackensack, NJ.

[SkatingOnClouds]

Mine are the Jackson Proflex. And I'm doing doubles in them. You're used to them in about three days and you don't have to break them in like normal boots. I bought mine at the Ice House in Hackensack, NJ.


So did you find anything different about about doing toe assisted jumps in them? Was anything harder to do at first? Was it harder to land a flying camel correctly? Did it really help your knee bend in general skating or things like sit spins?

I ask all these questions because I really want to know. I am going to by new boots, and won't get a chance to see whatever I decide on in action before ordering them.

[skate1965]

I felt no difference in the take off of the toe assisted jumps. None. The difference is the landing because I have never been good at landing on the front of the blade... with these boots I am doing that now and my landings are much better.

The axel took a bit of getting used to with the hinged boot. It took me a week to really feel comfortable about it. But other than that no problems.

Spins improved so much, especially my sit spins for obvious reasons. As far as a flying camel, I'm the last person to comment since I'm still trying to understand that spin.

[gt20001]

I just recieved my jackson hinged boots last week and i love them. I dont ever see myself going back to regular boots. I have not noticed any problems doing anyhthing i was doing before i was a little scared to try the jumps i was working on for fear of not being able to hold the landing position but once i got the courage i found out that they all felt the same except for one very important thing no pain when i landed the jump as in my last pair of jacksons. I am bending my knees so much better and have finally moved off that darn toe pick that i always scratched on back crossovers and my blades have bigger toe piicks than my old blades. Everything feels more effortless in these boots i dont have to fight against the boot like i did in my old boots they feel so comfortable and do what i need them to when i need them to and they have plenty of support i dont feel wobbly in them at all it only took me about a day to get back to doing everything that i was doing before. I absolutely love them and will never switch back.

[flippet]

This may be a silly question--aren't the hinged boots just the slightest bit wider, overall, at the ankle area? Has anyone had any issues with that--like knocking them together or catching the overlapped area on anything?

[gt20001]

I personally havent had any problem with hitting the ankles together. The only thing i usually hit together is the toepick on the heel of the blade. And actually these boots arent any heavier than a regular jackson boot my old jackson boots are just as heavy as the hinged boots.

[renatele]

I don't have hinged boots myself, but examined one dancer's boots the other day, and was surprised to find that they aren't as wide at the ankle as I thought they would be. The tightening thing in the back aside (that could really be smaller...), they didn't look that ugly in person, either!

[gt20001]

I think that they look wider when you see them but once you tighten them around your ankle i think it does shrink. I feel like it hugs the ankle well and yes i do agree that they dont really look ugly and if you have a boot cover on them it is even harder to tell that they are differemt.

[Casey]

I was just discussing these the other day with a couple fellow skaters. Supposedly there are a number of competitors at Nationals wearing them, but I don't follow skating very much so I can't confirm or deny that claim (though I tend to believe it because my friend follows these things much more closely and has been interested in the hinged boots since she started skating).

I personally don't like the idea, and don't see myself ever trying them. I don't mind a little break-in time, and I think the resistance offered by the leather is sufficient for me. I also have a preference for the appearance of non-hinged boots and I tend to prefer old-fashioned well-proven concepts over those new-fangled things like K-picks, parabolic blades, the bizarre Jackson Matrix blade system, and hinged boots... ;) I'm not really an old miser like I sound like there, but I am a skeptic of most new things.

That being said, I think it's great that these help some people, especially if it makes it easier to land onto a toe. Reading the linked article, I couldn't help but think continually to myself, "but I surely don't land flat-footed!" - for me, landing on the toe is just instinctive and has never been a problem. And aside from some occasional knee pain (especially when I was skating in the warm summer months it seems) and lumps forming on the sides of my ankles (which I think is a fault of the design of the top of the boot which hinges wouldn't affect, and bunga sleeves cure pretty darn well), I've never had any foot/leg injuries from skating, even when I skate a lot...so I don't think their supposed injury-reduction would be of any use to me.

But one lesson I've learned well from skating - different things work well for different people - it's too easy to make blanket statements like "Graf sucks!" (*cough cough whistle innocently*), when in fact something that sucks for me is in fact a perfect match for others' needs, and vice versa.

</ramble> ;)

[phoenix]

That being said, I think it's great that these help some people, especially if it makes it easier to land onto a toe. Reading the linked article, I couldn't help but think continually to myself, "but I surely don't land flat-footed!" - for me, landing on the toe is just instinctive and has never been a problem. And aside from some occasional knee pain (especially when I was skating in the warm summer months it seems) and lumps forming on the sides of my ankles (which I think is a fault of the design of the top of the boot which hinges wouldn't affect, and bunga sleeves cure pretty darn well), I've never had any foot/leg injuries from skating, even when I skate a lot...so I don't think their supposed injury-reduction would be of any use to me.


The boots were developed for people doing the multiple rev./triple/quad jumps which tend to result in the hip injuries we're seeing everywhere now. While they seem to offer other benefits to lower level skaters as well, the injury-reduction reality probably wouldn't show up in someone doing singles, because those aren't likely to cause injuries anyway.

[gt20001]

I was just discussing these the other day with a couple fellow skaters. Supposedly there are a number of competitors at Nationals wearing them, but I don't follow skating very much so I can't confirm or deny that claim (though I tend to believe it because my friend follows these things much more closely and has been interested in the hinged boots since she started skating).

I personally don't like the idea, and don't see myself ever trying them. I don't mind a little break-in time, and I think the resistance offered by the leather is sufficient for me. I also have a preference for the appearance of non-hinged boots and I tend to prefer old-fashioned well-proven concepts over those new-fangled things like K-picks, parabolic blades, the bizarre Jackson Matrix blade system, and hinged boots... ;) I'm not really an old miser like I sound like there, but I am a skeptic of most new things.

That being said, I think it's great that these help some people, especially if it makes it easier to land onto a toe. Reading the linked article, I couldn't help but think continually to myself, "but I surely don't land flat-footed!" - for me, landing on the toe is just instinctive and has never been a problem. And aside from some occasional knee pain (especially when I was skating in the warm summer months it seems) and lumps forming on the sides of my ankles (which I think is a fault of the design of the top of the boot which hinges wouldn't affect, and bunga sleeves cure pretty darn well), I've never had any foot/leg injuries from skating, even when I skate a lot...so I don't think their supposed injury-reduction would be of any use to me.

But one lesson I've learned well from skating - different things work well for different people - it's too easy to make blanket statements like "Graf sucks!" (*cough cough whistle innocently*), when in fact something that sucks for me is in fact a perfect match for others' needs, and vice versa.

</ramble> ;)

What is so bizarre about the ultima matrix blade system. I am also using that and i find that i like them very much and it saves you when you need to replace the blade becuase the runner is about a third of its traditional counterpart and if you are someone who does dance and freestyle you can have a dance runner and a freestyle runner and just change out the blade when you do the other instead of needing two different sets of boots or using a freestyle blade for dance or vice versa. Also they solve the problem of getting on a plane you just take the blade off but you dont have to unmount the chassis so you dont have to worry about wearing out the screw holes in the boot and i you are like me i will NEVER check my skates if they cant go on with me i wont be going on. Also as far as the injury i had jackson 3100's before my hinged skates and was only doing begining singles and half jumps and they were so painful to land a jump in and it started injuring my shins to the point that it was painful to walk and was off ice several times for a week or two. Since i got the hinged boots there is still some residual pain from my old boots but landing the same jumps in the hinged boots doesnt hurt at all. So i have to disagree with the doesnt help with injurys in lower levels i was going to wait a little while longer before buying them but i was in so much pain i knew i needed to try them now or keep being forced off ice and they have helped me alot i will never go back.

[Casey]

What is so bizarre about the ultima matrix blade system. I am also using that and i find that i like them very much and it saves you when you need to replace the blade becuase the runner is about a third of its traditional counterpart and if you are someone who does dance and freestyle you can have a dance runner and a freestyle runner and just change out the blade when you do the other instead of needing two different sets of boots or using a freestyle blade for dance or vice versa.
Personally, I think it looks bizarre, and I'm betting due to it's design that it's heavier. I've been skating rather a lot overall on fairly high-end boots and blades for the last year and couple months, and have never once needed to take the blade off or replace them. As it stands, the blades have quite a lot of life left in them, and will almost certainly outlive the boots (I think this is true for most skaters in general). So none of the above things are an advantage to me.

Also they solve the problem of getting on a plane you just take the blade off but you dont have to unmount the chassis so you dont have to worry about wearing out the screw holes in the boot and i you are like me i will NEVER check my skates if they cant go on with me i wont be going on.
Well, I don't fly, but if I did, I'd just follow the advice of others who refuse to check their traditional skates. :)

Also as far as the injury i had jackson 3100's before my hinged skates and was only doing begining singles and half jumps and they were so painful to land a jump in and it started injuring my shins to the point that it was painful to walk and was off ice several times for a week or two.
I'm not familiar with Jackson models, but maybe you had too high-level of a boot for your level?

In any case, I'm glad what you has works for you, but I personally don't see myself ever using either hinged boots or interchangeable blades.

[gt20001]

Personally, I think it looks bizarre, and I'm betting due to it's design that it's heavier. I've been skating rather a lot overall on fairly high-end boots and blades for the last year and couple months, and have never once needed to take the blade off or replace them. As it stands, the blades have quite a lot of life left in them, and will almost certainly outlive the boots (I think this is true for most skaters in general). So none of the above things are an advantage to me.


Well, I don't fly, but if I did, I'd just follow the advice of others who refuse to check their traditional skates. :)


I'm not familiar with Jackson models, but maybe you had too high-level of a boot for your level?

In any case, I'm glad what you has works for you, but I personally don't see myself ever using either hinged boots or interchangeable blades.

The blade is actually supposed to be 15 percent lighter than traditional blades becuase the chassis is made of aircraft aluminum and the blade is made of stainless steel so it isnt supposed to rust and is supposed to be harder than the traditional carbon steel blades and it isnt chromed so the chroming wont chip off. Yes your blades may outlast your boots but if you are an adult like me you can just put the old chassis on your new boots even if you need new blades and you only need to buy the runner which for the ultima freestyle model is only 110 verses the 330 for the tradiitional ultima freestyle blade and they are the same blade.

[luna_skater]

As it stands, the blades have quite a lot of life left in them, and will almost certainly outlive the boots (I think this is true for most skaters in general).


Interesting; I have never had a pair of blades outlive boots. Always the opposite.

[gt20001]

Interesting; I have never had a pair of blades outlive boots. Always the opposite.

I dont think i will have my blades outlive my boots either i like my blades sharp all the time and sharpen them quite frequently.