How long should it take?

[newskaker5]

I just started learning to skate (adult LTS program) and I am curious a to how long it will reasonable take to complete the LTS program and begin jumps/ advanced work, etc

I am new to skating, but I was a high level competitive gymnast and have only been out of that sport for about 3 yrs (I dont know if that helps w skating at all?). I workout daily and still have all the strength I did as a gymnast so I am fairly strong. I also run daily and strength train 3-4x per week. I am in good shape, but I know learning is more about technique than just brute strength.

Any estimates on how long it will take me? I know there are tons of variable, but I was just wondering

Thanks so much!

[VegasGirl]

Without seeing you skate there's really no way to even guess...

[newskaker5]

Ok...well I can do forward and backward glides, skake on one foot on each leg, and can do a one revolution spin on two feet. I have taken 2 group lessons so far

I was just wondering if there is an average length of time one takes to complete the LTS program from prealpha thru delta (or from 1-8)

[coskater64]

Without seeing you skate it really is difficult. There is a quality issue and in all honesty rushing through is not a good idea. Since you are a former athlete and in good shape you will have solid core strength and that is helpful along with the fact that you most likely have good coordination with your arms and legs.

Take your time, learn to do things correctly, focus on quality rather than quantity.

Good luck in your skating endeavors.:lol:

[DressageChica]

Hey. I've seen some people advance really quickly, and some people not advance at all...but of course that's been for a specific reason (like quitting, no privates, not pushing themselves, etc)

Generally our skaters advance very quickly because we all take 2-3 group lessons a week and 2 privates a week. Plus there is nothing else to do where I live so we just skate! All...the...time. I know one girl who has only been skating 3 years and has passed all of her silver dances and is working on her gold dances...but then again she was home schooled and lived at the rink. There's another boy who goes to a normal school and he's been skating 2 years and I think he's in Intermediate USFS (??) but I know he's almost in FS 7, but he takes double private lessons 4 days a week and skates 6 days a week.

I've also seen a ballerina who could not skate to save her life. We have ballet in our rink and the ballet teacher struggles with skating. She has beautiful extension, strength, etc...just can't skate with ease!

I guess the simple factors are 1) how much natural talent you have 2) if you are willing to fall and learn from your mistakes- people who NEVER fall NEVER learn 3) what kind of coaches you have at your rink- this makes a difference 4) how often you skate a week (with instruction and without) 5) how much you are willing to spend on private lessons, group lessons, ice time 6) how old you are (while this won't keep you from progressing, it can mean that things will take a little bit longer!) 7) how much you push yourself.

That's all I can think of right now, but they're all important factors. Just don't let it discourage you. You can become a great skater. Just focus on solidly learning the basics. Advanced footwork, jumps, and spins are HARD- even for the better skaters! If you can't do foward and backwards edges......most likely you can't do three turns, mohawks, waltz jump, two foot spin....if you can do these you can't do back threes, choctaws, brackets, toe loop, sal, one foot spin...if you can't do these you can't do backscratch and if you can't do a backscratch you can't do any single revolution jump or axel. You get the picture. I don't mean you can't do it literally...but they won't be right or polished like they should be.

It's the same thought of being able to add and subtract before you do multiplication and division, algebra before you do calculus, etc.

Just have fun!

[VegasGirl]

Well, again, without seeing you skate it's hard to tell... but I can tell you my time frame... I started taking group lessons in May 2004. After a few lessons I was tested and passed straight into Beta skipping Pre-Alpha & Alpha... but hey, not really a big deal since Pre-Alpha and Alpha are really easy any ways.
I started competing at the Beta level that Summer... that's also when I started taking half hour private lessons once a week in addition to the once a week half hour group lesson. I continued skating at that schedule until September last year progressing to Freestyle 1. Then my coach switched rinks and I followed. The new rink didn't offer adult group lessons so instead I started skating during coffee club for 1 1/2 hours 3 days a week (if possible, sometimes only twice a week) but continued the half hour private lesson once a week as well (taken during coffee club). I passed the Freestyle 2 test in December last year and was working on Freestyle 3 when we moved the first week in February. Last week I finally found a rink and am back on the ice doing coffee club sessions twice a week (that's all the coffee club sessions they offer) but have not checked into starting up private lessons again since the rink here is member of USFSA not ISI as I am and I'm not sure I want to make that switch.

Any way, long story short... it took me about 1 1/2 years from first lesson to passing ISI Freestyle 2.

[Isk8NYC]

I just started learning to skate (adult LTS program) and I am curious a to how long it will reasonable take to complete the LTS program and begin jumps/ advanced work, etc

It took me about a year (winter only) to go from ISI Alpha to FS 1. Everyone progresses at their own rate. I started competing the second season in ISI and testing USFSA. Within four years, I was skating a clean FS5.

I was a former high-level swimmer, so I had more strength and endurance than balance and control. It does make a difference in mastering maneuvers - many of them I did through speed and brute force. Given your gymnastics background, you know how to "square your shoulders" and "sweep the free leg."

You do know that you can take private lessons along with or instead of the group LTS program, correct? That, along with lots of practice, will accelerate your mastering the basics and moving on to jumps and spins.

Is your LTS program a Basic Skills program or an ISI LTS program?

[Casey]

...a bunch...
Best response EVER! :D

[newskaker5]

my lessons are ISI. Yes - I do know about privates - I guess I am waiting a bit until I get better to get them. Id be happy doing them now - I guess I am the type of person that worries if I ask my instructor too many questions about how Im doing or want privates ASAP after only to lessons I will look pushy. HAHA I know thats stupid but I am weird like that :p

BTW - what is the difference between ISI and Basic Skills program? Is one better than the other? Am I OK with ISI?

[Isk8NYC]

Both programs are fine, the test levels are structured differently. I have taught in both USFSA and ISI schools. I prefer the USFSA and that's what I currently teach.

The USFSA Basic Skills program groups elements together by level of difficulty. Each level has maneuvers that are foundations for one or more maneuvers on the next level. For example, you learn swizzles, then you learn one-foot swizzles, then proper pushes, and work your way up in small steps to crossovers. This also allows the school to easily create "blended" classes where students are working on both levels during a session. It's tough to manage at the lowest levels, but it's okay for Basic 6/7, for example.

Once the "Basic 8's" are done (Basic 1 - 8) you move up to specialties such as Freeskate. The Basic Skills competitions are usually maneuver-based for the lower (below Freeskate) levels. That means you do the maneuvers one at a time for the judges, as opposed to doing a program containing those maneuvers. (Some comps offer this option.) The competition groups can be quite large, often mixing ages and genders. However, the test level determines the event(s) you can enter.

The ISI LTS program (aka: "WeSkate") is organized in a similar way, but some of the required maneuvers take longer to master and some people think they're not needed. For example, the first backward crossover is done by LIFTING the foot off the ice to cross. No one does that in programs except students at that level. The ISI groups the levels fairly evenly, but each level has one or two "toughies" that are more difficult to master than the others at that level. It is common for students to repeat a level in an ISI skating school; as a result, many schools break the tests into two levels, ie. Alpha I and Alpha II. When you finish Alpha II, you've passed the entire Alpha test.

Note: Those "toughies" really show up in the Freestyle levels. There are many skaters who simply CAN'T move up to the next level until they master the __________. Fill that blank in with: camel spin, axel jump, and so on. It gets frustrating to be "plateaued" because of a single element, but it does happen. That's when people start using the words "sandbagging."

ISI Competitions are really focused on fun and sportsmanship. That said, every barrel has a few bad apples that just don't get it, if you get my drift. Ignore them and set the standard for good, I say. Everyone has the opportunity, regardless of level, to skate to music. The levels are usually divided by test level, age group, and gender. They try to keep each competition group at six competitors, and everyone gets an award.

In any case, you move up as you master skills and competition opportunities abound - you just have to look for them.

[VegasGirl]

ISI Competitions are really focused on fun and sportsmanship. That said, every barrel has a few bad apples that just don't get it, if you get my drift. Ignore them and set the standard for good, I say. Everyone has the opportunity, regardless of level, to skate to music. The levels are usually divided by test level, age group, and gender. They try to keep each competition group at six competitors, and everyone gets an award.

And that is exactly why I prefer ISI over USFSA... especially being an adult skater who simply is doing this for fun... and what fun it is!!!

[newskaker5]

Since the ISI is geared more towards fun competitions, does that mean you will progress slower? I am all for fun, but I really want to be pushed and reach the highest level I can (Im very competitive hehe). Will the ISI let me achieve that or should I switch to a school that teaches the basic 8?

[newskaker5]

One more question about ISI (sorry Im asking so much - there is just so much to learn!) Can you reach all the same levels such as novice, junior, senior, etc in skating as you can in the other?
Thanks!

[beachbabe]

I finished USFSA basic 1-8 in about 4 months, but then again thats shorter than most. i don't know I've never really had any trouble with anything untill i got up to freestyle 2. It has been 1 and a half year total since I started and I have passed all the group freestyle levels and am now doing just privates.

Everyones progress differs, b/c in the same time it took me to pass all the levels throught Freestyle 6, some kids who started at the same time as me are still in basic 6.

it all depends on previous experince, talent, and how much time you put into it.

theres really no way to tell

good luck!!! don't hurry yourself, good basics make everythiong easier

[techskater]

ISI goes Alpha through Delta and FS1-10. To skate Prepre-Senior you must skate USFSA.

[doubletoe]

Everyone is different, but if you're a gymnast, you are probably pretty fearless, not to mention coordinated and athletic. I am not a gymnast, but I was pretty athletic and already comfortable on the ice when I started group lessons at 27 (a friend had taught me forward and backward crossovers, the bunny hop and waltz jump when I was a teenager). I think I had all of my single jumps within about a year and a half, taking one group lesson per week and practicing about 4 hours a week.

[doubletoe]

By the way, even if you are a "jumper" by nature, there is a huge difference between the single jumps and any jump over 1 revolution, so each level you move up to will take you longer to master. Even though I got all of my single jumps very quickly and easily, it was several years before I got my axel and and another year or so before it was somewhat consistent. Doubles can take even longer. I landed my first double salchow a few months after I landed my first axel, but 2-1/2 years later I am still landing only half of my attempts. A lot of people never get the double axel, or only get it after several years of working on it tirelessly.

[dbny]

Any estimates on how long it will take me?

Other posters have made many good points, so now I will give you the most direct answer possible, which is exactly the same as the answer to "How long does it take to cut the ice?"

As long as it takes!

Do what you have to do and do not worry about the time. Get it done right, and however long that takes, is the right amount of time for it.

[Bothcoasts]

Since the ISI is geared more towards fun competitions, does that mean you will progress slower? I am all for fun, but I really want to be pushed and reach the highest level I can (Im very competitive hehe). Will the ISI let me achieve that or should I switch to a school that teaches the basic 8?

I don't think skaters necessarily progress slower or quicker in one system than the other. I've taught in both and find that skaters who are naturally good pick it up quickly with either system. Skaters who aren't as natural pick it up slower, irrespective of whether the program is USFSA or ISI.

I learned to skate with the ISI program at a very competitive rink and now coach using the ISI program. Some of the kids I learned to skate with are now competing at the senior level, and the recreational skaters I work with now are very happy with the ISI program, too. On a personal note, I prefer it to the USFSA program--the levels are much easier to keep straight, and the relatively few number of elements at a given level means that I can teach additional elements I believe to be relevant. It's the best of both worlds for me!

[VegasGirl]

Since the ISI is geared more towards fun competitions, does that mean you will progress slower? I am all for fun, but I really want to be pushed and reach the highest level I can (Im very competitive hehe). Will the ISI let me achieve that or should I switch to a school that teaches the basic 8?

No, it does not mean that you progress slower... your progress solely depends on your abilities. In the year or so that I have been competing so far I've gone from competing in Beta to competing in FS2 within 6 competitions. You can achieve as much or as little (and still compete) as you want and have fun at it... that to me is part of the beauty of ISI!

[VegasGirl]

ISI goes Alpha through Delta and FS1-10.

You forgot Pre-Alpha... :)

[Isk8NYC]

Since the ISI is geared more towards fun competitions, does that mean you will progress slower? I am all for fun, but I really want to be pushed and reach the highest level I can (Im very competitive hehe). Will the ISI let me achieve that or should I switch to a school that teaches the basic 8?

When you're ready to actually start testing, the first thing you should buy are the rulebooks for each program, USFSA and ISI. The internet is fine for abbreviated lists, but the rulebooks really lay out the requirements for each test and element in much more detail.

For now, you should relax and worry about learning the basics properly. Either program will suffice at the lower LTS levels. The threshold is at ISI Freestyle 2 and USFSA Freeskate 6. At that point, you'll need a private skating coach. That's when you can choose to test higher in the ISI, the USFSA, or both! On the USFSA's part, that's intentional: they want you to move into the traditional testing of Preliminary, etc. To do that, you really do need a private coach. I've never heard of someone learning more than the prep for an axel in a group lesson.

Both programs are challenging, they just approach it differently. The ISI proscribes the exact elements (ie. FS9's Double Lutz) that EVERYONE must do to pass the test. The USFSA states the level of elements needed to pass. (ie. A Double jump)

There are some test levels equivalencies between the ISI and USFSA. For example, a USFSA skater who's passed Preliminary freestyle can compete no lower than ISI Freestyle 4. However, the USFSA has no restrictions based on ISI tests. There is no MITF impact on ISI competitions.

That said, skaters can compete in BOTH types of competitions. The programs have to be modified somewhat to stay within the ISI restrictions. (No elements from higher levels.)

If you're a viscious competitor, stay away from ISI competitions. You'd be better off using your energy in USFSA qualifying competitions, where a win really matters. In the ISI, if you lose, no big deal. There's another competition coming up that you can enter.

[Isk8NYC]

I finished USFSA basic 1-8 in about 4 months, but then again thats shorter than most. i don't know I've never really had any trouble with anything untill i got up to freestyle 2. It has been 1 and a half year total since I started and I have passed all the group freestyle levels and am now doing just privates.

I'm just being picky, but do you mean USFSA FreeSKATE? The ISI FreeSTYLE tests are far more advanced than the USFSA FreeSKATE basic skills tests.

Unless you've finished the Basic Skills FreeSKATE tests and are testing ISI FreeSTYLE, which is common.

[beachbabe]

I'm just being picky, but do you mean USFSA FreeSKATE? The ISI FreeSTYLE tests are far more advanced than the USFSA FreeSKATE basic skills tests.

Unless you've finished the Basic Skills FreeSKATE tests and are testing ISI FreeSTYLE, which is common.


I never did anything with ISI, i just did the basic skills usfsa and feestyle 1-6 usfsa, these are not the same levels as ISI which my rink does not offer.

In usfsa I have passed pre-preliminary, preliminary, and pre-juvenile, i can't pass juvenile yet b/c i do not have an axel and can't do chnage of foot yet while maintaining required no. of revolutions after the change.
I really don't know much about the ISI thing, like I said its not offered at my rink

[Skate@Delaware]

I never did anything with ISI, i just did the basic skills usfsa and feestyle 1-6 usfsa, these are not the same levels as ISI which my rink does not offer.

In usfsa I have passed pre-preliminary, preliminary, and pre-juvenile, i can't pass juvenile yet b/c i do not have an axel and can't do chnage of foot yet while maintaining required no. of revolutions after the change.
I really don't know much about the ISI thing, like I said its not offered at my rink
ISI isn't offered at my rink either, but my coach tested me so I could compete at ISI competitions. The ISI version of crossovers had me befuddled (lifting the foot over)! YIKES!

[VegasGirl]

The ISI version of crossovers had me befuddled (lifting the foot over)! YIKES!

Funny you should mention that... I find that version of crossovers much easier since the toe pick doesn't get in the way of the long figure skating blade. Could/can do the other version (is it the official USFSA version?) just fine in hockey skates but when I first tried to do it in figure skates I just about landed flat on my face since the back of my blade got stuck on the darned pick!