Sweet singing or ghastly noise: 12-18 December 2005 [Archive]

Mrs Redboots

12-13-2005, 08:21 AM

Thinking of carol singing, you see......

Our couples lesson this morning, and the coach was in "Let's see how nearly I can kill them before they kill me" mode! Actually, I think he was trying to kill all his pupils this morning, he has days like that....

Sweetly Singing: We started off with ordinary figure-8 crossovers/runs round the circle, which he said had improved. Then he wanted to see our spin, and that went reasonably okay, except we were struggling with our free legs on the backspin section - mine was bent, husband's was too high. I know I still do have issues with that - usually I can't get my free leg into the right place before the spin ends.

He then required us to work on an exit, which we hadn't done before. Then we practised drop-downs - semi death-spirals, but where the woman is supported on her arms. Then we worked on our lift - I don't want to do the hip lift, I don't think, as it stresses my back. But I have seen a photo of our regular lift, and it looks awful, so we worked on changing my legs - now I have to have my legs crossed, would you believe? Yikes....

Husband, most gratifyingly, asked where my weight had gone.... hey, it's not that long since he last lifted me, and I still weigh more than he does, more's the pity!

Coach then tried to have Husband swoosh between my legs, since he is more flexible than me, but it didn't work and he nearly picked me up off the ice! Sheesh.....

Ghastly Noise: So we moved on from playing with choreography, and ended with the Swing Dance, which was awful as we went badly out of time in the swing rolls. So we then had to skate several laps of just swing rolls, and someone else put the music on, so we were able to do it to the music, and they were better. But both of us had trouble with the pushing, since we both found it easier to bring our feet together and then bend, which put us out of time, rather than bending as we bring our feet together! So we didn't bend enough and our pushing suffered! BUT I did feel that I was really getting some lean on my edges, and really trying to track Husband through the forwards section.... it does improve. I wish our Fiesta was as good, but it isn't.... Yet.

More sweet singing in the choir: After the Husband had gone, I spent most of the rest of the session pottering around with a friend, but when we got cold I went off to work on my dance moves, and found both of them much improved! Although I can only do them down one side of the rink - the other doesn't have anything to focus on in the right place, and the ice is never quite so good as it's where people congregate. But it's mostly not being able to focus. But I was really getting some edges, which is great. Not good edges yet, but better than they were. I am beginning to feel that I just might be able to test these before spring, which I have never felt before!

phoenix

12-13-2005, 09:49 AM

We'll start with Ghastly!!
Coach used magic camera on his phone to video my Kilian. Then showed it to me. I watched, then handed it back to him with the comment, "Thank you for not laughing at me while I skate." Him, still stone serious: "Yes. And today is better than it was before!" Oy. So then we worked on knee bend & skating with speed (!) for the rest of the time. Killer new exercise: 2-beat outside edges in time with the Kilian music. And he wants EDGES, almost 1/2 circle lobes. Also, cross steps in time w/ the Paso music. Lower in your knees. More. More. Lower. :giveup:

Sweet (maybe just semi-sweet):
Worked the last few days on KNEES, specifically on the Kilian steps, and I do think it's improved. I've also been trying to fix this weird kicky thing I do w/ one foot on fwd progressives. We'll see on Friday if he can detect any improvement.

Kilian choctaw is hugely improved. When I'm doing it slowly (my favorite speed!), it's fairly effortless & requires no extra checking to hold the exit edge. Now I just need to ramp it up....

Casey

12-13-2005, 09:53 AM

Err, I already posted this in the last thread, but didn't realize that the date was already the 12th. Reposting here because I'd like any advice I can get on improving the posture and arm position in the spins...

Some new videos (taken with my digital camera even, so the quality is good) here: http://kc.sk8rland.com/video/ice_skating/2005-12-12/

Sweet Singing: Well my spins are not *too* terribly bad these days.

Ghastly Noise: The last 2 videos especially show examples of "when spinning goes wrong". Not only that, but my posture is bad and arms are uneven in all the spins. Sigh...gotta figure out how to fix it. And I need to exit spins in practice more, it's apparent that I never do it. :P

Joan

12-13-2005, 10:27 AM

Sweet singing: I had one of those "a-ha" moments in my dance lesson yesterday. My coach explained how back progressives should "actually" be done, as opposed to how I was doing them and I noticed a similarity to the Silver moves back cross-strokes, for how the foot on the inside of the circle is supposed to be used to create power. I like to see my efforts in one area, say MIF, help out in another area, in this case, Dance. It definitely works the other way too, where Dance helps FS and MIF.

Ghastly noise: Am I ever going to be able to do a decent outside mohawk? It needs open hips, which I do not have the genes for, apparently.

Skate@Delaware

12-13-2005, 10:45 AM

And I need to exit spins in practice more, it's apparent that I never do it. :P
ALWAYS!!! That's the gospel from my coach! Get into the habit of exiting (nicely) every spin, even if they suck! :giveup:

jenlyon60

12-13-2005, 12:17 PM

I don't do freestyle (dance/MIF only) but my coach wants me (and other students) to finish nicely out of everything we do, even if it's just a drill. Nice extension (front or back as appropriate), nice carriage, nice arms, nice fingers.

jazzpants

12-13-2005, 01:10 PM

Ditto on jumps and spins here... on MIF, it would depend on whether I'm actually doing a pattern or doing parts of a pattern. If I'm doing the entire pattern, I'm expected to finish it off nicely, even though I looked like I'm about to collapse on the ice from being exhausted and in need of oxygen. :twisted:

Ghastly noise:

AHHHH!!! The sounds of CROWDS DURING THE HOLIDAY SEASON in a public session! Great business for the rink, but horrible, HORRIBLE skating situation for practicing moves.
Loops and flips were not there. They were close but not there... :frus: (Did someone swipe my loop and flip???) :twisted:
Couldn't even set up spins b/c the rink was so crowded. Even the center was too busy b/c the Monday night crowd was busy trying to get in whatever spins and jumps they have. (Plus, my primary coach was in the middle of a lesson with one of his students who he's trying to get into competing at Sectionals.) They're trying to crunch in a slew of moves and FS tests before the AN deadline. So I tried to do moves, but the hockey and the general beginners were there. GRRRRR!!! :x
Sweet singing:

Whatever Bronze Moves drill I can do in a crowded public session was pretty decent.
Back crossovers are better... :P

sunshinepointe

12-13-2005, 01:30 PM

Hey Casey -

You asked for some advice so I thought I'd throw this out there...but who am I to talk? Anywho...

It seems like you're rushing into the spin. I mean, speed is good and all, but you come to your spinning position way too fast. Take a couple of revolutions to get settled in the spin, leaving the free leg extended fully and checking posture. I notice your head tends to droop a little, and you have "helicopter arms" - something I suffer from as well. I think that taking your time getting into the spin should help fix some of this. Remember - like Dorothy Hamil says on the Lussi spin video, you don't have to enter a spin fast to actually spin fast. Take your time, work on your entry and you'll see an improvement. This is something I was working on when I was last skating :)

Mrs Redboots

12-13-2005, 01:54 PM

I so sympathise with Phoenix on the 2-beat outside edge drills (must do those - they sound horrid!) and with Joan on the outside Mohawks. I don't have open hips either, Joan, and mine are clunky, to say the least of it.

Forgot to say that Husband and I stumbled and kicked our way through the 14-step when the music for it came on (we had a pretty empty rink this morning). Unfortunately, I could not remember whether you did the run or the cross-behind first after stepping to forwards - and I've forgotten again, even though my friend did show me! Plus the other day we were trying to dance the Foxtrot and I discovered I'd not exactly forgotten, but was just not very sure of the step after the lady's back run - I know there's a back cross-roll and a step to forwards, but I think either Husband or I am missing an edge somewhere.....

jenlyon60

12-13-2005, 02:23 PM

Skate@Delaware

12-13-2005, 04:03 PM

Ghastly noises only: no skating today, must wait until tomorrow! I've taken a "holiday" from it (so nice to go shopping, pick up Chinese food and not have to rush to the rink back from the rink to the daycare home then to scouting, etc) ......Talked to the dance coach and found out she won't be teaching until after the holidays! DARN! There goes our chance to get something set up for the exhibition (Jan 15)! With hubby's schedule tight (he works 2 jobs) we were hoping on squeezing in something during the rinks modified holiday schedule (they dropped 2 freestyle sessions :evil: ).

So now we have music, outfits, but no dance steps! I'm not good enough on the Dutch Waltz to teach him, can barely eek it out of myself. I'm hoping a solution presents itself soon. This will be the one thing that really clinches skating for him! He's so Type-A if he meets with to much disappointment, he won't do it again.... :frus: I'll have to see if maybe I can work on it a bit, then she can smooth out all the edges (there will be a lot of smoothing to do)!

phoenix

12-13-2005, 04:11 PM

e-skater

12-13-2005, 04:54 PM

Loops and flips were not there. They were close but not there... :frus: (Did someone swipe my loop and flip???) :twisted:

Oh, regarding the loop, that HAD to be me. :P :P :P I did five in a row Monday, all with good landings and, for me, decent ice coverage. Which is anything over 12". ;)

My flip is way gone....stolen by someone else....same person who took yours! NOTHING there, nothing. :frus:

e-skater

12-13-2005, 04:56 PM

Ghastly noise: Am I ever going to be able to do a decent outside mohawk? It needs open hips, which I do not have the genes for, apparently.

Well, if it makes you feel any better, I can open into an outside spread eagle position without even thinking about it. Yet, despite my "open hips", I cannot do a decent outside mohawk yet to save my life. Think Ten Fox, and 14 Step, which coach showed me the steps to (the 14 step). EEEK!

e-skater

12-13-2005, 05:00 PM

Ghastly Noise: So we moved on from playing with choreography, and ended with the Swing Dance, which was awful as we went badly out of time in the swing rolls. But both of us had trouble with the pushing, since we both found it easier to bring our feet together and then bend, which put us out of time, rather than bending as we bring our feet together!

Annabel, you had me laughing on this one. I'm sure if I ever tried to partner with anyone I'd stab them first and trip them second. :lol: ;)

Skate@Delaware

12-13-2005, 08:26 PM

skate@delaware: is there another coach at your rink who does a lot of choreography? There's someone here who, along with coaching her own students, does a lot of programs for other kids as well--so it's very kosher to work with her on new programs. Maybe there's someone there who could do that? Or what about a college skater kid who'll be home for the holidays w/ lots of free time & eager for some extra spending money?

Talk to your coach--maybe you could work around this glitch...
It's a problem at my rink-too few coaches. We are mostly a recreational/hockey rink so we don't have that many available. As for college students, we don't have any.

My group coach would normally be available, but she is taking vacation for 2 weeks. She is the only other coach qualified to teach ice dance. All the rest are freestyle only.

As long as it's not the Canasta Tango, we'll be ok! (that dance gave me nightmares-I discovered my 2 left feet!) The Dutch Waltz is fine, as long as hubby doesn't freak out with the tempo-I'm incorporating that waltz and some freestyle moves into an original dance. When the other coach becomes available, she can "fix" us. It's just frustrating. Neither one of us wants to drive the 1.5-2 hours to the other rink that has ice dance (SCW).

Should be interesting! :roll:

mikawendy

12-13-2005, 09:42 PM

ALWAYS!!! That's the gospel from my coach! Get into the habit of exiting (nicely) every spin, even if they suck! :giveup:

Except if it's a busy freestyle session, you might be careful when exiting since you won't be able to see behind you. One time in a lesson, I was lucky to not have decided to push to the BO edge to exit--a girl zoomed by doing senior moves and it would have been a major collision. (Of course what she was doing skating that close to someone already in a spin and in a lesson is a whole 'nother discussion!) 8O :twisted:

mikawendy

12-13-2005, 09:46 PM

It's a problem at my rink-too few coaches. We are mostly a recreational/hockey rink so we don't have that many available. As for college students, we don't have any.

My group coach would normally be available, but she is taking vacation for 2 weeks. She is the only other coach qualified to teach ice dance. All the rest are freestyle only.

If the coaches at your rink aren't able to choreograph something for your exhibition in time for the exhibition, maybe you could see how your coach feels about you going to another rink to have a different coach choreograph something simple, then you could bring it back home to work on with your coach?

Edited to add: sorry, I didn't read the part where you said you didn't want to drive to another rink. Perhaps one of the freestyle coaches has enough dance background to help you with something simple? Sometimes coaches who primarily coach in one discipline are also able to do a little in others because of their past experience with testing and competing?

mikawendy

12-13-2005, 09:47 PM

Annabel, you had me laughing on this one. I'm sure if I ever tried to partner with anyone I'd stab them first and trip them second. :lol: ;)

Or you could try stabbing and tripping at the same time? Killing two birds with one stone--er--blade? ;) ;)

Mrs Redboots

12-14-2005, 09:07 AM

14Step...

Cross-behind (cross-back chasse), Cross in front (really a Progressive/run), mohawk, back inside, then restart.

Remembering the saying "cross-behind, cross-in front, mohawk" with the right rhythm helped me alot.

Foxtrot...

after the ladies back progressive/run... LBO cross stroke 2 beats), RFO (2 beats with a slight change of edge to RFI on the very end), LFO (2 beats), then RBO (the killer closed mohawk) hold for 4 beats, then LFI, RFI (2 beats each) and restart.

Thanks, Jen. Walked through Foxtrot with coach this morning, and no problems (except on the Mohawk, which I'm still not good at), so I think it's Husband, not me.... And even if it is me, it's still his fault (2nd law of ice-dance!).

Ghastly Noise: My Christmas flashers don't fit on my new blades!!!!! :cry: :cry: :cry: Husband's need new batteries, and I don't know whether they'll fit on his new blades either, but maybe mine will fit on his, and then maybe his will fit Other Woman, since hers were stolen a few weeks ago.... We'll have to have a sort out. I will have to go to dance club tomorrow since it's Husband's birthday and I can't not dance with him on his birthday, can I - so maybe we can get something sorted then. He didn't skate this morning because there were to be tests, so the session wasn't starting until 8:30, plus he thinks he's getting a cold.

Sweet singing: Lovely empty rink again this morning, after the tests. And one of my coach's pupils was praised for her basic skating in the test - all too often they get told they have lovely elements, but can't actually skate! Lesson went well - I actually managed a whole lap of cross-cuts AND back cross-rolls. Coach decided that since I was always getting the first side, to change and start in the opposite corner, so I can focus on the café sign as I get tired. And it worked! But oh dear, I so know I have hamstrings and calves.... They still need work, of course, before I can test them, but at least we know they will be testable in the not-too-distant future.

Also worked on waltz 3s, with more flow than normal (but I still scratch a bit on the step into the 3-turn, especially clockwise), and then spent time working on swing rolls and chassés. I made coach hold my hands when going backwards, as I knew that way I could just focus on getting a good edge and good extension.

And we finished with stepping through the Foxtrot, as mentioned above. A good lesson, I think, and a lot easier than yesterday's in some ways, except that I'm as stiff as a board now!

flo

12-14-2005, 11:17 AM

ghastly - it's freezing here!!!!!!

Sweet - Had a lesson last night and worked on the counter move. Also worked on a better flying cammel. Lots of fun, and it went by too fast. I have our show this weekend. I'll be skating to Silent Night while my friend plays it on guitar.

phoenix

12-14-2005, 11:59 AM

I have our show this weekend. I'll be skating to Silent Night while my friend plays it on guitar.

That sounds SO cool! Might you have it video'd to share? How do you practice it?

flo

12-14-2005, 12:03 PM

Hi,
I'll ask someone to tape it. Practice???? Actually we finally got together last Saturday. He played through and I skated. I'm going to use it as a finale piece, so all the skaters come on the ice for the second verse.

Mikaand Ross - you too!

coskater64

12-14-2005, 12:53 PM

Sweetly singing: After several weeks of not skating well my jumps are back. Spread eagle axel is clean and easy as is 2sow and 2toe. May have managed a 2loop but I think it was cheated about 1/4 but it was really easy.

Spins are solid especially 3's into back camel, coach wants it in the program...may kill me.

Ghastly noise: working on Foxtrot end pattern much better all the edges are correct but need more knee bend...as always.

Skate@Delaware

12-14-2005, 01:25 PM

Mika: I'm going to ask my private coach if she is up on the dances.....she hasn't mentioned it before, her handout states "freestyle and moves" but it's worth a shot. Her choreography is really good-my routine is nice! If only I could do it real credit...(ps-we do have busy freestyle sessions, but I'm supposed to look over my shoulder a bit anyways....so I haven't taken anyone out while exiting my spins :twisted: <yet>)

Mrs. Redboots: Where do you get Christmas Flashers???????? I want some!!!!

Casey: your spins are much better! I showed one video clip to my hubby so he could see how you are supposed to step out from the back crossovers (we could watch it frame by frame-geeks we are)

eagerly awaiting show day so we can finally skate in a warm rink (it's the only time they turn the heaters on) !!!!

crayonskater

12-14-2005, 01:36 PM

Casey, I'm not much of a spinner yet, but my coach always talks about 'feeding the spin'; you're trying to get the spin to center and to last as long as possible, so you add to it bit by bit. First rotate with the leg up, then cross it over, then bring the arms in, then bring them down.

jazzpants

12-14-2005, 01:59 PM

Sweet singing:

Back crossovers are much better!!! We were working on maintaining what I have and doing a wider side step into the circle and then cross under.
Starting to get neater feet into the 5 step mohawk... (We're playing "Make the boots kiss each other" today.)
Ghastly noise:

Me trying to incorporate my better back crossovers and my neater feet into the appropriate Bronze Moves patterns! AUGH!!! :frus: I end up changing the overall pattern. Have to do some adjustments there...
Casey, your spins are looking better! :D

Casey

12-14-2005, 02:20 PM

It seems like you're rushing into the spin. I mean, speed is good and all, but you come to your spinning position way too fast. Take a couple of revolutions to get settled in the spin, leaving the free leg extended fully and checking posture. I notice your head tends to droop a little, and you have "helicopter arms" - something I suffer from as well. I think that taking your time getting into the spin should help fix some of this.
Casey, I'm not much of a spinner yet, but my coach always talks about 'feeding the spin'; you're trying to get the spin to center and to last as long as possible, so you add to it bit by bit. First rotate with the leg up, then cross it over, then bring the arms in, then bring them down.
Thanks for the advice, guys (or girls as the case may be)! It's not really like I'm trying to rush, but it's hard to hold the leg up for long without losing balance! I have been trying to tilt my head up a bit more, but I'll definitely work on trying to keep the free leg up longer...

Casey: your spins are much better! I showed one video clip to my hubby so he could see how you are supposed to step out from the back crossovers (we could watch it frame by frame-geeks we are)
Thanks for the compliment - I'm glad the videos are useful. I'm not sure if I'd use them as a reference point though by any means, LOL!

phoenix

12-14-2005, 03:05 PM

I agree, Casey, your spins have greatly improved. Should try for at least 3 revs in "open" position (arms, free leg out) before crossing foot/pulling in. Also you're stepping too far back of the circle out of the crossovers.....I'm not saying that right; someone help me out here? You're stepping back the way you came & out of the circle, instead of stepping more forward into the center. That & not rushing (hold the entry edge longer) will help centering.

Sweet!: Team lesson this morning was not bad at all! We started in Kilian position, which I hate, & which is very difficult for us, but it is making slow painful progress. Today was as good as it's been. Then we did European 3's (waltz hold) in a circle, & those were actually quite good for our first time trying them. After a few adjustments, they were fast, controlled & we were able to do them pretty indefinitely without it all falling apart. Then we did some chasses in waltz hold as well, not too bad.

And THEN (insert drumroll here) we were asked to do the 1st half of the Starlight! Our very first attempt at a dance & I was very surprised it was such a high one. And it really was not bad. We went through it several times & it got better. This was truthfully the first time skating together that made me start to think, "this might just work!" I was very happy.

Nothing Ghastly for this time, I'm looking on the bright side of life (insert Eric Idle singing..... (http://www.mwscomp.com/sounds/mp3/brghtsd.mp3) ) :D

Mrs Redboots

12-14-2005, 05:18 PM

Mrs. Redboots: Where do you get Christmas Flashers???????? I want some!!!!!Ask Beccapoo - I think she imports them into the USA.

Team lesson this morning was not bad at all! We started in Kilian position, which I hate, & which is very difficult for us, but it is making slow painful progress.What about Reverse Kilian, which I find much harder?
Today was as good as it's been. Then we did European 3's (waltz hold) in a circle, & those were actually quite good for our first time trying them. After a few adjustments, they were fast, controlled & we were able to do them pretty indefinitely without it all falling apart.First time we tried, we nearly fell over. These days we can do them until one or both of us gets dizzy, but clockwise is still tricky.

Then we did some chasses in waltz hold as well, not too bad. Lap after lap after lap - start with you going backwards, then at the end of the rink you turn round and he goes backwards, then you swap again at the end of the rink, and maybe do swing rolls.... we are doing endless drills now as we are hoping to test our Level 4 Compulsories which are Swing Dance and Fiesta

And THEN (insert drumroll here) we were asked to do the 1st half of the Starlight! Our very first attempt at a dance & I was very surprised it was such a high one.Now, that is impressive! Well done. I do hope it works out for you.

e-skater

12-14-2005, 05:40 PM

Sweet Singing: Today at adult session, toward the end, since the session had been light, four of us adults lined up and did "spin line", where each person does the spin of their choice, and so on. We did this til end of session and it was great fun. I even got a whim to try a camel sit and it was hilarious. Of course I have no clue how to do it! But it was loads of fun.

Ghastly noise: working on the changes coach made to fit my program in to reduced ice for Holiday Show on Sunday. 8O EEEP! Let's scratch through those toe picky turns with a smile! :roll:

Skate@Delaware

12-14-2005, 09:33 PM

Ask Beccapoo - I think she imports them into the USA.
Beccapoo-Where can I get them??? They would be awesome to have. I've only seen them once and didn't get a chance to ask the person where they got them before they left the rink.

Ghastly Noises: The Perimeter Pattern---evil, flat, end crossovers! They are just weird! Back inside edges are completely gone again :frus: of course it doesn't help that I'm dodging Arabian Dancers and Snowflakes......and my blades are sharpened and I can't spin well....maybe they will work better tomorrow once they are ground down a bit :lol:

Sweet Singing: Worked on the new 3-turn pattern for pre-bronze....It's more like a dance pattern than anything. I kind of like it! My homework is to do 3-turns on a hockey circle, then do the back edges with the cross in front and step to the front-both directions

and work on my loop, routine, toe-loop (hate that jump), etc.

Dress rehearsal tomorrow night! However, I will be going to the daytime skate to workout. Haven't skated since Sunday and I was all shaky tonight.

FrankR

12-15-2005, 08:34 AM

Hey all,

Singing Sweetly: I actually ran through my new program from start to finish for the very first time today! :D This program has been in the making for a very long time. I chose the music and cut it back in October. However, since I had been focusing my attention on working gold moves, my coaches and I didn't really start working in earnest towards choreographing the new program until a month ago. Then I went away for a week to visit family. When I came back, one of my coaches was sick and the other had gone to Junior Nationals with another one of his students. So I went without lessons for another week and the program was on hold during that time. We JUST finished mapping it out on Tuesday during the last minute and a half of my lesson. lol :lol: At the end of the session today I decided I might as well give the new program a try and I was just as shocked as anyone else to actually get through 85% of it and stay on the beat! 8O I finished a bit late because I'm still thinking through the straight-line step that precedes the ending but otherwise not bad for a first try. Here are my elements:
Forward sit with sideways leaning variation
Axel/Half-loop/Salchow/Loop
Lutz/Loop/Loop from a quick mohawk entrance
LFO Spiral/Cross in front/Mohawk/Axel
Flying Camel
Straight-Line Step
Flip
Camel/Sit-Change Sit/Back Scratch

Ghastly Noise: My new program is supposed to be a bit of a character piece. As a result, I'm supposed to put a lot of life into the choreography with facial expressions and there are many trickly (at least tricky for me! :oops: ) little transitions and nuances that I'm still not doing yet. I suppose with time that these added touches will become more second nature as I get the program under my feet but right now it's pretty ghastly. lol :lol:

Take care all,

Frank

Skate@Delaware

12-15-2005, 02:42 PM

Melzorina

12-15-2005, 02:57 PM

Maybe she's a girl that can't pat her head and rub her tummy at the same time...

Ooh! I can pat my head and rub my tummy at the same time!!

NoVa Sk8r

12-15-2005, 03:06 PM

Here are my elements: Forward sit with sideways leaning variation, Axel/Half-loop/Salchow/Loop, Lutz/Loop/Loop from a quick mohawk entrance, LFO Spiral/Cross in front/Mohawk/Axel, Flying Camel, Straight-Line Step, Flip, Camel/Sit-Change Sit/Back ScratchWow, sounds like a power-packed program!
Looking forward to seeing it 8-) ... NOT looking forward to competing against it! :P

FrankR

12-15-2005, 03:26 PM

My daughter is having this problem with her exhibition piece....although she can perform beautifully in front of people on stage (acting and opera) when it comes to skating with "expression" she just doesn't get it going. Ah, what to do? :giveup: Maybe she's a girl that can't pat her head and rub her tummy at the same time...

:lol: lol I can't pat my head and rub my tummy. However, I think the issue with me is that I tend to zero in so much on the technical aspect of what I'm doing that any and all emotive/interpretive thoughts go right out the window. That's been the case with me especially after I've introduced the axel into my programs last year and this year. Hopefully with some practice the expressive part of me will wake up and get with the program...literally! ;)

FrankR

12-15-2005, 03:30 PM

Wow, sounds like a power-packed program!
Looking forward to seeing it 8-) ... NOT looking forward to competing against it! :P

LOL!! :lol:

Well that's always assuming that I can produce all of that consistently. That was my first run-through. Hopefully all that stuff will stay put and not decide to wander on me during competitive skates. If things go well I may add more modifications to some of the spins and hopefully the steps will get crisp. Believe it or not, within all of that I'm actually doing one pattern of the eight-step mohawk sequence from silver MIF!! 8O It actually fits into the music! It just goes to show that moves in the field can come in handy when choreographing freestyle. :D

jazzpants

12-15-2005, 05:20 PM

Ghastly Noise: My new program is supposed to be a bit of a character piece. As a result, I'm supposed to put a lot of life into the choreography with facial expressions and there are many trickly (at least tricky for me! :oops: ) little transitions and nuances that I'm still not doing yet. I suppose with time that these added touches will become more second nature as I get the program under my feet but right now it's pretty ghastly. lol :lol:
Geez, Frank! This is your very FIRST runthru!!! Give yourself a break, man!!! :roll: :P :lol:

I look forward to see it when I get over there to Ice House. (That is... if the transit strike over in NYC doesn't cause trouble for me... 8O Shouldn't though... since I'm sticking with LIRR and NJ Transit. :D )

It just goes to show that moves in the field can come in handy when choreographing freestyle. :DI have 5 step mohawks in my program. Nuf said! :P

Ghastly noise:

The SCREAMING of TONS of middle school kids during my lesson this afternoon!!! AAAAAUGH!!! Needless to say, no moves practice today!!! GRRRRRR!!! :frus:
Me cursing when I tried to do a camel and can't get beyond ONE rev. :x
ISI 3 change foot spin. (Primary coach almost suggested a change sit and I was like 8O ) After seeing those change foot spins, it's okay but he decided it was not a great idea for me to try for a change sit today!!! (But soon... I suspect 2006 I'll start on change sit.)
Humming:

Toe loops, salchow, and waltz! (Oh, my!!!)
Scratch spin
Sit spins
Backspin
Sweet Singing:

Landed ONE single loop cleanly this afternoon, after fighting for a clean landing on a couple of the loops...
Landed ONE single flip at the end cleanly!!!
Primary coach ended my very lesson of the year saying it's been a VERY good year skating-wise for me!!! (And indeed, it has been great overall!!!) :mrgreen:

cutiesk8r43

12-15-2005, 05:53 PM

Sweet Singing:
went on the harness today and landed some double salchows. :D coach was teaching me a flying camel! Axels were really nice today.had a good skate ;)

Ghastly noise:

Dance coach didnt show up because of the weather.back and stomach hurts from doing too many laybacks.

~Cutie ;)

e-skater

12-15-2005, 06:11 PM

Hey all,

I actually ran through my new program from start to finish for the very first time today! :D This program has been in the making for a very long time. I chose the music and cut it back in October. However, since I had been focusing my attention on working gold moves, my coaches and I didn't really start working in earnest towards choreographing the new program until a month ago. My new program is supposed to be a bit of a character piece. As a result, I'm supposed to put a lot of life into the choreography with facial expressions and there are many trickly (at least tricky for me! :oops: ) little transitions and nuances that I'm still not doing yet. I suppose with time that these added touches will become more second nature as I get the program nder my feet but right now it's pretty ghastly. lol :lol:

Take care all,

Frank
Would love to see this program. Chock full of difficult stuff, and I just know you will get every nuance you need. It IS just the first complete run through!!!! Give yourself a tad of breathing room! :roll: :)

I had to laugh when I read through the rest of your post, as regardless of one's skating skill level, the program tribulations appear to be relative--right down to the "we didn't work on it because we were working on other stuff."

My biggest laugh came at myself when I realized how much I stress over my simple little beginnerish program------I often think "the man on the street" could do my program. Let me say, when I read what you are doing in yours, I was SO grateful to have my easy little ditty!!!!! :) ;)

Skate@Delaware

12-15-2005, 08:32 PM

Sweet Singing: Show rehearsal actually went well tonight 8O (from my point of view). The party girls were right on the mark and went ok (for the most part). Iced Delites was good, even if I didn't do the arm thing (so what-I'm trying not to fall over on the power-3's). Got lots of complements from my classmates (who are only party girls)-they liked the number and the dress! They want to be an Iced Delite next year!

And, last year we ended the show with no finale, curtain call or anything. This year, we go up to the lobby in our costumes for pictures and to schmooze with the public.

Ghastly Noise: Ok, I do power-3's all the way down the rink, trying not to take out the little candy canes and gingerbreads, and gumdrops that are zinging all around Candyland....So, when I get all the way down to the end, the rest of the girls are 10 feet beyond the mark!!! Ugh! So after we do our pivot line (which came dangerously close to the wall), we were no where near where we needed to be for our back crossover segment :evil: (one of the girls was one that almost killed me in a synchro number in the spring by "changing" the routine on a whim-don't know if she is doing the same thing tonight). Other than that, it was good.

So, if I keep working on moves, and get better on my footwork (faster power-3's and such), then next year I can audition to be a snowflake! (yeah, people who know me already think I'm flaky). They have the coolest music, routine, and costumes! It's a 4-5 girl ensemble piece! Hey, I'm moving up, anyway! Last year I was a cupcake and a flower! 8O

FrankR

12-16-2005, 08:59 AM

I look forward to see it when I get over there to Ice House. (That is... if the transit strike over in NYC doesn't cause trouble for me... 8O Shouldn't though... since I'm sticking with LIRR and NJ Transit. :D )

I have 5 step mohawks in my program. Nuf said! :P

Hey jazzpants,

Cool! Hopefully I'll be able to run through it for you and if all goes well I won't go splat. :D I had another lesson today and we've already changed a couple of sections. lol :lol:

I also had a couple of patterns from the 5 step in my bronze program a few years ago. Interesting coincidence! Maybe our coaches were trying to get us to work on them. :lol:

Take care,

Frank

FrankR

12-16-2005, 09:05 AM

Would love to see this program. Chock full of difficult stuff, and I just know you will get every nuance you need. It IS just the first complete run through!!!! Give yourself a tad of breathing room! :roll: :)

I had to laugh when I read through the rest of your post, as regardless of one's skating skill level, the program tribulations appear to be relative--right down to the "we didn't work on it because we were working on other stuff."

My biggest laugh came at myself when I realized how much I stress over my simple little beginnerish program------I often think "the man on the street" could do my program. Let me say, when I read what you are doing in yours, I was SO grateful to have my easy little ditty!!!!! :) ;)

Awww, thanks! :halo: Hopefully you'll be right and I'll get the hang of all the in-between stuff. For example, my coach today looked me squarely in the eye and said "You must be missing a gene." I said, "Really? Which one is that?" His reply: "The RHYTHM gene! :evil: " :oops: He's also asked me how I can do axels without a problem and then turn around and stumble out of a mohawk. My response: "Umm...I don't know." :frus:

In any case, I think putting a new program together is a similar process for everyone, as you said. Best of luck with your program! Will you be going to AN's? Hopefull I'll be able to see it.

Take care,

Frank

jazzpants

12-16-2005, 10:55 AM

I also had a couple of patterns from the 5 step in my bronze program a few years ago. Interesting coincidence! Maybe our coaches were trying to get us to work on them. :lol: In my best Bugs Bunny voice "Ummmm....COULD be..." :roll: :P

(Especially a couple of years back I originally had a forward power 3 in my artistic program... and at that time I can barely managed a LFO3, never mind at speed! :oops: :lol: )
"The RHYTHM gene!" MAN!!! The guy *IS* BRUTAL!!! http://www.cosgan.de/images/kao/frech/d030.gif

Edited to add: Okay, I got a good one... my secondary coach was clapping to keep me in rhythm on the 5 step mohawks, b/c she assumed that I had no sense of rhythm. (It's not that. I just don't have any sense of EDGE to do them in rhythm :P ... but I digress...) I came back to the penalty box where she and this other coach was teaching from. The dialog goes like this:

Secondary Coach: "Haven't you ever taken a music class?"
Me: "Ummm... I have a Bachelors degree in music?" :oops:
Secondary Coach: "Well, I can't even imagine what kind of music you play considering you have NO SENSE OF RHYTHM on these 5 step mohawks!!!" :roll:

Later on, as I was doing the 5 step again... I can hear her and this other coach joked in time...

Secondary Coach: I - AM - A - MUSIC - MAJOR!
Another coach: WELL WON - DERS - NE -VER - CEASE! :twisted: :lol:

Bothcoasts

12-16-2005, 11:08 AM

Casey,

I couldn't help but post a response after watching your spins. You get a nice number of revolutions and can hold your one-foot spins for awhile--great job!

Here are my suggestions for improvement:

1) Use fewer Xovers into the spin with less speed. Sometimes too much speed hinders centering--work on using only one or two deeper Xovers into the spin.

I like the suggestion someone made about stepping into the circle instead of away from it. The way I teach it is that you want to be in a right t-position as you push onto your left foot. If your feet are more in a mohawk position, you're stepping too far outside of the circle.

2) Bend your knee more upon entry, as you step onto your left foot. Your knee should straighten out only when you find yourself in the spin itself.

3) Your free leg should be higher when extended during the initial part of the spin. Hold that position--don't try to pull in--until you feel yourself become centered. When you feel centered, then begin to pull in (see below).

4) Keep arms even with your shoulders, or slightly below. You want your arms to be straight. As mentioned in a previous post, your arms have a tendency to fly around a little--it sometimes looks like you use your arms to maintain your balance. Force your arms to stay completely straight at the shoulder and elbow, and work on centering yourself more before you start picking up speed. Hopefully, you won't need to rely on your arms for balance. They're there for aesthetics, rotation and speed.

5) Pull your feet and arms in in increments to maintain the spin longer and to continue to give you speed throughout the spin. I've heard people suggest to pull your feet in first (3 revs), followed by your arms to a circle in front of you (3 revs), then pull your arms all the way in. Make sure you pull everything in tightly; it looks like you have a tendency to keep everything slightly loose.

6) Upon push-out, check your left arm more and bend onto a deeper right outside edge. Make sure your left shoulder is further in front of you in order to really stop your rotation. The deeper your kneebend, the more control you'll have over your push-out.

Good luck! I hope these suggestions help you out.

Bothcoasts

e-skater

12-16-2005, 06:52 PM

For example, my coach today looked me squarely in the eye and said "You must be missing a gene." I said, "Really? Which one is that?" His reply: "The RHYTHM gene! :evil: " :oops: He's also asked me how I can do axels without a problem and then turn around and stumble out of a mohawk. My response: "Umm...I don't know." :frus:

In any case, I think putting a new program together is a similar process for everyone, as you said. Best of luck with your program! Will you be going to AN's? Hopefull I'll be able to see it.

Take care,

Frank
Your coach's comment was hysterical! :lol: :lol: So, someone else is missing "skating genes". ;)

No AN's for me. Sectionals are in a place I could go this year, but I can't, so..... :giveup:

As for my current dramatic program, it's for a showcase event. I know you would be too kind to actually laugh when you saw it, but I can't imagine it would look like anything to someone who can skate!!!! :lol:

e-skater

12-16-2005, 06:55 PM

Secondary Coach: "Haven't you ever taken a music class?"
Me: "Ummm... I have a Bachelors degree in music?" :oops:
Secondary Coach: "Well, I can't even imagine what kind of music you play considering you have NO SENSE OF RHYTHM on these 5 step mohawks!!!" :roll:

Later on, as I was doing the 5 step again... I can hear her and this other coach joked in time...

Secondary Coach: I - AM - A - MUSIC - MAJOR!
Another coach: WELL WON - DERS - NE -VER - CEASE! :twisted: :lol:

Evil, EVIL coaches! :twisted: :twisted: I wish you could come up to skate at our rink a couple times. We could work on the 5-step, and it would be so fun! It was my absolute worst move, yet one of the best on my test. It's no longer test quality, and of course I don't practice it EVER anymore......but....it would still be fun.

Can't get over the evil coaches. :roll: I LOVE the clapping in time part, and the little song....... :lol:

luna_skater

12-16-2005, 07:31 PM

Sweet Singing: Sorry to all those who lost your flips....I HAVE THEM! :twisted: I've been refraining from posting in these threads for a while because I didn't want to jinx my progress. But two of my flips this week were soooooo good! They had great spring, and my coach was really impressed. He hasn't really gushed about my jumps before, so I KNOW these two were good. That was Tuesday, and flips have still been good on Thu and Fri. Concentrating on really checking my arms and pushing strong off my pick has made a big difference.

Spins have also gotten really good! Started working on a sit again after a few months away from it, and it's pretty respectable. It can of course get lower, but I am getting true revolutions on it, and am getting fairly low for not having worked on them very long! Also revisited camel spins, which still aren't great, but are much better than the last time I tried them (back in the summer). I think getting a strong forward spin has really helped improve my re-attempts at the sit and camel.

Skate@Delaware

12-16-2005, 07:46 PM

Sweet Singing: Last class for two weeks!!! It was test night and I got a few things signed off. We also worked on the power-3's for the show. I learned to pull my arms in on the 3-turn part, then push them out for the crossover part. It seemed to make them faster. I'm still not doing the "over the arms thing" in the show....and that's my final answer! And, we fixed my 1/2 lutz (when she had me do one she asked me "what was that?") Obviously, I wasn't doing a 1/2 lutz! :oops: So, now I am.

Ghastly noise: started working on the back 3-turn! Needs tons of work but they sure are interesting!

I'm off to my sewing room...gotta finish one more dress (for a gift and put crystals in the shape of butterflies on it).

Casey

12-16-2005, 08:01 PM

Maybe she's a girl that can't pat her head and rub her tummy at the same time...
Oooh, my friend today proved that she can pat her head and rub her tummy...while doing an otherwise beautiful and well-centered spin!

I was impressed. :P

Casey

12-16-2005, 08:16 PM

I couldn't help but post a response after watching your spins. [...] Good luck! I hope these suggestions help you out.
Thanks! I'm going to write all this stuff down and take it to the rink with me next week. Hopefully I'll have some new videos a couple times as the week progresses. It will probably take a while to get all of these things ingrained, but at least I have a goal list now. :)

mikawendy

12-16-2005, 08:38 PM

In my best Bugs Bunny voice "Ummmm....COULD be..." :roll: :P

(Especially a couple of years back I originally had a forward power 3 in my artistic program... and at that time I can barely managed a LFO3, never mind at speed! :oops: :lol: )
"The RHYTHM gene!" MAN!!! The guy *IS* BRUTAL!!! http://www.cosgan.de/images/kao/frech/d030.gif

Jazzpants & FrankR, are you sure your coaches don't have some secret chatroom where they talk to my coach?! :lol: Until recently, my program had 3 forward alternating threes in it! (Then I switched the first three turn to a rocker and put in two more steps whose name I don't know before two three turns to better meet the well-balanced Bronze FS program requirement for a footwork or step sequence that covers at least 1/2 ice. The steps are going backward and are sorta the reverse of backward crossrolls--the foot in back disengages from the ice and is set down in front of me--I have no idea what this is called...)

(And jazzpants, too funny about your coach and the rhythm of the 5 step!)

jenlyon60

12-16-2005, 09:37 PM

Sounds like Mrs. Redboots' dreaded backward cross-cuts...

(Then I switched the first three turn to a rocker and put in two more steps whose name I don't know before two three turns to better meet the well-balanced Bronze FS program requirement for a footwork or step sequence that covers at least 1/2 ice. The steps are going backward and are sorta the reverse of backward crossrolls--the foot in back disengages from the ice and is set down in front of me--I have no idea what this is called...)

Skate@Delaware

12-17-2005, 02:50 PM

Ghastly Noise: Had to go to rehearsal (again) and work on those darn power-3's. Also showed daughter the small change on the end pattern (and promptly got into an argument on who was supposed to be where)..... I told her forget about it-I'm going back to the original thing where I do the other thing. No problem!

I couldn't really spin this morning, either. Maybe it was the cold, or the curlers in my hair! 8O

Rink was COLD and the wall was missing in a large place! They plan on putting flowers there, but still..... 8O several of the better skaters are doing BIG jumps in that area and are un-nerved by this lack of wall.

I'm a bit tired now (it's 3:45) because I went to bed late, and got up early (5:00 a.m.) and my son has a big head cold and doesn't feel good.

Mrs Redboots

12-18-2005, 06:35 AM

Sweet singing: Back on the ice this morning after a couple of days off due to a minor virus. Although only 45 minutes, as I was taking the carol service. Husband's free-skating lesson - and he did a really most acceptable sit-spin, only a week after being shown how! Only the one, mind, so it was as well I happened to be looking.

I didn't do all that much, only skated round working on edges & one lap of back cross-cuts, which weren't very good.

Ghastly noise: Had printed out the requirements for Bronze free-skate programmes for next year, plus the protocols from the men's bronze at Oberstdorf for husband's coach, only to find I'd left them at home. Actually, I found when I'd got home that I'd carefully put them in my church folder in the middle of the carol service stuff! That would have given me the giggles if I'd found it when I was doing the Bidding Prayer, so just as well I found it beforehand.....

We will not discuss the husband's attempts at a parallel spin..... nor, indeed, our joint attempt to do runs round the circle in Reverse Kilian hold (suffice it to say we had to stroke all the way down to the far circle in hold before we succeeded!).

Ah well.....

e-skater

12-18-2005, 08:44 AM

Ghastly noise: Had printed out the requirements for Bronze free-skate programmes for next year, plus the protocols from the men's bronze at Oberstdorf for husband's coach, only to find I'd left them at home. Actually, I found when I'd got home that I'd carefully put them in my church folder in the middle of the carol service stuff! That would have given me the giggles if I'd found it when I was doing the Bidding Prayer, so just as well I found it beforehand.....

Hmmm, could have been interesting.....especially if one were at all on auto-pilot........I can hear it now ;)

Love your sense of humor. Skating seems to seep into everything we do!